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14 May 10
01:56
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06 Sep 05
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0514/1224270378463.html
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Internet betting to be taxed
MARY MINIHAN
THE GOVERNMENT will introduce legislation to ensure overseas betting providers comply with a licensing regime that will permit them to sell their products in Ireland, Taoiseach Brian Cowen has announced.
He said this would underpin funding for the racing industry by facilitating the extension of the tax regime for the betting industry to cover companies providing online and telephone betting.
Mr Cowen said the Horse and Greyhound Racing Fund was established at a time when annual income from excise duty collected on off-course betting was in the region of €60 million per annum, but receipts from excise duty on off-course betting had dropped to €31 million in 2010.
He said the exchequer contributed in excess of €31 million to the fund in 2009 and a further €28 million in 2010, but a more sustainable system of support for the industry was needed.
“All forms of betting including betting offered over the internet, other remote platforms or over the telephone should make a contribution.
“Such betting must be brought within the tax net,” Mr Cowen added.
MARY MINIHAN
THE GOVERNMENT will introduce legislation to ensure overseas betting providers comply with a licensing regime that will permit them to sell their products in Ireland, Taoiseach Brian Cowen has announced.
He said this would underpin funding for the racing industry by facilitating the extension of the tax regime for the betting industry to cover companies providing online and telephone betting.
Mr Cowen said the Horse and Greyhound Racing Fund was established at a time when annual income from excise duty collected on off-course betting was in the region of €60 million per annum, but receipts from excise duty on off-course betting had dropped to €31 million in 2010.
He said the exchequer contributed in excess of €31 million to the fund in 2009 and a further €28 million in 2010, but a more sustainable system of support for the industry was needed.
“All forms of betting including betting offered over the internet, other remote platforms or over the telephone should make a contribution.
“Such betting must be brought within the tax net,” Mr Cowen added.
Very unjust as expected. Presumably sports betting will be taxed to pay for horse racing prizemoney? Does anybody know anymore about this? What will the rate be? Will the exchanges be affected? Will the bookies / exchanges absorb the proposed taxation?...... Have the betting Industry representatives anything to add?
Would not be too worried if I had an internet site.
Too hard to make laws for this type of thing that would not contradict our European masters in Brussels.
Too hard to make laws for this type of thing that would not contradict our European masters in Brussels.
What does this mean for Betfair.
The commission rate is already high.
The commission rate is already high.
HRI chap wants the tax to all layers on Betfair. Hahaha that should be fun!!
Not good for betfair, if they jack up commisions to 7-8% then it be a disaster, they will have to fit it into current charges or meet half way which still wont be good.
Only proper that revenue on here goes back into the sport, but I certainly dont want it to be put in to that operation they call ballydoyle, winner of these G1 flat races shouldnt get any prizemoney, the individual horse eventual stallion is worth fortune anyway
Only proper that revenue on here goes back into the sport, but I certainly dont want it to be put in to that operation they call ballydoyle, winner of these G1 flat races shouldnt get any prizemoney, the individual horse eventual stallion is worth fortune anyway
I'll be quitting if it goes to 7-8%. Don't Betfair contribute directly to HRI anyway?
I don't bet on racing here generally, I don't want my small soccer and GAA bets to go to Magnier's and McManus' pockets. as you say. Betfair have a significant Irish operation, contribute to sport here, employ people here, sponsor things here and pay tax here. They should be left alone to get on with it. I'm writing to my local TDs about it. Hopefully sense prevails.
I don't bet on racing here generally, I don't want my small soccer and GAA bets to go to Magnier's and McManus' pockets. as you say. Betfair have a significant Irish operation, contribute to sport here, employ people here, sponsor things here and pay tax here. They should be left alone to get on with it. I'm writing to my local TDs about it. Hopefully sense prevails.
Betfair used to give HRI €1 million a year, but Brian Kavanagh said it wasn't enough. Don't get me wrong I like racing, but I think those idiots in HRI need to have a long look at themselves. Remember they wanted to spend €100m redevelopping the Curragh - which nobody ever goes to ... they spend hundreds of thousands on Hector O'H.
