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06 Jul 12
12:41
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Date Joined:
30 Nov 10
It seems there is a concerted effort to strip Armstrong of his seven Tour De France victories,were that to happen look who the beneficiaries would be,Jan Ulrich,Ivan Basso,Alex Zulle and Andreas Kloden all cyclists who failed tests in the past.
From the beginning cycling has been riddled with drugs,Jacques Anquetil five time tour winner infamously said to a journalist while looking up Mont Ventoux you hardly think we go up there on water,the tour itself went on strike in the sixties to prevent drug tests.In 1966 the first five men to finish in the professional world road race at the Nurburgring refused to take a dope test,were suspended only to be absolved shortly after.The death of Tommy Simpson in the Tour of 1967 and the subsequent coroners verdict that stimulants were the main cause led to tighter controls but these were cosmetic.Sometimes there is a thin line between taking supplements and legal pills and slipping into the world of doping.
Most would agree that Lance Armstrong was the best cyclist of his time and if he got some help well so did all the others,maybe they should leave it be.
From the beginning cycling has been riddled with drugs,Jacques Anquetil five time tour winner infamously said to a journalist while looking up Mont Ventoux you hardly think we go up there on water,the tour itself went on strike in the sixties to prevent drug tests.In 1966 the first five men to finish in the professional world road race at the Nurburgring refused to take a dope test,were suspended only to be absolved shortly after.The death of Tommy Simpson in the Tour of 1967 and the subsequent coroners verdict that stimulants were the main cause led to tighter controls but these were cosmetic.Sometimes there is a thin line between taking supplements and legal pills and slipping into the world of doping.
Most would agree that Lance Armstrong was the best cyclist of his time and if he got some help well so did all the others,maybe they should leave it be.
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Most would agree that Lance Armstrong was the best cyclist of his time and if he got some help well so did all the others,maybe they should leave it be. .... lets hope for sport and our children that this never happens.
To be fair Wildmanfromborneo has made it clear on here his view on sports people using performance enhancing substances..........if you are caught or refuse to give a sample you should get gate........The sure they were all at it is not a good enough defence.
FAIR enough 007.... but lets hope they never leave it be..no dought with the olympics around the corner there will be lots debate on the suject.
I am totally against all drugs in sport but accept the reality of the situation in cycling,if Lance Armstrong were to be stripped of his tour victories Jan Ulrich would gain a second tour victory and he has been banned many times and already stripped of a third place in the tour.
If they were all at it,as they were you can't disqualify one and promote someone equally guilty.
The famous 100 metre final in Seoul won by the obviously drugged up Ben Johnson contained no clean athlete.
If they were all at it,as they were you can't disqualify one and promote someone equally guilty.
The famous 100 metre final in Seoul won by the obviously drugged up Ben Johnson contained no clean athlete.
"The famous 100 metre final in Seoul won by the obviously drugged up Ben Johnson contained no clean athlete."
Sorry but seriously how the hell do you kno this? More rubbish from you. Were all 8 found guilty? If not then you're talking rubbish as usual.
Sorry but seriously how the hell do you kno this? More rubbish from you. Were all 8 found guilty? If not then you're talking rubbish as usual.
Which of the finalists did you think was drug free?
I'm asking you a question were all of them found guilty ? Yes or No, simple answer surely.
cycling was, is and forever will be riddled with substance abuse. recently read a biography of fausto coppi, it was no different in the 40s or 50s. the prolonged chasing of armstrong is strange though. he musta been taking some serious stuff!!
Still no answer from the Wildman for my question. It could not be harder "yes" or "no"
Neither was the Brazilian Da Silva but the other 6 most certainly were. Having said that Flo Jo was 'clean' and her world record in 1988 still stands today and no one has even got within a sniff of it since with or without drugs.
Apologies to Rocketfingers for not replying sooner,doing something he has never done........work.
Naturally Rocketfingers low attention span has kicked in again,he only read my post of 23.38 so misses the context.
The point of the thread is when drug taking is rife disqualifying a cyclist from the past and promoting someone equally guilty is silly that's why the Seoul 100 metre final is relevant,Ben Johnson was disqualified with Carl Lewis promoted yet he failed tests and were he to have been disqualified Linford Christie would have been declared the winner,another beauty.
Naturally Rocketfingers low attention span has kicked in again,he only read my post of 23.38 so misses the context.
