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28 Feb 25
18:09
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22 Apr 04
Phew! That Vance is almost as gobby as Trumpy.
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There were no security guarantees, no ceasefire, nothing about the war in that deal
If there were it would have been called a peace deal, a ceasefire deal or something like an armistice etc. There was nothing about the war.
That is why all the worlds media call it a Minerals deal, because that's the entirety of it.
The deal is about $MONEY not peace.
If there were it would have been called a peace deal, a ceasefire deal or something like an armistice etc. There was nothing about the war.
That is why all the worlds media call it a Minerals deal, because that's the entirety of it.
The deal is about $MONEY not peace.
Zelensky should have asked Trump straight up "What dirt does Putin have on you?"
Is Zelenskyy nor begging for help?
Even most genuinely desperate homeless beggars asking for spare change, would turn down someone like you offering £10-£100 in exchange for sex.
Just because somebody is desperate, doesn't mean they'll do anything you want them to.
when you have nothing, you still have your morals and integrity, some are not for sale.
Trump doesn't give a sh1t about peace, he wants the minerals and is basically saying that Ukraine will get protection by default because American workers will be on the ground, nothing to do with wanting peace, if Ukraine never had the minerals they'd have been cut adrift the minute Trump became President.
What Trump isn't grasping is that Ukraine is fighting on behalf of the West and that includes America, they as the West does, believes in democracy, free speech, freedom, choice, China and Russia are oppressive regimes that must be fought against.
America is reverting to pre WW11 isolationism and their defence will suffer in due course as a result of it.
America is reverting to pre WW11 isolationism and their defence will suffer in due course as a result of it.
What an unorthodox live national political spat between President Trump and President Zelensky? President Trump and his assistant used the location as an excuse to "insult" America.
It's been known some unscrupulous and disgraceful landlords in Wembley and areas nearby have asked for personal "bedroom favour" in return for accommodation in his house/flat from Eastern Europeans.
It's been known some unscrupulous and disgraceful landlords in Wembley and areas nearby have asked for personal "bedroom favour" in return for accommodation in his house/flat from Eastern Europeans.
Trump & JD are sleepers for Russia? Oh, just like Russia was involved in Trump's previous election win. Which of course has now been roundly debunked as a pack of lies. But, hey don't let Facts get in the way of your TDS. As for the US Economy, if you hadn't noticed, it's already trashed, the previous administration saw to that. Absolutely no surprise to see Facts make an appearance on this one. The Trump thread he started on here was one of the most pathetic threads ever to be started on the Internet. Full of Reddit rejects seething with hatred and TDS! lol
Could the Chinese ask the Americans the money the Americans owe them? If so, America could be teetering on the precipice of collapse and utmost embarrassment.
I think you need to get your facts straight and stop repeating Trump's lies. The Republican led Senate intelligence committee after a 3 year investigation found that Russia interfered in the 2016 election to help Trump.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/senate-panel-finds-russia-interfered-in-the-2016-us-
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Trump campaign’s interactions with Russian intelligence services during the 2016 presidential election posed a “grave” counterintelligence threat, a Senate panel concluded Tuesday as it detailed how associates of Donald Trump had regular contact with Russians and expected to benefit from the Kremlin’s help.
The nearly 1,000-page report, the fifth and final one from the Republican-led Senate intelligence committee on the Russia investigation, details how Russia launched an aggressive effort to interfere in the election on Trump’s behalf. It says the Trump campaign chairman had regular contact with a Russian intelligence officer and says other Trump associates were eager to exploit the Kremlin’s aid, particularly by maximizing the impact of the disclosure of Democratic emails hacked by Russian intelligence officers.
The report is the culmination of a bipartisan probe that produced what the committee called “the most comprehensive description to date of Russia’s activities and the threat they posed.” The investigation spanned more than three years as the panel’s leaders said they wanted to thoroughly document the unprecedented attack on U.S. elections.
The findings, including unflinching characterizations of furtive interactions between Trump associates and Russian operatives, echo to a large degree those of special counsel Robert Mueller’s Russia investigation and appear to repudiate the Republican president’s claims that the FBI had no basis to investigate whether his campaign was conspiring with Russia. Trump has called the Russia investigations a “hoax.”
While Mueller’s was a criminal probe, the Senate investigation was a counterintelligence effort with the aim of ensuring that such interference wouldn’t happen again. The report issued several recommendations on that front, including that the FBI should do more to protect presidential campaigns from foreign interference.
The report was released as two other Senate committees, the Judiciary and Homeland Security panels, conduct their own reviews of the Russia probe with an eye toward uncovering what they say was FBI misconduct in the early days of the investigation. A prosecutor appointed by Attorney General William Barr, who regards the Russia investigation with skepticism, disclosed his first criminal charge Friday against a former FBI lawyer who plans to plead guilty to altering a government email.
Among the more striking sections of the report is the committee’s description of the professional relationship between former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Konstantin Kilimnik, whom the committee describes as a Russian intelligence officer.
“Taken as a whole, Manafort’s high-level access and willingness to share information with individuals closely affiliated with the Russian intelligence services, particularly Kilimnik, represented a grave counterintelligence threat,” the report says.
The report notes how Manafort shared internal Trump campaign polling data with Kilimnik and says there is “some evidence” Kilimnik may have been connected to Russia’s effort to hack and leak Democratic emails, though that information is redacted. The report also says “two pieces of information” raise the possibility of Manafort’s potential connection to those operations, but what follows is again blacked out.
Both men were charged in Mueller’s investigation, but neither was accused of any tie to the hacking.
A Manafort lawyer, Kevin Downing, said Tuesday that information sealed at the request of Mueller’s team “completely refutes whatever the intelligence committee is trying to surmise.” He added, “It just looks like complete conjecture.”
Like Mueller, the committee reviewed a meeting Trump’s oldest son, Donald Trump Jr., took in June 2016 with a Russian lawyer he believed to have connections with the Russian government with the goal of receiving information harmful to Clinton.
The Senate panel said it assessed that the lawyer, Natalia Veselnitskaya, has “significant connections to the Russian government, including the Russian intelligence services,” as did another participant in the meeting, Rinat Akhmetshin. The panel said it uncovered connections that were “far more extensive and concerning than what had been publicly known,” particularly regarding Veselnitskaya.
The report also found no reliable evidence for Trump’s longstanding supposition that Ukraine had interfered in the election, but did trace some of the earliest public messaging of that theory to Kilimnik and said it was spread by Russian-government proxies who sought to discredit investigations into Russian interference.
The committee said that messaging campaign lasted to “at least January 2020” — after the House had impeached Trump for pressuring Ukrainian officials to investigate the family of Democrat Joe Biden, now Trump’s general election opponent. During that effort, some Republicans, including Trump, argued Ukraine was meddling, not Russia. Trump was acquitted by the Senate.
The report purposely does not come to a final conclusion, as Mueller did and as the House intelligence committee’s 2018 report did, about whether there is sufficient evidence that Trump’s campaign coordinated with Russia to sway the election to him and away from Clinton, leaving its findings open to partisan interpretation.
