champions day thoughts ascot saturday

also had a small ew double at odds of over 700/1 just in case ^^^

tamfana looks a fab eway bet esp as i think fred will be going first 4

Good luck with those two.

The opener is much closer on ratings than the market suggests. Euphrates is actually rated the same as Al Nayyir, and only 6lb's behind Kyprios. Even though he was third, Sweet William never travelled in this race last year. Bellocio is likely to struggle with the ground. I am tempted to throw a dart at Burdett Road. He trounced an improving 3yo last time, and maybe going forward is the key to him? Obviously, the trip is an unknown.

Gone with James's Delight in the Sprint in the hope/expectation he will love the ground, and find 7-10lbs. Trainer good with sprinters, and hopefully, he has him primed for this target.

The Fillies & Mares was always about getting Kalpana beat. I can't see her handling the ground, and no surprise if she finishes out the back. Already misfired with two Gosden entries, Emily Upjohn and Danielle. I can't believe they haven't declared the former. She has the best form, and her two good runs this season have been on testing ground. So I am just left with Tiffany who has been weakish in the market.

I think Charyn has been winning weakly contested mile races. It might be the same again, but I have opposed him with Prague.

Very disappointed if Calandagan can't get the job done. There are a couple of concerns: the possibility of the jock (from stall 1) riding over confident race, and although he has shown he can handle testing ground there is a fear it might blunt his speed. It's a huge ask for Los Angeles who has been on the go all year, and had one tough race after another.

Replaced Norwalk Havoc (think he would have gone off 10/1) with a far less confident, Mr Professor, in the handicap.

after several serious reverses on soft/heavy ground over the last 5 or 6 years I am finally going to change my approach on Saturday, and bet more in tune with your approach Foyle. I have a decent bet on Economics but that will be the only favourite for me. I like Factor Cheval in the QE2, though I have been wrong b4 with this horse. Fresh for this , stays a bit further and should love the ground. Cannot resist a tiny e.w on Poker Face as well. 66/1 seems a very big price on the ground against horses who have been running all season. Grateful in the Fillies. Showed he best form at the Arc meeting and fillies can sometimes hold their form well and improve. Will stay well. Vadream is a daft price in the sprint. I like your view on The E Foyle. I regard Kyprios as a cash machine but think this may a race too many at the price. At least I shouldn't lose the huge amounts I have lost at this meeting recently......famous last words once I get a bottle of fizz down me! Good luck.

i know theres 4 group1 on this card, but i still cant take to it, forb  me its a group races shergar cup , at least thats on decent ground, loved it as it was , fillies mile on friday and qe11 on the sat ,

good luck donegal & diffdrum , rain expected and we have had more than our fair share in the south lately ,plenty of races to get stuck into, possibly 4 for me wont bother with the handicap ,the qe2 looks a decent betting race just glancing at the runner a few possibles  there and the champion stakes looks interesting .

I agree with DP about Kyprios; the ground will be extreme with the likely further heavy rain on Saturday morning, and i think it'll bottom him out after a full season for him. As to what beats him, Sweet William will likely run his race, but looking for something at bigger odds, Caius Chorister. Won around this time of the season last year on bottomless ground at Salisbury (admittedly an egg and spoon race in comparison to this), and form with Sweet William (and Trueshan fwiw) twice early this season at Ascot and Sandown makes the price just look totally out of sync; also trainer in rather good form.

good luck guys .....the qe2 metropolitan very lightly raced  just the 6 races in total won the french gns on very soft and 3l to find with charyn on deuville form the ground should suit much better . henry longfella isracker ! a double figga price and was a bit unlucky in the french gns and should be well in the mix here .no selection yet but it looks a c

In the opener, I'm going to back Al Nayyir. I was quite impressed with him at Newmarket on his last run and Kyprios is having a quick return after running on soft ground only a fortnight ago. I'm hoping Kind Of Blue runs a big race in the Sprint. A nice progressive type with a high draw, which I'm hoping will be favourable. Charyn is the most likely winner of the QE II but at 5/4 I can happily watch him win without playing. I like Facteur Cheval but am not so keen on the draw. Economics is top class but I think Calandagan is four or five pounds better than him and has conditions to suit. If the Haggas horse shortens I may well be pushing the lay button. Good luck if punting.

Bottled the first race a little, and backed Burdett Road at 20/1 without Kyprios.

That 20/1 now doesn't look too bad as he is no better than 25/1 with kyprios in. Mr Professor also punted in the last.

