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Judge Roughneck
14 Nov 11 16:17
Joined:
Date Joined: 14 Aug 07
| Topic/replies: 105 | Blogger: Judge Roughneck's blog
I am looking to buy between £5-10k worth. What would people recommend? Sovereigns look a good idea as they are CGT free?
The next big question is where/how to get them.
Does anyone who has done this have any recommendations/advice?
TIA
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Report Menelaus November 14, 2011 5:46 PM GMT
What's your rush? Wait until *this* happens:

Mrben    Joined: 25 Oct 03
Replies: 2828 25 Jan 11 03:09
Im with you there johhnie re gold.Im thinking the same as whippet, first stop around 1250, the lower and lower
I have a long range bet based on gold going under 1000 in the last 3 mths of 2011 and the first 3 mths of 2012.


SillySillySilly
Report wykhamist2 November 14, 2011 8:07 PM GMT
I got mine through Bairds (goldline.co.uk). You can get QE2 mint sovs for about 270 quid each. You set up the contract online then send them the money via BACS. They then send the coins by registered mail. I have done this 3 times without any problems.

For storing them you might want to think about getting a safe deposit box at your local bank. I do not want to keep any in my house for security reasons.
Report Mrben November 14, 2011 9:01 PM GMT
well said melly.

don't waste your time buying gold at these levels.

sit on your cash.

cheaper assets are just around the corner.
Report Menelaus November 14, 2011 9:23 PM GMT
I thought even someone with a brain the size of a pea could understand the implications of what I posted about their playbook (they will print, print, print - there's no Plan B). I guess I was wrong. Shocked




****************** eases pressure on fingers from squeezing nose ************************
Report Menelaus November 14, 2011 9:33 PM GMT
It also seems this chap has been shouting "around the corner" for nearly a month now. I wonder if Bernanke will give him at least a few days in the sun before he fires those Heidelbergs at full speed again. Hmmmm........

SillySillySilly


Mrben 20 Oct 11 05:15 
..................

   Asset inflation is over my friends,for the foreseeable future. Dont buy a business, house or any other kind of "asset' hold onto your cash and job if you can.

......................

SELL SELL SELL
Report Mrben November 15, 2011 4:19 AM GMT
ho-hum, melly  YAWNNNNNNN!

do you have anything else to offer other than cut and paste?
Report FINE AS FROG HAIR November 15, 2011 11:42 PM GMT
I would expect that Menelaus, given his apparent " top dog" financial and social status, has bought a producing gold mine somewhere.
Perhaps next to his chateau in France, so he can keep an eye on those " thieving" peasants mininig it for him ?.
Report V4 Vendetta November 16, 2011 5:59 PM GMT
Yes, sovereigns if you're UK domiciled and likely to stay so.  Ignore people telling you it's going down, it may do but if everything else disappears it's all you'll have left so you're doing the right thing diversifying.  Check out the retail websites and call them up for a few quid extra off.  You can take a chance on ebay too depending how brave you feel.
Report bobby2424 November 16, 2011 6:17 PM GMT
I would not advise ppl to take chance buying gold off ebayers
Report FINE AS FROG HAIR November 16, 2011 7:58 PM GMT
I suggest that if you are all that alarmist about everything then perhaps you might be better advised to buy some good farming land somewhere and start to learn how to live off it.
Trotting around with a few gold sovereigns in your pouch is only going to last so long. And then what ?
Report wykhamist2 November 16, 2011 11:23 PM GMT
If the whole banking system and currency go belly up it does not mean we will be bartering for goods indefinitely. Things would be a bit hairy for a few months for sure. But a new currency would be formed and gradually things would get back to normal.

The elite, particularly the bankers, would love us to believe we will all starve to death and that a meltdown must be avoided at any cost. They have a lot to lose if it all comes crashing down.

One advantage of sovereigns is that they are easily transportable (unlike land) if you decide to make a new life elsewhere. If it turns out the banking system is saved and we continue with another generation of being ripped off by the elite then you can always just pass them on to your kids as inheritance tax-free presents.
Report Menelaus November 16, 2011 11:32 PM GMT
Some random and not so random thoughts from me:

get back to normal

Cheap oil is gone. We'll define a new normal, but there's no such thing as getting back to normal

They have a lot to lose if it all comes crashing down

It depends how it all comes down. Deflation hurts them, hyperinflation doesn't. Which why there has NEVER been a deflationary economic collapse in any nation ever since man started walking on two legs.

One advantage of sovereigns is that they are easily transportable (unlike land) if you decide to make a new life elsewhere. If it turns out the banking system is saved and we continue with another generation of being ripped off by the elite then you can always just pass them on to your kids as inheritance tax-free presents.

Spot on save the part the banking system being saved and continuing with another generation. This fiat monetary system that relies on growth to pay the coupon was designed to collapse from the outset. It now has, it's just that most people haven't clued in yet.
Report FINE AS FROG HAIR November 16, 2011 11:52 PM GMT
Does Menelaus have a specific alternative monetary system all mapped out btw ?.
If so, I'm sure we would all love to hear about in advance.
Where were the Menelaus's of the world when the current system ( apparently doomed to failure from the outset) was designed and implemented ?
I do believe many consumption paradigms will and must change, but that is a far call from changing the whole way the world monetary system works.
Report Mrben November 17, 2011 1:04 AM GMT
my advice is dont buy gold. Or silver. You will get it much much cheaper into the future.
Report Judge Roughneck November 17, 2011 12:35 PM GMT
Wykhamist - Thanks for the site recommendation.

