what did Pat have to say regarding Hayley

I know she wasn't there,it was a wh rep///that was the reason i asked it

Thursday, May 5, 2011
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Bookies refuse to lay in bed of own making

By Pat Keane

Saturday, November 06, 2010

HAVE a glance at this e-mail that I, along with many others, received from William Hill some days ago.


a d v e r t i s e m e n t


According to the company, David Yu’s first interview as chief executive of the betting exchange, Betfair, has revealed that his firm has a serious identity crisis.

Yu, they say, claims that Betfair is a bookmaker. According to William Hill: "Up to now that is an assertion that his company has angrily refuted, claiming instead to be just a simple technology platform. On that basis it has avoided paying around three times less in tax and levy than traditional UK bookmakers — like William Hill.

"The technology claim has enabled Betfair to pay tax and levy only on the commission it charges backers and layers operating through its UK exchange. It seems David Yu has now stopped believing his own propaganda."

Ralph Topping, William Hill’s chief executive, said: "The emergence of Betfair has distorted the UK betting market and led to very significant tax and levy leakage. The taxpayer and the racing industry have been the losers.

"Most expert observers believe that Betfair has many unidentified big layers on its platform paying no tax and no levy. It is ridiculous for Betfair to claim to be the injured party when in fact other operators, like William Hill, have had to go offshore in the face of a company which has gamed the system to secure a competitive advantage."

You know, I’m sure, there is plenty in what William Hill and Ralph Topping claim, but on reading their message the overwhelming feeling was one of sheer cynicism.

I mean, can you actually accuse the likes of William Hill and Ladbrokes of being so-called traditional UK bookmakers? Well, if traditional means they behave in England in the same manner as they do in Ireland then definitely. There’s "a serious identity crisis" all right.

In Ireland, all these firms are short of doing is putting up signs which say "only mugs wanted", or "thou shalt not win". Listen, essentially you can lump all of the off-course bookmakers in Ireland into the exact same box, except that one, two at a real push, are a bit more accommodating.

William Hill and the others are entitled to worry about the effect Betfair continues to have on their businesses.

But they don’t get it and are still failing to come to terms with the reasons why Betfair has attracted so many thousands of punters. And, indeed, why Betfair is likely to continue to grow and grow.

It’s quite simple, off-course bookmakers no longer offer a service which is acceptable to many punters.

If standing at a counter with the possibility of being kept waiting and, ultimately, humiliated is for you then you know where to go.

I could fill this column every week with stories of punters being knocked back when attempting to wager relatively small amounts.

The off-course layers don’t seem to realise that every time they refuse to take a bet they are driving that punter closer to opening a Betfair account.

The beauty of Betfair is that, on most occasions at least, you can have a proper lump on, free from the worry of being told to take your custom elsewhere.

That e-mail from William Hill is one of many racing correspondents receive every day from the off-course bookmakers’ PR agents.

They waffle on about this bet and that bet and for how much they have laid such and such a horse.

We take it all with the proverbial grain of salt. And then, of course, there is Ladbrokes’ Hayley O’Connor and her appearances on Attheraces.

She is repeatedly given an audience, but never asked a serious question. She’s merely doing her job, of course, and more power to her. Meanwhile, however, you have numerous viewers screaming at the television, "but Ladbrokes wouldn’t lay eggs".

LET me give you a personal example. On Sunday, October 24, Ladbrokes were going 7-4 on a horse called Dylan Ross in a bumper at Galway.

I wandered into their Midleton office in Co Cork as I wanted a decent few quid on and decided €600 would be a start and unlikely to raise the hare.

I handed the cash and the docket to the clerk, who began to play with his computer. Everything was going smoothly, until his head arched in my direction.

"You can only have €100 on," he said. I politely declined his kind offer and shuffled away. Yes, another possible Betfair candidate had just been born.

William Hill, Ladbrokes and the rest can behave as they like, sadly there is no legislation in place to force them to treat people properly.

But when the likes of William Hill think they should e-mail the press, questioning the behaviour of another organisation, then excuse me if I consign such utterings to the nearest bin.