Several Republicans on the panel submitted “additional views” to the report, saying it should state more explicitly that Trump’s campaign did not coordinate with Russia. They say that while the report shows the Russian government “inappropriately meddled” in the election, “then-candidate Trump was not complicit.”
The panel’s acting GOP chairman, Florida Sen. Marco Rubio, signed on to that statement but the chairman who led the investigation, North Carolina Sen. Richard Burr, did not. Burr stepped aside earlier this year as the FBI was examining his stock sales.
Burr, who submitted the report before he stepped aside, often faced criticism from his GOP colleagues for working with Democrats on the probe and for summoning sensitive witnesses, such as Trump Jr.
Another Republican committee member, Maine Sen. Susan Collins, also did not sign on to the GOP statement.
Democrats submitted their own views, saying the report “unambiguously shows that members of the Trump campaign cooperated with Russian efforts to get Trump elected.”
Maine Sen. Angus King, an independent who caucuses with Democrats, did not sign on to that statement, saying he believed the report should be bipartisan. But he said in an interview that he believes the report is a “warning.”
The report is “not a hoax,” King said. “It’s just one more set of facts that’s hard to ignore.”
Mueller concluded in his report issued last year that Russia interfered in the election through hacking and a covert social media campaign and that the Trump campaign embraced the help and expected to benefit from it. But Mueller did not charge any Trump associates with conspiring with Russians.
The Senate investigation did find fault in aspects of the investigation, suggesting agents did not respond with sufficient urgency to the hacking of Democratic National Committee email servers.
The report also delved into areas of great interest to Trump that were not explored by Mueller. Those include the FBI’s reliance on opposition research on Trump’s ties to Russia that was compiled by a former British spy, Christopher Steele, whose work was financed by Democrats.
The committee found the FBI gave Steele’s “allegations unjustified credence” as it relied on the dossier of research to seek court approval to wiretap former Trump campaign adviser Carter Page. It says many of the dossier’s allegations remain uncorroborated “nearly four years after Steele delivered the first of these memos.”
A separate investigation by the Justice Department’s inspector general also faulted the FBI for errors and omissions related to the Steele dossier as it sought surveillance warrants.
Rubio said in a statement that the committee was troubled the FBI had been willing to use the dossier “without verifying its methodology or sourcing.”
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/senate-panel-finds-russia-interfered-in-the-2016-us-
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Trump campaign’s interactions with Russian intelligence services during the 2016 presidential election posed a “grave” counterintelligence threat, a Senate panel concluded Tuesday as it detailed how associates of Donald Trump had regular contact with Russians and expected to benefit from the Kremlin’s help.
The nearly 1,000-page report, the fifth and final one from the Republican-led Senate intelligence committee on the Russia investigation, details how Russia launched an aggressive effort to interfere in the election on Trump’s behalf. It says the Trump campaign chairman had regular contact with a Russian intelligence officer and says other Trump associates were eager to exploit the Kremlin’s aid, particularly by maximizing the impact of the disclosure of Democratic emails hacked by Russian intelligence officers.
The report is the culmination of a bipartisan probe that produced what the committee called “the most comprehensive description to date of Russia’s activities and the threat they posed.” The investigation spanned more than three years as the panel’s leaders said they wanted to thoroughly document the unprecedented attack on U.S. elections.
The findings, including unflinching characterizations of furtive interactions between Trump associates and Russian operatives, echo to a large degree those of special counsel Robert Mueller’s Russia investigation and appear to repudiate the Republican president’s claims that the FBI had no basis to investigate whether his campaign was conspiring with Russia. Trump has called the Russia investigations a “hoax.”
While Mueller’s was a criminal probe, the Senate investigation was a counterintelligence effort with the aim of ensuring that such interference wouldn’t happen again. The report issued several recommendations on that front, including that the FBI should do more to protect presidential campaigns from foreign interference.
The report was released as two other Senate committees, the Judiciary and Homeland Security panels, conduct their own reviews of the Russia probe with an eye toward uncovering what they say was FBI misconduct in the early days of the investigation. A prosecutor appointed by Attorney General William Barr, who regards the Russia investigation with skepticism, disclosed his first criminal charge Friday against a former FBI lawyer who plans to plead guilty to altering a government email.
Among the more striking sections of the report is the committee’s description of the professional relationship between former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Konstantin Kilimnik, whom the committee describes as a Russian intelligence officer.
“Taken as a whole, Manafort’s high-level access and willingness to share information with individuals closely affiliated with the Russian intelligence services, particularly Kilimnik, represented a grave counterintelligence threat,” the report says.
The report notes how Manafort shared internal Trump campaign polling data with Kilimnik and says there is “some evidence” Kilimnik may have been connected to Russia’s effort to hack and leak Democratic emails, though that information is redacted. The report also says “two pieces of information” raise the possibility of Manafort’s potential connection to those operations, but what follows is again blacked out.
Both men were charged in Mueller’s investigation, but neither was accused of any tie to the hacking.
A Manafort lawyer, Kevin Downing, said Tuesday that information sealed at the request of Mueller’s team “completely refutes whatever the intelligence committee is trying to surmise.” He added, “It just looks like complete conjecture.”
Like Mueller, the committee reviewed a meeting Trump’s oldest son, Donald Trump Jr., took in June 2016 with a Russian lawyer he believed to have connections with the Russian government with the goal of receiving information harmful to Clinton.
The Senate panel said it assessed that the lawyer, Natalia Veselnitskaya, has “significant connections to the Russian government, including the Russian intelligence services,” as did another participant in the meeting, Rinat Akhmetshin. The panel said it uncovered connections that were “far more extensive and concerning than what had been publicly known,” particularly regarding Veselnitskaya.
The report also found no reliable evidence for Trump’s longstanding supposition that Ukraine had interfered in the election, but did trace some of the earliest public messaging of that theory to Kilimnik and said it was spread by Russian-government proxies who sought to discredit investigations into Russian interference.
The committee said that messaging campaign lasted to “at least January 2020” — after the House had impeached Trump for pressuring Ukrainian officials to investigate the family of Democrat Joe Biden, now Trump’s general election opponent. During that effort, some Republicans, including Trump, argued Ukraine was meddling, not Russia. Trump was acquitted by the Senate.
The report purposely does not come to a final conclusion, as Mueller did and as the House intelligence committee’s 2018 report did, about whether there is sufficient evidence that Trump’s campaign coordinated with Russia to sway the election to him and away from Clinton, leaving its findings open to partisan interpretation.
Several Republicans on the panel submitted “additional views” to the report, saying it should state more explicitly that Trump’s campaign did not coordinate with Russia. They say that while the report shows the Russian government “inappropriately meddled” in the election, “then-candidate Trump was not complicit.”
The panel’s acting GOP chairman, Florida Sen. Marco Rubio, signed on to that statement but the chairman who led the investigation, North Carolina Sen. Richard Burr, did not. Burr stepped aside earlier this year as the FBI was examining his stock sales.
Burr, who submitted the report before he stepped aside, often faced criticism from his GOP colleagues for working with Democrats on the probe and for summoning sensitive witnesses, such as Trump Jr.