If you have time, can you tell me the implications (if any) of buying bars with a fineness of 999.9 and Sovereigns which I believe are 916.6. I get that the fineness indicates the quality/content of gold but looking at the Goldline site the price for the bars only works out about £14/oz more than the coins. If/when I come to sell will the bars be worth much more than the coins? Regarding storage, that’s not a problem for me – I already have off-site safety deposit.

V4V – What are the implications of my domicile? I am currently in the UK but there is a fairly good chance that I won’t be in 15-20 years time. I am definitely not brave enough to buy from e-bay! Have you used any retail sites that you would recommend?

FAFH
I am not “all that alarmist” about it, if I was I would be putting all my money in real assets wheras I am looking to put a fraction in gold as a bit of insurance. The truth is, if I buy some gold, I hope it gradually becomes worth less as it will mean things are returning to normal and my other investments will be rising. 
While I get what you are saying about farm land, I am not sure it would be a great option unless it was somewhere really remote. Just my opinion but thanks for your input.
Report Menelaus November 17, 2011 12:50 PM GMT
I've seen this posted more than once so it's worthy of a comment.

Posters on here, who admittedly are buying gold as insurance against the SHTF, need to rethink the notion that you will be granted access to your bank's safety vault to retrieve your gold in a SHTF scenario. The notion that you can pack your gold in your suitcase and leave the UK if a worse case scenario unfolds also needs rethinking.

History is not on your side.
Report donny osmond November 17, 2011 2:55 PM GMT
you can buy sovs at coin auctions, dont forget to add premiums to your bids
else you will end up over paying, jewellers are paying £238 up our way at
the minute. watch out for older ones and ones with foreign mint marks

gold coin values tend to be based on bullion as the price overtook
all the old values fairly rapidly and therefore the experts struggle to price
gold coins these days.

there are plenty of coin shops on this site

http://www.ma-shops.com/

i cant vouch for them all, but, credit card payments should be covered in the normal manner
Report wykhamist2 November 17, 2011 10:43 PM GMT
I did actually ask at the bank whether I would easily be able to get my box back if they went under. This caused much hilarity with the staff who said I really didn't need to worry about such things. So I said, Why do you think I am wanting to hold gold in the first place? Anyway, in principle all the safe deposit boxes should be returned to the owners even if the bank cease trading.

It's true that governments would not like to see money leaving the country although its quite hard for them to stop every foot/car passenger leaving by ferry and searching them for coins.

Regarding bars vs coins I am not much of an expert. What has put me off bars a bit is the fact that in the past governments have made holding bullion illegal, but not coins. Personally I would not be wanting any tattered old used sovereigns either, since I believe they would be harder to sell than nice shiny brand new ones in plastic which have not been touched. Having the relevant paperwork from when you bought them is also a plus I believe. I did once sell one on ebay and mint condition plus certificate of authenticity seemed to be required.
Report donny osmond November 18, 2011 4:23 PM GMT
the jewellers dont seem that bothered and simply weigh them
and have means to tell the carat content of coins

obviously if i sold you one , you would expect some certification
if i was charging over bullion value
Report ahosang November 19, 2011 12:26 AM GMT
In my opinion confiscation is unlikely, as confidence will need to be managed. The question is will there be an orderly market in the price rise of gold(where the government agents buy it back off you for printed currency(devalued), or will there be a disequilibrium??

In the event of a disequilibrium, you will need to hold until the storm passes. I may be wrong but I believe the last skill they have left is to manage the process. You will need to gauge when its best to sell and carry on with life.

Political reality tells me that the people at the top will protect as much as their nominal wealth as possible(because it can be sustained relatively by devaluing the currency), so menelaus has it right. The people at the top do not destroy themselves, they lose a little to try and placate the masses, and socialise the losses. The debts might be paid by all.

The web however has thrown a spanner in the works, because the awareness and knowledge of the people has grown exponentially, so the dynamics of the social landscape has changed a bit. Thus they are not in the same position to take advantage of the relative ignorance of masses of bygone ages.

Who knows how it will exactly play out??
Report FINE AS FROG HAIR November 19, 2011 11:48 AM GMT
Are we potentially going to return then to the old gold standard type monetary system ?
Can we go back to this in reality ?
Report ahosang November 19, 2011 2:05 PM GMT
"Are we potentially going to return then to the old gold standard type monetary system ?
Can we go back to this in reality ? "

No, gold standard is not desirable. But if gold becomes a more prominent collateral asset that actually moves at a market rate, then the price may rise even further to reflect the nominal currency amounts which is supposed to defend.

Market gold as now, but with gold being collateral and tradeable wealth. The gold standard is just another Government fix attempt. That will not happen.

The ECB already marks its gold to market value and publishes reserve value in its balance sheets.
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