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Racing pundit and Grand National winning trainer Ted Walsh says he is prepared to answer any questions the Irish Turf Club has after an inquiry into Foxrock's run at Punchestown in December was reopened.
Foxrock, who is owned by businessman and well-known horse enthusiast Barry Connell, finished third in the race behind Henry De Bromhead's Grand Jesture.
Walsh and jockey Adrian Heskin attracted the attention of the stewards when Foxrock finished third at the track, with officials accepting the seven-year-old had finished slightly lame and lost both front shoes during the course of the race, although they banned Heskin for not reporting the issues in the first instance.
Heskin has explained to Walsh that he wasn't pleased with how his horse had moved in the second half of the race and as the horse returned to the stable yard, Walsh noticed that both the horses front shoes were missing.
The stewards received a report from The Turf Club veterinary officer who stated that Foxrock had pulled off both his front shoes in running and was slightly lame post-race.
The Turf Club has reopened the enquiry after new video evidence emerged. It is understood that the camera evidence located at the parade ring in Punchestown show Foxrock wearing both front shoes after the race.
The Turf Club’s Referrals Committee is scheduled to meet with all the relevant parties on April 2 and Ted Walsh told the Irish Times that he is prepared to answer any question.
“Obviously they’re not happy with whatever happened on that day and they’re reopening the enquiry,” the Kill, Co Kildare based trainer said. “I’ll be there at the enquiry to answer any questions they want.”
Foxrock delivered one of Walsh biggest recent successes when he won the **** Handicap Chase at Leopardstown in January.
Afterwards the horse was runner-up to Carlingford Lough in the Grade One Hennessy Gold Cup and was supplemented for the Ryanair Chase at Cheltenham last week where he finished last of the 12 runners behind Tony McCoy's Uxizandre.
Foxrock, who is owned by businessman and well-known horse enthusiast Barry Connell, finished third in the race behind Henry De Bromhead's Grand Jesture.
Walsh and jockey Adrian Heskin attracted the attention of the stewards when Foxrock finished third at the track, with officials accepting the seven-year-old had finished slightly lame and lost both front shoes during the course of the race, although they banned Heskin for not reporting the issues in the first instance.
Heskin has explained to Walsh that he wasn't pleased with how his horse had moved in the second half of the race and as the horse returned to the stable yard, Walsh noticed that both the horses front shoes were missing.
The stewards received a report from The Turf Club veterinary officer who stated that Foxrock had pulled off both his front shoes in running and was slightly lame post-race.
The Turf Club has reopened the enquiry after new video evidence emerged. It is understood that the camera evidence located at the parade ring in Punchestown show Foxrock wearing both front shoes after the race.
The Turf Club’s Referrals Committee is scheduled to meet with all the relevant parties on April 2 and Ted Walsh told the Irish Times that he is prepared to answer any question.
“Obviously they’re not happy with whatever happened on that day and they’re reopening the enquiry,” the Kill, Co Kildare based trainer said. “I’ll be there at the enquiry to answer any questions they want.”
Foxrock delivered one of Walsh biggest recent successes when he won the **** Handicap Chase at Leopardstown in January.
Afterwards the horse was runner-up to Carlingford Lough in the Grade One Hennessy Gold Cup and was supplemented for the Ryanair Chase at Cheltenham last week where he finished last of the 12 runners behind Tony McCoy's Uxizandre.
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"The Turf Club veterinary officer who stated that Foxrock had pulled off both his front shoes in running and was slightly lame post-race.
" amazing how the racing mafia always stick together. didnt a vet at bangor in the uk recently have his evidence ignored regarding a non trier. if guilty i hope they ban all the walshes all from every racecourse in ireland.
" amazing how the racing mafia always stick together. didnt a vet at bangor in the uk recently have his evidence ignored regarding a non trier. if guilty i hope they ban all the walshes all from every racecourse in ireland.
It certainly needs addressing , contridictory evidence from the vet is something that could open a can of worms , why say it lost both shoes if it didn't , was he asked to say that I wonder , hardly something you would make up now is it...Await developments with bated breath...
Ted's a wrong un, who'd have guessed 
rumours of a certain sponsor shaking up the can of worms 
Wetherbys Ireland were the sponsor of the race in question?
This case has shifted completely,in the first instance the horse Foxrock was looking at a ban,now the trainer is looking at a ban some shift.
He is in some bother.
