Double your money in 30 days!

Gambling on horse racing looks a bit out of place on a financial forum.

Hi Hayden,i think we are all aiming for the same thing I;E PROFITS, whether it be from stocks/shares or other investment opportinities,its all about trying to achieve the best possible returns.Its high risk,sure(so was Northern Rock),but the returns can be spectacular.

My first question is  Why Timber Treasure  ?

Because it meets certain criteria for it to be a bet on my system.

3rd?

you placed a bet on a hoss to win a race 6 hours before the off?

trust me, there is only one way to profit from the nags... lay the cheats.

i studied form etc etc etc, knew everything there was to know about formlines, courses, breeding, you name it, i knew about it... net result = hundreds of hours of study and lost around 200 grand

then i went back to my grass roots, and let my career in fx trading (tech anayl) show me the way to profit on betfair.

spot the cheats, and lay em.

net result = 3 or 4 hours studying the screens.charts.price movements a day and guranteed profits.

not broken even yet, but just a matter of time, slowly slowly clawing it back.

but i have the fishing rod to feed me for as long as cheats propser in hoss racing.

Valero Joined: 06 May 10
Replies:

you placed a bet on a hoss to win a race 6 hours before the off?

trust me, there is only one way to profit from the nags... lay the cheats.

Hi Valero,

How do you do it?

you want me to tell you what it took me nearly 8 years and 200 grand and plenty of misery to find out?

righto.

no system to sell etc, there is not enough liquidity for that, which is why my system is only known to one man alive, and will always remain that man's fishing rod.

Valero ur spot on i had to pretty much give up backing horses due to cheats, but like you i now lay certain trainers,it can still be difficult tho. I study national hunt trainers in ireland with eye on uk aswel, what field section do you study?

Valero

Good luck with your system,chasing that 200k..It seems alot to lose before you sussed out that what you were doing wasn't working'

I only use TA,and trade what I see. Using tic charts,just follow the trend,using momentum and Support and Resistance levels.

I'd be intrigued to know how you were playing,as to now.

biodiesel / kohaku

hi chaps,

bio - i dont study any trainer in particular, just price movements and pattersn i have seen prior to the off, i could expand on this a lot lot more, but this would give my edge away, or a lot of it. I only play the hoss racing markets, flat and NH with certain constraints in place before i lay. Sorry that is about as much as i can say.

koh - took me years to blow that 200 grand, but i am very calmly and simply making it back, but my system is very tight money management wise now, i know if i keep going i will have it made back within 18 months, that will do me, as i am glad i have a moeny printing machine on the work.

with regards to fx trading - KISS, honestly there are so many fancy technical indicators around now, i was taught and mentored by an ex Citbank fx trader from the golden era, and it was simply to find the firm support and resistance levels that reoccure over 4 time frames, 15m, hourly, daily, weekly... and the only indicator we used was MACD.

Valero,i dissagree with you as far as it not being possible to make a profit backing horses to win as i hope to show over the next 30 days.As far as you losing 200k backing horses i think your strategies must have been seriously flawed.

naah, remember this, anybody can have a successful month of betting, hell i had months inside a 5/6 year period where i turned 200 quid into 8 grand.

overall, i began to see pattern emerge in unfair play, and thankfully BF allows to be in on the scam.

i do feel its almost theft like what i do.

i do no research whatsoever, just watch the market like i would the price action of cable (sterling v the greenback) and over the years have learnt correllations between movements and markets that lead me to suspect a certain hoss may not be primed, may be going for a new handicap mark, held back for other reasons... but certianly not in with a chance of winning.

everybody knows the game is bent, people in the game have even told me, not that i needed to be told.

years of closely watching races run out, having placed money on them... any analytical mind will see patterns forming.

i just took the pain of losing and ran with the feeling of BENT, and joined THEIR gravy train.

