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peckerdunne
14 Dec 22 10:37
Joined:
Date Joined: 26 Apr 12
| Topic/replies: 47,977 | Blogger: peckerdunne's blog
Very sad but far too frequent occurrence.

People have died in a boating incident of the kent coast.
Pause Switch to Standard View Channel migrants Rescued, some.
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Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 3:46 PM GMT
pp every dinghie crossing can be tracked
All can be sent back
Report SirNorbertClarke December 14, 2022 3:48 PM GMT
If you don't like dinghies then why not simply arrive in the UK as a tourist

Or try the back of a lorry

Or get a job driving a lorry and abandon it in a layby

or fly into Dublin as a fellow EU tourist then drive across the border to the UK

Dinghies are just this years choice. There are plenty of other options
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 3:48 PM GMT
Either in France , anywhere between France and England , this side of the water, or as they reach England
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 14, 2022 3:49 PM GMT
Well they may be able to be tracked but it's clear they're not are they. If the worst that happens is they're towed back to Calais then they've faced a hell of a lot worse.
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 3:52 PM GMT
There are other  options , we are talking about people crossing
the channel . This is an option we should stop and is probably
one of the easiest to stop .
Report akabula December 14, 2022 3:53 PM GMT
risking their lives crossing the Med in dinghies

Not surprising that Porkie only ever sees this through the eyes of the illegal immigrants.
What about the lives of the rescue services who they are putting at risk?
The RNLI are currently advertising for donations. I wonder how many people will give given where the cash is going.
Report SirNorbertClarke December 14, 2022 3:53 PM GMT
Speaking as a former raider engineer I can tell you detecting small craft at sea is a very difficult job. That is why small vessels mount radar reflectors on their masts.
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 3:54 PM GMT
pp , I’ll try again
If they are stopped and returned to France
They will , unless extremely stupid not keep trying
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 14, 2022 4:00 PM GMT

Dec 14, 2022 -- 9:53AM, akabula wrote:


risking their lives crossing the Med in dinghiesNot surprising that Porkie only ever sees this through the eyes of the illegal immigrants.What about the lives of the rescue services who they are putting at risk?The RNLI are currently advertising for donations. I wonder how many people will give given where the cash is going.


Fair point. Have you donated to the RNLI lately aka?

Report PorcupineorPineapple December 14, 2022 4:01 PM GMT

Dec 14, 2022 -- 9:54AM, lfc1971 wrote:


pp , I’ll try again If they are stopped and returned to France They will , unless extremely stupid not keep trying


just epic thickness

Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:02 PM GMT
As a person with eyesight I can tell you
that detecting a quite large object full of a large group of people
travelling across a small stretch of water is a very easy thing to do
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:05 PM GMT
pineapple becoming abusive now
leftists are like that . Now try and keep up

All dinghies can be tracked and all can be sent back
I know you don’t like to hear that pp
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 14, 2022 4:07 PM GMT
If they can all be tracked how have so many sneaked in?
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:10 PM GMT
I don’t know that any have sneaked in ?
If we have a policy of tracking , stopping , returning immediately
Then none would sneak in
Report Foinavon December 14, 2022 4:11 PM GMT
I'm with porky on ID cards. I carried one with me (residency card for foreigners) for years when I lived in France. It had to be renewed at regular intervals and certainly would have impeded illegal activities as you had to show it to do all sorts of things or on demand from a police officer.
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:11 PM GMT
How many have sneaked in ?
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 14, 2022 4:11 PM GMT
Lots. Let's say at least 10,000.
Report SirNorbertClarke December 14, 2022 4:12 PM GMT

As a person with eyesight I can tell you
that detecting a quite large object full of a large group of people
travelling across a small stretch of water is a very easy thing to do


Really?

Then why does the channel navigation information service (CNIS) use radar?

Why do enormous merchant ships use secondary radar transponders?

Why do big ships run over small vessels?