He declared the horse clipped heels,that didnt happen,he claimed the horse lost his two front shoes yet he complainant has produced a video showing the horse returning to the parade ring with both shoes on.
He may well get away with it but its still interesting.
I must be one of he few that really like the Walsh family.
Ted is knowledgeable,likeable and a good commentator.
Ruby is the best jockey I've e ver seen and is a great judge.
Katie is a honey and another brilliant rider,that iconic photo of her is one of the sweetest I've ever seen.
He declared the horse clipped heels,that didnt happen,he claimed the horse lost his two front shoes yet he complainant has produced a video showing the horse returning to the parade ring with both shoes on.
He may well get away with it but its still interesting.
I must be one of he few that really like the Walsh family.
Ted is knowledgeable,likeable and a good commentator.
Ruby is the best jockey I've e ver seen and is a great judge.
Katie is a honey and another brilliant rider,that iconic photo of her is one of the sweetest I've ever seen.
One thing is for sure, no matter what the result of this and i believe it will be swept under the carpet, the obnoxious Walsh and family will be back on RTE in time for Fairyhouse and Punchestown.
Owner took the high ground in the Fenton case.Wonder what his slant is in this one?
Widman you will go a long way to find anyone who doesn't respect the Walsh for what they have collectively achieved in racing. No-one doubts their abilities or knowledge. However, that doesn't necessarily equate to liking them. Ted is past his sell by date in terms of racing coverage though he throws out the odd decent quip. Never met Ruby but the overwhelming majority of people I know who have dealt with him find him a dislikable smart arse who isn't nearly as clever as he thinks he is. Greatest rider to grace the jumps game though.
The evidence must be damning to the eye given it forced the hand of the authorities to act. It's odds on some kind of fudge conclusion will be reached.
The evidence must be damning to the eye given it forced the hand of the authorities to act. It's odds on some kind of fudge conclusion will be reached.
All it needs now is some unconnected barrister
Yeah, difference between being loved and respected. They'll fudge it is right, just put out something that what Ted said wasn't transcribed properly or whatever.
Nothing worse than a guy who is always tapping cigarettes in the smoking area.
Turf Club reserve judgement on running of Ted Walsh-trained Foxrock
‘A volume of evidence to consider’ after 19 witnesses called to day-long hearing
The Turf Club has reserved judgement after a day-long hearing into the running of the Ted Walsh-trained Foxrock at Punchestown in December.
The hearing concluded at 7.45pm on Saturday evening after evidence was heard throughout the day at Turf Club headquarters at the Curragh.
Trainer Walsh and rider Adrian Heskin were originally interviewed following the race, in which Foxrock finished third, with the local stewards hearing from the on-course veterinary officer that the horse had lost both front shoes during the race.
The only action taken was to suspend Heskin for one day for failing to report the matter.
Fresh video evidence subsequently became available to the regulating body, prompting the reopening of the inquiry in front of the Turf Club’s Referrals Committee.
The hearing started at 10am, with Grand National-winning trainer Walsh, who was represented by former attorney general and minister for justice Michael McDowell, giving evidence for around an hour and 20 minutes.
Trainers Aidan O’Brien and Willie Mullins were among the expert witnesses called, together with several vets and farriers.
After the hearing finished Turf Club chief executive Denis Egan said: “There were 19 witnesses called, seven from the Turf Club and 12 from the other side. There were two inquiries, the original race and post-race.
“Judgement was reserved and will be communicated in writing to both parties.
“There is a volume of evidence to consider.”
Ted went in all guns blazing and with the cheque book open.
‘A volume of evidence to consider’ after 19 witnesses called to day-long hearing
The Turf Club has reserved judgement after a day-long hearing into the running of the Ted Walsh-trained Foxrock at Punchestown in December.
The hearing concluded at 7.45pm on Saturday evening after evidence was heard throughout the day at Turf Club headquarters at the Curragh.
Trainer Walsh and rider Adrian Heskin were originally interviewed following the race, in which Foxrock finished third, with the local stewards hearing from the on-course veterinary officer that the horse had lost both front shoes during the race.
The only action taken was to suspend Heskin for one day for failing to report the matter.
Fresh video evidence subsequently became available to the regulating body, prompting the reopening of the inquiry in front of the Turf Club’s Referrals Committee.
The hearing started at 10am, with Grand National-winning trainer Walsh, who was represented by former attorney general and minister for justice Michael McDowell, giving evidence for around an hour and 20 minutes.