I certainly agree with you when you say anyone can have the odd winning month,but using this system i've only had 4 losing months out of 21,and in that time has shown a fantastic profit on turnover.Maybe 21 months is too small a period of time to analyse certain trends, but so far it has proved most lucrative and i'am confident that results can continue to keep showing good returns.

best of luck.

i trade currencies myself, interesting u say they only use MACD,id well believe it,timming of its use crucial. How many trades a year should a successful trader follow i know people have different styles but what did the golden era follow

Monday 21st,2 bets on system, both run at Chepstow;6.50 SERMONS MOUNT 47.50 Win.
7.20 SPIC 'N' SPAN, also 47.50 win.

bio - these were bankt traders, so maybe dozens of small trades a day, linked with a few longer term plays.

all dependant on your style.

a tip... if you are day trading, the real movement comes (for sterling anywany) between 6.30 and 8.30 am

get the charts set up on the different timeframes, mark off the support/resist, keep a close eye on the macd, and go in hard for a signal show.

Kiss of Death..Goldhunter

cheers Valero, Iav learned that the main moves happen in the morning alright. Any other tips?

yes, FX is VERY VERY VERY dangerous, a move of 2, 3, 400 pips can wipe you out in minutes.

only takes a rogue indonesian bank to sell a yard of any currecny, or a bomb to go off somewhere, and you are cleaned out.

always always use guaranteed stops if you are planning on holding a position overnight.

u canot lose on my system
u put on for me and u take 10% commision on my winnings and you stand u lose nothing
interested ?

money on what horses or FX

I always use stops i wouldnt trade otherwise.

greyhounds

u joking me i dont like dag racing. I know of a system, it involves a iphone and betting with high st bookmaking firm, ur prob on the same system yea

?

u r talking about arbing
i am not
i talking bettiung greyhounds over the price that they should be
so u win in he long run

goldhunter Joined: 06 Mar 09
Replies: 55 20 Jun 10 20:29 
but using this system i've only had 4 losing months out of 21,and in that time has shown a fantastic profit on turnover. but so far it has proved most lucrative and i'am confident that results can continue to keep showing good returns.

ok gold hunter if yur system is that good then post a few trades BEFORE they happen.
  I'm betting you dont but I could be wrong.Lets see the colour of you trades goldigger.
ps- where is your current location- nigeria?[:x]

not interested, I think ul find the desperados in the football forum.

Goldhunter: You might of had only 4 loosing months but how many home run months did you have, like big winning months.

'

Bank now stands at 812.25 after todays losing bet.

Biodiesel,not sure i quite understand you about 'home runs' but there have been many big winning months during period, so big that it would be pointless posting past results on here because you will NOT believe me.

Mrbean,i had to post todays bet on another topic (1 BET ON SYSTEM TODAY)as , for whatever reason i couldn't post on this link.If you care to notice earlier'proofs',you will find that i do so way before the off,even 6hrsin one case,ask Valero.

Mrbean,i had to post todays bet on another topic (1 BET ON SYSTEM TODAY)as , for whatever reason i couldn't post on this link.If you care to notice earlier'proofs',you will find that i do so way before the off,even 6hrsin one case,ask Valero.

Wed 23 June, 1 bet on system;'GUGA' 9.10 Bath £40.60 win.

i applaude you goldie for posting the pick.please post the result also as i am here in aust.Interested to see how it goes as I m sure many others are, although they may not be posting.

GUGA, came 6th of 9 runners. are these lay bets goldie 100%strike rate!!!

GREAT TIPSTER



NOT

Losing day again yesterday;Bank now stands at £771.65.
4 bets today,all are £35.80 win.
Bath 6.10 'WHISPERED TIMES'
Hamilton 9.00 'MUSICAL BRIDGE'and in same race,'HAZELBRIGG'.
Hamilton 9.30 'MINTURINO'

Correction.Stakes should be £38.70 and not £35.80 for todays bets.