Another Republican committee member, Maine Sen. Susan Collins, also did not sign on to the GOP statement.
Democrats submitted their own views, saying the report “unambiguously shows that members of the Trump campaign cooperated with Russian efforts to get Trump elected.”
Maine Sen. Angus King, an independent who caucuses with Democrats, did not sign on to that statement, saying he believed the report should be bipartisan. But he said in an interview that he believes the report is a “warning.”
The report is “not a hoax,” King said. “It’s just one more set of facts that’s hard to ignore.”
Mueller concluded in his report issued last year that Russia interfered in the election through hacking and a covert social media campaign and that the Trump campaign embraced the help and expected to benefit from it. But Mueller did not charge any Trump associates with conspiring with Russians.
The Senate investigation did find fault in aspects of the investigation, suggesting agents did not respond with sufficient urgency to the hacking of Democratic National Committee email servers.
The report also delved into areas of great interest to Trump that were not explored by Mueller. Those include the FBI’s reliance on opposition research on Trump’s ties to Russia that was compiled by a former British spy, Christopher Steele, whose work was financed by Democrats.
The committee found the FBI gave Steele’s “allegations unjustified credence” as it relied on the dossier of research to seek court approval to wiretap former Trump campaign adviser Carter Page. It says many of the dossier’s allegations remain uncorroborated “nearly four years after Steele delivered the first of these memos.”
A separate investigation by the Justice Department’s inspector general also faulted the FBI for errors and omissions related to the Steele dossier as it sought surveillance warrants.
Rubio said in a statement that the committee was troubled the FBI had been willing to use the dossier “without verifying its methodology or sourcing.”
Oh, just like Russia was involved in Trump's previous election win. Which of course has now been roundly debunked as a pack of lies.
Unreal there are still those that doubt Russia is trying very hard to destabilise the West by whatever means at their disposal. They must still believe in the tooth fairy too.
Unreal there are still those that doubt Russia is trying very hard to destabilise the West by whatever means at their disposal. They must still believe in the tooth fairy too.
the reporter was under orders to ask the question about the suit, then jd prob told try winde him up
z man never had a hope in there
z man never had a hope in there
The ignorant one couldn’t grasp the dress code represents the battle field….the killing field….big ignorant idiot…
America 3 wars costing trillions……lost all 3……enough said tbf….
War in Vietnam the most humiliating of all. Who invaded who there? America or Vietnam doing a 9-11?
Mr Vance was so out of his depth in the Oval Office. He spoke like someone on social media or a poster here. Utter sh1t, and the American people should be ashamed having these two political "monkeys" to represent them on the world stage sucking up to mad Putin.
Mr Vance was so out of his depth in the Oval Office. He spoke like someone on social media or a poster here. Utter sh1t, and the American people should be ashamed having these two political "monkeys" to represent them on the world stage sucking up to mad Putin.
Shaven heads with music blaring going through Iraq…..24/7 who could forget….
Mom….look mom…..the killing fields seem to be a joke to this mob….
Mom….look mom…..the killing fields seem to be a joke to this mob….
Japan has learnt from their part in World War 2, America seems not to despite the humiliation in the Vietnam War.
The estate agent and his merry men are clueless tbh….
Ex top military official looked after the estate agent on his visit to the Uk…..during conversation he realised the estate agent was clueless……Q time BBC……
Ex top military official looked after the estate agent on his visit to the Uk…..during conversation he realised the estate agent was clueless……Q time BBC……
Love to know how the Secretary General expects Zelensky to patch things up with two bits of work who are intent on showing him no respect whatsoever. There's no guarantee that all the grovelling in the world will achieve anything.
The 90 minute phone call….
October 7th wouldn’t have happened….ffs….ffs….ffs….the largest helmet in history…..
Hamas its me the estate agent behave now…..idiot…
October 7th wouldn’t have happened….ffs….ffs….ffs….the largest helmet in history…..
Hamas its me the estate agent behave now…..idiot…
Wants the US army involved , Its not happening
get your families ready to sign up for the cause
Free Boots any feet will do
get your families ready to sign up for the cause
Free Boots any feet will do
Wants to opencast Ukraine and put American workers in operating machinery….putin won’t touch them….
Yeah they’re fkn miles away…..
Yeah they’re fkn miles away…..
One senator has come out and apologised:
“I don’t care what title you hold! This isn’t some long gone reality tv show or failed casino….this is war! How dare a draft dodging dumb dupe humiliate an ally and berate an actual brave man who has actually been on a battlefield for his people?!”
“I don’t care what title you hold! This isn’t some long gone reality tv show or failed casino….this is war! How dare a draft dodging dumb dupe humiliate an ally and berate an actual brave man who has actually been on a battlefield for his people?!”
Who was that, I suppose one is better than none?
Just heard the full interview with the Secretary General. Just came across as another Trump bootlicker. One step behind Vance.
Just heard the full interview with the Secretary General. Just came across as another Trump bootlicker. One step behind Vance.
I actually agree with Trump's attempt to initiate dialogue as the situation hasn't been improving at all, which isn't the same as saying Zelensky should merely accept any old deal.
But Trump trying to pitch a few US workers extracting minerals as a solid basis for Ukrainian security just shows us what he's truly in it for. Hell, he's not even trying to hide his lack of interest in Ukraine and to have the arrogance to suggest that as a security guarantee is indicative of the echo-chamber and bubble this rampant egomaniac lives in.
A more capable vice-president could at least have mitigated the damage, but Vance is a political lightweight and in way over his head.
Starmer's bootlicking visit the other day, while understandable in the circumstances, is not aging well at all. If there wasn't a lot of enthusiasm for a Trump state visit then, there's certainly even less now.
But Trump trying to pitch a few US workers extracting minerals as a solid basis for Ukrainian security just shows us what he's truly in it for. Hell, he's not even trying to hide his lack of interest in Ukraine and to have the arrogance to suggest that as a security guarantee is indicative of the echo-chamber and bubble this rampant egomaniac lives in.
A more capable vice-president could at least have mitigated the damage, but Vance is a political lightweight and in way over his head.
Starmer's bootlicking visit the other day, while understandable in the circumstances, is not aging well at all. If there wasn't a lot of enthusiasm for a Trump state visit then, there's certainly even less now.
says a lot when Trump and co more or less ridiculed Zelensky and today Starmers kissing and cuddling him.
What an utter cringe fest.
I suppose Trump is probably the first POTUS for a long time, probably since Reagan to realise he is the ACTUAL most powerful man in the world and he is going to act like it.
Zelensky, I have a lot of sympathy for his situation but if you roll up at the White House you have to play the game. Even Macron understood that.
As for the war, its an avoidable conflict.
The argument, peddled in the west that Putin is Hitler incarnate, well that appears to be a bunch of horse manure that Trump has seen through.
Putin is in his seventies. Been in the job for donkeys years. The only countries he has invaded are Georgia & Ukraine. Both have large Russian minorities who were under attack from ultra Nationalist regimes, seeking to blame Russia for their impoverished state once they gained independence.
Of course, the fact that Putin has been in power for such a long time is not a good thing. But then who do we have to thank for that?
