Royal Ascot Betting Ring Saturday

Good read,a right spanking was had.

enjoyed the read all week simon, thanks

Cheers Simon, always a good read, thanks for sharing.

Real eye opener on the big hitters that can make or break your day with one bet.

if they were breaking you,you wouldn't be getting accommodated

Thanks Simon Great Late Night Read

Star will give you a run but if you are tailing them after three months or so you will be effectively closed

nott was in a Twitter spat last night with Gary Wiltshire and a couple more bookies for not giving a true reflection of the current betting ring and RA this week for highlighting these large wagers ,when
Wiltshire said his average bet all week was 2.50 ew and the others bookies said their average bet for the week ranged  from 6 to 10 quid

Star were merely reporting their Book and can hardly be blamed for lack of trade by other Books.
After all,it is hardly like Star are going over the odds to corner the market

yep but it was not complaining that on Fri and sat the big punters stayed away and they were taking buttons in maj of the races, and he said he highlights the big wagers because he,s employed by star to do the blog and big up the company/books etc

if your taking 10,15,20 grand bets and only have 4,56 grand in the hood from other bets,your not bookmaking your punting/gambling

I am certain that the bets by Star are real as they don't make a Book but take on their chosen customers.
They have a client base of rich but not professional punters.
What is stopping Gary from laying a £10,000 / £5,000 a horse that is 3.3 on here and taking a £450 profit?

Naturally,that only applies to massive meetings and not a Wolverhampton Seller

give the lad a break he,s just finished paying back standing one for a million

AK the new lads on the block paid 6 figures for their pitch and stand next to starsports,said they were taking 100,200 quid bets , and are always top p,srice because they bet at standard ew terms

Enjoyed reading this all week. Thanks.

Need unedited fieldbook images for these type of blogs. Likes of AK Bets, Dragonbet often post each final book at the big festival meetings. And thats not to suggest Star or Simon are hiding anything (always enjoy Simons blogs btw) but seeing the figures puts more relevance to things.

AK Bets

AK lay a better bet than most in the Irish betting ring now. Havent dealt with them online (which I told AK himself about directly) as they want all the invasive paperwork for verification.

Online two bob flimpers

Did the 10k e/way treble cop. ??  Threes on shot in the first leg came second, who puts on a bet like that. ??

Couldnt really cop could it,5 runners win only!

who puts a bet on like that
money laundering

These blogs highlight the huge gulf between a few high rollers and the vast majority of punters who bet from £20 downwards. The comment about money laundering is a pure guess I suspect. We should not forget that many really wealthy individuals attend the meeting but may not go racing at any other time and £20,000 is the sort of money they would spend on a meal out with a few friends. And there is a decent chance of getting it back plus some profit if you are in the right box number The worry for the bookmakers should be how few of these big punters are left. They are very vulnerable to a day of winning favourites and if the 2 or 3 big bets are all on the winner they are in trouble. We keep hearing about the reluctance of betting shops to take bets but that is because of the inexperience of the staff to sniff out a pro punter when one comes through the door. On the course it must be very hard to refuse a bet and retain any credibility.

5 runners isn't win only Driver, that's why I asked.

Imagine a Punter going into a High street shop and Asking for 30K to 20K Would they get On ?

Of course not unless they had a private agreement with the owner of the shop. High street shops (occasionally) and telephone accounts were where I placed most of my bets until the internet took over. I now have 99% of my bets on the Exchange.

money laundering was possible answer to a ew treble at short odds including horse at the away,s, wouldn't include someone going to RA once a yr et,they can get on the always 24/7 ,50 weeks a yr, but agree 20 grand will be a very small % of their dispossable income = a 2 grand bet for 35 yrs ago,and the Uber rich.wealthy have  increased their wealth far more in those 35 yrs than the plebs