They are a holy joke. They should be able to fund themselves and not rely on handouts from the government or bookies.
By their argument the Airtricty League teams should also be getting a cut!
They are a holy joke. They should be able to fund themselves and not rely on handouts from the government or bookies.
By their argument the Airtricty League teams should also be getting a cut!
Agree with your sentiments entirely paw. Thought the era of the gravy train was ended but apparently not. Theres nothing like a begging bowl and a poor mouth to get a bit of sympathy and a few quid. Does anybody on this forum know what the Tote's(HRI's betting business) net profit was for 2009? Just curious as HRI continue to look towards bookmakers/punters to provide funding while they have their own betting business.
Would not be too worried if I had an internet site.
Too hard to make laws for this type of thing that would not contradict our European masters in Brussels.
Not that hard at all. They will inform the I.S.P to block the websites that will not conform, like they do in France.
Too hard to make laws for this type of thing that would not contradict our European masters in Brussels.
Not that hard at all. They will inform the I.S.P to block the websites that will not conform, like they do in France.
Fair is fair, if you use a product you have got to expect to pay for the service. Why wouldnt Betair absorb the 1% levy like Irish bookmakers are currently doing?
Irish fears over plan for online betting tax
BY JOHNNY WARD 9:41AM 15 MAY 2010
DEEP concern remained in the Irish racing industry last night about how Taoiseach Brian Cowen will effect plans to tax online and telephone betting.
Cowen's speech at a dinner on Thursday night confirmed his intention to bring offshore betting into the tax net and a government source told the Irish Racing Post "there is a plan - that is for sure".
Despite that confidence, the bookmaking industry held fire on passing judgement too quickly and conceded that they were waiting to see the details of the government's plans.
The Taoiseach - a shareholder in the Noel Meade-trained hurdler, Donnas Palm - conceded that "harsh measures" had been taken regarding state funding of the sport in Ireland. He stressed that funding for racing should come from the proceeds of betting duty.
"The government will introduce legislation to ensure that overseas betting providers comply with a licensing regime that will permit them to sell their products into our jurisdiction," said Cowen.
"This will have the additional benefit of facilitating the extension of the tax regime for the betting industry to all those providing online and telephone betting and so underpin funding for the racing industry."
Horse Racing Ireland welcomed the news, but the big question related to the system used to implement the plan - which Cowen admitted was a "complex issue".
Paddy Power last night said that specifics on the government's plans were needed.
"We are interested in the detail behind Brian Cowen's comments - it's absolutely vital," said a company spokesman.
"As we have always maintained, we have no problem paying an online betting tax as long as it is enforceable. If it isn't enforceable across the market, it will not only be a tax on Irish jobs but a tax based on us creating jobs in Ireland.
"This is because we are one of only two of the top ten online betting providers to the Irish market who are actually based in Ireland and employ people here."
Sharon Byrne, of the Irish Bookmakers' Association, welcomed the Taoiseach's speech, but said its success "depended on the detail of the new legislation".
"Betting shops are suffering badly and the figures for the first quarter show that revenue was down 15.6 per cent from 2009 figures in the Irish betting-shop industry. In the last 19 months, 135 betting shops have closed in Ireland," said Byrne.
"It is crucial that the betting exchanges, online betting and telephone betting have to pay what the betting shops must pay - in whatever format that is suitable to attract inward investment."
HRI chief executive Brian Kavanagh hailed the role of Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries & Food, Brendan Smith, "for the understanding and support" he had shown towards racing.
"We very much look forward to working withthem to secure the future of our sector. In 2001, when the Horseracing and Greyhound Racing Fund was established, betting in Ireland was e1.3 billion, generating duty of approximately e8 million.
"In 2009, although betting has increased to more than e4bn, the duty received by the exchequer has fallen to e31m.We welcome the commitment to address this anomaly."