Revisited that first race again, and so many puzzles. Kyprios has that one freak performance on deep ground, but they haven't gone near that sort of ground in his other races. Perhaps just coincidence. Trawlerman looks as if he wouldn't want ground worse than good to soft. Al Nayyir looks solid enough, but has drifted from 4/1-8/1. Why? Burdett Road dictated at Newmarket, but his last furlong was his best. A couple of taps and he careered away. On that day it looked as if some extra distance would have been a plus. Watched The Euphrates last two runs. He doesn't finish off either race well. In the Irish St Leger he weakens out of a tussle with Kyprios, and any further and he would have been well beaten. I think Moore gave him a very canny ride in the handicap. He stole a few lengths off an ordinary pace, and just about held on. He has a scrappy action, and not sure whether softer ground would be a plus. All the chat, and Kyprios will probably end up justifying the odds. His stamina/class on the the ground might be enough.

the hope is that  the euphrates is improving for the step up in trip which looks the case given his last 2 runs ,the irish st leger run may have been more of a prep  to get him spot on for the irish ces which was a big pot in its own right , no suprise if the front 2 prove too good .

Like Al Nayyir in the first. Looks to have progressed in both runs for new yard.

Elite Status from a good draw this time in the sprint.

Doha in the Champion fillies, new trip might eke out a bit more.

Facteur Cheval, just for the value in the mile.

Royal Rhyme for a place in the Champion.

Bo Pedro in the last off a good mark.

Good racing and good luck.

3.55 Royal Thyme finally has his ground and was a massive price at 50s earlier today.

sorry Royal Rhyme

State Actor to hack up in the last….hack up.

Not good enough last year, but trainer seemingly has a golden touch with outsiders for this owner.

Ryan Moore gives a good mention to State Actor and the draw could help a lot.

John Gosden, joint-trainer of Audience
"He's back in trip but has plenty of speed and it's going to be a testing six furlongs in the ground. He could be in the right place in stall two as I'm sure they'll be heading over there owing to the grandstand shadow."

Have backed both.

These are my selections covered in e/w doubles and trebles.

1.55 Flora Of Bermuda & Vafortino
2.35 War Chimes & Sea Theme
4.35 Mirsky & Star Of Orion

Realistically looking for a place from each pair and whereas 10/1 is normally max price for Ascot, there are many variables involved today.

I have also laid Calandagan in 3.55, I believe he needs further and better ground.

GL all.

good luck all ,have had a pop on metropolitan ew bog with the firms french gns winner should love the ground 3l to find with charyn on deuville form but this ground could bring them much closer and the price looks big around 16/1 bog

Easy decision here , watch every minute & not even consider any bets.

Too classy for me these meetings , not enough handbrakes on show.

Best of luck all     

fook me no bet melish in the mares has backed
QUAND,thinks ARREST has great chance ,would back SUNIAH as his 2nd pick and if he new kappanna would go on the ground it would be his bet of the meeting
and after all that its not a NO BET RACE FOR NO BET MELISH

champions day cant be a commercial success if they invite 7,000 students in at presumably discounted rates, like giving discounted tkts to f a cup final,wimbledon, lords test etc etc

I can see some French and possibly a German winner today. Metropolitan might be improving and has soft ground form so look out Charyn.
Calandagan is heavily backed against Economics.
Beauvatier not far behind Kinross but are either good enough? Karl burke has three in the sprint and all have a chance.

Also like Karl Burke in that race, Sage
He's had a few big race Saturday wins recently
Elite Status may be the one
Also backing Metropolitan

Gl all

The Euphrates now the strongest outsider with Burdett Road becoming very weak. Tiffany continues to be weak in the mares and fillies. Amazed at the weakness in James's Delight, particuiarly as the extra rain should have been a plus. Have a feeling he's going to bomb. Prague suddenly strong having been weak yesterday. Mr Professor big mover yesterday, but lukewarm today even though the rain should have been a plus.

burdett Rd was 40,s after decs so just heading back to where it was after been backed after been put up by value + in sportinlife

In the Balmoral at 4.35 I had a small interest with 7 places Sky on POPMASTER.
Had quite a few tips last time with Saffie onboard but disappointed.
Reunited with Ross Coakley now and his last win was last autumn at Newbury on soft when he finished the race well. 
Ed Walker, trainer: "We're trying something new. He's in good form and should have no problems with the ground. He needs everything to go right for him to run a big race."

You can get 50/1 5 places with PP or hope Sky at SP with 7 places might see a drift.

Very comfortable for Kyprios. As per usual could only get a tenner on the price boost, but better than nothing. Got a few things right, but Burdett Road had no chance out the stalls. He reared, the jock showed no intention of going forward, and he has ended up racing much too freely off an ordinary pace. Had he gone forward, and settled I think he would have been close to being in the four. The alarming market drift was spot on.

Not a single runner at Ascot for Charlie Appleby.

Thunder Run now favourite for the Balmoral Handicap.

I think it could be prudent to forget Thunder Run. I've backed him in a multiple for free spins.

