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16 Jun 26
21:54
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26 Jun 12
I was at Ascot today and had a bundle on Bow Echo ante-post. Watching live you could see the dirty tactics from those 'see you next Tuesdays'.... I truly hate O'Brien and he always plays dirty. He is no Sir Henry Cecil and I hope the sheep wake up to the trainer that he really is!!
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Fair play for your voice and recollection of what you saw today.
For once Newmarket Sausage is correct.
Naturally,Delbert failed to see the deliberate infringements by Coolmoore in the race
Naturally,Delbert failed to see the deliberate infringements by Coolmoore in the race
An enquiry was held to consider interference shortly after the start involving GSTAAD, placed second, ridden by Ryan Moore; the winner, BOW ECHO (IRE), ridden by Billy Loughnane; TALK OF NEW YORK, placed third, ridden by William Buick; and POWER BLUE (IRE), placed fourth, ridden by David Egan. Moore was suspended for 3 days for careless riding for allowing his mount to edge left-handed without correction causing BOW ECHO (IRE) and TALK OF NEW YORK and PUERTO RICO (IRE) to become short of room for a number of strides when awkwardly placed between GSTAAD and POWER BLUE (IRE) on the far outside.
An enquiry was held to consider whether C Soumillon, the rider of PUERTO RICO (IRE), unplaced, rode in a manner to benefit GSTAAD, placed second, ridden by Ryan Moore, and in doing so caused minimal interference to POWER BLUE (IRE), placed fourth, ridden by David Egan. Soumillon, Moore and Egan were interviewed and shown recordings of the incident, and Aidan O’Brien, the trainer of PUERTO RICO (IRE) and GSTAAD, was interviewed via telephone. Soumillon was suspended for 8 days for riding his mount in such a way that intended to give an advantage to another horse from the same stable, in that he moved his mount away from the rail thereby ensuring a clear run for GSTAAD on his inside.
An enquiry was held to consider whether C Soumillon, the rider of PUERTO RICO (IRE), unplaced, rode in a manner to benefit GSTAAD, placed second, ridden by Ryan Moore, and in doing so caused minimal interference to POWER BLUE (IRE), placed fourth, ridden by David Egan. Soumillon, Moore and Egan were interviewed and shown recordings of the incident, and Aidan O’Brien, the trainer of PUERTO RICO (IRE) and GSTAAD, was interviewed via telephone. Soumillon was suspended for 8 days for riding his mount in such a way that intended to give an advantage to another horse from the same stable, in that he moved his mount away from the rail thereby ensuring a clear run for GSTAAD on his inside.
I'm sure Ed and the team will give it a full discussion today.
Lets be logical here and not bet on it Mr. Spock.
'Insufficient facts always invite danger'
'while technically possible it is highly illogical'
'Insufficient facts always invite danger'
'while technically possible it is highly illogical'
They said as much as they dared to.
Coolmore are absolutely vile in their conduct and are highly unlikely to change unless Draconian punishment is handed out (1,000,000/1}
Coolmore are absolutely vile in their conduct and are highly unlikely to change unless Draconian punishment is handed out (1,000,000/1}
Soumillon should have got a month then maybe when AOB allegedly asks him to do something similar in future he'll give them the finger.
Stewards' action long overdue. I've long feared AOB tactics could cause an accident with possible serious injury to horse and rider. What kind of penalty would be appropriate then?
Thank goodness that Bow Echo won as the chances of Gstaad getting disqualified would have been unlikely at best.
Was the penalty for Soumillon moving off the rail or colliding with the Amo horse?
Yes,brandy and in so doing making a gap for Gstaad to take whilst hampering the opposition.
Just watched again, clearly looks behind to see where Moore is and opens up the gap. Moore also banned for trying to box in Bow Echo from the start.
A truly rancid operation,Spocko.
The only reason that I did not back the winner was the fear of "Team Tactics" and they threw the lot at it yesterday
The only reason that I did not back the winner was the fear of "Team Tactics" and they threw the lot at it yesterday
AOB has only one master. The one who employs him to keep the gravy train rolling at any cost.
its all easy when AOB hasn't won the race bit if Moore had got up on the line would they have
a, even looked at the start , [ no chance ]
b, diq, Moore for either of the offences they were thought to have committed [ no chance ]
will AOB now top these team tacticsin case they result in them losing a race in the stewards room ?
a, even looked at the start , [ no chance ]
b, diq, Moore for either of the offences they were thought to have committed [ no chance ]
will AOB now top these team tacticsin case they result in them losing a race in the stewards room ?
