Were Coolmore up to their own tricks again?

Sure who the hell would want to win the Irish Derby.

Up to their old tricks??In the Irish Derby,please give me strength!!This place is like a mental hospital these days.

Well Gant tell me this, did you think Festive Cheer was left in from O'Briens 4 entries as a pacemaker considering he was any price the rest before final declarations?, yet he's held up behind goes through the field like a knife through butter only to be checked at a vital stage of the race, the Epsom Derby winner was floundering, you tell me gant?

You might gather that Joseph didn't ride RULER at Epsom because they knew he wasn't all that good, so 2 flukes in a row was hardly going to happen so Festive Cheer was the one prepared for the latest group one black type?

ffs you're not that stupid, when the so called pacemaker is held right up instead of making the pace for the so called first string then alarm bells should be ringing.

Was festive cheer declared a pacemaker?.

Joeseph said ruler of the world didn't get home(never travelled for me,another derby winner where Epsom took its toll and got run of race at Epsom)

ROTW dam raced over 7 furlongs and was by kingmambo and probably won the Epsom Derby because of the slow pace,he had the best turn of foot at crucial stage.

The only thing Godolphin got right was supplementing a pacemaker for 100k because they realised that festive cheer wasn't one.

As for setting it up so another horse can get black type is absolute BONKERS,fair enough setting up a poor group 3 to sell on an average stallion to the far east but in a classic.A dual Derby winner is worth a fortune.

Oh yeah it never happened before?, so I'm bonkers.

2 group one winners is better than one considering they knew ROTW was a fluke.

I think they let Jim Bolger win it for the craic.

If they thought ruler of the world would finish 5th -he wouldn't have run and would have been retired due to a "knock".

Define up to their old tricks-Running 2 horses in a group 1 on their own merits trying for their lives is it??

Gant-Murtagh was delighted on RTE with bolger winning it-"he's the best trainer in Ireland"

Not Coolmore they've no qualms about ruining their horses reutations in any type of group race , see St Nic Fame and Glory et al, or even listed races see St Nic and Moth, or Yeats take your pick?

Such is our dominance we can always restore their reputations again if we so choose?.

JSB has been the master trainer for years........self made man.

Is this today's Conspiratorialism thread?

Why am I even replying??

A defeat doesn't matter to an unbeaten 3 year old ??

Fame and Glory/Yeats stand for 7k and are national hunt sires basically -stupid analogy.You're comparing apples and oranges

That's why they retired Desert King,Footstepinthesand and Pour Moi.

"Coolmore have no qualms in ruining their stallions reputations??"-that's up there I tell ya

No. It's just a lad with a few cans on him letting off some steam.........it's allowed.
But if your 2 boys Kingrat/Rocketfingers join in, it could be a cracker.

Dj they used the queen anne as a stepping stone for Rip Van Winkles seasonal debut before been beaten narrowly by canford Cliffs, the English 2000 guineas is their best scholling ground for the Irish version, witness Power and Roderic in recent years, do you want some more examples Dj that their dominance means they don't really care unless they think the horse is out of this world.

Oh yeah gant its all drink talk, instead of a guys genuine opinion of how this dominant force operate, they don't do routine believe me.

Silvergreaser,i think you may well need a bit of medical care.

erase Desert King,now I have entertained enough of your eccentric thoughts silver g. Enjoy the rest of your evening.

If they thought ROTW wasn't up to much-they would have retired him.

What does up to their old tricks mean??

Running 2 horses that are both trying for their lives??What's wrong with that??

I love been called some sort of nut job for exposing these guys, do your homework there is loads of eveidence

Greaser, you are not yer man out of The Corrs are you?

Please Explain what up to their old tricks mean??

They kept ROTW in to scare off opposition(that worked)-knew he fluked the derby but shur we will run him anyway,just cost us about €3million per annum in stud fees rather than retire him.

or were they just using the Irish derby as a prep race for the King George??

Chased leader for 2f, stayed chasing leaders, lost place and 8th straight, driven and struggling when barging match well over 1f out, soon weakened (op 20/1)

10th of 12 beaten 12L's behind Ruler of the World

Festive Cheers last run BTW, miracle performance today in hindsight, huge turnaround don't you think?

Oh and it was heavy on the bridle today before getting chopped off?

Sivergreaser.......you are like an auld lad I know from the greyhounds. He says everyone is entitled to his/her opinion but if you don't agree with him you are a sheep.

