Just because I am not against immigration does not mean I think it is ok to have an open border.
Of course there should be control, but we have to do our bit.

Dixie. People landing on our shores are not illegal.

Cider. What are Christian values? Are they different from the other 2999 religious values?

If you don't already know what they are, brandy, it would explain a lot. I'm sure there is a fair bit of correlation over different religious values. Christian countries don't tend to make it illegal for women to show their faces in public, would be one example.

The boat people are predominately being taxied in by the organised border force sham, ie being escorted nearly half way by the French, stopping in the sea then claiming to the UK authorities that they are in peril (deliberately). Do you support that sham, brandy?

You want control, and also give anyone who fancies it the right to come and live for free off the UK state/taxpayer, if they were born 'unlucky'. Do you spot the conflict in your analysis?

To be fair, you have most likely been born into a family with Christian values, in a country that has evolved with them over centuries. So you wouldn't know anything else, they were ubiquitous. I suggest giving Iran a pop, see what you think. Or Tower Hamlets.

My values do not come from any religion.
Taking values from an invisibl3 man in the sky is not for me.
You are obviously an intelligent guy, Cider. So I am sure you see how ridiculous the concept is that depending what part of the world you are born you just conveniently are born into the "correct" religion.

I have never once said that people should come to this country and live free off of the state.

This will still be the discussion during the next election…..

TameTheTiger • September 20, 2025 9:51 AM BST
by the time of the next election there will be another 150,000 here

And 16 year olds will have the vote!

These defectors are nothing but mercenaries who are hungry for power over principles!

Vote for them at your peril!

Country was lost long ago ……..

Labour is suffering what the Tories had to go through, block after block! Stalemate!

With brandy seemingly there are approx 3,000 gods across 40k religions worldwide,depending on where u are born I am supposedly a roman Catholic simply due to the fact I was born in Ireland, religions have caused billions of deaths over centuries over a non existing fictional character who has 3k different identities.  Something i personally could never get my head around total lunacy from my point of view

Perhaps it's the lazy obvious example, but how can anyone give credibility to an ideology that sets one gender as superior over the other?

But the liberalists do exactly that, under the banner of 'diversity and inclusion'

Dixie. People landing on our shores are not illegal.


     

You have to have some central ideology/rules for millions of people to live relatively peacefully and harmoniously, for society to progress.

So it's a question of the least worst.

Are you aware of a more successful way of achieving that then Christianity? Nut zero perhaps

Agree 100 saddo and here in Ireland it was drilled into my parents and grandparents don't dare question anyone in power , my ex mother in law was reared in Westminster of ireland and as little as 60 years ago if they were walking down the road and a priest was walking towards them everyone would stop bow and kneel until he passed them , in my school in the 80s it was common knowledge which Christian brothers were the ones that preferred either the physical or sexual abuse and which common law teachers likewise they preyed on the vulnerable ones like vultures , terrible horrible excuses for humans the sports ones were the worst of them all . When I look back at it I cannot fathom how they all got away with it for so long

The victims of a former Christian Brother, who indecently assaulted them when they were schoolboys in the 1980s, have said the trial was all about being believed.

The three men, now in their late 30s and early 40s, welcomed Edward Bryan's conviction and the five-year prison sentence imposed on him at Cork Circuit Criminal Court today.

Judge Seán Ó Donnabháin said the 59-year-old, with an address at Martinvilla, Athboy Road, Trim in Co Meath, had not shown a shred of remorse, which the judge found alarming.

It was the third time the former Christian Brother at the North Monastery School in Cork City had stood trial on the indecent assault charges.

A re-trial collapsed last November when one of the complainants accused the former metal work teacher and basketball coach of ruining his life in front of the jury.

Outlining how the sexual abuse during one-to-one basketball training had affected them, one victim said that he had trusted a man who had betrayed and violated him in the most horrific way.


The victim, who is now in his early 40s, said the abuse had haunted him for 23 years.

Another told of how he had begun using drugs to help himself escape from his overwhelming sense of shame and guilt and how his addiction scarred everyone he loved.

He said he had spent ten hours in the witness box during this trial going through what Bryan did to him in graphic detail.

He said if it took another 20 trials, and 100 hours in the box, he would still do it.

The third victim told the judge that he just wanted to be believed, to be vindicated, to get some justice, and happily, he has been.

This was my school

5 years?

It runs deep within them as we saw with the reaction by some for Spew Edwards.

Jacko, our music teacher was a paedo, along with a GP and a vicar. Google
'The ‘Holy Trinity’ Paedophile Ring needleblog'. The teacher was never reported
when I was at the school and parents were never informed after his arrest.
The school was miles from Huddersfield, so no local press coverage and no one
but the kids involved, and their friends, ever knew about it. I expect things are
much better now among professions.
Remember though, the Police and politicians knew about, and ignored, industrial scale rape
among another group for thirty years after that, until quite recently.

The trouble is Cider we are no longer united by faith.

Do we have to have one to have a way of life that’s means freedom of choice for the individual?

Freedom of choice, with limitations.

Who sets the limitations?

Threats of violence against a teacher for showing a cartoon in a classroom. Meaning they are no longer a teacher, and he and his family will spend the rest of their lives in hiding.

My view, as I've alluded to is that you don't have to believe in everything the faith teaches, to live by the values that it advocates.

“My view, as I've alluded to is that you don't have to believe in everything the faith teaches, to live by the values that it advocates.”

Agree totally. The youth have turned their back on it though, they talk of the universe. The values with which we grew up with no longer exist.

We know about limitations but have grinned and bared it. Bent over and been shafted.

My friend in an editor in Dubai, he grew up here is of Italian and Lebanese decent, Christian, he says that we’re far too soft here.
Can’t believe what it’s like every time he returns. 

He said never would they give a church special status as was done when a mosque in London was Listed as Grade 2.

It might go in waves and I know there are some as you say being switched on but there’s still a huge difference in belief.

We are not and never will be programmed like others. That gives unity we are fractured and never will have that same bond or belief.