I was waiting for Gstaad to be declared a Non Runner. 
Similar tactics are on display at every Cheltenham Festival for all to see.
Multiple runners from certain stables that get in the way of who ever needs to be got in the way of.
Multiple runners from certain stables that get in the way of who ever needs to be got in the way of.
OK - this is a casual side issue, but it's made me think about the Shergar Cup and the Racing League. To quote Richard Russell in the RP today. "Tactics play a part in every race in Britain and Ireland, but the team tactics we witnessed when Puerto Rico manufactured a gap for Gstaad, have absolutely no part in our sport.."
So if this happened in either of those two events, say to secure points needed to win the wider competition, then sanctions would follow. In which case one has to ask, what is the point of the wider competition?
The obvious conclusion that bears repeating, every time these abhorrations come round again; Horse Racing IS NOT a team sport.
And the usual argument that it provides a bit of variety and different interest, simply falls apart.
So if this happened in either of those two events, say to secure points needed to win the wider competition, then sanctions would follow. In which case one has to ask, what is the point of the wider competition?
The obvious conclusion that bears repeating, every time these abhorrations come round again; Horse Racing IS NOT a team sport.
And the usual argument that it provides a bit of variety and different interest, simply falls apart.
Didn't see the race live but caught up with it after the discussion about it. It did have a whiff of the Shergar Cup type races about it and the penalties appear lenient at best. Not in any way subtle either. Disappointing and depressing in equal measure.
Think penalties are long overdue for this pre planned scenario. Also why is there no penalties for jockeys who 'get a shout' in races everyday and move out of the way to let their mate go by. What about 'best possible placing' in this scenario when a jockey has clearly compromised the 'best possible position' of his own horse?
Why do we persevere with backing GB trained horses? Yes there were three wins yesterday with Bow Echo at 5/6, a 50/1 outsider and a nice handicap for Alan King but from how many runners? The O'Briens have plenty as well but 5 winners from 9 races is extaordinary.
As far as the St James Palace is concerned, the penalties were for deliberate interference with other horses as much as opening a gap along the rail. Soumillon deliberately carried the winner and third wide as well as opening up the rail. The Shergar Cup has not led to deliberate obstruction so far as I can recall.
racings apologist booby walsh said Puerto Rico,s winning chance weren't effected ,but if it was trained by gosden and souey let the winner up the inside like that,booby would have ripped him to shreds,even a moron like chamberlian wasnt having it
It's taken the stews years to finally take action on the team tactics that have occured time and
time again. When they tried it on at the Melbourne Cup, having all 3 runners on the front stacking up
the field, they were lucky to get out of Australia alive! You can't blame them for employing these
tactics as long as the authorities turn a blind eye.
In Hong Kong or Oz, Soumi would have been banned for months not days.
time again. When they tried it on at the Melbourne Cup, having all 3 runners on the front stacking up
the field, they were lucky to get out of Australia alive! You can't blame them for employing these
tactics as long as the authorities turn a blind eye.
In Hong Kong or Oz, Soumi would have been banned for months not days.
their not bothered 2 champions jocks fined.suspended for basically trying to cheat punters, ashamed, nah just a shrug of the shoulders , so what
I know I'm late for this. Any mention of it on tv and the journos and pundits? I hope, in the future, the BHA would throw the book at AOB and disqualify his entire team or battalion of runners. It's cheating - the most despicable in any sport. It's also unsporting.
has kevin blake mentioned it today, all ive seen of him messing about with strides etc
If someone at the racecourse or winner's enclosure calls out "you're a cheat" AOB, Moore or Soumillon then this can only be a deterrent for the 3 individuals concerned. Name and shame is effective and necessary in the King Of Sport, I firmly believe.
Pointless as they would laugh at you before you were ejected.
Only the Authorities can try to stop it
Only the Authorities can try to stop it
Really pleased with this thread personally i would have trebled the bans at least sick of this cheating and putting horses and jockeys at risk, hate the idea of pacemakers full stop.
love pacemakers. produced 1 of the greatst races of all time Grundy V Bustino.
But,geoff,they were there to set the pace and not to deliberately hamper other rivals
What Moore did at the start was deliberate and unforgiveable for a senior jockey. It was downright offensive professionally, and clearly unsporting; Soumillon (the accomplice) received a hefty sentence than Moore.