Well gant nobody explained to me how festive cheer could turn around x amount of lengths with ROTW. I'm all ears?

Same as pacemaker cap o rushes finished ahead of libertarian. Galileo rock finishes ahead of rotw.......That's racing, they aint machines.

silver why not ask the same question about Trading Leather and Libertarian??

Can u explain how Trading Leather could turn around x amount of lengths on their Dante form??

No,That doesn't suit your agenda.

Fair enough gant but some turnaround all the same, and who would've thought Festive Cheer would be hard on the bridle 2 out and ROTW hard at work?.

Very honest stable indeed, and dare you highlight this, you're either a nut job or you drink too much?

silver,why do u just assume because o'brien has 2 horses in a race that one of them is a pacemaker?

I think there was only a lth between them in the dante tbf Chelt ..so not a lot of tuning around in all fairness...

Lets be honest roar I think everyone assumed, if you thought any different this morning you're probably a liar?

Even Kilkenny look beaten tonight..........that's sport.

you know what they say about 'assume'.

No i didn't think any different at all silver,
Having back frozen fire a few years ago in the same race maybe that's why i didn't think any different.
Fair point WR,But how many lengths turn around in form was that this evening?

That was suppose to say "Having backed frozen fire in the same race a few years ago"

UP in distance CHELT.....

indeed wr,and Trading Leather looked a non stayer in the Dante,Hence why his last two races were over a mile and 10 furlongs.

Cant agree with you there Chelt ..I backed him at york were he ran a strange race , They might have rode him to get the trip there . I also backed him at the curragh ...He showed that day that he relished the step up in trip ..Sadly i thought he was just below this class ....

think WR is right, trading leather wasnt far off libertarian in the dante, teofilo seem to thrive at the longer distances,
plus didnt race at epsom, which probably was of great benefit, and had that spin over 10f at the curragh. irish derby must
of been the target all along, bolger is very smart, giving the horse a few runs at the track.

1. The favourite boiled over
2. The ground was a factor
3. The winner loved the Ground
4. It was a poor race standard wise.

I think Coolmore left this race behind them as they are normally mob handed and with the favourite boiling over the winner was handed the race.

Look, loads of form tied many horses together and anybody who thought that those bastions of virtue Coolmore were not up to their own tricks are just serial apologists for this rancid operation, horrible disgusting operation that often gets Mecca like adulation when they deserve nothing but our total disdain for their constant screwing over of the public.

In fact its the bought regulators who are the worst culprits, shame on them that they allow this rancid control freak called Coolmore to dictate how Irish racing should be run, shame on you, shame on you...

lol if nothing else you do provide some laughs on here silver

Laugh if you like roar, just take a good look at yourselves?

Ah Silvergreaser, the forum looney..

The funniest part is how seriously you take yourself.

how many scoops have you on board tonight, Greaser?

Pre fats usual contribution, an insult usually followed by a smiley face, not an ounce of intelligent counter argument, ah well?

para·noia noun

Definition of PARANOIA

a psychosis characterized by systematized delusions of persecution or grandeur usually without hallucinations

a tendency on the part of an individual or group toward excessive or irrational suspiciousness and distrustfulness of others

Silver,Epsom and the Curragh are chalk and cheese,an awful race with a fierce pace today, Sugar Boy and Libertarian last and second last which some right unconsidered horses were in front of them,race maybe not to take to much notice of except the winner is improving and watch the 3rd horse.

I love this, the guys think greaser is rubber, had a small few I admit, far from a guy who has lost the run of his brain.

Keep on making excuses for an operation that has been taking the piss for years, and greaser is an alcoholic in need of serious psychiatric help?

When all he does is expose the cozy status quo, and thats a crime?

Lustrumm is a dark horse and has this again spot on.

The favourite boiled over its as simple as that,no conspiracy,I watched The favourite in the parade ring and he was sweating up,he went down to the start alright but I had my binoculars on him at the start and the sweating spread to his neck and he just boiled over.

The Turf Club apparently asked Coolmore not to enter too many horses as they felt it was damaging the race and Coolmore complied,the first dividend came by the two supplementary entries they got

I am an admirer of Coolmore and Aidan OBrien and feel they get a rough time here but you can't deny that last year they ran Camelot for the Curraghs sake and got punished for it,this year they agreed to limit their numbers and look what happened,the favourite boiled over and they had no suitable horses in the race to take advantage.

silver i'm not saying their a squeaky clean operation,Far from it.