Trainers Aidan O’Brien and Willie Mullins were among the expert witnesses called, together with several vets and farriers.
After the hearing finished Turf Club chief executive Denis Egan said: “There were 19 witnesses called, seven from the Turf Club and 12 from the other side. There were two inquiries, the original race and post-race.
“Judgement was reserved and will be communicated in writing to both parties.
“There is a volume of evidence to consider.”
Ted went in all guns blazing and with the cheque book open.
Ted had McDowell representing him. Sounds like he called his sons employer as an expert witness along with AOB.
Willie and Aidan could be experts in dementia and say that Ted is in an advanced stage and therefore like Lord Janner not fit to stand trial.
Bit like Tom Queally who when caught drink driving claims on appeal that it is sleep driving.
Bit like Tom Queally who when caught drink driving claims on appeal that it is sleep driving.
this is without doubt a show down of sorts. given the 19 witnesses and legal heavyweights involved something certainly smells in the state of Denmark.
here is the official wording of the original enquiry
"The Stewards enquired into the running and riding of Foxrock, placed third, ridden by A.P. Heskin, and trained by T.M. Walsh. Evidence was heard from the rider and trainer concerned.
A.P. Heskin, stated that his instructions were to jump his mount off 5th or 6th, give him space at his fences, get into a good rhythm and do his best from there. He said early on the race was developing as he planned but after passing the stands, he clipped a heel, stumbled badly and lost his action and from there on he wasn't entirely happy with his mount, with him being behind the bridle from down the back straight. He said from about 4 out he was riding as strong as he could bearing in mind he wasn't entirely happy with how he was moving.
T.M. Walsh confirmed the instructions and stated that watching the race live he felt his rider could've been a bit more forceful between 3 out and 2 out, and he could've used his whip at this stage. However his rider explained on dismounting how he wasn't entirely happy with how the horse moved in the second half of the race and as the horse returned to the stable yard, Mr Walsh noticed that his front shoes were missing, and at this stage his riders report made sense and he was satisfied with the ride.
The Stewards also received a report from the Turf Club Veterinary Officer who stated that Foxrock had pulled off both his front shoes in running and was slightly lame post race.
Having viewed the recording of the race and considered the evidence, the Stewards noted the explanations offered by both rider and trainer, but were of the opinion A.P. Heskin was in breach of Rule 213 in that he failed to report in the first instance something that may have affected the running of his mount, and having taken his record into account, they suspended him for 1 raceday."
according to the above....ted noticed the 2 front shoes were missing when he looked at the horse in the stable yard...plus the turf club vet stated Foxrock had pulled off 2 front shoes(...though he does not mention where he examined the horse, or offer a view as to when the offending shoes lost their hooves".
todays re-opened case we are led to believe was based upon photographic evidence that the horse had said shoes intact some time soon after the race.
one assumes there are a few angles of approach.....if the evidence has us to believe that Foxrock shed the shoes between leaving the un-saddling area and his return to the stables......the option are...1--the horse merely by accident lost them between the two areas, plausible if rare...2---someone not so accidentally whipped them off.
as very very few people would have been on the actual scene, convicting on 2 would seem near impossible.
one ponders as to why this particular case was re-opened?
where did the new evidence come from, an inside turf club source or an ordinary joe soap?
with 19 witnesses, and a 3 week deferral indicates that there was a whole lot more to this case than meets the eye.
most punters and pundits are critical of the blind eye approach of the stewards and their stipe helpers oncourse, with far too many non jiggers ignored. I would be surprised if little more than waffle is the outcome of this referral. If so that I believe will be bad for the game, because it will be seen as trainers and wealthy owners putting the turf club and their investigators back in their box.
one thing for certain is that this case might major on personality incompatibilities putting it kindly.
here is the official wording of the original enquiry
"The Stewards enquired into the running and riding of Foxrock, placed third, ridden by A.P. Heskin, and trained by T.M. Walsh. Evidence was heard from the rider and trainer concerned.
A.P. Heskin, stated that his instructions were to jump his mount off 5th or 6th, give him space at his fences, get into a good rhythm and do his best from there. He said early on the race was developing as he planned but after passing the stands, he clipped a heel, stumbled badly and lost his action and from there on he wasn't entirely happy with his mount, with him being behind the bridle from down the back straight. He said from about 4 out he was riding as strong as he could bearing in mind he wasn't entirely happy with how he was moving.