I think the penalty dished out was extremely lenient esp on AOB, and Moore. I think it ought to be reviewed, and the perpetrators called before the Jockey Club in High Holborn.
I think the penalty dished out was extremely lenient esp on AOB, and Moore. I think it ought to be reviewed, and the perpetrators called before the Jockey Club in High Holborn.
Penalties are imposed within the Rules not what they would like to do.
When they are used as pacemakers i.e POW truly run providing a great race with the best horses coming to the fore.
Helped to deliver Montjeu's imperious KG. My best day's racing.
Jun 17, 2026 -- 4:28PM, geoff m wrote:
When they are used as pacemakers i.e POW
Jun 17, 2026 -- 4:20PM, impossible123 wrote:
What Moore did at the start was deliberate and unforgiveable for a senior jockey. It was downright offensive professionally, and clearly unsporting; Soumillon (the accomplice) received a hefty sentence than Moore.I think the penalty dished out was extremely lenient esp on AOB, and Moore. I think it ought to be reviewed, and the perpetrators called before the Jockey Club in High Holborn.
My thoughts exactly, for my money, Moore's riding at the start was reckless and the more serious offence.
How can jockeys of pacemakers be considered to be doing everything within the rules to obtain the
best possible placing? Surely a jockey on a front runner who wanted the horse to run it's best would
go to the lead and then slow it down ,recover from the initial effort and then kick again?
Like our interference rules this pacemaker rule is a total nonsense!
best possible placing? Surely a jockey on a front runner who wanted the horse to run it's best would
go to the lead and then slow it down ,recover from the initial effort and then kick again?
Like our interference rules this pacemaker rule is a total nonsense!
Like the "loveable" JPM,Coolmore are largely "untouchable"
A horse ridden at the front, whether it be a pacemaker or running on its merit, its fate will be decided by its jockey. However, what happened in the St James's yesterday was neither. It was running to aid its stablemate, Gstaad,by occupying a position to facilitate Gstaad at the critical juncture in the race; he was engineering a smooth passage next to the rail for Gstaad by coming off the rail to the left.
I hope the next time this "team tactic" is deployed, causing an impede or not, the stewards must issue a heftier suspension to the same connections. Horseracing is not a team sport, and this "cheating" behaviour must be stopped for the good of the sport.
I hope the next time this "team tactic" is deployed, causing an impede or not, the stewards must issue a heftier suspension to the same connections. Horseracing is not a team sport, and this "cheating" behaviour must be stopped for the good of the sport.
The following is AOB's explanation of yesterday's race;
Asked if he disagreed with the suggestion team tactics were used, O'Brien said: “There’s no doubt about that. I always say when we put horses in a race, they’re in there for one thing. It’s to make sure there’s an even pace for everybody. That’s the only reason.
"Then you come out of the race and you know what trip your horse wants, and whether your horse is good enough to run against those horses or not. If it’s a muddle, you don’t know what’s going to happen and nobody knows. It’s inconclusive for everybody.”
When O'Brien was asked whether the stewards took the right action, he replied: “The stewards are the ones that make the decision. Rules are rules, the stewards have their job to do and that’s the way it is.
“I thought both horses would be very forward and I thought one could be leading. I thought Christophe might be leading because his horse won making the running twice last year in a Group 1 and that’s why Christophe was on him. I thought he would lead and I thought Ryan would be sitting second. That’s the way I read it.
“I don’t know what happened. I saw it like everyone else.”
Strangely enough I think he is talking utter cobblers
Asked if he disagreed with the suggestion team tactics were used, O'Brien said: “There’s no doubt about that. I always say when we put horses in a race, they’re in there for one thing. It’s to make sure there’s an even pace for everybody. That’s the only reason.
"Then you come out of the race and you know what trip your horse wants, and whether your horse is good enough to run against those horses or not. If it’s a muddle, you don’t know what’s going to happen and nobody knows. It’s inconclusive for everybody.”
When O'Brien was asked whether the stewards took the right action, he replied: “The stewards are the ones that make the decision. Rules are rules, the stewards have their job to do and that’s the way it is.
“I thought both horses would be very forward and I thought one could be leading. I thought Christophe might be leading because his horse won making the running twice last year in a Group 1 and that’s why Christophe was on him. I thought he would lead and I thought Ryan would be sitting second. That’s the way I read it.
“I don’t know what happened. I saw it like everyone else.”