But you do go a bit ott with some of your claims,Which is probably why not many take you serious on here.

roar, I just get fed up with people making the pious one out and the lads as he calls them as some sort of bastion of fair play, considering their riches you'd expect a little bit of transparency, but you haven't got a goddamn clue what is going to happen next.

At least when Vincent was in the fold at Ballydoyle you knew exactly what you were going to get!

The Turf Club apparently asked Coolmore not to enter too many horses as they felt it was damaging the race and Coolmore complied......jesus I give up

I suggest anyone who thinks I'm blowing **** check out a stud called Croom House,

Owned by none other than good old business partner of John Magnier Denis Brosnan former chairman of HRI, you couldn't make it up if you tried, check out their horses for sale, no coincidence that many are from Coolmore stallions?

The time was 4.83 seconds below standard.  My guess is hard ground.
Trading Leather ran 5x8f and 2x10f before today, the last two runs on GF.

Ruler Of The World looked sweaty and uneasy in the parade ring.  Too may ribs on view imo.
Ted Walshe said if he was going to have €100 on ROTW he would have put it back in his pocket.
I backed the winner at Epsom at ~16s.  Today I didn't bet at odds on.
Libertarian and Sugar Boy were the last two home.

I would use the form of today's race to line the bottom of my budgie cage (if I had one).

That should have read run rather than enter although I think Paulie Walnuts will still be skeptical,just think about it The Irish Derby was going downhill fast because Coolmore were scaring off the opposition with their multiple runners,the request worked as they got two supplementary entries yielding them nearly two hundred grand and two runners from England.

One final point not related to Coolmore. How stupid are Godolphin. They have a great relationship with Jim Bolger who was only dying to sell and they bought a long distance hurdler who needs soft ground.
I'll say this much for the people that sold him, they owe Karl Burke a big favour. This is the biggest flop they have ever bought imo

Well said lustrumm,They'll struggle to win a Group 1 with that fella.

JP McManus

They will struggle to win a group 1 with that fella,thats the understatement of the decade. That horse is worthless and anybody who knew anything about racing wouldn't have touched him with a bargepole. The people that advise these doughnuts are a laughing stock,Crisford used write for the racing post I think,now he's the Sheiks right hand man. I don't know much about Redvers,but what a riding that  Qatar prince is getting,and as for the people who suggested buying Sugar Boy for another one of those Arabs. You wouldn't back sugar boy in the Slan Abhaile in Listowel if he was in it.
Its the same with the jumps,you will only have to wait for the next horses in training sale to see the  moron that will sign for Zarkiyr,and he will make six figures plus. In a wide open betting event as to who throws away a couple of hundred thousand belong to somebody else,id make Aiden Murphy favourite.

Fwiw, I thought Manning rode a poor race at York and TL was the best horse there. I was surprised Bolger ran it so soon after in the Guineas but not surprised it improved for 12f yesterday. I stuck with the fav because I had it at Epsom. No complaints. 
For various reasons, all the winners of trials and classics (colts) here and in England have all run below par subsequently.
Cap o Rushes 4th off 95 last week? They just look like another ordinary bunch of 3yos unfortunately.

i fancied and backed Festive Cheer at Epsom.

People who thought he was a pacemaker haven't done their research.

I backed him yesterday and i'll back him again.

Classy horse with a turn of foot.

O'Brien blames busy schedule for Ruler flop
By Peter Scargill 8:29PM 30 JUN 2013

AIDAN O'BRIEN said on Sunday that Ruler Of The World's defeat in the Dubai Duty Free Irish Derby may have been a result of too many races in a short period of time.

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    Race replay

Winner of the Investec Derby at Epsom, Ruler Of The World was sent off the 4-5 favourite to maintain his unbeaten record, having also claimed victories in a 1m2f maiden and the Chester Vase, and provide his trainer with an eighth successive victory in the Classic.

However, the son of Galileo could only manage a lacklustre fifth, beaten ten lengths, behind winner Trading Leather at the Curragh.

After winning a maiden on his racecourse debut in April, Ruler Of The World's three subsequent outings came in 52 days and O'Brien blamed the workload for Ruler Of The World's failure on Saturday evening.

"He had three quick runs and maybe he needed a break. Obviously getting warm [before the race] didn't help," O'Brien said.

"Of course we want to win every race, but wasn't it great for the race [that Jim Bolger won it]?"

He is a G3 horse at best, worst Irish Derby in living memory. I will debate that with anyone.