T.M. Walsh confirmed the instructions and stated that watching the race live he felt his rider could've been a bit more forceful between 3 out and 2 out, and he could've used his whip at this stage. However his rider explained on dismounting how he wasn't entirely happy with how the horse moved in the second half of the race and as the horse returned to the stable yard, Mr Walsh noticed that his front shoes were missing, and at this stage his riders report made sense and he was satisfied with the ride.
The Stewards also received a report from the Turf Club Veterinary Officer who stated that Foxrock had pulled off both his front shoes in running and was slightly lame post race.
Having viewed the recording of the race and considered the evidence, the Stewards noted the explanations offered by both rider and trainer, but were of the opinion A.P. Heskin was in breach of Rule 213 in that he failed to report in the first instance something that may have affected the running of his mount, and having taken his record into account, they suspended him for 1 raceday."
according to the above....ted noticed the 2 front shoes were missing when he looked at the horse in the stable yard...plus the turf club vet stated Foxrock had pulled off 2 front shoes(...though he does not mention where he examined the horse, or offer a view as to when the offending shoes lost their hooves".
todays re-opened case we are led to believe was based upon photographic evidence that the horse had said shoes intact some time soon after the race.
one assumes there are a few angles of approach.....if the evidence has us to believe that Foxrock shed the shoes between leaving the un-saddling area and his return to the stables......the option are...1--the horse merely by accident lost them between the two areas, plausible if rare...2---someone not so accidentally whipped them off.
as very very few people would have been on the actual scene, convicting on 2 would seem near impossible.
one ponders as to why this particular case was re-opened?
where did the new evidence come from, an inside turf club source or an ordinary joe soap?
with 19 witnesses, and a 3 week deferral indicates that there was a whole lot more to this case than meets the eye.
most punters and pundits are critical of the blind eye approach of the stewards and their stipe helpers oncourse, with far too many non jiggers ignored. I would be surprised if little more than waffle is the outcome of this referral. If so that I believe will be bad for the game, because it will be seen as trainers and wealthy owners putting the turf club and their investigators back in their box.
one thing for certain is that this case might major on personality incompatibilities putting it kindly.
2 eye witnesses one turf club one a staff member for another trainer are supposed to be giving evidence that they saw ted pull off the shoes.....dont no if this is true....may b another rumor
To add even more intrigue I understand that the racecourse farrier on the day is also Ted's regular farrier.
He is taking no chances...interesting to see what story he came up with....AOB some wildcard
Obviously playing the Jesus Card.
The whole world knows what happened but proving it is another thing.
The whole world knows what happened but proving it is another thing.
Cant imagine the Walsh's egos are taking this sort of questioning well 
You wouldn't get McDowell for a tenner an hour. I have experience of a senior counsel charging 300 per hr just for reading a brief.
Can't imagine what McDowell would charge for the hearing. Also Mullins and o Brien giving up a Saturday to come to teds aid.
I read the above to the Mrs who's not mad into racing and she said ted must be bricking it.
Can't imagine what McDowell would charge for the hearing. Also Mullins and o Brien giving up a Saturday to come to teds aid.
I read the above to the Mrs who's not mad into racing and she said ted must be bricking it.
300 an hour is cheap for a senior counsel. I would guess 500 to 600 an hour for preparation and anything up to 10,000 for yesterdays hearing
Someone said it started at 10 am and finished at 7.45 pm. A long one - obviously plenty at stake. It would appear that there has to be a loser irrespective of result.
Unlike a normal court where the loser pays all costs, if Ted loses he will have to pay his own costs and those of the Turf Club but if he wins he will not get his costs, each side will bear their own.
someone involved yesterday told me that nothing is going to happen because apparently the turf club evidence was poor.
assuming the above is correct, and then one must question why the turf club reopened the case. in the normal civil law the dpp, representing the state, will only take to court cases he/she believes have a high chance of earning a prosection.
if the turf club lose this case due to lack of evidence, then someone needs to take responsibility as there will be a hefty legal cost involved and who is going to pony up for that...probably the state.
assuming the above is correct, and then one must question why the turf club reopened the case. in the normal civil law the dpp, representing the state, will only take to court cases he/she believes have a high chance of earning a prosection.
if the turf club lose this case due to lack of evidence, then someone needs to take responsibility as there will be a hefty legal cost involved and who is going to pony up for that...probably the state.