Mikael Gorbachev was supposed to lead the Russians into the promised land of capitalism.
He was a good friend of Mrs Thatcher. His plan, with her advice, was a staged process of privatisation. Bit like what she did here. It wasnt til her second term that Mrs T introduced the BT share sell off. More followed but it was gradual.
Thing is Mrs Thatch, was as hated by the UK establishment as she was by lefties like me.
When Gorbachev told her in 89 that the Berlin Wall was going to come down some time soon, the intelligence agencies laughed in her face. Seems they were as clueless then as they are now.
The whole end of the Soviet Union caught them unawares.
The UK and the US rushed to install capitalism. Favouring Boris Yeltsin over Gorbachev. Privatisation was swift and instantaneous. And utterly catastrophic. The west had eyes on Russian oil and gas but were outmanouevered by guys like Roman Abramovic. They employed a strong man, Putin, to run the country. And here we are now, still picking up the pieces.
Typical western-liberal sh!t show.
I suppose Trump is probably the first POTUS for a long time, probably since Reagan to realise he is the ACTUAL most powerful man in the world and he is going to act like it.
Zelensky, I have a lot of sympathy for his situation but if you roll up at the White House you have to play the game. Even Macron understood that.
As for the war, its an avoidable conflict.
The argument, peddled in the west that Putin is Hitler incarnate, well that appears to be a bunch of horse manure that Trump has seen through.
Putin is in his seventies. Been in the job for donkeys years. The only countries he has invaded are Georgia & Ukraine. Both have large Russian minorities who were under attack from ultra Nationalist regimes, seeking to blame Russia for their impoverished state once they gained independence.
Of course, the fact that Putin has been in power for such a long time is not a good thing. But then who do we have to thank for that?
Mikael Gorbachev was supposed to lead the Russians into the promised land of capitalism.
He was a good friend of Mrs Thatcher. His plan, with her advice, was a staged process of privatisation. Bit like what she did here. It wasnt til her second term that Mrs T introduced the BT share sell off. More followed but it was gradual.
Thing is Mrs Thatch, was as hated by the UK establishment as she was by lefties like me.
When Gorbachev told her in 89 that the Berlin Wall was going to come down some time soon, the intelligence agencies laughed in her face. Seems they were as clueless then as they are now.
The whole end of the Soviet Union caught them unawares.
The UK and the US rushed to install capitalism. Favouring Boris Yeltsin over Gorbachev. Privatisation was swift and instantaneous. And utterly catastrophic. The west had eyes on Russian oil and gas but were outmanouevered by guys like Roman Abramovic. They employed a strong man, Putin, to run the country. And here we are now, still picking up the pieces.
Typical western-liberal sh!t show.
The only countries he has invaded are Georgia & Ukraine. 
My thoughts entirely along with 'its an avoidable conflict'. Yes, if Ukraine just waved a white flag. As regards 'playing the game' the only people playing games were Trump and Vance. Trump can see weakness all around Europe and all the grovelling is not certain to make any difference to how hep acts. It certainly hasn't so far.
I think Zelensky reacted because the dipstick Vance injected and being gobby; his verbal onslaught was so unnecessary, inaccurate and stupid. Who's Vance? A Trump puppet! The puppet knew so little of Ukraine and the war in Ukraine; his interjections were hugely inaccurate and out of line with international diplomacy eg...insulting America at the Oval Office; not a word of thanks to Trump; etc. This is so inaccurate.
Trump and Vance behaved like two bullies in the past because of their superior military and economic wealth though lacking intelligence or understanding of the situation at hand. I think Trump and Vance exhibited the barbaric behaviours of Genghis Khan or past colonial rulers lacking tact or sympathy for the people of Ukraine.
Trump and Vance behaved like two bullies in the past because of their superior military and economic wealth though lacking intelligence or understanding of the situation at hand. I think Trump and Vance exhibited the barbaric behaviours of Genghis Khan or past colonial rulers lacking tact or sympathy for the people of Ukraine.
My thoughts entirely along with 'its an avoidable conflict'. Yes, if Ukraine just waved a white flag. As regards 'playing the game' the only people playing games were Trump and Vance. Trump can see weakness all around Europe and all the grovelling is not certain to make any difference to how hep acts. It certainly hasn't so far.
What's the achievable outcome that you foresee, that would result in Ukraine recovering all the territory it wants, and not trying again in our lifetimes. And how would it be achieved?
What's the achievable outcome that you foresee, that would result in Ukraine recovering all the territory it wants, and not trying again in our lifetimes. And how would it be achieved?
Ukraine will never recover all the territory she's lost certainly not in the presidency of mad Putin. I think Ukraine ought to think about the best possible outcome from war. This will depend entirely on the influences and participations of EU, Canada and possibly Australia; Ukraine cannot do this on her own for obvious reasons.
I think the EU and the UK might have to go it alone, and not expect economic and military support from the US as a given; EU and the UK must take the lead on this given the geographical position of Ukraine. I think Trump could be trying to appease mad-Putin (and sacrifice Ukraine) for a coalition with a post Putin Russia.
I think the EU and the UK might have to go it alone, and not expect economic and military support from the US as a given; EU and the UK must take the lead on this given the geographical position of Ukraine. I think Trump could be trying to appease mad-Putin (and sacrifice Ukraine) for a coalition with a post Putin Russia.
I wrote it elsewhere, it's analogous to covid. Something bad has happened, so lots of lay people think there's some magic wand that western leaders can wave that just will make the bad thing go away. Doesn't matter what harm and suffering that intervention causes, doesn't matter if it's strategic or effective, as long we are seen to be doing the right thing. In this case backing 'good' over 'evil'. Unfortunately, real life is not a computer game of disney fantasy, sometime something bad happens and nothing can plausibly done that won't cause more damage than the problem it's intended to resolve.
impossible, what makes you think Russia is so powerful that all the countries in the EU alone can't do anything about the invasion?
You are bad mouthing JD, I'm assuming just from what is being said and clipped on the internet. Zelenskyy triggered the row when JD mentioned diplomacy, the nutter took exception to that as he read it as making concessions to Russia/Putin. It won't end peacefully without him making concessions to Russia. realpolitik. Zelenskyy effectively put his marker down and inferred he expects the US to back him until all the territory is recovered. Trump can never countenance that, he's not interested in prolonging the war whilst the US are involved = game over.
I do not believe the EU will fully commit towards Ukraine war eg troops on the ground, military hardware, etc, even if mad-Putin Russia increases its assault if America is signalling their unwillingness or reticence to get (fully) involve; Ukraine is not as significant as Poland its neighbour for obvious reason.
Ukraine could be used as a pawn for future peace and non-Russian aggression into Europe; The EU has little option or choice but to accept mad-Putin in a negotiated "agreement" for a ceasefire.
I think an already weakened Russia could still be a good ally for the US post mad-Putin era; the Chinese is the ultimate project for the USA. Trump does not like or trust mad-Putin; he needs him though for geographical and strategic reason.
On the other hand the Chinese are deeply detested, hated and distrusted by the US because of its ever-increasing political influences (Africa and S Asia), economic and military might.