NOTT complaining/moaning about the lack of money in the hood when the few big punters sat it out bet elsewhere,but him high lighting the big bets would I assume put regular 100 quid and below punters off betting with star sports,when there's 50 other bookmakers to choose from on course, I think I,d feel intimidated putting what's considered in their eyes a small bet on with them, so they could be on big days/Saturdays losing out on say 50 bets a race,

the reason to bet  with star is because you get 10k on in one hit. And no expert fees.  Anyone wanting £100 can get a better price on here.

btw a 50,000 to 20,000 ticket is pictured on the blog

Struggle to get that on Here

but taking , 1,2 20,000 quid bets etc, alongside 2,3 grand in the hod from othet bets isnt bookmaking is it,its punting on their behalf ,as we,re told star dont hedge in the ring or on the machine

It's always been like that with the big layers Stephen Little etc.  Even at the smaller meetings with lesser stakes. Of course it's nearly punting.  But if you keep taking money on 6/4 shots how many of those punters are going to beat you ?

Not always Howard there was an article in the post a couple of years ago a punter wanted 6500/4000 one at kempton jumps he was surprised when star layed him a 2600/1600

Think you are bang on 1st time Take what they get and Hope for the Best

Presumably Star are playing the percentages of winning and losing favourites over a big sample size but they are vulnerable to big plots like Merchant and My Cloud. In some years equally confident plans go astray.
Listening to Harry Herbert you get the impression that they, Highclere, (or William Haggas) rate it extremely highly in which case how did it get in on 90? Haggas rang Herbert immediately after it was sold and begged to train it. Why? Teofilo is not exactly the most fashionable sire and the dam sire Vocalised is nothing out of the ordinary. The sale was as a yearling so no breeze up clues to his ability either. Someone had a hot line to Jim Bolger? My Cloud was completely different having been bred by Coolmore and sold at breeze up for 325,000. It has still taken until he is 4yo to reveal his true ability.

Candelari was the horse they layed 50-20k ...  Got beat 30 lengths. !!

sageform  Pilsudski  carried 8-4  ( rating 82 )  in the same 3-y-o Royal Ascot  h'cap and got well beat.  But star bet the people. Many punters having collected on Merchant  would back the 2/1 fav in the next which got beat.  If you're really clever you back something else big on the same day. Whether you fancy it or not

jimnast can't get my head round those numbers. Are you saying star wouldn't take all his bet at the price they were offering ?

Nothing clever about blowing the profit from a 3 month plan in the very next race unless that is 3 month plan that you are also in on. If big hitters are just following the money then what you say makes sense but if it was connections, they would be on the second bottle by the time the next race started.

Don't think you've won 5 figs on a race waited another 2/3 months and then tried to win another 5 figs with the same bookie.

Like others I enjoy reading Simon's tales from the betting ring.

What I did notice from the Royal Ascot week that a lot of bets struck were from the trade in other words other bookmakers hedging their liabilities.

However while Brighton based Star have been known to take on the heavy hitters consider this.

William Davis was born in 1819 and was working  as a carpenter repairing the subscription rooms in Newmarket.

He heard about some upcoming races and decided money could be made so he started laying half crown bets he became a success at bookmaking then moved to London taking bets and was the first to actually hang up lists of the runners at various places in London.

This eventually became illegal following an act of parliament.

He rose to the top of the bookmaking profession when he laid The Earl of Strafford £12,000 to £1,000 on his horse  The Cur the 1848 Cesarewitch and duly paid the Earl the following day.

He lost over £100,000 in 1852 when outsider Daniel O'Rouke won the Derby but started out the year 1853 with a bank balance of £130,000 in the London and Westminster bank.

Apparently daily travel took its toll and he wound up his business at the Houghton meeting at Newmarket in 1857.

He retired to live in Brighton and on the death of his wife in his will he left £50,000 for Brighton Council to open Preston Park in Brighton.

For those who travel by car to Brighton it is a big park just as one enters the city.

Known in his life as The Leviathan put the majority of current bookmakers to shame.

PS known about his exploits for a while but more details on Wikipedia.