State will not have to pony up, it is not their court. If Ted wins he will not get costs so his remedy is to take the Turf Club to the Civil Courts which will cost him more money and if the civil courts agree with him it would set a dangerous precedent as it would mean in effect that the Turf Club would be unable to bring cases for fear of losing and inability to pay.
Dean McKeown went to the Civil Courts to try and get his BHA ban overturned, he failed and it cost him another £80,000 in costs.
Dean McKeown went to the Civil Courts to try and get his BHA ban overturned, he failed and it cost him another £80,000 in costs.
The Courts are very reluctant to involve themselves in these kinds of affairs so will nearly always uphold the finding of the sporting body. As you say, would be a very dangerous precedent.
Agree Neild though I remember a case where Bolger went to the High Court to overturn a ban on his stable jockey Christy Roche to enable him to ride in the Derby. From memory I think Bolger won, I guess he got costs
That's very interesting mrcombustible, would be a grand topic for someone studying Sports Law or the like. Bolger is some man to try and get the better of.
I thought that bolger/roche case, was st jovite in the king George, and without checking I think Stephan craine rode it at ascot, so he must have lost.
my point about costs, is even if Connell/walsh picks up their tabs, there still must be a decent tab for the turf club end, and as they are in effect subsidised by the state, hence a loss of a weak case, comes at a cost to the state, the individuals in the turf club will be at no monetary cost.
my point about costs, is even if Connell/walsh picks up their tabs, there still must be a decent tab for the turf club end, and as they are in effect subsidised by the state, hence a loss of a weak case, comes at a cost to the state, the individuals in the turf club will be at no monetary cost.
Suppose it might be laying down a marker that they are taking a firmer stance on this kind of thing. That might be the only good thing to come out of it. Don't think it will put people off trying, though. 95% of horse racing is losing to win after all.
Sorry Keen Leader you are correct the race was the King George and as Craine rode it he must have lost
acing: Piggott in pursuit of St Jovite
JOHN COBB Friday 24 July 1992
A HIGH COURT judge yesterday decided that Christy Roche will not be on board when St Jovite goes to post as favourite for tomorrow's King George VI and Queen Elizabeth Stakes, Jim Bolger will today adjudicate on whether Lester Piggott should be Roche's replacement.
Roche's application for an injunction that would prevent the Irish Turf Club from imposing a 15- day riding ban was refused yesterday morning after four days of legal argument. The court had barely cleared before Piggott began to angle for the ride. Booked to ride Alhijaz for John Dunlop in the Prix Daphnis at Evry, he has freed himself from that arrangement and will now definitely be at Ascot.
Whether he will be on St Jovite is another matter. Bolger was still making his way back from the Keeneland Sales in Kentucky yesterday and Piggott, when asked if he would be partnering the Irish Derby winner, said: 'I don't know yet.' On returning to his stable last night Bolger made it clear that he will not be rushed into a decision and will not announce who will partner St Jovite until this afternoon.
Alternatives to 56-year-old Piggott, who excelled in the last of his seven King George victories on Teenoso in 1984, are thin on the ground. Of Bolger's own team of riders only his son-in-law, Kevin Manning, is available as his apprentice, Conor Everard, will also be serving a ban this weekend.
The memory of the ride that Manning gave Bolger's Arrikala when they managed to get trapped behind User Friendly in the Irish Oaks is still fresh in the mind and a jockey with more big-race experience may be preferred. Cash Asmussen would seem to be Piggott's main rival in that category. The colt's owner, Virginia Kraft Payson, may favour her fellow American who was rumoured to have been on standby for the ride had Roche missed the Irish Derby .
Willie Carson is certainly unavailable for the mount. Michael Stoute confirmed yesterday that the Scot, who has won the race four times, will take over from the suspended Pat Eddery on the second favourite, Saddlers' Hall.
Roche, however, will be no more than a bystander and must now serve the remaining 12 days of his suspension immediately. A further legal avenue is open to him in an application to the Supreme Court, but that would now appear unlikely to succeed.
'I am sick and stunned. I can hardly believe it,' Roche said after Judge Declan Costello ruled that none of the complaints raised by Roche's legal counsel constituted, 'any breach of natural justice'.
Roche has been embroiled in a court battle with the Irish Turf Club since they suspended him for an incident at Naas last month. He lost his appeal against the ban, but after serving three days on the sidelines, won an injunction. On Wednesday his counsel claimed that the original appeal hearing had been unfair.