Ukraine could be used as a pawn for future peace and non-Russian aggression into Europe; The EU has little option or choice but to accept mad-Putin in a negotiated "agreement" for a ceasefire.
I think an already weakened Russia could still be a good ally for the US post mad-Putin era; the Chinese is the ultimate project for the USA. Trump does not like or trust mad-Putin; he needs him though for geographical and strategic reason.
On the other hand the Chinese are deeply detested, hated and distrusted by the US because of its ever-increasing political influences (Africa and S Asia), economic and military might.
What do you think the US should do that all the countries in the EU can't do for themselves ?
The UK should not be directly involved either. I'm fine with temporary sanctuary and humanitarian aid, not depleting our meagre defences or boring more cash to hand it over to the former comedian.
I am tempted to say while Trump remains in power - or indeed any of his cronies - it looks impossible for Ukraine to get everything they want. Any sane person would want everything to be restored, but I suspect even Zelensky would realise that isn't possible. I don't know enough on their stockpiles/willingness to speculate how long Europe on it's own can sustain Ukraine. I doubt it's long enough to see the back of the Republicans. This isn't just about what Ukraine wants, it's what most of a peaceful world should want. Trump has just reduced everything to a combination of self interest and self congratulation. Beyond that is just phoney rhetoric. He seems to be happy to reward an aggressor, one who he can't even admit is the aggressor. Anyone in power is terrified to call him out for what he is. In private they must view him as a total bag of ****. At the same time he shows no restraint at all, childishly rubbishing those he sees as an 'enemy'.
In short any agreement has to be something that first and foremost Ukraine can agree with. If they can't, I don't see an end, at least not a good one.
In short any agreement has to be something that first and foremost Ukraine can agree with. If they can't, I don't see an end, at least not a good one.
I am tempted to say while Trump remains in power - or indeed any of his cronies - it looks impossible for Ukraine to get everything they want. Any sane person would want everything to be restored, but I suspect even Zelensky would realise that isn't possible. I don't know enough on their stockpiles/willingness to speculate how long Europe on it's own can sustain Ukraine. I doubt it's long enough to see the back of the Republicans. This isn't just about what Ukraine wants, it's what most of a peaceful world should want. Trump has just reduced everything to a combination of self interest and self congratulation. Beyond that is just phoney rhetoric. He seems to be happy to reward an aggressor, one who he can't even admit is the aggressor. Anyone in power is terrified to call him out for what he is. In private they must view him as a total bag of ****. At the same time he shows no restraint at all, childishly rubbishing those he sees as an 'enemy'.
In short any agreement has to be something that first and foremost Ukraine can agree with. If they can't, I don't see an end, at least not a good one.
Thanks but that is just defection. It didn't get anywhere with Biden nominally in charge. So assume a neutral leader in the whitehouse.
As I noted, the whole thing blew up and Zelenskyy eventually got kicked out for that very reason. He's not willing to compromise anything/ His fantasy is that the US joins his team and ends Russia's ability to fight.
In short any agreement has to be something that first and foremost Ukraine can agree with. If they can't, I don't see an end, at least not a good one.
Thanks but that is just defection. It didn't get anywhere with Biden nominally in charge. So assume a neutral leader in the whitehouse.
As I noted, the whole thing blew up and Zelenskyy eventually got kicked out for that very reason. He's not willing to compromise anything/ His fantasy is that the US joins his team and ends Russia's ability to fight.
Trump said it as only he can. Zelenskyy would prefer ww3 to conceding ground to Putin.
Why so much distaste for Zelensky Cider referring to him as a comedian, which he was. Wasn't Regan a B movie actor and Trump a TV personality and former Bankrupt amongst many other things most decent people would find abhorrent.
What happens is Ukraine carry on, surrendering isn't an agreement, they'll carry on and it is America that are in an awkward spot because they will not cease their support for Ukraine, even without the mineral deal in place because I think that Trump will recognize that as we see the inevitable demise of Ukraine with all that would entail, America would begin to look worse and worse as they stand by and watch it happen, I think that will play horribly on the world stage and in particular with all the "fcuk yeah" American tough guy core support that Trump has.
So yeah, Europe needs to man up but Trump will still keep the support going, he knows it and that is what is pi55ing him off IMO.
So yeah, Europe needs to man up but Trump will still keep the support going, he knows it and that is what is pi55ing him off IMO.
Why so much distaste for Zelensky Cider referring to him as a comedian, which he was. Wasn't Regan a B movie actor and Trump a TV personality and former Bankrupt amongst many other things most decent people would find abhorrent.
No distaste. Was out of his depth on Friday
No distaste. Was out of his depth on Friday
He was the only sensible person in the room, kept his cool whilst the other two lost the plot...have you said thankyou
, what for ffs, for being the first line of defence for the west and the free world which includes America by the way, or it used to be.
Should have been Zelensky asking the thank you question
, what for ffs, for being the first line of defence for the west and the free world which includes America by the way, or it used to be.Should have been Zelensky asking the thank you question
(Out of his depth), he was bullied from the start and wasn't allowed to speak, even pilloried for what he was wearing. Didn't lick their @rses like Starmer did, was a disgusting spectacle.
The US are very important to the world esp with Trump at the helm. However, ride out his 4-year reogn; a different administration will be different, probably better even if it's Republican again.
EU and the UK need to step-up with defence spending; Western powers are helping China (Russia is regressing) to become more dominant, economically and militarily superior and powerful in the world. I think Westerners should wake up and stop buying goods from Chinese immediately; China needs trade (revenue) to dominate and maintain its superiority over others in the world - the Chinese only recognise economic might as the road to success, dominance and supremacy; owes nobody nothing will/can dictate advantageous terms and self-interest strategies forward.
And, without the Westerners bargain-hunting - trade will reduce to a trickle. China will feel the effects internally and nationally more than others; china is not an island either despite its population.
EU and the UK need to step-up with defence spending; Western powers are helping China (Russia is regressing) to become more dominant, economically and militarily superior and powerful in the world. I think Westerners should wake up and stop buying goods from Chinese immediately; China needs trade (revenue) to dominate and maintain its superiority over others in the world - the Chinese only recognise economic might as the road to success, dominance and supremacy; owes nobody nothing will/can dictate advantageous terms and self-interest strategies forward.
And, without the Westerners bargain-hunting - trade will reduce to a trickle. China will feel the effects internally and nationally more than others; china is not an island either despite its population.
(Out of his depth), he was bullied from the start and wasn't allowed to speak, even pilloried for what he was wearing. Didn't lick their @rses like Starmer did, was a disgusting spectacle.
Clearly you have only seen a clip, and not the full pc.
Clearly you have only seen a clip, and not the full pc.
Trump and dipstick Vance will not be saying that to the middle-eastern countries with petrol currency and black gold. The US did not ask any question when "invading" Kuwait to stop Iraq and its dictator from snatching the black gold; America does not do anything for nothing in return, as history has proven.
Trump and dipstick Vance are the lowest of the low in International politics and diplomacy. They were highly emotive, and could not stop being gobby when 'David' accorded the truth ie mad-Putin and Russia being the aggressor.