Betfair also reacted positively. Ireland regional manager Graham Ross said: "We hope to be in a position to pay an appropriate rate of betting duty and would be happy if the government, under the Taoiseach's leadership, does indeed decide to allocate these taxes to the Horseracing and Greyhound Fund."
BY JOHNNY WARD 9:41AM 15 MAY 2010
DEEP concern remained in the Irish racing industry last night about how Taoiseach Brian Cowen will effect plans to tax online and telephone betting.
Cowen's speech at a dinner on Thursday night confirmed his intention to bring offshore betting into the tax net and a government source told the Irish Racing Post "there is a plan - that is for sure".
Despite that confidence, the bookmaking industry held fire on passing judgement too quickly and conceded that they were waiting to see the details of the government's plans.
The Taoiseach - a shareholder in the Noel Meade-trained hurdler, Donnas Palm - conceded that "harsh measures" had been taken regarding state funding of the sport in Ireland. He stressed that funding for racing should come from the proceeds of betting duty.
"The government will introduce legislation to ensure that overseas betting providers comply with a licensing regime that will permit them to sell their products into our jurisdiction," said Cowen.
"This will have the additional benefit of facilitating the extension of the tax regime for the betting industry to all those providing online and telephone betting and so underpin funding for the racing industry."
Horse Racing Ireland welcomed the news, but the big question related to the system used to implement the plan - which Cowen admitted was a "complex issue".
Paddy Power last night said that specifics on the government's plans were needed.
"We are interested in the detail behind Brian Cowen's comments - it's absolutely vital," said a company spokesman.
"As we have always maintained, we have no problem paying an online betting tax as long as it is enforceable. If it isn't enforceable across the market, it will not only be a tax on Irish jobs but a tax based on us creating jobs in Ireland.
"This is because we are one of only two of the top ten online betting providers to the Irish market who are actually based in Ireland and employ people here."
Sharon Byrne, of the Irish Bookmakers' Association, welcomed the Taoiseach's speech, but said its success "depended on the detail of the new legislation".
"Betting shops are suffering badly and the figures for the first quarter show that revenue was down 15.6 per cent from 2009 figures in the Irish betting-shop industry. In the last 19 months, 135 betting shops have closed in Ireland," said Byrne.
"It is crucial that the betting exchanges, online betting and telephone betting have to pay what the betting shops must pay - in whatever format that is suitable to attract inward investment."
HRI chief executive Brian Kavanagh hailed the role of Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries & Food, Brendan Smith, "for the understanding and support" he had shown towards racing.
"We very much look forward to working withthem to secure the future of our sector. In 2001, when the Horseracing and Greyhound Racing Fund was established, betting in Ireland was e1.3 billion, generating duty of approximately e8 million.
"In 2009, although betting has increased to more than e4bn, the duty received by the exchequer has fallen to e31m.We welcome the commitment to address this anomaly."
Betfair also reacted positively. Ireland regional manager Graham Ross said: "We hope to be in a position to pay an appropriate rate of betting duty and would be happy if the government, under the Taoiseach's leadership, does indeed decide to allocate these taxes to the Horseracing and Greyhound Fund."
We'll be grand going by reading that, drinks all round 
I'll give you a reason Morrga, because Betfair offered to give HRI 1.5 million a year and the HRI turned it down. 4 HRI board members sat on the Punchestown board which turned down 100,000 euro sponsorship from Betfair, the meeting was described in the newspaper as "tense".
I'd have no problem paying it if it was used to fund sport in Ireland. I do have a problem paying it if it's going to stuff the HRI's pockets. That's the issue for most people I think.
I'd have no problem paying it if it was used to fund sport in Ireland. I do have a problem paying it if it's going to stuff the HRI's pockets. That's the issue for most people I think.
Surely this is the most unequitable system ever that is being proposed?unless i have read something wrong,perhaps if betting turnover on golf = 4% of all turnover then the GUI will get 4% of the betting tax collected,the GAA IRFU and FAI will clean up also.This to me looks like the only fair way of doing it.
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