Strangely enough I think he is talking utter cobblers
Two points, first can we have less C&P please?! 
Second is this quote,
"Then you come out of the race and you know what trip your horse wants, and whether your horse is good enough to run against those horses or not. If it’s a muddle, you don’t know what’s going to happen and nobody knows. It’s inconclusive for everybody.”
If this is the case then why did he run a miler in last years Derby?
Why was Albert talked up as a Guineas horse?
It’s total bs.
Second is this quote,
"Then you come out of the race and you know what trip your horse wants, and whether your horse is good enough to run against those horses or not. If it’s a muddle, you don’t know what’s going to happen and nobody knows. It’s inconclusive for everybody.”
If this is the case then why did he run a miler in last years Derby?
Why was Albert talked up as a Guineas horse?
It’s total bs.
So how did you view the effort by Devils advocate today? He was never intended to win the race although if he had gone a bit slower for the first 5 furlongs he might have been placed. The rest of the field ignored him.
O'Brien's statements are even less convincing than Trump's and that is saying something.
I recall Andre Fabre saying that even in a slow tempo the class horse will win.
Sosie never needed a pacemaker to win the 1m 1f DISPHAN nor did Daryz.
Sosie never needed a pacemaker to win the 1m 1f DISPHAN nor did Daryz.
I don’t see how the pacemakers in the POW today helped the race or pace in any way, except the winner who like last year was held up in last off of a strong gallop as he was last year.
The first reaction to his win last year was that there was a pace collapse. 12f horses were treading water at the end of this compared to Rewilding who was held up and ran on strong.
Buick had sitting ducks in front of him to aim at.
The first reaction to his win last year was that there was a pace collapse. 12f horses were treading water at the end of this compared to Rewilding who was held up and ran on strong.
Buick had sitting ducks in front of him to aim at.
Watch back last years Champion, see where the 1st and 2nd sat.
Calandagan and Ombudsman.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptw3pqBjthw
Today he ran by already beaten horses.
Calandagan and Ombudsman.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptw3pqBjthw
Today he ran by already beaten horses.
NS - I've hated Coolmore for about 20 years and there is so much I could focus on with numerous examples.
Aidan does seem to be a genuinely decent guy but I can't stand listening to his incessant búllshit!
I cannot believe more pundits don't say it just as it is - he deserves mass ridicule for the shíte he spouts.
Remember the legendary speed which Galileo was supposed to have...that the July Cup was there for the taking?
Funny that...as a 2f shorter trip was the reason Fantastic Light found a couple of lengths on him from Ascot
Every season he's hailing half a dozen 'wonder horses' who'd get nosebleeds if they reached the heights of 130!
In summary...I think he's not got a clue as we saw YET AGAIN on Derby Day!
He's a very helpful gent and always polite & accommodating but despite the frequent interviews...he NEVER tells
you ANYTHING remotely useful...or truthful! We glean what we can through the betting.
He's breaking records that will likely remain for a lifetime and this may sound very churlish to many of you
but he IS NOT the genius they keep reminding us about...just in case we forgot our brainwashing!
Just how many horses have they had in now three decades which have reached the elevated heights of an official
130 rating?
Only Galileo (130) along with that ridiculous 137 for Hawk Wing...and that was due to one inexplicable, anomalous performance.
He was given an embarrassing official mark of 137 which is absolutely senseless...as it puts him higher than
Sea The Stars, Troy, Dubai Millennium & Montjeu to name a few which is ludicrous & absolutely laughable!
I do believe Aidan's LOWERED the bar...despite having a virtual monopoly of the best bloodstock to choose from.
It's a poor substitute/comparison when someone compares official ratings & class with an overall resume of G1 wins
when those performers can be a stone inferior to genuine historical champions! Don't we all love brilliance?
Cecil, Stoute, Vincent et al had numerous far superior performers despite having far fewer superbly bred candidates.
Does anyone really believe he's superior to Vincent or Henry...or many others I could name?
His very best horses CANNOT compare to Stoute's or some of the aforementioned legends.
It's ALL about rattling up the numbers of Group Ones with them...NOT quality.
I despise their conveyor belt of relentless bluebloods who never have the panache of the greats going back.
It's arguable that City Of Troy is as good as he's had but they weren't so adventurous or sporting in running away
to stud with him were they? The #myth' would've been exposed...that's why!
An improved 4yo Calandagan would've reigned supreme and improved past him- the official ratings actually say so too.