Fri/25th.
Bank stands at exactly the same as yesterday £771.65 after break even day yesterday with 3-1 winner WHISPERED TIMES which won the 6.10 at NEWCASTLE,and not BATH!which i mistakingly put;3 other bets lost.
4 bets again today.
Market Rasen 4.55 'GINGERS LAD'
Newcastle 9.00 'DARK MOMENTS' and in same race 'TOP BID'
Chester 9.20 'GLENRIDDING'
All bets are once again £38.70 win.

Sat 26th.
Bank now stands at £655.55, 3 losers and one NR yesterday.
5 bets today,adjust staking to £32.70 on all bets.
Newcastle 2.30 'MEDICI TIMES' 16-1 with Skybet.
Newcastle 3.40 'DEADLY ENCOUNTER'
Chester 4.20 'GREEN PARK' 8-1 Betfred.
Doncaster 7.10 'PRETTY ORCHID'
Doncaster 7.45 'CORNUS'

Sun 27th,
Bank stands at £524.75 after 4 losers and a NR yesterday.
Its typical that the 1st week i try proving these bets that it happens to produce one of the worst set of results i've encounted(not quite the wosrt, i had 14 consecutive losers in nov 2009)
Its been a little frustrating with the ammount of 2nds- 1 yesterday at 8-1 and was unlucky in running-but basically system has underperformed,this happens in racing from time to time of course,but i've still 3 weeks to hopefully turn things around.
1 bet on system today, Uttoxeter 4.55 'YELLOW FLAG'£26.20 Win.

Mon/28th,
No bet today.
Bank now stands at £570.75 after yesterdays winner at 7-4.

believe me, backing horses does not pay.

Tue/29th,
5 bets today all £28.85 win.
Brighton 3.30 'THE MOUSE CARROL' 16-1 with Victor Chandler.
         5.00 'MULTAHAB'
Thirsk   7.30 'MOHEEBB' and in same race 'OBSERVATORY STAR'
         8.30 'HIGH IMPORTANCE'

Talking of horses, why don't you post this on the racing forum you donkey.

Seeing as its upsetting you i'll continue to post on here live4.
1 bet today 4.30 catterick 'GLENRIDDING' £21.30 WIN.
Bank stands at £426 before todays bet.

ohh goldie, the double yur money in 30 days is looking folorn.Plaudits to you for posting your picks and dont let the negative heads here upset you.
   However, your system is a dud,there is not a horse racing system in the world that can work unless you randomize the bet amounts.Since markets are set to 100+% all systems must axiomatically fail.Read the nassim taleb books and you will understand more.
   In short- winning results cannot be foretold, therefore they are  random, winners will occur but we don't know when.You will eventually run out of money or courage when the inevitable run of outs comes.Hence in order to win one must randomize the bet amount to give yourself the chance to beat the random resutls.
  If you  look at almost all staking plans they are either some form of martingale, flat stakes or odds based progressions.All are doomed to fail even if the have a short term success.
   Just as the results are a gamble so to should thge stake be a gamble.
  Stop now while you still have 426 and re analyize.Remember somewhere between .7% and 3% of betfair punters win.

rbs

Thanks for the-sort of support Mrben, i certainly take on board what you have posted,but i'am really miffed as to how bets have gone on here in last 10 days or so. Runs like this have and WILL always happen on a system such as mine, when ave odds are around 9-2,but its sods law that its been "one of those periods" since i've started posting these bets(Just like it is sods law today when i could'nt post bet in time  and horse duly won at 5-2)Anyway, i'll stick with it to the bitter end and see what materializes.
1 bet today, REDCAR 8.50 'AMIR PASHA £20.30 WIN.

you do not win money backing horses.

the game is bent.

believe me, or don't believe me.