I suspect, like in a lot of matters, you know sweet FA about surveillance of shipping channels.
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:14 PM GMT
And how many have been sent back ?
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:19 PM GMT
Tell me this noblet

How many small vessels , including dinghies
were run over by a large vessel this year ?
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:19 PM GMT
In the channel crossing from France ?
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:25 PM GMT
Because if it was none
Thanks for making my point for me

It appears as usual you’re having problems thinking logically
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:28 PM GMT
How many was it ?

come back when you know the answer , thanks anyway
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:33 PM GMT
I noticed pineapple  hasn’t told us how many
of those  ‘ 10,000 ‘  who sneaked in were returned
to France and tried again …
Report SirNorbertClarke December 14, 2022 4:34 PM GMT
You are demonstrating another area of your ignorance.

The channel navigation information service (CNIS) is directing traffic in the English Channel to prevent collisions.

Small vessels not engaged in illegal activities use radar reflectors and in some cases transponders and VHF radio to alert CNIS of their whereabouts.

If you are a dinghy your height will be about 6ft max and you won't be made out of a very reflective material so Primary radar won't detect you. At best you'll be a speck in a lot of clutter.

The idea that every small vessel is visible to CNIS or the royal navy is poppycock.
Report dukeofpuke December 14, 2022 4:38 PM GMT
1300 in uk jails about another 10,000 in criminal gangs
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:40 PM GMT
Ah , it was you that mentioned radar and of course
large vessels have to be forewarned of small objects
as it takes time to alter course and speed etc

That’s not relevant to spotting dinghies in the channel !
We’ve no intention of running over them in a large vessel

Now as usual noblet you’re not making any sense
Report akabula December 14, 2022 4:47 PM GMT
lfc1971
Tell me this noblet
How many small vessels , including dinghies
were run over by a large vessel this year ?


I'd imagine it was quite a few on Nobbys watch.
he was known as Uncle Albert for a reason.
Report markzzz December 14, 2022 4:49 PM GMT
I for one am not going to feign concern about these law-breaking people who are knowingly taking risks whilst breaking the law.

I do not mourn "joy-riders" who are killed or injured. I do not mourn burglars who are shot by irate farmers.

Certainly I don't wish them harm, but they are accepting the risk when they illegally contract to cross the channel. If they were not breaking the law, they would not have died. Caveat emptor.
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:50 PM GMT
You see noblet there’s a difference in a large unwieldy vessel trying not to run over
or bump into something in the channel

And trying to see something in the channel
See where you are going wrong - again ?
good
Report Dr Crippen December 14, 2022 4:52 PM GMT
Don't you get the feeling that the lefties are desperate not to stop the illegals coming?

As if they can’t wait for us to be outnumbered.
Report akabula December 14, 2022 4:57 PM GMT
Agreed mark but it must be noted that not only did they endanger themselves they endangered the lives of those in the rescue services
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:58 PM GMT
They seem to be able to convince themselves of anything
dr c , no matter how ludicrous , it’s really just intellectual dishonesty
( that’s the nicest way I can think of saying it )
they’re certainly not thinkers
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 4:59 PM GMT
noblet and pp are good examples of that ..
Report akabula December 14, 2022 5:02 PM GMT
I'd imagine lfc that having a hatred for the UK plays a big part in this for some.
Report SirNorbertClarke December 14, 2022 6:00 PM GMT
lfc, you know next to nothing about radar and the difficulties of detecting small craft at sea. Trying to explain it to you is like trying to educate a pigeon.

I'll leave you to your trill.
Report akabula December 14, 2022 6:04 PM GMT
I think I'd rather have Uncle Albert in charge of the radar rather than Nobby.
Report peckerdunne December 14, 2022 6:10 PM GMT
Senegal India Iraq Afghanistan
Report lfc1971 December 14, 2022 10:02 PM GMT
4 dead , this madness cannot be allowed to continue
Report Timber December 15, 2022 5:41 AM GMT
This migrant issue is huge, if the Tories grow a backbone and solve it with new laws they will gain a lot of votes
Report Timber December 15, 2022 5:43 AM GMT
I'd prefer we spent 10 million a day on stopping every dinghy, rather than allowing these creatures to fester in hotels
Report SirNorbertClarke December 15, 2022 8:52 AM GMT
Calling people creatures, your overt racism is showing Timber
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 9:05 AM GMT
Oh dear now safe streets has joined in with the racism Sad

and no condemnation of the rioting and violence of the Moroccan supporters
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 9:15 AM GMT
Macron all happy and smiles this morning on France24 en direct
With not a care in the world about the channel deaths . Forget about football
and do your job macron
Report Dr Crippen December 15, 2022 9:33 AM GMT
It's striking the way illegal economic migrants are made out to be victims.
No one makes them pay the traffickers thousands of Euros to get on flimsy boats.
They choose to do it.
No one is forcing them to do anything, especially to leave a safe country like France, but still they come.