But Judge Gillespie, refusing the application, ruled that the Turf Club appeal 'was a full and proper inquiry' and that the evidence of a stipendiary steward was 'not prejudicial' to Roche.
That ruling, according to the Turf Club's Cahir O'Sullivan, was 'a good decision for sport'. And not a bad one for Pig
JOHN COBB Friday 24 July 1992
A HIGH COURT judge yesterday decided that Christy Roche will not be on board when St Jovite goes to post as favourite for tomorrow's King George VI and Queen Elizabeth Stakes, Jim Bolger will today adjudicate on whether Lester Piggott should be Roche's replacement.
Roche's application for an injunction that would prevent the Irish Turf Club from imposing a 15- day riding ban was refused yesterday morning after four days of legal argument. The court had barely cleared before Piggott began to angle for the ride. Booked to ride Alhijaz for John Dunlop in the Prix Daphnis at Evry, he has freed himself from that arrangement and will now definitely be at Ascot.
Whether he will be on St Jovite is another matter. Bolger was still making his way back from the Keeneland Sales in Kentucky yesterday and Piggott, when asked if he would be partnering the Irish Derby winner, said: 'I don't know yet.' On returning to his stable last night Bolger made it clear that he will not be rushed into a decision and will not announce who will partner St Jovite until this afternoon.
Alternatives to 56-year-old Piggott, who excelled in the last of his seven King George victories on Teenoso in 1984, are thin on the ground. Of Bolger's own team of riders only his son-in-law, Kevin Manning, is available as his apprentice, Conor Everard, will also be serving a ban this weekend.
The memory of the ride that Manning gave Bolger's Arrikala when they managed to get trapped behind User Friendly in the Irish Oaks is still fresh in the mind and a jockey with more big-race experience may be preferred. Cash Asmussen would seem to be Piggott's main rival in that category. The colt's owner, Virginia Kraft Payson, may favour her fellow American who was rumoured to have been on standby for the ride had Roche missed the Irish Derby .
Willie Carson is certainly unavailable for the mount. Michael Stoute confirmed yesterday that the Scot, who has won the race four times, will take over from the suspended Pat Eddery on the second favourite, Saddlers' Hall.
Roche, however, will be no more than a bystander and must now serve the remaining 12 days of his suspension immediately. A further legal avenue is open to him in an application to the Supreme Court, but that would now appear unlikely to succeed.
'I am sick and stunned. I can hardly believe it,' Roche said after Judge Declan Costello ruled that none of the complaints raised by Roche's legal counsel constituted, 'any breach of natural justice'.
Roche has been embroiled in a court battle with the Irish Turf Club since they suspended him for an incident at Naas last month. He lost his appeal against the ban, but after serving three days on the sidelines, won an injunction. On Wednesday his counsel claimed that the original appeal hearing had been unfair.
But Judge Gillespie, refusing the application, ruled that the Turf Club appeal 'was a full and proper inquiry' and that the evidence of a stipendiary steward was 'not prejudicial' to Roche.
That ruling, according to the Turf Club's Cahir O'Sullivan, was 'a good decision for sport'. And not a bad one for Pig
keen leader 19 Apr 15 20:17 Joined: 05 Feb 02 | Topic/replies: 500 | Blogger: keen leader's blog
someone involved yesterday told me that nothing is going to happen because apparently the turf club evidence was poor.
The Turf Club through its stewards has any amount of legal brainpower at its disposal (Frank Clarke, Tony Hunt, Neville O'Byrne, Phillip McCartan et al). One would imagine that they would have sought "in-house" legal opinion before proceeding with the case but perhaps not?
someone involved yesterday told me that nothing is going to happen because apparently the turf club evidence was poor.
The Turf Club through its stewards has any amount of legal brainpower at its disposal (Frank Clarke, Tony Hunt, Neville O'Byrne, Phillip McCartan et al). One would imagine that they would have sought "in-house" legal opinion before proceeding with the case but perhaps not?
When will the letter drop through Ted's letter-box or has anyone heard anything.
It will hardly happen before Punchestown anyway. A fudge is still the favourite in my book.
The report is utterly embarrassing one of the factors taken into account was teds clothes being clean, It stated they'd have to be dirty if he removed shoes 
http://www.turfclub.ie/web/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=3759...
Link to the decision for those less technologically inclined. A long read and incredulous in parts.
Link to the decision for those less technologically inclined. A long read and incredulous in parts.