I keep stating the obvious in that Coolmore has an unstoppable conveyor belt of ammunition bred in the purple
which we've NEVER seen the likes of and sheer numbers means the rest can't compete and he can't fail - it's
like having a penalty with an open goal!
It is NOT that he's TOO smart for the rest...and that's a huge insult to Gosden, Cumani, Haggas et al.
It's got that bad with me that even when I haven't got a bet in a race, I can't help cheering on something else
when they've been locked in a battle - it's a kick as if I'd actually won money!
Bow Echo yesterday was a prime example.
If were talking about achievements then it's an A* but for quality of horses (considering the fail-proof ammunition)
then it's probably a D- as I suspect ANY half-decent professional trainer could achieve likewise...and possibly even
squeeze out a bit more. Just imagine what Vincent, Stoute or Cecil could've achieved with the firepower Aidan's had!
Aidan does seem to be a genuinely decent guy but I can't stand listening to his incessant búllshit!
I cannot believe more pundits don't say it just as it is - he deserves mass ridicule for the shíte he spouts.
Remember the legendary speed which Galileo was supposed to have...that the July Cup was there for the taking?
Funny that...as a 2f shorter trip was the reason Fantastic Light found a couple of lengths on him from Ascot
Every season he's hailing half a dozen 'wonder horses' who'd get nosebleeds if they reached the heights of 130!
In summary...I think he's not got a clue as we saw YET AGAIN on Derby Day!
He's a very helpful gent and always polite & accommodating but despite the frequent interviews...he NEVER tells
you ANYTHING remotely useful...or truthful! We glean what we can through the betting.
He's breaking records that will likely remain for a lifetime and this may sound very churlish to many of you
but he IS NOT the genius they keep reminding us about...just in case we forgot our brainwashing!
Just how many horses have they had in now three decades which have reached the elevated heights of an official
130 rating?
Only Galileo (130) along with that ridiculous 137 for Hawk Wing...and that was due to one inexplicable, anomalous performance.
He was given an embarrassing official mark of 137 which is absolutely senseless...as it puts him higher than
Sea The Stars, Troy, Dubai Millennium & Montjeu to name a few which is ludicrous & absolutely laughable!
I do believe Aidan's LOWERED the bar...despite having a virtual monopoly of the best bloodstock to choose from.
It's a poor substitute/comparison when someone compares official ratings & class with an overall resume of G1 wins
when those performers can be a stone inferior to genuine historical champions! Don't we all love brilliance?
Cecil, Stoute, Vincent et al had numerous far superior performers despite having far fewer superbly bred candidates.
Does anyone really believe he's superior to Vincent or Henry...or many others I could name?
His very best horses CANNOT compare to Stoute's or some of the aforementioned legends.
It's ALL about rattling up the numbers of Group Ones with them...NOT quality.
I despise their conveyor belt of relentless bluebloods who never have the panache of the greats going back.
It's arguable that City Of Troy is as good as he's had but they weren't so adventurous or sporting in running away
to stud with him were they? The #myth' would've been exposed...that's why!
An improved 4yo Calandagan would've reigned supreme and improved past him- the official ratings actually say so too.
I keep stating the obvious in that Coolmore has an unstoppable conveyor belt of ammunition bred in the purple
which we've NEVER seen the likes of and sheer numbers means the rest can't compete and he can't fail - it's
like having a penalty with an open goal!
It is NOT that he's TOO smart for the rest...and that's a huge insult to Gosden, Cumani, Haggas et al.
It's got that bad with me that even when I haven't got a bet in a race, I can't help cheering on something else
when they've been locked in a battle - it's a kick as if I'd actually won money!
Bow Echo yesterday was a prime example.
If were talking about achievements then it's an A* but for quality of horses (considering the fail-proof ammunition)
then it's probably a D- as I suspect ANY half-decent professional trainer could achieve likewise...and possibly even
squeeze out a bit more. Just imagine what Vincent, Stoute or Cecil could've achieved with the firepower Aidan's had!
Surely Ballydoyle would have wanted Gstaad sat just behind Puerto Rico.
The start was messy, with the Amo horse and Rico coming from wide looking for the rail.
Bow Echo was not the only one inconvenienced.
As for the home turn, was this any different from Richard Hills on Give The Slip, allowing Fantastic Light to slip up the rail Vs Galileo?
A lot of hot air about nothing.
The start was messy, with the Amo horse and Rico coming from wide looking for the rail.