Trump and dipstick Vance are the lowest of the low in International politics and diplomacy. They were highly emotive, and could not stop being gobby when 'David' accorded the truth ie mad-Putin and Russia being the aggressor.
He was the only sensible person in the room, kept his cool whilst the other two lost the plot...have you said thankyou, what for ffs, for being the first line of defence for the west and the free world which includes America by the way, or it used to be.
Should have been Zelensky asking the thank you
Going back to Disney fantasies again.
Should have been Zelensky asking the thank you
Going back to Disney fantasies again.
I'd not say a 4-minute video clip is the same as a cut and paste of a few seconds clip.
Trump and dipstick Vance will not be saying that to the middle-eastern countries with petrol currency and black gold. The US did not ask any question when "invading" Kuwait to stop Iraq and its dictator from snatching the black gold; America does not do anything for nothing in return, as history has proven.
Trump and dipstick Vance are the lowest of the low in International politics and diplomacy. They were highly emotive, and could not stop being gobby when 'David' accorded the truth ie mad-Putin and Russia being the aggressor.
The US has nothing to lose. Literally.
If you think Zelenskyy doesn't want any further US support, it was a great approach.
Trump and dipstick Vance are the lowest of the low in International politics and diplomacy. They were highly emotive, and could not stop being gobby when 'David' accorded the truth ie mad-Putin and Russia being the aggressor.
The US has nothing to lose. Literally.
If you think Zelenskyy doesn't want any further US support, it was a great approach.
Plenty of Centrist Dad's on the Betty Forum. lol
https://youtu.be/SSIwr1etPR8?feature=shared
https://youtu.be/SSIwr1etPR8?feature=shared
The US has nothing to lose. Literally.
If you think Zelenskyy doesn't want any further US support, it was a great approach.
But the thing is that everyone is missing is that Trump won't stop the support, even without the deal, like it or not the look for America globally would be so horrific as they stood by and watch Ukraine fall and I think that would matter to Trump, America has no choice, one way or another America will no way be walking away.
If you think Zelenskyy doesn't want any further US support, it was a great approach.
But the thing is that everyone is missing is that Trump won't stop the support, even without the deal, like it or not the look for America globally would be so horrific as they stood by and watch Ukraine fall and I think that would matter to Trump, America has no choice, one way or another America will no way be walking away.
That's a pretty brave gamble. Would be most likely a losing one in my view.
I've asked this question elsewhere on the forum. Do you think US support is the only thing stopping Russia from taking the Ukrainian territory they want?
I've asked this question elsewhere on the forum. Do you think US support is the only thing stopping Russia from taking the Ukrainian territory they want?
Someone's gunna get assassinated. Anyone price it up?
Zel
DT
VP
KS
EM
Zel
DT
VP
KS
EM
The problem that Trump has is that Zelensky has called his bluff and not caved in to the deal on the table as he has realized that America won't walk away, so Trump now has to retreat back and construct the deal which will include military assurances whilst trying not to look like he has been the one to back down.
Many observers simply don't appreciate the revolutionary type of people who now have their hands on the levers of power in the US. They aren't interested in niceties or precedence. They'd do well to watch the pertinent elements of the latest Musk edition on Joe Rogan.
The problem that Trump has is that Zelensky has called his bluff and not caved in to the deal on the table as he has realized that America won't walk away, so Trump now has to retreat back and construct the deal which will include military assurances whilst trying not to look like he has been the one to back down.
zelenskyy was literally about to sign the deal before he got kicked out
zelenskyy was literally about to sign the deal before he got kicked out
Cider,
That is the fascinating thing in all of this, what you've just stated that is, because the look of what we're seeing, how far could it go along the road you are suggesting, my question would be....would it be possible for some sort of element, seeing the perils coming down the road, be able to rise up and overthrow the regime...is that a possible outcome?
That is the fascinating thing in all of this, what you've just stated that is, because the look of what we're seeing, how far could it go along the road you are suggesting, my question would be....would it be possible for some sort of element, seeing the perils coming down the road, be able to rise up and overthrow the regime...is that a possible outcome?
Trump has already faced multiple assassination attempts. Trump is simply delivering on his pre-election promises and mandate. People are now shocked that he's doing what he promised. It's quite weird.
There's obviously no fair means of getting rid of an administration under the constitution.
There's obviously no fair means of getting rid of an administration under the constitution.
Trump will need to engage to a degree otherwise America leadership in the world or perceived "free" world with America as the head, the dollar the currency measurement could be toast; China will try and seize the opportunity.
Remember, Trump is only a 4-year boil/pimple!
Remember, Trump is only a 4-year boil/pimple!
It's revolutionary in the sense of not continuing down the road of the deep state having ultimate authority. It's a revolution that won the democratic vote. USAID is only the beginning...
Trump is such a Lennonist.
Come on people "give war a chance"
Come on people "give war a chance"
Trump doesn't do backing down. Being perceived as weak is as bad as it gets for him. That's the background to Europe trying more grovelling.
Three visits this week and absolutely no mention of offering security guarantees. Some people think Starmer had a 'good' visit, but that's what he went for, and he seemed frightened to even approach the subject. Our news describing Starmer as some sort of go-between, but I am struggling to see the evidence to support that theory.
Three visits this week and absolutely no mention of offering security guarantees. Some people think Starmer had a 'good' visit, but that's what he went for, and he seemed frightened to even approach the subject. Our news describing Starmer as some sort of go-between, but I am struggling to see the evidence to support that theory.
I think Sir Shameless will play the two protagonists ie Zelensky and Trump; the former to appease the EU, the latter US. I think Sir Shameless could get some political kudos from this spat.
cider only addresses certain things he thinks he can get away with. maybe he is a fascist after all. no word of criticism for putin. its his war
heres everyone squabling about trump and zelensky while the maniac putin who has brought large-scale war of annihilation back to europe and is its nastiest most murderous dictator since stalin sits in his bunker rubbing his hands
heres everyone squabling about trump and zelensky while the maniac putin who has brought large-scale war of annihilation back to europe and is its nastiest most murderous dictator since stalin sits in his bunker rubbing his hands
I'm not living a Disney fantasy. Putin has complete control over a country of 150 million people and a massive nuclear arsenal. What would you like to do about him ?
As I covered, just because something very bad is happening, doesn't mean it's in 'your' gift to fix it. When China took overall control of Hong Kong earlier than agreed, what were you advocating for?
As I covered, just because something very bad is happening, doesn't mean it's in 'your' gift to fix it. When China took overall control of Hong Kong earlier than agreed, what were you advocating for?
I am sorry, but the idea that Europe is going to replace the Yanks in providing for Ukraine is surely wishful thinking.
I mean...
they spend all year arguing and bickering in the EU about budget responsibilities, immigration quotas, fining eachother for breaking regulations.
And now they are going to come together for Ukraine?
Do me a favour.
Best thing we ever did is leave that shower, and i voted remain.
I mean...
they spend all year arguing and bickering in the EU about budget responsibilities, immigration quotas, fining eachother for breaking regulations.
