Is Camelot finally Ballydoyle's Derby Winner?

anyone taking 6/4 prob needs their head looked at.

6/4 is still available

I don't arb so it's off no real interest to me, i'll let ye get all the €€€€ [;)]

I bound to be a 5 runner farce, say they take Tibet and Daddy Longlegs out and put a pacemaker in their prob learn and see what the English have. I think the Derby is at the mercy of the Irish Next year. England really struggling to unearth any decent 2yr olds. Noble Mission still has to run and that is the big hope

He has beat All Aproved (useless) 2 lengths. He is the biggest lay of all time this Saturday. He comes from a long line of Ballydoyle aeroplanes.

Fascinating!
Quite how an unimpressive winner of a poor Leopardstown maiden over a mile in mid July, is such a short priced favourite on his next start in a Gr1 in October, I'll never know?

He was impressive enough Giant Strides but there's no doubt that he's this sort of price on pure reputation alone. Another catching pigeons on the Ballydoyle gallops me thinks....

I'm with Tradefair here COM. I honestly thought he was workmanlike. Their 2yo I was looking forward to most was Apollo, but he seems to have vanished.

To be fair, if they'd pushed him out he could have won a lot easier, perfectly reasonable debut for a would be top horse, I heard he has had a problem since and that is why he hasn't won, would surprise me in the slightest if he won easily on Saturday, but whether he is a 6/4 shot is another thing. Sometimes there isn't as much as one would think between a big field Irish maiden and a small field Irish Group or listed.

St nick won a wank Beresford the form of which people questioned and he hacked up in this, the race on Saturday doesn't look strong by any means to me andI certainly wouldn't be laying him. I'm pretty non plussed by the field bar Fencing and this fella.

Good point about St Nick neill. I didn't see that coming. I'd imagine this one is far better than he showed that day but nothing justifies the price in this instance and he's a poor bet.

Following on, I have a little theory with regard to this lad that he probably is the real deal. I'm going to try and word it as well as I can, hopefully ye'll get my train of thought.

If anyone follows the breeding a little bit,(I try, usually fail), but one would see that every single son of Montjeu that has gone to stud has been an absolute commercial disaster, the degree of stamina in the pedigree is deemed unfashionable andwhile Montjeu is deemed a great sire of champions, he is categorically not considered a good sire of sires given the number of good horses he produces (his book wouldn't be anything like the quality of Gallileo's but that is another story). What I'm getting at is that this is not a horse they can b ulls hit with like they do with their lots of speed slow Gallileos or their Footstepsinthesand (Steinbeck), these gus aren't stupid, commercial breeders already are extremely dubious of sons of Montjeu and for this lad to make the grade in his next career, he has to do it on the track in order to get the support. Since he is not a sexy, fashionable commodity breeding wise, the only other reason he could be here is that he is their best staying 2yo.

Also, a horse like Daddylonglegs with his American pedigree by Scat Daddy is one that would be very interesting to breeders I'd have thought, the fact that Camelot is here and this lad isn't says to me that Camelot must be  significantly the better horse because we can see from Coolmore's recent Juddemont sired purchases and mtings that they are trying to diversify.

So in conclusion, why not push the Daddy? because Camelot is the better horse in their oppinion and if indeed he is, that will most likely be enough to win on Saturday.

yaeh probably, but mine is at least some way reasoned, not saying i will back him but I can see why he is short.

Huge potential this fellow! He should go very well on Saturday and he'll be one to look forward to next season

Aristotle won a run of the mill maiden in Galway before winning the RP race after more than a 10 week break.
High Chaparral did something similar, taking 2 runs to break his duck.

St Nicholas Abbey beat a subsequent group 1 winning 2yo in Passion for Gold in the Beresford, so the race was hardly as bad as described here.

I would not back Camelot at the price, but there is certainly every chance that he is a nice horse in the making.

Not much wrong with the way Encke won his maiden and if the ground was decent on Saturday, then he could be the value at the 7/1 mark.

There is a lot of talk about Fencing and I love his sire, but I thought he was very workmanlike in beating an average field for the race at Newbury.

night mate...

Interesting that this fella was Derby favourite before he even ran , he beat absolutely nothing on his debut but beat them well and I checked him out on his return to the winners enclosure - seems an unusually straightforward docile Montjeu so should have no head issues ( like Recital )and most decent Montjeus at two improve considerably at three . The market is again suggesting he is the second coming so expect his Derby odds to plummet next Saturday if he wins the way the money is talking at the mo.....

Im on Encke for the rp trophy. 7/1 ew[;)]

I agree with Rubyisgodinthesaddle and neill d.
I accept that Camelot beat nothing but it was the way he was ridden and the way he did it that impressed me.The Aiden O`Brien horses that are fancied but not thought to be top class are bounced out and given a hard race,the real good ones are ridden like Camelot was at Leopardstown,out the back,jockeys hands on withers,no urgency,pick up in your own time and win as you like.
This lad will win on Saturday.

didn't realise Daddylonglegs was in this.

Much as i wouldn't want back camelot for this race, you would find it hard to oppose it in fairness.
Three of the last big 2yo colt races in the u.k were the Royal lodge (1,2and3), the Middle park (1st and 3rd) and a good/bad second in the dewhurst. Possibly not a vintage year for them but they're going fairly strong, moreso in the backend ?