Fri 2nd July,
10-1 winner last night which takes bank up to £606,still £400 down on start but hopefully a step in right direction.
4 bets on system today all £30.30 win
Doncaster.3.35' ESORTERICA and in same race'MAHADEE'#I will not be backing these 2 horses today as also in same race i know that 'ALDERMOOR is quite strongly fancied from S C Williams stable, i occasionaly get info from this yard and it is very good so i won't be backing against it#
Warwick 4.20 'CORR POINT.
Sandown 4.35 TARTAN GUNNA.

Hope it,s a change of luck for you goldhunter, sometimes you just can,t win GOOD LUCK.

Sat 3rd July.
2 winners yesterday @7-1 and 8-11 brings bank up to £780.
5 bets today all £39 win.
Leicester 5.20 'MACANTA.
Haydock 5.10 'MISARO' and in same race 'HAZELRIGG.
Carlisle 8.25 'MOHEEBB
"------" 8.55 'HIGH RESOLUTION'.

How about you post this on the horse racing forum? No one here cares.

Here's a tip for you: If you continue to clutter up this forum with your rubbish tips then I will phone up betfair customer services and get you banned.

Hope this helps.

Sun 4th july,
2 winners yesterday at 7-2 and 2-1; 3 losers also but bank now stands at £877.5.
4 bets today all £43.75 win.
ARY 2.40 'SPAVENTO and in same race 'BARNSTORM,
BRIGHTON 4.30 'HIGH IMPORTANCE'
MARKET RASEN 4.50 'ORMUS'
Whippet, only 2 weeks left for me on this post;I'am just trying to show that it is possible to make agood return through backing horses using my system and a% of betting bank, altering after each day.Why if you could'nt care less about this subject do you keep poking your nose in and clustering this topic up.

I'm following this thread, looking forward to the outcome.

Mon 5th,
3 losers and 1 winner yesterday at 5-4; 11-4 was availible a few hours before race so in future i'll advise bets at early prices;It would have made a big difference to bank as presently, after 38 bets ,system has had 8 winners and is currently showing a tiny profit of .75 of a pt;If early prices had been taken profit would be nearer 10pts;
Bank now stands at £797,
2 bets tonight both £39 win;
RIPON 8.20'HOT SPARK 7-1 with Corals.
WINDSOR 9.10 'MELLIERA 9-2 Corals.

1 more bet tonight which i overlooked, also runs in the 8.20 at Ripon 'FLANEUR', 9-2 SkyBet

are you putting real money on these  goldhunter

Absolutely Y.Me. Its just a pity that system has'nt performed as well as normal and has been a little disappointing up to press.

Whippet Joined: 01 Oct 07
Replies: 1476 04 Jul 10 12:15 
How about you post this on the horse racing forum? No one here cares.

Here's a tip for you: If you continue to clutter up this forum with your rubbish tips then I will phone up betfair customer services and get you banned.

Hope this helps.


hope this helps whippet-you are a dikhead, if you dont like the thread move to the next one.easy enuff?just fk off- hope that helps.

Could'nt have put it better myself Mrben;Well said.
6th July;
No bet today.
3 losers yesterday brings bank down to £680.

7th July,
1 bet on system today,Worcester 7.10 'SIR BUMBLE' £34 Win, is generally at around 3-1 .

8th July,
Losing bet yesterday,2nd at 11-4 takes bank down to £646;
3 bets today.
Warwick 3.30 'CHINESE DEMOCRACY' 7-1 with Stan James.
"----"  5.15 'WANCHAI WHISPER' 3-1 Generally.
Folkstone 3.20 'THOUGHTOFSTARDOM' 10-1 Victor Chandler.
All bets £32.3 win.

9th July;
1 winner yesterday advised at 7-1 and 2 losers.Bank now stands at £808.
1 bet today; Newmarket 4.55 'KAMES PARK' £40.40 WIN; 18-1 with Victor Chandler, Stan James.

10th July,
NR yesterday so banks still stands at £808.
2 bets today both £40.40 win.
Nottingham 4.55 'CLASSIC DESCENT' 9-2 with Sporting Bet.
Ascot 5.15 'SOLEMN also 9-2 with Sporting Bet.