Bow Echo was not the only one inconvenienced.
As for the home turn, was this any different from Richard Hills on Give The Slip, allowing Fantastic Light to slip up the rail Vs Galileo?
A lot of hot air about nothing.
Thanks EJ - it makes a refreshing change to have bonafide common sense & FACTS appreciated on here - the majority just haven't got the wisdom of some excellent posters who were on here 15 yrs ago.
I just can't understand why everyone's under his spell and nobody will speak about it (for fear of reprisals like no more interviews) but there are a few who come armed with experience & knowledge who despite not being around would definitely be in MY camp.
PS - I'd welcome retaliation from the fanboys...as the FACTS are on my side
I just can't understand why everyone's under his spell and nobody will speak about it (for fear of reprisals like no more interviews) but there are a few who come armed with experience & knowledge who despite not being around would definitely be in MY camp.
PS - I'd welcome retaliation from the fanboys...as the FACTS are on my side
Interviewer "What did you make of Christophe Soumillon's ride"?
AOB "Look obviously delighted, over the moon, Claude and Claudette brought him up, Chantelle looks after him at home. Delighted for the lads, Jean=Paul, Kilian, Pascal and Jacques."
AOB "Look obviously delighted, over the moon, Claude and Claudette brought him up, Chantelle looks after him at home. Delighted for the lads, Jean=Paul, Kilian, Pascal and Jacques."
The big difference between Aiden and the list of Champion trainers of the past is partly the number of horses he has to choose from for every Group 1 race. He probably had 8 that might have won the Derby if everything was in their favour (fitness, going, tactics etc.) Even the likes of Cecil and Stoute only had 1 or 2 each year and if things were not in their favour they either didn't run or didn't win.
Sage - that's what I'm saying so in a nutsác..Aidan's ALL about quantity NOT quality!
All considered, they have had very few QUALITY horses and that barometer must be quantified
on ratings, not resumés...as someone's gotta win the G1s.
I remember seeing what I figured was a improving high class prospect in Give The Slip (Ebor winner)
being purchased by Godolphin to be used as a pacemaker for Fantastic Light - I knew they'd ruin
that horse (which they duly did) as he was sacrificed - couldn't stand the fcúkers for that but
Coolmore use proven G1 winners (not prospects) in that role and we've seen it many times.
I do actually like the odd one - HIgh Chaparral was a tremendous campaigner back in the day.
All considered, they have had very few QUALITY horses and that barometer must be quantified
on ratings, not resumés...as someone's gotta win the G1s.
I remember seeing what I figured was a improving high class prospect in Give The Slip (Ebor winner)
being purchased by Godolphin to be used as a pacemaker for Fantastic Light - I knew they'd ruin
that horse (which they duly did) as he was sacrificed - couldn't stand the fcúkers for that but
Coolmore use proven G1 winners (not prospects) in that role and we've seen it many times.
I do actually like the odd one - HIgh Chaparral was a tremendous campaigner back in the day.
I've forgotten which horse won the Epsom Derby 2026. However, I remember it was run on 6th June. And, I can remember which horse won 2000G 2026.
Looked like might be Lordan again there at one point.
Herbie, enjoyed reading that, yes when considering greatness perhaps we should apply the example we often use in football when considering Pep's greatness, stick Aiden into a struggling northern yard run on a shoestring and let him show us how great he is
I'd be happy if AOB draws a blank today. A bit of variety is preferred even in horseracing.
I think AOB's greatest skill is the fact, and even Herbie mentions it, is despite the negatives we feel toward the operation, it is still very hard to not actually like the man as he always comes across as a "really pleasant individual" I like to think that it is not a front and how he comes across as a man is real.
Substitute his demeanour with that of what was typically Stoute's in his heyday and the feeling toward him and the operation would be even more negative than it is now.
Substitute his demeanour with that of what was typically Stoute's in his heyday and the feeling toward him and the operation would be even more negative than it is now.
duffy,he's a gent. Seen him go the extra mile with racegoers here at minor meetings in Ireland. Very hard not to actually like the man.
Previous posters. Coolmore are both quantity and quality.
Previous posters. Coolmore are both quantity and quality.
Quantity - Yes. None a smidgeon of Frankel, Dancing Brave, Montjeu, Sea The Stars or even Golden Horn.