The point of the thread is when drug taking is rife disqualifying a cyclist from the past and promoting someone equally guilty is silly that's why the Seoul 100 metre final is relevant,Ben Johnson was disqualified with Carl Lewis promoted yet he failed tests and were he to have been disqualified Linford Christie would have been declared the winner,another beauty.
i'm on your side on this wildman, i wouldn't encourage any kid of mine to enter a sport that courts so much controversy.
but they seem determined to get Armstrong and they won't give up until they do, but you would think they would have got him by now.
but they seem determined to get Armstrong and they won't give up until they do, but you would think they would have got him by now.
Carl Lewis has broken his silence on allegations that he was the beneficiary of a drugs cover-up, admitting he had tested positive for banned substances but claiming he was just one of "hundreds" of American athletes who were allowed to escape bans.
"There were hundreds of people getting off," he said. "Everyone was treated the same."
Lewis has now acknowledged that he failed three tests during the 1988 US Olympic trials, which under international rules at the time should have prevented him from competing in the Seoul games two months later.
"The climate was different then," said Lewis. "Over the years a lot of people will sit around and debate that [the drug] does something. There really is no pure evidence
"There were hundreds of people getting off," he said. "Everyone was treated the same."
Lewis has now acknowledged that he failed three tests during the 1988 US Olympic trials, which under international rules at the time should have prevented him from competing in the Seoul games two months later.
"The climate was different then," said Lewis. "Over the years a lot of people will sit around and debate that [the drug] does something. There really is no pure evidence
Christie: I will fight to clear my name
UK Athletics, the sport's governing body, said the action had been taken following a positive test for nandrolone at an indoor meet in Dortmund, Germany, on February 13.
Christie, who now acts as an agent for British athletes, has officially retired from the sport and competes only in selected meetings.
In a statement the organisation said: "UK Athletics confirms that it has been notified of the suspension by (the) IAAF of Linford Christie, following an adverse finding of metabolites of nandrolone in a urine sample."
UK Athletics, the sport's governing body, said the action had been taken following a positive test for nandrolone at an indoor meet in Dortmund, Germany, on February 13.
Christie, who now acts as an agent for British athletes, has officially retired from the sport and competes only in selected meetings.
In a statement the organisation said: "UK Athletics confirms that it has been notified of the suspension by (the) IAAF of Linford Christie, following an adverse finding of metabolites of nandrolone in a urine sample."
The Men's 100 metres at the 1988 Summer Olympics in Seoul, South Korea ended in controversy, after Canada's Ben Johnson defeated defending champion Carl Lewis from the United States with a world record time of 9.79s. Two days after the final however, Johnson was stripped of his gold medal by the IOC when his post-race drug test indicated steroid use. His record time of 9.79 seconds was also erased. However, Johnson was not the only participant with a cloud over his success. Carl Lewis, Linford Christie and Dennis Mitchell all tested positive for banned substances during their careers.[1] The race has been nicknamed by one writer to be "the dirtiest in history".[2]
At the 1988 Summer Olympics in Seoul, Smith was involved in the most controversial Olympic 100 m final of all time and ended up receiving the Bronze Medal. Ben Johnson of Canada crossed the line first, with Lewis second, Linford Christie of Great Britain third, and Smith fourth. But Johnson then tested positive anabolic steroids and was stripped of his Gold Medal. Smith was thus upgraded to the Bronze Medal position. The race has been called by one newspaper the dirtiest race in history, as Lewis later admitted to having tested positive for stimulants in that year's trials, and Christie's urine also contained metabolites of a banned substance after the race. Of the top 5 in that race, Smith is the only one who never failed a drugs test. Smith later said: "I should have been the gold medallist".[1]
Incredible that Sky broadcast one of their "Sporting Greats" recently which was on Carl Lewis. Nobody seems to care about his drug taking and he is still regarded as one of the great Olympians. His legacy hardly seems to have been tarnished which is amazing.
In the 80's - mid 90's, performance enhancing drugs had a much greater impact on a women's achievement, then with the male counterparts. The oldest world record that still exists for men is kevin young's 400m hurdle time, set in 1992. Most of the women's world records will never be broken, such as flo jo over 100m, 200m, marita **** 400m, Kratochvílova 800m, Yunxia over 1500m, 3000m, and 10000m. We all know that none of these achievements have any credibility, and without any substantial evidence that cheating did take place, these times will exist for ever.
DID you know VINNIE that Kratochvílova never wore a bra..she did however ware a jockstrap.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YDlbHHICsU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YDlbHHICsU
A sport with a limited amount of skill is always going to attract the drug men.