Howard they layed him 1600 at 13/8 he had to go elsewhere for the other 2400 ,don’t get me wrong taking 1600 is still a very fair bet to lay and it’s absolutely right that bookmakers lay what there comfortable with but my point was the punter was very surprised having read the reports about the firm,of course star might well have had a very good reason for not taking the full bet .

Howard you mentioned pilsudski I remember backing a Paul melon horse at goodwood who had no luck in running and just failed to get up the horse that beat him in that handicap was pilsudski

Surely there is a big difference between taking a £10k bet at Royal Ascot (or Goodwood) compared to a smaller meeting? If you take on a liability like that you need to expect enough turnover on the race to cover it. £4000 at a small meeting might be 90% of a days turnover. Enlighten us Simon?

jimnast, was that horse ROKEBY BOWL , sorry if spelling is wrong

sageform I think star may have lost well into six figures at RA. Haven't bothered with the calculator. Crying out for your expertise ?

Good memory elis   

In July, Pilsudski won at his fifth attempt, staying on strongly to win a mile and a quarter handicap at Newmarket under a light weight.[7] Two weeks later, he followed up over a mile and a half at Glorious Goodwood, winning another handicap by a neck from Rokeby Bowl.[8] On his final start of the year he finished third to the future Caulfield Cup winner Taufan's Melody in a handicap at Ascot in September.

jimnast and sageform  the big firms bet to faces.  If they think you're a mug you can have 100k on a 6/4  anywhere.  Of course it has to be a decent track for them to be there.

Star turned down a 800k -200 k   ( 4/1 )  on a 7/2 chance at RA.  The horse lost.  Think they would have made a book on that race even at RA ?

THE 1600 bet lays to rest once again THE LIE repeated on this thread,thaT STAR lay any bet at price advertised

So faces are the ones they expect to know something? Why not lay most of it off at a lower price if possible?

listened to the very good AK podcast yesterday  , it was their 1st RA and they were gobsmacked at how many times they were asked what their minimum stake was, took a 50p ew bet,must be 20/25 yrs since barry dennis was moaning  about ladies having 2 knicker bets  with him

I meant faces it terms of individuals not whether they know something.  At the end of the day they are there to take money. That's what they do by the look of it. If they want to take more money from one person than another that's up to them.  Most punters haven't a clue regarding bookmaking and making it pay.  Why should they ? But maybe many should keep their mouths shut.  I have held a bookmakers licence btw.

Howard, I think Star said the RA losses were circa 300k.

in a week when most thought bookies had the better of it

3,000 losing 100 quid bets going forward,
AK said it will have been 10 grand expenses minimum for the week and theres only 3 of them. 2 grand a day profit to break even

thanks GC.  I think it's clear they took plenty of big bets without hedging too much if anything. As I say what they take and what they don't take is entirely up to them. Even if the price is still on the board. Plenty of people have failed at on course bookmaking because you're not going to make much money if you need to avoid individual big losing horses.

Well remembered elisjohn as heydon rightly says it was rokeby bowl

I'm surprised on knocking a 13/8 back, more so the RP printing it.
Bit different from Simon calling for big hitters wherever you are, let's be having you, and taking on "bagmen".

I'm outdated tho, my only dealing with Star, was bumping into his arbers running around central London shops a few year back.

I agree jay about the post reporting it I’ve recently sent in two letters regarding jockey club racecourses fair letters but not printed in fact I sent another yesterday replying to a letter printed in yesterdays post regarding ascot overfunds compared to 20 years ago again a fair explanation but I doubt it will be posted.

I’m pretty sure the horse at kempton was ree okka which returned 8/13 on 15/1/22 so I would imagine it would of been in the post either the Sunday or the Monday,the reason I remembered it was the following week the post were reporting the same firm had layed a 50,000 forecast in the shiskin energumene race plus enormous bets for both horses.

As I said earlier bookmakers laying what there comfortable with is absolutely right and perhaps they were aware the strength of the horse involved and thought I better to lay at much shorter.