Quality - No
what was their last quality Epsom Derby winner? I cannot remember
What was their last quality 3-yr old ARC winner? Zilch
So many runners in the big races, why? Lacking confidence and most were riding shotguns for the principal (fav) runner.
Horse are like humans. If one only breeds with one within their offspring is very unlikely to be much better eg a superstar.
Quality - No
what was their last quality Epsom Derby winner? I cannot remember
What was their last quality 3-yr old ARC winner? Zilch
So many runners in the big races, why? Lacking confidence and most were riding shotguns for the principal (fav) runner.
Horse are like humans. If one only breeds with one within their offspring is very unlikely to be much better eg a superstar.
I think you have the wrong O'Brien. His son could teach his dad a few tricks. Made even more nauseating by having his PR man bigging him and his jock up every five minutes. 50/60 losers every fortnight.
I do not do horses from Joseph's stable esp shorties, period. There had been several odds-on taken a walk into the wilderness and "2nd string" backed from double digits, won or gifted the race. Tbh I very seldom back anything in Ireland.
Jumper45 - who would you nominate as 'the quality'?
There's not a single performer who you could say was worthy of sniffing the árses of the elite of the game!
AND even the second tier like Daylami, Pilsudski, Singspiel, Mtoto, Montjeu etc...are FAR superior!
There's not a single one who could break into the top 100 yet the ludicrous bélléndry I heard about in 2024
that victory for City Of Troy in the Breeders' Cup Classic would elevate him into the 'TOP THREE OF ALL TIME'
is utter LINACY - I really don't know how such góbshítes have jobs! They should be signing on...with crayons
Please don't give me that búllshít about Hawk Wing as I've already mentioned him...and if you're talking
about Galileo or City Of Troy, then get the fine-toothed comb out and you'll realise why they didn't keep
either of them around at 4yo.
It must be said that everyone draws a line through their disappointing BCC runs as at least they had the bálls
to roll the dice and give it a go...and IMMORTALITY would've rightfully awaited.
There's not a single performer who you could say was worthy of sniffing the árses of the elite of the game!
AND even the second tier like Daylami, Pilsudski, Singspiel, Mtoto, Montjeu etc...are FAR superior!
There's not a single one who could break into the top 100 yet the ludicrous bélléndry I heard about in 2024
that victory for City Of Troy in the Breeders' Cup Classic would elevate him into the 'TOP THREE OF ALL TIME'
is utter LINACY - I really don't know how such góbshítes have jobs! They should be signing on...with crayons
Please don't give me that búllshít about Hawk Wing as I've already mentioned him...and if you're talking
about Galileo or City Of Troy, then get the fine-toothed comb out and you'll realise why they didn't keep
either of them around at 4yo.
It must be said that everyone draws a line through their disappointing BCC runs as at least they had the bálls
to roll the dice and give it a go...and IMMORTALITY would've rightfully awaited.
Montjeu was obviously nothing to do with AOB, not even trained in Ireland. And most definitely first tier!
Cider - I loved the horse and I remember thinking he was the best 12f horse I'd seen in 15 yrs since Dancing Brave but...
there's another step up to the absolute elite over the decades and I'd reluctantly say NO as his career petered out like
a damp squib, with three below par runs, so it's doubtful he joins those ranks of Frankel, Sea Bird, Nijinsky, Sir Ivor,
Shergar, El Gran Senor, Dubai Millennium, Troy, Sea The Stars et al.
there's another step up to the absolute elite over the decades and I'd reluctantly say NO as his career petered out like
a damp squib, with three below par runs, so it's doubtful he joins those ranks of Frankel, Sea Bird, Nijinsky, Sir Ivor,
Shergar, El Gran Senor, Dubai Millennium, Troy, Sea The Stars et al.
Does Dubai Millenium really deserve to be in that list? I've never thought so myself
thank god that camelot didnt win the leger, or we be hearing that he was the greatest horse by coolmore and their fans, camelot won the worst derby imo ever as for opposition, and the gns win wasnt much better ,
Duffy - not a personal fav of mine but I'd reluctantly have to concede that he had a nigh-on perfect career.
I think I've a habit of throwing him in just to shut the Godolphin fanboys up
I would've been well behind Montjeu if that famous duel ever threatened to happen...a la Dawn Run/Buck House.
I think I've a habit of throwing him in just to shut the Godolphin fanboys up
I would've been well behind Montjeu if that famous duel ever threatened to happen...a la Dawn Run/Buck House.