Two of the choicer segments:
23. The Committee concluded on the basis of this evidence that two shoes could be lost by a horse during handling and movement after a race, but that such incidents, whilst not impossible, were extremely rare. It was specifically noted that the evidence and experience of Mr Kelly and Mr Gowing corroborated the evidence of Mr Smith by demonstrating that it was perfectly possible to go through a lengthy veterinary career dealing with racehorses without ever coming across such an incident. On this aspect of the enquiry, the committee preferred the evidence of these three experienced veterinary surgeons and accordingly, it totally rejected Mr Aidan O’Brien’s description of Mr Smith’s evidence as “nonsense”, and therefore approached the balance of his evidence on this issue with circumspection
34. The Committee noted that the conclusion of the inquiry rested more on an overall view of the facts than on the absolute credibility of any of the various contributions of Messrs Walsh, Bruen or Brady. Both the prior interview and the evidence of Mr Walsh were coloured by a clearly expressed and long-standing antipathy to the Turf Club and its officials, especially Mr Gordon, and contained much unnecessary and excessive assertion. In particular, the Committee rejected his allegation that he had been intimidated by Mr Gordon in the course of his interview. The Committee considered that Mr Walsh displayed a forthright and articulate personality, and would not be intimidated easily by anyone, including officials of the Turf Club, or Mr Gordon.
23. The Committee concluded on the basis of this evidence that two shoes could be lost by a horse during handling and movement after a race, but that such incidents, whilst not impossible, were extremely rare. It was specifically noted that the evidence and experience of Mr Kelly and Mr Gowing corroborated the evidence of Mr Smith by demonstrating that it was perfectly possible to go through a lengthy veterinary career dealing with racehorses without ever coming across such an incident. On this aspect of the enquiry, the committee preferred the evidence of these three experienced veterinary surgeons and accordingly, it totally rejected Mr Aidan O’Brien’s description of Mr Smith’s evidence as “nonsense”, and therefore approached the balance of his evidence on this issue with circumspection
34. The Committee noted that the conclusion of the inquiry rested more on an overall view of the facts than on the absolute credibility of any of the various contributions of Messrs Walsh, Bruen or Brady. Both the prior interview and the evidence of Mr Walsh were coloured by a clearly expressed and long-standing antipathy to the Turf Club and its officials, especially Mr Gordon, and contained much unnecessary and excessive assertion. In particular, the Committee rejected his allegation that he had been intimidated by Mr Gordon in the course of his interview. The Committee considered that Mr Walsh displayed a forthright and articulate personality, and would not be intimidated easily by anyone, including officials of the Turf Club, or Mr Gordon.
so here a brief outline of what happened..
1) Horse runs poorly. Jockey and trainer blame his shoes coming off.
2) Horse is later filmed wearing shoes shortly after
3) Trainer & Jockey are cleared of lying.
only in good ole ireland!!
1) Horse runs poorly. Jockey and trainer blame his shoes coming off.
2) Horse is later filmed wearing shoes shortly after
3) Trainer & Jockey are cleared of lying.
only in good ole ireland!!
Read the Irish times report and it reads as if the fact that the horse is filmed with shoes on after the race is totally ignored
Is it just me ?
Is it just me ?
Not necessarily, the premise of the re-opening was that they knew he had the shoes on after the race. Once everyone agreed on this the tape wouldn't have had much more purpose.
Basically the hearing was to investigate whether they could prove it was more likely chicanery was at play rather than the horse simply losing the shoes down the yard.
Basically the hearing was to investigate whether they could prove it was more likely chicanery was at play rather than the horse simply losing the shoes down the yard.
If the horse lost two shoes after the race between the parade ring and the wash area one question is unanswered.
Did anyone find two horseshoes lying about?
Did anyone find two horseshoes lying about?
We need Colombo.
"I worry. I mean, little things bother me. I'm a worrier. I mean, little insignificant details
- I lose my appetite. I can't eat. My wife, she says to me, "you know, you can really be pain."
"There are a couple of loose ends I'd like to tie up. Nothing important you understand."
"I worry. I mean, little things bother me. I'm a worrier. I mean, little insignificant details
- I lose my appetite. I can't eat. My wife, she says to me, "you know, you can really be pain."
"There are a couple of loose ends I'd like to tie up. Nothing important you understand."
We know its part of the game and i wouldnt say theres a trainer out there who didnt pull strokes at some stage of their career.