And now they are going to come together for Ukraine?
Do me a favour.
Best thing we ever did is leave that shower, and i voted remain.
Cider Joined: 29 Aug 02
Replies: 6091902 Mar 25 19:36
I'm not living a Disney fantasy. Putin has complete control over a country of 150 million people and a massive nuclear arsenal. What would you like to do about him ?
As I covered, just because something very bad is happening, doesn't mean it's in 'your' gift to fix it. When China took overall control of Hong Kong earlier than agreed, what were you advocating for?
the 150 million mean nothing. certainly to him. its the resources it possesses. his economy is pitiful and he uses its fossil fuels to power his messianic ambition. he has total control alright
what i would like to do and what is possible are entirely separate. there have been many similar 'discussions' ( a charitable description) about the war over the last 3 years and ive never seen any input from you. until now, when trump/zelensky are the subject. odd, i think. what is your opinion of putin and what he has been doing since he abolished the constitution? you have plenty to say now
from what you say, its a fait accompli, and ukraine cant be held. please correct me. europe has been hiding under the u.s umbrella for too long, and much as i dislike trump, hes right about that
as ive said a million times, this was on the cards long ago, but nobody acted, and here we are
the chance to prevent putins swallowing of ukraine has passed and now we are in a deadly pickle. war-weariness and putins propaganda machine have seen to that. but i still dont accept ukraine is beyond help. putin attacks us all. cyberwar, assassination, disinformation, sabotage, interfering in elections, hes a g1 canute, so i think 'we' should stop the hand-wringing and grow a pair, because it will only get worse if he detaches the u.s from europe, his no1 aim
funny how the most belligerent anti-putinites are the nordics and the baltics. they aint daft and hes been buzzing them for 20 years. sweden and finland resisted nato for 70 years. theyve relunctantly got on board. they havent done this to antagonise russia
if the e.u could put on a united front hes scared of it, which is why he tries to fragment it with his propaganda promoting the afd, national rally, freedom party nl, orban, fico, and others. his 'troops' arent really dedicated as the ukrainians are, for obvious reason. hence emptying his prisons and using north korea. hes resisted using people from 'heartland' russia and been hoovering them from the asiatic east, who count for nothing
to answer your q, something bad is happening and im saying what we could do. sadly i doubt it will happen
he has a chunk of georgia and moldova and they will go. is that ok? belarus likewise as soon as that idiot lukashaenko snuffs it or putin does him in. evens each of two
Replies: 6091902 Mar 25 19:36
I'm not living a Disney fantasy. Putin has complete control over a country of 150 million people and a massive nuclear arsenal. What would you like to do about him ?
As I covered, just because something very bad is happening, doesn't mean it's in 'your' gift to fix it. When China took overall control of Hong Kong earlier than agreed, what were you advocating for?
the 150 million mean nothing. certainly to him. its the resources it possesses. his economy is pitiful and he uses its fossil fuels to power his messianic ambition. he has total control alright
what i would like to do and what is possible are entirely separate. there have been many similar 'discussions' ( a charitable description) about the war over the last 3 years and ive never seen any input from you. until now, when trump/zelensky are the subject. odd, i think. what is your opinion of putin and what he has been doing since he abolished the constitution? you have plenty to say now
from what you say, its a fait accompli, and ukraine cant be held. please correct me. europe has been hiding under the u.s umbrella for too long, and much as i dislike trump, hes right about that
as ive said a million times, this was on the cards long ago, but nobody acted, and here we are
the chance to prevent putins swallowing of ukraine has passed and now we are in a deadly pickle. war-weariness and putins propaganda machine have seen to that. but i still dont accept ukraine is beyond help. putin attacks us all. cyberwar, assassination, disinformation, sabotage, interfering in elections, hes a g1 canute, so i think 'we' should stop the hand-wringing and grow a pair, because it will only get worse if he detaches the u.s from europe, his no1 aim
funny how the most belligerent anti-putinites are the nordics and the baltics. they aint daft and hes been buzzing them for 20 years. sweden and finland resisted nato for 70 years. theyve relunctantly got on board. they havent done this to antagonise russia
if the e.u could put on a united front hes scared of it, which is why he tries to fragment it with his propaganda promoting the afd, national rally, freedom party nl, orban, fico, and others. his 'troops' arent really dedicated as the ukrainians are, for obvious reason. hence emptying his prisons and using north korea. hes resisted using people from 'heartland' russia and been hoovering them from the asiatic east, who count for nothing
to answer your q, something bad is happening and im saying what we could do. sadly i doubt it will happen
he has a chunk of georgia and moldova and they will go. is that ok? belarus likewise as soon as that idiot lukashaenko snuffs it or putin does him in. evens each of two
The EU leaders are weak, unintelligent and at times pretty politically naive internationally eg President Macron (duped by mad-Putin) and von der Leyen (inept procuring Covid vaccines); EU member states are too self-interested to be a team player. Also, the EU will never be more economically and militarily mightier or superior than China or USA given their mish mash compilation, differing languages, religions and ethics.
Belfast factory to supply 5,000 missiles to Ukraine
The Thales missile factory in Belfast is to supply 5,000 air defence missiles to Ukraine, the Prime Minister has announced.
The deal is worth up to £1.6bn and will involve recruiting 200 additional staff.
Thales is a French-owned company which one of Europe's biggest arms manufacturers.
The order is for lightweight multirole missiles (LMMs) which Ukrainian forces are already using.
Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer announced the order as he laid out a four point plan to "reach peace and defend Ukraine".
A £162m contract announced in September last year saw 650 LMMs supplied to Ukraine as an initial order to ramp up production, with the first deliveries in December.
The new order is much bigger: it is worth an initial £1.16bn with the potential for around a further £500m of work to be added in collaboration with a Ukrainian industry partner.
The partner firm will manufacture launchers and command and control vehicles for the missiles in Ukraine.
The UK Ministry of Defence said it is the largest contract ever received by Thales in Belfast.
The Defence Secretary John Healey said the deal would "help protect Ukraine against drone and missile attacks and help deter further Russian aggression following any end to the fighting".
The contract has been placed by the MoD's procurement arm Defence Equipment & Support on behalf of the Ukrainian Government.
It will be funded by a loan underwritten by United Kingdom Export Finance (UKEF) after a deal signed last year to allow Ukraine to draw on £3.5bn worth of support from UKEF to spend with UK industry.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c74knzk9x8zo
The Thales missile factory in Belfast is to supply 5,000 air defence missiles to Ukraine, the Prime Minister has announced.
The deal is worth up to £1.6bn and will involve recruiting 200 additional staff.
Thales is a French-owned company which one of Europe's biggest arms manufacturers.
The order is for lightweight multirole missiles (LMMs) which Ukrainian forces are already using.
Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer announced the order as he laid out a four point plan to "reach peace and defend Ukraine".
A £162m contract announced in September last year saw 650 LMMs supplied to Ukraine as an initial order to ramp up production, with the first deliveries in December.
The new order is much bigger: it is worth an initial £1.16bn with the potential for around a further £500m of work to be added in collaboration with a Ukrainian industry partner.