Duffy - not a personal fav of mine but I'd reluctantly have to concede that he had a nigh-on perfect career.
I think I've a habit of throwing him in just to shut the Godolphin fanboys up
I would've been well behind Montjeu if that famous duel ever threatened to happen...a la Dawn Run/Buck House.
I think I've a habit of throwing him in just to shut the Godolphin fanboys up
I would've been well behind Montjeu if that famous duel ever threatened to happen...a la Dawn Run/Buck House.
Well said EJ - thank fcúk fro Encke!
I backed him too ante-post...got a couple of grand out of him
As you say...he's now just regarded as an average G1 winner which is exactly what he was but imagine the bullshit if
he would've prevailed? We would never have seen just how exposed he was to be as a 4yo so the LIE would've become immortal!
I backed him too ante-post...got a couple of grand out of him
As you say...he's now just regarded as an average G1 winner which is exactly what he was but imagine the bullshit if
he would've prevailed? We would never have seen just how exposed he was to be as a 4yo so the LIE would've become immortal!
PS - to the pedants...I do realise that there are only the words 'vacuum & continuum' (I can think of) which have a pair of ewes
It doesn't tale too much to outwit those moderators
It doesn't tale too much to outwit those moderators
https://x.com/i/status/2068833171345445270
Interesting stat if true that the Coolmore horses spend less time in the stalls
Interesting stat if true that the Coolmore horses spend less time in the stalls
I’d made that point after the Prix Du Jockey Club, asked how Moore is always in last even in big fields.
Tiger you said jocks are free to compete more, that goes for the loading too.
Tiger you said jocks are free to compete more, that goes for the loading too.
he is the greatest trainer that has ever lived, over the jumps and the flat.
I'd disagree. Without the incessant ammunition available I think he'd be far less successful. His mob-handed strategy at big races and the type of horses Coolmore breeds are a clear testament to that.
You could argue the mob handed still have to be trained to win these big races.
At the top of the game , NH and flat..the man is the best ever....churlish to say otherwise.
of course the top trainers get given the best tools....its the way of the world....The man delivers at all levels.
of course the top trainers get given the best tools....its the way of the world....The man delivers at all levels.
Group sprint and handicap races? The bloke is ungentlemanly on the track eg mob-handed and team tactics.
He wins across the board....When he targets a big handicap, never far away.....and its not as though he is hiding the ability of his horse.
i get that folk are jealous, but the "lads" picked him for a reason.....I loved the man when he was a NH trainer....some great memories, especially a horse called Urabande winning at Aintree....Rough Quest's year.
i get that folk are jealous, but the "lads" picked him for a reason.....I loved the man when he was a NH trainer....some great memories, especially a horse called Urabande winning at Aintree....Rough Quest's year.
It's just tedious if the same people keep winning in any sport. Sure, the quality can be acknowledged, but it becomes monotonous. I still recall when I was quite into tennis and Sampras winning Wimbledon every single year. The only sportsman where the domination was never boring in my time watching, was Tiger. And maybe Bolt, But athletics is infrequent viewing for most people.
No match with Sir Cecil. When Sir Cecil targeted a prestigious handicap eg The Ebor with Kneller he won. There would be only 1 runner - no team tactic necessary. His star charges would only have one target each.
AOB is a good trainer. I'd like to see him as a freelance trainer. I'd also like to see him train some handicappers.
AOB is a good trainer. I'd like to see him as a freelance trainer. I'd also like to see him train some handicappers.
But some posts miss the point. To arrive in his current position, Aiden had to demonstate his ability from the lower levels up to the top. Now he is the figurehead for a billion pound multinational company who can breed or buy the 10 best middle distance colts and fillies each year so that Aiden can turn as many of them as possible into Group 1 winners that end up in the Coolmore Stud ranks. They clearly don't care if some of those Classic winning colts turn out to pretty useless as 4yos. Witness the treatment of Lambourn, now used as a pacemaker!
And Illinois, so much so that Moore remarked that AOB ran him in the wrong race at Epsom.
Herbie's post should be on the front page of the Racing Post. Great stuff, H
why was Ed and all going along with fantastic training from obrien to get Illinois to win the last at Rascot, yes he was pulled up in coronation, which imo was disgraceful by coolmore , running a leger 2ndlike a hare in that atrocious conditions at epsom, , he wasnt pulled up for tiredness , he just did his job for lambourn and jan and then stopped, and he was suppose to win that r ascot race he had stones in hand of the others .
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