Worst ride ever on Montassib... so far behind you would need binoculars to see it. Clearly should've won.

bradsil apart fitted the profile in these sprints look for one that hasn't won one before ,unbelievable given his runs that under the system swing along has missed out all season,I,d be backing him till one falls his way next season

Oct 19, 2024 -- 8:05AM, high_lander wrote:

Worst ride ever on Montassib... so far behind you would need binoculars to see it. Clearly should've won.

You could say the same for Kinross

Montassib was last with just over a furlong to go, made up a ridiculous amount of ground. An amazing feat to get that close the way it was ridden. No reason for it to be so far behind it was cantering all the way through.

Kinross 7 fur horse drawn high had no chance once the race developed away from him

For those who cannot bear ITV

Chapman "Economics is quite weak in the betting, does that surprise you?"

Haggas: "I never know why these moves happen, probably he was too short to start with. But I would back him if I were you."

but did he add
BUT NOT WITH MY MONEY

Oct 19, 2024 -- 8:24AM, 1st time poster wrote:

but did he add BUT NOT WITH MY MONEY

Just thought it was an usual thing for Haggas to say .. he usually takes pains to tell viewers their bets are well down his list of concerns.

Big relief with Kalpana. Very important for Balding to win one today for these owners. Flora from Bermuda a good third too and I thought she was well outclassed in that.

How easy was that Kalpana. Was going to bet it until Ruby singled it out that he didn`t think it would handle the ground. Even the most knowledgeable can get it way wrong.

High numbers dominated the Sprint. Will that be the same in the mile races?

drawn high but ran middle to far side,would suggest if pace is far side a low draw shouldn't be a disadvantage

Low draw no advantage, to say the least.

Would be very hard on connections of STATE ACTOR if Ryan Moore swoops again Wigmore St style.

3.15 Checkand challenge

out of his depth but finished 4th twice in this race.
wont mind the ground
Deja vu

Silvestre still got it. Brave horse who looked beaten a furlong out.

everyone fighting to get on the far rail and yet people saying they don't want to be drawn low

BOOBY hasn't got with the programme yet or been intentionaly ignorant
keep the whip in same/wrong hand don't risk losing momentum by changing whip hands and win by half a length or more and it doesn't matter what hand your whips in

fook me hold up horse,drawn 1 over 10 furlongs in a race where they,ll be strung noldlike a 4 mile chase at uttox in the straight and still moaning about the draw 200k yrs ago they,d have considered it the perfect draw,stats frazzling everyone's minds these days,you,d think my granny was riding it or something

big blanket to cover straight at uttox but it doesn't matter where your drawn if you lose 5 lengths leaving the stalls

Soft ground ruins everything on flat

One of those rubbish days if you oppose favourites (including one they couldn't give away) and then the biggest one gets stuffed by a skinner for the bookmakers.

this race should be at hq and the qe11 in sept

I agree elisjohn.

Well done the Royal Rhyme backers e/w. I opted for Irisine place only so bound to be fouth. I was sorely tempted to lay the first 2 in the betting there but chickened out. Karl Burke yet another great day without a big winner. Second and third in Group 1 races not bad. Perhaps Thunder Run will put that right in the last. Another great run by See The Fire in fifth.

sunny day & can hardly see them until last few yards on the hurdle course because of the shadow...and not at all on the straight track

elisjohn I agree also

newmarket was chosen for october as most years would be flat racing ground
ascot isn't

QEII should be round course as well

what is it 10+ years of this now, started great on g/f with frankel then its been downhill ever since

sageform, i backed Irsine as well ,

Used to be in September but cannot compete with the Arc meeting. Remember Culture Vulture winning the 2 y-o race on a disqualification then following up at Longchamp. Had him in a treble with Arazi and Generous, so must have been '91.

..but I don't think this meeting was a thing until the 'Nineties. And it has never really worked.

royal lodge, fillies mile & QEII all on same was always a good days racing

champion stakes newmarket worked well

Was a 3 day meeting and Grandstand hosted the Saturday show from the course with Des Lynam

Milligram, Miesque, Sonic lady

champions stakes was at HQ until.  2011.   Yes Cardinal , the fillies mile im sure was  on the friday and perhaps the cumberland lodge on the thurs ?

When Diminuendo won Hoover Fillies Mile that was a Saturday and the 3rd that day Ashayer then won the Marcel Boussac

The Hoover bit is still lodged in my mind

thought it was royal lodge maybe not remembering correctly

Quality of sponsor has detoriated massively Household names that everyone knew what their products were

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rB-OJha4BE.           HOOVER FILLIES MILE 1984 ,  ( COMMENTARY DOES START IN THE STRAIGHT )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yRfc1hq_nA.....     Diminuendo

I could not name a single classic sponsor of 2024 but I still know the General Accident 1 & 2000 Guineas

Oct 19, 2024 -- 10:52AM, Cardinal Scott wrote:

I could not name a single classic sponsor of 2024 but I still know the General Accident 1 & 2000 Guineas

From the 80s

Bad day for me - much easier to bear in sunshine and good company at the track. The sun reminds me of the day Frankel won the QEII first time. Pricewise tipped the Balmoral winner that day and tipped the winner today so, to end on a positive note: full of admiration for Tom Segal for doing the business, decade after decade.