So why do lefties see them as victims?
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 9:35 AM GMT
Your regular reminder that ~75% of asylum applications are granted and they aren't in fact illegal economic migrants at all but are refugees.
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 9:39 AM GMT
Your regular reminder that we are talking about stopping illegal migrants
crossing the channel
Report Dr Crippen December 15, 2022 9:44 AM GMT
No wonder I posted this after reading PP.

Don't you get the feeling that the lefties are desperate not to stop the illegals coming?

As if they can’t wait for us to be outnumbered.
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 9:47 AM GMT

Dec 15, 2022 -- 3:39AM, lfc1971 wrote:


Your regular reminder that we are talking about stopping illegal migrants crossing the channel


I've no problem with that per se, but we've essentially shut down the mechanisms for genuine refugees to claim asylum and now they feel they are forced to use this route. That a few bad apples join them is a consequence of our decisions.

Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 9:48 AM GMT

Dec 14, 2022 -- 10:11AM, Foinavon wrote:


I'm with porky on ID cards. I carried one with me (residency card for foreigners) for years when I lived in France. It had to be renewed at regular intervals and certainly would have impeded illegal activities as you had to show it to do all sorts of things or on demand from a police officer.


yep, same in Malta. Just not sure what the argument against them is really.

Report Timber December 15, 2022 9:49 AM GMT

Dec 15, 2022 -- 2:52AM, SirNorbertClarke wrote:


Calling people creatures, your overt racism is showing Timber


People who pay child torturers & rapists 10k to get on a dinghy to enter a country illegally are creatures

Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 9:51 AM GMT
They are leaving France by dinghie - if they are in France they
shouldn’t be applying for asylum in England so any process or lack of such for asylum seekers in these cases does not apply
Report Dr Crippen December 15, 2022 9:52 AM GMT
Here we have a chronic shortage of houses. A health service on its knees. Every public service under pressure. Hotels bursting with people who have entered the country illegally,  and the lefties are arguing to make everything worse.

It’s no wonder Maggie called these lot - ''the enemy within.''
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 9:53 AM GMT

Dec 15, 2022 -- 3:51AM, lfc1971 wrote:


They are leaving France by dinghie - if they are in France they shouldn’t be applying for asylum in England so any process or lack of such for asylum seekers in these cases does not apply


Well, that may be the rule in your head but it's not a rule that any western nation actually follows

Report Timber December 15, 2022 9:55 AM GMT
You can apply for asylum in your choice of country, HOWEVER if you've got 10k to pay the worst humans imaginable then your claim should be null and void IMMEDIATELY
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 9:58 AM GMT

Dec 15, 2022 -- 3:52AM, Dr Crippen wrote:


Here we have a chronic shortage of houses. A health service on its knees. Every public service under pressure. Hotels bursting with people who have entered the country illegally,

Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 9:58 AM GMT
Yep, you truly are. You swallow every soundbite like the good little sheep you are. Tories promising to build hundreds of thousands of houses every year but build none. Hey, blame it on immigration! Tories promising to build 40 new hospitals but instead refuse to even sit down with nurses' unions and watch as the NHS is brought to its knees. Hey, blame it on immigration! Numbers of immigrants rising after brexit, no recruitment to match meaning they're now looking at shelf stackers to process claims and refugees being housed in unfit barracks where disease is widespread. Hey, blame it on immigration!

You should log on to ebay to get an extra braincell because that one's awful lonely.
Report Timber December 15, 2022 9:58 AM GMT
THE GREAT REPLACEMENT THEORY ... another 'conspiracy theory' coming true

Migrants will be encouraged to move to rural areas through a special visa to combat depopulation and replenish ageing communities under plans by Government advisers

Intelligent old British people replaced by simpletons who will work for pennies & have zero affinity to the country
Just what massive corporations want

.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/12/13/migrants-encouraged-move-rural-areas-boost-economies-population/?utm_content=telegraph&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=Echobox&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1670933678-1
Report SirNorbertClarke December 15, 2022 10:03 AM GMT
Public Service Announcement


This is lfc's smarter brother.