The partner firm will manufacture launchers and command and control vehicles for the missiles in Ukraine.
The UK Ministry of Defence said it is the largest contract ever received by Thales in Belfast.
The Defence Secretary John Healey said the deal would "help protect Ukraine against drone and missile attacks and help deter further Russian aggression following any end to the fighting".
The contract has been placed by the MoD's procurement arm Defence Equipment & Support on behalf of the Ukrainian Government.
It will be funded by a loan underwritten by United Kingdom Export Finance (UKEF) after a deal signed last year to allow Ukraine to draw on £3.5bn worth of support from UKEF to spend with UK industry.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c74knzk9x8zo
Bottom line.
This is a money-making war just like 'em all.
Trump wants peace. We (and th efrench owned company) seemingly want war. A war that cannot be possibly won by Zelensky.
This is a money-making war just like 'em all.
Trump wants peace. We (and th efrench owned company) seemingly want war. A war that cannot be possibly won by Zelensky.
Trump wants peace
no he wants Ukrainian concessions whilst getting guaranteed assets stripping while no certainty of Ukraine's sovereign future..
bit different..
no he wants Ukrainian concessions whilst getting guaranteed assets stripping while no certainty of Ukraine's sovereign future..
bit different..
Vlod wants missiles to slow up the meat fodder at the front and is offering earth minerals in exchange.
No, he wants a credible peace deal..not a massively pro Russian sell out..
He doesn't trust Putin, and probably justified in that respect, although Putin has no respect for Vlod.
An increasing amount of Ukranians want an end to teh war, and why wouldn't they having seen their men young and old dragged off the street to be sent into the man mincer.
Vlod wants to join NATO. Putin won't entertain that notion.
Trump dislikes Europe, Europe dislikes Trump.
Putin wont relinquish that land which he has grabbed whiloe Vlod wants it back.
f0ookin mess.
An increasing amount of Ukranians want an end to teh war, and why wouldn't they having seen their men young and old dragged off the street to be sent into the man mincer.
Vlod wants to join NATO. Putin won't entertain that notion.
Trump dislikes Europe, Europe dislikes Trump.
Putin wont relinquish that land which he has grabbed whiloe Vlod wants it back.
f0ookin mess.
If Trump hadn't totally undermined Ukraine's position - a plausible 'win win win' was probably close to achievable..(Ukraine concede a smallish amount of land but guaranteed future , USA get economic benefit form minerals, naughty Poots claims he won..
difficult to see it now ...and likely a few lesser able Ukraines' to be next in line..
difficult to see it now ...and likely a few lesser able Ukraines' to be next in line..
it would have been better for all concerned if putin invades, nobody does anything. not our business, dont fight a war you cant win
those who blame ukrainians for fighting for their country dont say a word about putins invasion of it. im still waiting for someone to explain why
and zelensky gets a hard time. 'weasel' says wp. whats putin then, t rex?
they certainly wouldnt enjoy living in his police state. but they dont think that way because the decadent west he decries allow people to think and behave as they please. he controls both
putin now has a big new russian province. we have a few million more refugees
bit of a nuisance, obv. but trying to stop him aint worth the risk
that risk was massively increased when ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons and russia guaranteed to respect its borders as a quid pro quo
hows that going?
is that ok with everyone?
those who blame ukrainians for fighting for their country dont say a word about putins invasion of it. im still waiting for someone to explain why
and zelensky gets a hard time. 'weasel' says wp. whats putin then, t rex?
they certainly wouldnt enjoy living in his police state. but they dont think that way because the decadent west he decries allow people to think and behave as they please. he controls both
putin now has a big new russian province. we have a few million more refugees
bit of a nuisance, obv. but trying to stop him aint worth the risk
that risk was massively increased when ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons and russia guaranteed to respect its borders as a quid pro quo
hows that going?
is that ok with everyone?
mitolo…I wouldn’t be too concerned about nuke damage….the china man has them well warned about using them…..it won’t ever happen……Spewtin was told a while back….
The estate agent in America doesn’t have a clue tbh.
The estate agent in America doesn’t have a clue tbh.
Starmer is lying through his teeth whenever anyone asks a question regarding Trump and the US involvement. He is unable to give an honest answer, it's all gestures but no words. Trump still indulging in a war of words with Zelensky. It strikes me Starmer himself is now over egging this supposed relationship with Trump.
How much of a 'success' was yesterday? I am inclined to think not much of a one. Starmer has come up with a 'slogan' - Coalition Of Willing' - but not put any meat on the bones. Who are the willing? Why don't we know who they are? Or are they not willing enough to go public? The reluctance to go public makes me wonder if it is little more than a handful. So a continuation of the warm words, and limited action?
How much of a 'success' was yesterday? I am inclined to think not much of a one. Starmer has come up with a 'slogan' - Coalition Of Willing' - but not put any meat on the bones. Who are the willing? Why don't we know who they are? Or are they not willing enough to go public? The reluctance to go public makes me wonder if it is little more than a handful. So a continuation of the warm words, and limited action?
How much peace would Trump want if Ukraine never had those minerals?
The biggest annoyance to the west broadly speaking is that Ukraine didn't roll over in three days, if they had been there would have been a lot of continued hand wringing but everyone would now have moved on and saved a lot of faux gestures of support and saved a lot of money in the process.
The biggest annoyance to the west broadly speaking is that Ukraine didn't roll over in three days, if they had been there would have been a lot of continued hand wringing but everyone would now have moved on and saved a lot of faux gestures of support and saved a lot of money in the process.
Er, yeah he'd still want peace. Those minerals and money ain't much good if a Nuclear War kicks off. Also how many Wars did he start in his previous term?
I'll be sure to add you to the TDS list.
Btw, talking of protecting borders, any chance the Red side of the Uniparty might get around to protecting our own? Just the 150k from Islamic Nations have entered Britain illegally.... I mean, what could possibly go wrong?
I'll be sure to add you to the TDS list.
Btw, talking of protecting borders, any chance the Red side of the Uniparty might get around to protecting our own? Just the 150k from Islamic Nations have entered Britain illegally.... I mean, what could possibly go wrong?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiginMmf_70&t=11s
June Slater explains all
June Slater explains all
https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1896248819547070782
Imagine defending this Globalist owned Weasel
Imagine defending this Globalist owned Weasel
Tory MP thinks Trump is a Russian asset, the rest sh1t scared to say it in public.
Mineral deal sign without the ceasefire…..Spewtin making a mockery of this fool trumpet
Sign then keep ducking the bombs….
Spewtins right hand mouth puppet maintains the military action will continue lol you couldn’t make it up….
The wild Hogg slagging his dress code meanwhile Elon skipped into the big room in tea shirt and silly cap….child in hand.
How the fk can anyone take this seriously ffs….
Spewtins right hand mouth puppet maintains the military action will continue lol you couldn’t make it up….
The wild Hogg slagging his dress code meanwhile Elon skipped into the big room in tea shirt and silly cap….child in hand.
How the fk can anyone take this seriously ffs….
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14461995/Trump-leadership-NATO-UK-F...
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