You can drug me and others to the eyeballs but ye can`t make us good hurlers.
You can drug me and others to the eyeballs but ye can`t make us good hurlers.
That's not true, they can make you stronger, quicker, faster which makes you a better hurler. In the Tour de France drugs don't tell you when to sit when to make a break for it, where to position yourself for a sprint finish, when to b in gear x or gear y, when to use the big gears etc etc that's the skill in cycling, often track cyclists don't convert to roadies as they have the wrong skill set.As usual you're wrong, and totally wrong to say it has no skill.
Your reading ability is poor as well as every other aspect of your idle life,limited amount of skill is not the same as no skill.
Read it again and you will see i never said no skill,its not a particularly long post so you should be able to grasp it.
Read it again and you will see i never said no skill,its not a particularly long post so you should be able to grasp it.
I think i will have to spell it out for you.
Jim Hines was the Olympic 100 metre champion,he broke the world record in 1968 in Mexico,he was quick and fast so turned to a career in American Football,he had however a fatal flaw he couldn`t catch the ball so his career ended abruptly.
In typical American fashion he earned the moniker OOPS.
Jim Hines was the Olympic 100 metre champion,he broke the world record in 1968 in Mexico,he was quick and fast so turned to a career in American Football,he had however a fatal flaw he couldn`t catch the ball so his career ended abruptly.
In typical American fashion he earned the moniker OOPS.
Obviously, could a hurler win the tour de france or could an American football player win the 100m at the Olympics, i've got to say no. So you're still wrong, i've explanied how drugs could make you a better hurler can they improve your skill set at that sport obviously not but they can improve you in other aspects yes of course. You don't read my posts or at least you don't think them out fully.
Will you at least admit that cycling/road racing has more skill than you first thought?
I said limited skill not no skill,i love the Tour De France and always considered Stephen Roche to be a clever and skilful cyclist,during the 1987 tour the peloton were passing a feeding station when Roche noticed Jean Francois Bernard had stopped,he pressed on attacked and with the help of Andy Hampstead dropped Bernard and he never recovered,He was favourite that year and later won the mountain time trial but it was the quick thinking of Roche that lost him that tour.
Nice copy and paste from a leading online article i believe Wildman, i know i've read that before, give it up Wildman you've been caught out too many times by myself. Last night i destoyed Gant with his fibbing, today your back for more. You're like a pair of punch drunk fighters at this stage.
Everything i post here is from memory which is why i sometimes get things wrong.
You can`t grasp the idea that some people have independant minds,ideas and memories probably because of your dull nature,you can barely remember your previous post.
Gant007 has destroyed you so often here he has taken his foot off the pedal out of sympathy,he is even now saying you are probably a nice guy,he is alone in that thought.
It is pretty much an unequal fight which is why i like it when i can get some others on your side to even things up,i should leave you alone but feel you might pick ip something which you could use for the benefit of your Asian clients.
You can`t grasp the idea that some people have independant minds,ideas and memories probably because of your dull nature,you can barely remember your previous post.
Gant007 has destroyed you so often here he has taken his foot off the pedal out of sympathy,he is even now saying you are probably a nice guy,he is alone in that thought.
It is pretty much an unequal fight which is why i like it when i can get some others on your side to even things up,i should leave you alone but feel you might pick ip something which you could use for the benefit of your Asian clients.
In the Tour de France drugs don't tell you when to sit when to make a break for it, where to position yourself for a sprint finish, when to b in gear x or gear y, when to use the big gears etc etc that's the skill in cycling, often track cyclists don't convert to roadies as they have the wrong skill set
Exactly then why are the two favs for the Yellow jersey are Cadel Evans who comes from mountain biking and Bradley Wiggins who is formerly a track cyclist and who finished 4th in his first Tour De France less then 12 months after winning two gold medals in Beijing. If they have the stamina the skill set carries across easily.
Exactly then why are the two favs for the Yellow jersey are Cadel Evans who comes from mountain biking and Bradley Wiggins who is formerly a track cyclist and who finished 4th in his first Tour De France less then 12 months after winning two gold medals in Beijing. If they have the stamina the skill set carries across easily.
Just admit it you got it wrong about cycling, admit it be the bigger man and say you know what RF i'm wrong. Btw you're right about something for once it was an unequal fight alright as i took on 4 of you bumpkins last night, as yourself and gant had to call in the cavalry of Kavvie and Squigs, get more you'll need it.
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