Please remember this when trying to reason with him.
Report Dr Crippen December 15, 2022 10:11 AM GMT
HOWEVER if you've got 10k to pay the worst humans imaginable then your claim should be null and void IMMEDIATELY

Yes, they've got 10K readily available, but they've haven't got any documents. Send them back!
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 10:18 AM GMT
pp last I checked the rules were that you apply for asylum in your first safe country
When did that change , or is France not considered to be a safe country ?
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 10:30 AM GMT
Oh well , it seems that’s another question that will remain
mysteriously unanswered
Report SirNorbertClarke December 15, 2022 11:53 AM GMT
Ask your smarter brother

Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 1:39 PM GMT

Dec 15, 2022 -- 4:18AM, lfc1971 wrote:


pp last I checked the rules were that you apply for asylum in your first safe country When did that change , or is France not considered to be a safe country ?


Not the rule I've ever heard. Can you point me to it please.

Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 2:29 PM GMT
Well I heard it from Italy’s new Prime Minister
This is what she said : Under current EU regulations
migrants reaching Italy must have their asylum requests
processed there , a process that can take months or years .
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 2:31 PM GMT
Does France have different rules to Italy ?
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 2:32 PM GMT
That's not what the EU says - https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/policies/migration-and-asylum/common-europ...
Report Foinavon December 15, 2022 2:38 PM GMT
You have got it wrong nobby, he looks more like sparrow's big brother to me.
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 2:40 PM GMT
That is what the EU regulations say
Unless Germany or France or any other country agrees to take on
the responsibility of processing asylum seekers it must take place in Italy

Here are the Italian pms words ‘ if we let them in and they can’t go north
Italy becomes the refugee camp of Europe ‘ ‘ That isn’t reasonable
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 2:50 PM GMT
Got it now pp ?
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 2:53 PM GMT
I've literally given you a link to what the EU follows.
Report Dr Crippen December 15, 2022 2:53 PM GMT
Got it now pp ?

That's impossible lfc - he'll be back tomorrow with the same arguments.
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 2:58 PM GMT
It's the one argument. It's the EU's one. FFS
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 3:10 PM GMT
I’ve read it and you haven’t understood it
I’ll explain again . If a country agrees to take some asylum seekers
from another safe country ( the EU ) then those asylum claims can be processed
in let’s say Germany rather than Italy
However if Germany or another EU country declines then the asylum claim must take place in Italy

Now England has not agreed to take these migrants crossing the channel by dinghie
Their asylum claims should be processed in France as it is a safe country

Understand the rules now pp ?
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 3:13 PM GMT
So you're saying the EU has a rule saying countries can simply refuse to process asylum claims?

That's what you're saying?
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 3:20 PM GMT
Assuming they aren't signed up to the Refugee Convention, though I think everyone in the EU has done.
Report flat16 December 15, 2022 3:24 PM GMT
Give up lfc "you can beat it and eat it but you cannot educate pork".
The populations of Africa 1.4 BILLION ,population of Asia 1.4 Billion only a do gooder leftie could think little UK ,could absorb every single male ,unskilled economic migrant who fancies a giro and a bit of room service and can plead to a lawyer Starmer crony any old spurious sob story.Should we manage to accommodate the wishes of the many ,the dependants scam kicks in.
The socialist plan to solve this ,ask that nice Mr Macron to hold a few back at a price ,like he did before Brexit ,did he fck.
Report SirNorbertClarke December 15, 2022 3:26 PM GMT
PorcupineorPineapple what did I tell you about explaining things to lfc

Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 3:38 PM GMT
pp that’s not what I am saying
Obviously when migrants arrive in England illegally or illegally
we have to process them . That’s why we have thousands occupying our hotels
The point is EU countries will come to an agreement to take so many migrants
( some may even opt out I don’t know but anyway ) if there is an understanding then
Migrants don’t have to apply for asylum in the first safe country ( say Italy )
But that does not mean that European countries should not and indeed they must
control their borders from illegal migration .
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 3:39 PM GMT
And another one...Doesn't matter how upset some people are at refugees or migrants or whoever. You don't just get to make the rules up to what you want them to be. We signed up to legally binding stuff. Them's the rules. No amount of stomping your feet and throwing your rusk around won't change it.
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 3:42 PM GMT
We are happy to abide by the rules
But are just attempting to stop the madness
of people crossing the channel from France in dinghies
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 3:43 PM GMT
England doubtless will take its fair share
But that shouldn’t include thousands crossing the channel
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 3:45 PM GMT
I actually agree with that point (3.38) mostly (Shocked)

But I'm wondering how it relates to the point you originally made - pp last I checked the rules were that you apply for asylum in your first safe country
When did that change , or is France not considered to be a safe country ?


You first said refugees had to apply in the first safe country. This is clearly not true though to your credit you seem to have taken the last few hours to learn it.
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 3:51 PM GMT
Migrants don’t have to apply for asylum in their first safe country
IF another country ( say EU ) agrees to take a proportion of migrants from one safe country ( say Italy )
Also IF migrants arrive across borders illegally say into Germany then it is probably going to be Germany
who processes the asylum claim
That’s assuming they don’t travel through France and across the channel by dinghie to England
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 3:55 PM GMT
Migrants deciding where to apply for asylum is not contingent on countries' "quotas".

Migrants simply have the right to decide where to apply for asylum, full stop. They could do a world tour first if they wanted, but the Geneva Convention says they can choose where they want to claim and can't be forced to do it in a specific place.
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 3:59 PM GMT
Nice , I’m not going to get into that just now pp Happy
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 4:01 PM GMT
There's nothing to get into. It's an old trope that's been debunked comprehensively. Flat may throw his dummy out but them's the rules.
Report Timber December 15, 2022 4:06 PM GMT
Funny how the Japanese have virtually zero illegals or refugees
Report Timber December 15, 2022 4:08 PM GMT
Third largest economy in the world

Japan granted refugee status to 74 asylum-seekers in 2021. You might be astounded at this tiny number, but it is the highest since Japan first recognized refugees in 1982. Nearly half of the 74 people granted asylum last year came from Myanmar following last year's military takeover
Report SirNorbertClarke December 15, 2022 4:09 PM GMT
lfc do you remember saying that a radar could detect a dinghy anywhere in the English channel? And do you remember me telling you radar ain't that good at detecting small craft at sea?

Smart motorway radar misses a third of broken-down vehicles, says regulator

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/dec/15/smart-motorway-radar-misses-40-percent-of-broken-down-vehicles-says-regulator



Turns out radar ain't that good at spotting cars on motorways either Laugh
Report Timber December 15, 2022 4:09 PM GMT

Dec 15, 2022 -- 10:08AM, Timber wrote:


Third largest economy in the worldJapan granted refugee status to 74 asylum-seekers in 2021. You might be astounded at this tiny number, but it is the highest since Japan first recognized refugees in 1982. Nearly half of the 74 people granted asylum last year came from Myanmar following last year's military takeover


99% homogenous

Meanwhile we are becoming mongrelised

Report SirNorbertClarke December 15, 2022 4:21 PM GMT
mongrelised

It started with the Romans and Vikings then the Normans came along etc etc

We have a bunch of Germans camped in Buckingham Palace too.

No such thing as pure English and hasn't been for 2000 years.
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 4:33 PM GMT
If the forums chief liar imagining things in his little brain again
Where did I say that  noblet ?
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 4:45 PM GMT
Where did he say you said it?
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 4:51 PM GMT
Post 16:09
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 4:52 PM GMT
Take your time noblet …
Report akabula December 15, 2022 5:16 PM GMT
Nobby showing he knows nothing about history as well as radar.
Report PorcupineorPineapple December 15, 2022 7:22 PM GMT
didn't timber make the 16.09 post?
Report lapsy pa December 15, 2022 7:59 PM GMT
Russian bots going rogue! tis always been like this.
Report lfc1971 December 15, 2022 8:50 PM GMT
We all have our good and bad days

but I’m getting a very mean vibe from Mr Lapsy today
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