11th July,
1 loser and 1 NR yesterday,bank now stands at £767.60.
1 bet today runs at Southwell 4.50 'SMILING APPLAUSE' £38.50 WIN,
12-1 in general.

goldie, your putting in a lot of effort for a losing result.Buy yourself a copy of "the black swan" by nassim taleb.It will help you to get over the delusion of being able to win at the track.

13th July,
1 week to go,lets see what happens,but the £2000 bank looks a step too far;
2 bets today;
Ary 3.00 'REQUISITE' 7-1 generally.
"-" 4.30 'GRAND DIAMOND 3-1 "----"
Both bets ££36 win.

Mrben,i wound'nt say that i'am being 'deluded' with this system of mine.OK,the betting bank has lost some25%, but actually to level stakes ,it,despite being a below par month, is showing a small profit.Maybe i was due a quiet month after 3 exceptional ones,but all i know is that the profits it has previously produced over the last 2 years are very much far from delusional.

Will you be trying out your system next month goldhunter,? I find i  make more money on football basketball cricket team games, hoarse racing bets for me are just too hard to predict."GOOD LUCK".

I reaaly admire your courage goldie.You are posting daily bets here well b4 the event.You should be applauded.
  However the results of all horse racing  is always a loss.The more you bet  and the longer the period will always result in a loss.it is not that your system is so bad, its the odds, or lack of them that will beat all systems in the end.You had 3 winning months but now in month 4 your behind- surely that tell you something?Consider all the effort you have put in.
  If for recreation its no problem, but gambling cannot be considered a serious money maker.

I'm a strong believer that a "system" relying on archive stats alone will hit a brick wall sometime in the not yet proven future , an absolute necessity is to be able to tell yourself WHY the systems works , if you can do that then proceed with confidence but all the archive stats will only help the belief behind the fundamental reason which is that you actually know WHY the golden goose lays the golden eggs.

Stats don't give answers they just provoke more questions.


Good luck mate

13th;
another losing day yesterday brings bank down to £703.
1 bet today;Brighton 3.40 'FIRE KING' 3-1 generally.
£35 win.

1 more bet this evening;Yarmouth 8.00 'MORGANS CHOICE'4-1 generally also £35 win

Gold you should plot a equity curve you seam just to be going sideways. When I mentioned homeruns, its like hold out for one bet a week or month and have 10% of ur roll on it

14th;
1 winner yesterday advised at 3-1 and 1 loser.Bank creeps back up again to £773.
1 bet today;Uttoxeter 3.40 'RIPALONG LAD' 4-1 generally,£38 win.

15th;
Another winning day yesterday with a 4-1 winner,bank now stands at £925.
2 bets today both in same race.Hamilton 4.35 'TOP BID',-12-1GENERALLY and ''MONTE MAYOR ONE' 11-1 generally. Both bets are £46 win.

16th,
2 losers yesterday so bank slides back down to £833.Highly unlikely that the £2000 bank will materealise in the time i thought it would but one never knows.
4 bets today all £41.65 win.
Haydock 2.55 'SANDS CROONER' 20-1 Sporting Bet,although i think 'AVERTOR' will be hard to beat.
Nottingham 3.55 'RAINBOW MIGRAGE'
Newbury 4.20 'PEOPLETON BROOK'
Hamilton 8.20 'BAVARIAN NORDIC'9-1 Paddy Power.

Biodiesel Joined: 04 May 05
Replies: 1064 14 Jul 10 12:19   
Gold you should plot a equity curve you seam just to be going sideways. When I mentioned homeruns, its like hold out for one bet a week or month and have 10% of ur roll on it 


I really like this idea goldie.Your system is obviously very good and with some tweaking it could be a real winner.Bio's idea is essentially to cut out some of the losers.
  Go over the selections and see if there is a common element in the losers.Cut a few out may make all the difference.