However that doesnt make it right and when someone is caught red handed then lies to their teeth and are still found out then the shame is on the turf club imo.
They had a chance to say were not fools , make it blatant and we will do you, but all this has achieved is confirm peoples view of them.
Sad state of affairs.
However that doesnt make it right and when someone is caught red handed then lies to their teeth and are still found out then the shame is on the turf club imo.
They had a chance to say were not fools , make it blatant and we will do you, but all this has achieved is confirm peoples view of them.
Sad state of affairs.
Of the shoes ?
No if thats what you mean but from the transcripts of the inquiry all accepted after a while that he had them on.
No if thats what you mean but from the transcripts of the inquiry all accepted after a while that he had them on.
And I suppose if you found your horse had lost two shoes on the racecourse you would tell the Clerk of the Course that there were a couple of horseshoes (with nails) lying on the course that would be a danger to other horses.
Its fairly obvious to most what happened but you still need proof,the Turf Club had no proof it was a poor prosecution and appears vindictive.
I read the report far different. They assembled a strong case in order to reach the necessary burden of proof. The lack of an eyewitness account is what killed the case. However, if that was required for all legal cases then the jails would be largely empty. It would have been far worse if the Turf Club didn’t take the case following the appearance of the video.
The evidence was entirely circumstantial in the recent Graham Dwyer murder case and that case was considered proved beyond reasonable doubt by the jury in that case - the Walsh case only had to be proved on the balance of probabilities .
So what's the verdict then. Ted Walsh is a goody two shoes?
if we posted the truth it would more than likely be removed in minutes and a fair chance the poster would be removed to
Ha good one Lee,
The thing that annoyed me though was that Walsh was fully exonerated but the Turf club's report, i mean it is one thing not to have the evidence but it's another to clear him of any wrong doing when clearly the probability that skulduggery has occurred is so high. I also laughed when i read the claim that Walsh did not have the expertise to remove a horse's shoe, a man who has been around horses all his life. All in all it does not paint the TC has a sporting body who want to stamp out corruption in there sport.
The thing that annoyed me though was that Walsh was fully exonerated but the Turf club's report, i mean it is one thing not to have the evidence but it's another to clear him of any wrong doing when clearly the probability that skulduggery has occurred is so high. I also laughed when i read the claim that Walsh did not have the expertise to remove a horse's shoe, a man who has been around horses all his life. All in all it does not paint the TC has a sporting body who want to stamp out corruption in there sport.
i suppose we can all pretend that ted is as straight as a bannana
AOB reported that Chamonix lost a front shoe in the first. I never knew the man had such a sense of humour.
Was a massive fan of tat lad on the Flat TTK, at his peak he was was probably only a Group 3 away from getting to stand somewhere far away and sandy or maybe even in Coolmore NH the poor bugger.
Wasn't in for that race tonight but he's a horse I can see myself backing as he used find plenty for pressure. He' have the size for NH? I'd say the engine is there but maybe not the chassis from how long it took him to make the track at 3.
Wasn't in for that race tonight but he's a horse I can see myself backing as he used find plenty for pressure. He' have the size for NH? I'd say the engine is there but maybe not the chassis from how long it took him to make the track at 3.
I dunno Neil, they’d be as well of bringing him to Puck Fair the way he ran tonight.
Just saw the video there now, looked pretty done, alright. Thought it might just have been case of a quiet one but looked more than that.
Maybe you should make them an offer Neil. I'm sure they would give you the head collar for luck. You could show him the delights of Icon, could sweeten him up even if the tackle is gone. Or better yet give him to Flan to train.
Spoke with the boys this morning, they've reluctantly parted with him. I'll be up to Piltown with the Box on Saturday morning. Going to be staying with Flan Costello until I'm fully sorted at home.
Will give him lots of time and maybe a few trips to Kilkee. We're working back from the Irish Leger. Going down to the Labour Exchange(misnomer!) after lunch for a workrider/jockey (jobsbridge). I intend to show loyalty to staff provided they don't steal from me.
ATR have him listed as an entire, it didn't come up in the conversation this morning, Kieran only asked me 'had I cash'?
Will give him lots of time and maybe a few trips to Kilkee. We're working back from the Irish Leger. Going down to the Labour Exchange(misnomer!) after lunch for a workrider/jockey (jobsbridge). I intend to show loyalty to staff provided they don't steal from me.
ATR have him listed as an entire, it didn't come up in the conversation this morning, Kieran only asked me 'had I cash'?
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