This appeared in the printed version of the Irish Examiner Saturday, November 06, 2010

Read more: http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/pat-keane/bookies-refuse-to-lay-in-bed-of-own-making-135579.html#ixzz1LW80IQxD

anybody know who these traders are that laddies and hills have in Ireland,i hear laddies main odds compiler in Ireland is female

It's quite unfair slagging someone on their job because they are female but yes the head of trading for Ladbrokes is female.

ok sorry I miss interpreted the point.

poors trader must be a pygmie so laying what appear to be huge bets althogh they are small in the scheme of things

So Keane wanted to have €600 on?, well talk about a big pink elephant walking into a betting shop!, these PLC's simply don't take that sort of money in shops anymore, and haven't done for years. Anyone that comes in wanting to have that sort of cash on will automatically set alarm bells ringing, putting all your eggs in one basket almost guarantees you to get knocked back, spread the bet around in non suspicious amounts in different shops, you'll probably get it all on without causing any suspicion, another thing is never bet with the same firm all the time, if you have a consistent winning run you are automatically logged as a dangerous customer and guaranteed to get knocked back eventually.
These are so obvious yet people still go in looking for hundreds on in the one shop?

sinn,you know hans christian andersens fairytales, that where this mysterious punter resides

Stunned that Keane is still on moaning about not being able to get on. Honestly the more this guy opens his mouth the less I think of him.

silver are you implying that vip customers(large successful punters) are getting good money on at early prices without being knocked

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/leisure/8331789/Ladbrokes-60m-worse-off-as-high-roller-stops-playing.html

Just an example of the pain Ladbrokes go thru at times.

In fairness most of what PK said was spot on but it would appear Lustrumm has just about nailed this one .

lustrumm,is it lads or spoils you work for?how on earth could what pat keane said yesterday result in anyone thinking less of him?he spoke the truth and everyone  knows it.in fact he didnt say half enough to be honest.you say hes moaning about not being able to get on?are you saying hes lying?..come on tell us why hes gone done in your estimation.im intrested to know.can you also tell us why lads got ran out of the curragh last weekend?..maybe the curragh management have gone down in your estimation also!??!!?..

tell us the reason so icchy?

fair enough gimme.i didnt know that.i was told different.obviously i was told wrong.epople like the more dramatic story i guess.

Gant people do love drama but I wouldnt be so quick to call bull on the story you mention.

yep true story that day the powers staff turned up to punchestown the racecourse had stopped the electricity in the shop to stop them from opening,the laddies staff were waiting in the wings

Anyone that deal with PPs on a professional capacity (i.e provides services to them or supplies them or does business with them knows all too well that they are terrible to deal with. They are ruthless and would leave you in the halfpenny place.
I have the height fro Punchestown and if they gaves Paddies the road there was a good reason for it. Punchestown is the nest run course in the Country by a mile great to do business with.

AS for Pat Keane I do not have an issue with him raising the fact that the morning price fiasco is nothing more than a ready up and a marketing tool for bookmakers but any professional to come on TV moaning he could not have €600 at 7/4 on a 4/5 shot or €300ew at 7/2 a 6/4 shot does not deserve to be laid. Bookmakers are not going to hand money over to you. I bet if "cool" Pat had got off his ass and tried to break his bets into 3 or stuck someone else in like everyone else does he would have been laid. Point I am making is grow up Pat you clown and give over your moaning because bookies will nor line your pockets. Get over it.

Finally I have to make a comment about the Totty at the races yesterday. What a day out. For an old perv like me it was lik dying and going to heaven. Never enjoyed a day so much despite not winning.

I work in IT by the way Kavvie not a bookmaker although one of the major firms were customers of ours until we fell out with them

lustrumm  -  if they considered it a 4/5 shot - they should have marked that up, not 7/4.

it is mind-boggling to think that an outfit with over 2000 shops would not stand a liability of 1050.

If one person walked into each of their shops and had 30p on - it would be the same thing  -  I just do not understand the business-thinking behind it.

I don't know about the Customer Care in your IT business  ..  but to expect your Customer to visit a number of your locations to avail of an offer that you have advertised publicly, mentioning nothing about conditions or limits,  ...  is disgraceful imo.