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The question is how that song ever finished 2nd,beggars belief to me.
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lapsy - because their supporters would slam in votes if someone farted their national anthem as their entry.
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I'm amazed they never just banned them - they did for Russia.
Would be much easier than letting them into this contest, then trying desperately to reduce their chances of winning. |
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You want to ban Ukraine as well? These arguments are incessantly daft. People vote in public votes for all sorts of reasons, and ev has always been impacted by diaspora and 'friendly nations', then you get to juries nobbling the supposed competition.
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Were they second on merit and is it fair on other countries?
Surely the answer is no to both. If that is what this competition is becoming it has lost its soul. |
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Why do you care? You seem obsessed by Israel, I wonder why that is. Why are you not equally moaning about Ukraine's politically motivated televote?
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Am i right?
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As usual, no. The public vote, the votes are added up. When they were totalled up for individual countries, Israel reached third in the table. Do you think Moldova reached 4th on 'merit'?
The juries allegedly award points on musical and artistic merit, which is meant to offset the public, who vote based on motivation. And yes, wanting a particular country to do well is merit based. |
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And the glaring, inconvenient example for the racists is that Ukraine came 5th. But there is tumbleweed about that (a far less creditable entry than Israel as it happens).
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A pile o chite Cider^ That song didn't deserve 2nd musically or artistically and not even a top 6, if you think it did it says a lot.
The Ukranian song was far superior. |
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The professionals put Ukraine in 15th, Israel 8th
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Even without the pogrom, Israel this year would have been in the running. It is undoubtedly however contaminated by politics and racists, like most people I expected the virtue signalling to infect juries like it has in the recent past. Absolutely nobody knows for sure where Ukraine or Israel would have finished, without the external factors. But people miss the blindingly obvious, if it wasn't for all the Israel hate, you probably wouldn't get the contrarian voting.
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I think it got no points from the UK jury. Embarrassing and unprofessional. But sadly, inevitable. They gave Ukraine 7, naturally :)
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There's always been some support for countries based on other aspects than song - but only two stand out - Ukraine and Israel.
The Ukraine one was fairly organic (a natural televote that won it), but Israel have tried to buy country televotes in an organised campaign (see Spain's results for example last year). If Ukraine won every year, then yes, I'd agree with removing them too. Any act that just ignores song and only becomes a voting campaign to stitch up a win should always be removed from a singing contest like this. |
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If it only gets them to third, it's not that organised!
Israel haven't won at all due to the political element. Ukraine, at least once, arguably twice since I've been involved. If Israel, or any other entry, were repeatedly winning due to external factors then yes they would need to take some mitigation. But we're not in that space. To pretend it isn't about anything other than the widespread racism that Jews have suffered around the world since the pogrom would be completely disingenuous. The fear on Saturday was palpable, and that fear wasn't that the considered best song wouldn't win. In contrast, they celebrated Ukraine winning (the 'bubble' and the commentariat). |
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Anyway, in more positive news, Dara is at number 12 on global spotify. Entered at #9 in the UK chart.
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This thread is littered with people making less than glowing comments about various countries and their songs.
Fair game, fair comment. Mention one particular country and a few get crazy triggered. They go off spaffing and spurting like a dropped bottle of cola. "It's about religion, religious righteousness, and religious phobias", and claiming it's all fix. You're nutz This is a song contest between countries, and the voting system is built in such a way that political allegiances and other things such as who's civilians are being attacked? and who is attacking a lot of civilians? come in to play and influence the voters and voting system. If this was a song contest between religions, then your spaffing about religion would have relevance. It's not, religion has no relevance to the comments about any country in this competition. So stop whinging about religious bias ITT and shove a chocolate chip muffin up your starfish |
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lapsy joining the the thread just to b11tch about Israel's entry is everything to do with religion.
bearcub's racist tropes are everything to do with religion. Just two examples. As I've stated numerous times, our job is to judge what is going to happen, not what should happen (the job of trying to make money out of public voting events). Therefore the external factors, and how they might influence the professional juries (such as the UK), and the public voting are inevitably part of the analysis. |
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You think you know it all but know F A Cider.
I joined the thread to highlight the campaign of advertising of votes by Israel,i also said despite what i thought was a poor song that were a blinding bet EW @ 20/1 4 places. If you think that is morally right and fair on other countries frankly that is your problem. |
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Who cares about fair on a betting forum. Get yourself over to digital spy. Plenty of fellow travellers over there.
Nobody can meaningfully get on EW (aside from gb2), but assuming it was 1/5 odds place there was not much gravy in that bet. There's no way I know it all, likely closer to very little to be honest, but I do know that you only posted as it was another opportunity to demonstrate your vitriol of Israel. And yes, it is tiresome. |
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The advertising and campaigning by Israel for votes was made public when i posted,it was relevant of course to the thread and i didn't see it mentioned in posts for the previous days beforehand. You are ignoring that but knowing you i presumed you knew all that anyway as that is the way you come across.
You are showing yourself up with your lack of knowledge of betting when you are maintaining that 'not much gravy in that bet'. Say a small £10 ew,it returned £50, ie a 6/4 winner or a 250% return on your investment,you could also have laid back the win £10 on here and had a free bet on the win part which would have maximised your bet and the place part would have been 4/1. The price halved a day after my post and i presume though not certain BF would have been in the general ballpark of 10/1. There has been no vitriol whatsoever on my part re Israel on this thread,this only concerned the unfair addvantage they were trying to manipulate, you are a liar. |
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Not sure I would be referencing a lack of betting knowledge of someone else, then immediately stating that a 6/4 winner is a 250% return on funds invested. More work to do on that ratio ;)
Yes anyone taking EV remotely seriously was fully aware Israel were likely to overperform on the televote and underperform with the juries. It is also Wednesday tomorrow. You could easily have made that point without b1tching about the entry. Most followers of the event if being fair would have been very positive about the Israel entry in of itself, one of the stronger entries. But obviously with them, there are/were more pertinent factors to be considered. |
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I expect you to underline all this vitriol on the thread from me and back up your accusations.
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Where is it?
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Isreal had a decent song, it was a poor year, imo
but worthy of top 4 at least, The right song won for me, but restricting votes was a good thing, take it down to 3 per person, there are always ways around it, but if you are that bothered maybe ruining a song contest for political gain.. should see a ban. |
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