Mr Chamberlind does talk a lot of sh1t. He's waffling every minute he's speaks. I'd like to see children and young adults on racecourses. But, they must not be bombarded or seduced by promotions from bookies on their mobiles, laptops, etc. If so, many will get hooked, and the excessiveness or gambling addiction will eventually ruin their lives for sure.

if you asked the 7000  students to name the 6 winners now ,I,d guess thew fav on the spreads would be between 2 and 3

no one no,s the answers and plenty don't even think there's a ? to answer
but they've been trying to get kids/newcomers to racing for last 12 yrs and more and heard the new go to ascot team today getting interviewed on TV, banging on about face painting and jocks singing autographs ,could have played the same clip from 12 yrs ago and saved 12 yrs in wages of everyone involved

Christoph Soumillon had plenty of rides and got the last one up. Thunder Run just fourth so another strong run by a Burke horse. both of his went too fast though. The winner and third were the slowest away from the stalls.

Rounded off nicely with Mr Professor 33/1-8/1 then noticeably weak out to 14/1. Like James's Delight earlier in the day (also a similar market drifter) should have loved the ground, but runs like a carthorse. If horses who on all known evidence should like the ground run like that what chance have you got?

Crowley on ruk talking about horse getting beat in France in opera had half a dozen excuses but missed out the main one his trainer mentioned on itv earlier
NOT THE JOCKS GREATEST HOUR

I could not back a horse trained by Raphael Freire how ever much the formbook said it had a chance.

Foyles

Hope you haven't been too distracted to miss that Aidan 3rd string debutant at 49.5   

Whole card needs downgrading to G2 status imvho.
The prize money is mind boggling and ought to be put elsewhere.

The idea of this mega 'champions days' in flat racing presumably caught on with the success of the Dubai World Cup, Breeders Cup and the enlargement of the cheltenham festival.
I remember when it all came about in 2011. It was back in the days when the Irish racing was on ATR. I recall one of their discussion programs led by Gary O'Brien. Think Johnny Murtagh was on it. Anyway everyone was having a great laugh about the fact that Horse Racing Ireland had announced their 'Champions day' for mid september, which was always the date for the Irish Champion Stakes.

The word was that the British Horse Racing Authority had dithered, letting the Irish get first run as it were. The BHA had been stymied by the date of the Leger in mid september. Late September would have meant the supposed 'show piece' Champion Stakes would have been a week before the Arc. Which would probably mean a small field of G2 horses at best. Any earlier would have meant a clash with the York International.

The old Newmarket Champion stakes was run on Cesarewitch day I believe. A week earlier than it is now. And in the east of the country, so far less susceptible to the vagaries of bad ground which seems to be the norm for this meet.

I also am reminded of Pricewise Tom Segal confidently predicting that ten years on the Ascot Champions Stakes would be bigger than the Arc.
Dont think so.
Nick Mordin on the other hand bemoaned this trend of lumping together as many G1 races as possible. He pointed to the Japanese model which liked to have one big race as the highlight, spread over many weekends.
Given that the Land of The Rising Sun arguably produces the best turf horse in the world at the moment and stands at least as good a chance as Coolmore of capturing the Breeders CUp in a couple of week, I think I know which I prefer.

was this the ASCOT card that used to show all the races on BBC and finished with a mile 4 handicap usually run on heavy ground,seemed to remember QUICK RANSOM winning it for Johnson one yr ?

im certain the qe11 was group2 in the 80s , royal ascot itself had only the gold cup as group1 , goodwood didnt have any in the 70s 80s  theres far too much now

Yes Sure Blade won it as Group 2 that was the year before Milligram, Miesque and Sonic Lady

quick ransom won 26th  sept 1992 12 furlongs won by a head in soft ridden by D McKEOWN  BEATING LIFT AND LOAD , it would have been the qe11 meeting

cheers, easy to remember one of  your last 20 winners

ps 14/1

I've never been a backer myself and winning is winning
but having seen economics  last 3 runs rather than been a champion for 90% of each of his last 3 races he,s looked like losing them
bled again as well

Oct 19, 2024 -- 11:34AM, elisjohn wrote:

quick ransom won 26th

That's right. There were a lot of anxious City types in the crowd because Black Wednesday had just happened. Racing attracted more businesspeople than students back then.