Bio,Mrben,
i've been looking at various filters compairing all past results,and without wanting to 'backfit' the system i appear to have found a way to improve overall performance of system quite significantly.
The reasons seem logical,the only downturn is that the number of bets will be down by some 60-70%.It might be an idea to back horses  as 1 pt or 2pt in future with obviously the 2pt bets being the 'max' but also still include the 1pt bets,as although not as profitable as max bets, do still produce a profit.

17th,
The months almost up and after yesterdays results,(3 losers and a NR)bank now stands at £709.
Just 1 bet today,Newmarket 5.15 TABARET 20-1 Skybet and Betfred,£35.50 win.

A 3-5pt bet would make u even more selective, even try just one a month, u land it and its a home run!! these little bets are getting you to the bases before you know it you could be out. Your showing good dicipline trading could be ur forte

18th,
penultimate day and betting bank now stands at £673.50.
Quite a gamble almost came off yesterday with Tabaret being backed down to 8-1 and was only just beaten in a blanket finish.
I've noticed that the majority of these bets do, for whatever reason, come in for quite a lot of support, and it seems that early prices should be taken.Although this month will be a losing one, if early prices had been taken a profit of around 8pts would have been achieve,still not brilliant, but a profit nevertheless.
1 bet today,and in the 4.20 at Redcar TABARET again qualifies as a bet.10-1 with William Hills £33.80 win.

Following on from bio's idea.I counted 51 bets so far { i could be  a few out}. The current loss is 327. Therefeore  you would beed an extra 6.5 points per bet to get to break even.I hear you say" no I only need it about the winning bets".But since you don't know where the winners will fall you need it about EVERY  bet.

   This is one of the most misunderstood aspects of punting.All sysyems  produce some winners.But those winners are effectively random.Time of occurence is unknown.So it is neccessary to get the "overs" about every single bet in order to win long term.For the  TABARET bet the available odds are 10-1, you will need to get 16-1.
Thats why filtering your selections is a great idea.You will cut out  a lot of the losers, some winners too.But the require "overs will reduce, thus increasing your long term chances.
  If you were to cut 70% of the bets but produce a certain profit, it would then be just a case of upping the bet size to produce a good income.Forget about your need for "gambling action" goldie and concentrate on winning.There's no doubt your system has merit.

Mrben,
You've raised one or two interesting points here,which could well be valid.I'am still at the early stage of filtering bets as to try and get the best returns,but,due to lack of certain data i can only analyse the last 8 weeks results so for the time being its a case of further monitering.As i wrote earlier,the reasons for better performance seem obvious,but 8 weeks is nowhere near enough time to make a proper coclusion.
Last day on system today and with NR yesterday bank stays same.
3 bets today all £33.80win.
Yarmouth 4.45 STERNIAN 11-1 William Hills.
Ary      5.30 MONTE MAYOR ONE 4-1 general..
Beverly  8.30 LIBERTY SHIP 4-1 general.
*There has been a lot of support for AZADAY in the 4.45 at Yarmouth,and i would be weary of this one against our selection(This may be another area i could look into when filtering selections.)

20th,
The months up and system did not perform as expected.
Out of the 54 bets there were only 11 winners and an overall loss of -4.5 pts to level stake.Final bank ended up at £572.1, a loss of 43%,infact the last 30 days results were the 3rd worse since i started.On an average month i would normally expect aprofit on turnover in excess of 65% with a strike rate of almost 30%.
I looking at ways to maximize profits by generally being more selective,but,because i've had one bad month i don't want to start tinkering about too much.
Anyway,thanks for the positive input guys-You know who you are-and hopefully i'll post again in the not too distant future.

Was there a reason you chose this 30 day period? Historically is this a better than average period than other times of the year?

well done goldie.Full plaudits to you for the courage to  post for 30 days.Let the forum know if you do any tweaks and the results.

All the best
               Mrben