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HappyHibby
29 Feb 24 17:00
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Date Joined: 18 Oct 02
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MPs should be given the opportunity to debate and vote on assisted dying after the findings of a new report, Dame Esther Rantzen says.

The Health and Social Care Committee found evidence it has led to better end-of-life care in countries where it is allowed.

Dame Esther said this showed there is no "slippery slope" when it comes to the impact on palliative care.

But Baroness Tanni Grey-Thompson said potential coercion remained a concern.

The Commons' committee's review looked at places where assisted dying for the terminally ill is allowed, including parts of the US, as well as Australia, Switzerland and New Zealand.

The cross-party group of MPs did not rule on a change in the law in England, saying it only wanted to inform debate.

Despite concern a change in the law would lead to poorer support at the end of life, the committee's report said, if anything, it was linked to improvement in the countries to have taken the step, with evidence showing the alterations resulted in extra investment in palliative care.

Dame Esther, who has stage four cancer, said the new report assuaged fears that palliative care could be damaged by introducing assisted dying.

"There isn't the slippery slope that so many are worried about," she said.

The report has cemented Dame Esther's belief that a parliamentary debate and free vote should be held on the subject.

"I'm not demanding that everybody in the world agrees with me, I'm just saying let's debate all the issues now that we've got international evidence and we know the public attitude is in favour," she told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

But she said she was "disappointed" that the committee had not made a clear call for a vote, saying it "doesn't fit into her timescale".

"This report does not help very much for those of us who desperately want the current law to change for the sake of our own families, and the many others in our situation," Dame Esther told the PA news agency.

The 83-year-old has been campaigning on the issue, including backing the launch of a petition demanding a parliamentary vote, which amassed tens of thousands of signatures over a few weeks.

She added: "If they had said 'we urgently need a Parliamentary debate and a free vote', you know, that could perhaps have fitted into my own timescale, but it doesn't."

The 83-year-old Childline founder and broadcaster has long campaigned in favour of assisted dying, and revealed last year that she has joined the Dignitas assisted dying clinic in Switzerland.

Dame Esther said she wanted to avoid tarnishing her family's happy memories of her by suffering as her life draws to a close.

"The thing that motivates me greatly is having watched the deaths of loved ones around me and seen how memories of a bad death obliterate happy memories and become very painful for those involved," she said.

Current laws in England mean her family cannot join her in Zurich if and when she decides to take that step without facing criminal investigations.

In England and Wales, the 1961 Suicide Act makes it an offence to encourage or assist someone to take their own life.

Separate laws in Scotland and Northern Ireland prevent dying people asking for medical help to die.

Over the last eight years, more than 250 people have travelled to Dignitas to end their lives, according to the clinic.

The cross-party group of MPs behind the new report said hospices in England needed extra money as access to care was patchy.

Currently hospices only receive a third of their funding from the NHS, despite providing the majority of specialist palliative care, according to Hospice UK.

Baroness Grey-Thompson, a critic of legalising assisted dying, acknowledged the findings of the report regarding countries that allow the practice, but said she believes palliative care is a "postcode lottery" in England.

"We need to make sure people are protected," she told BBC Breakfast.

She added further concerns that vulnerable people could be coerced into pursuing assisted dying, and that adequate safeguards were difficult to place.

Assisted dying was not always the "Hollywood death" that some might imagine, she said, and that complications could arise once lethal drugs enter the body.

She said she was not against a debate in parliament, and it was important to keep up the conversation about death.

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Replies: 99
By:
HappyHibby
When: 29 Feb 24 17:01
completely agree with Dame Esther personally.
By:
leif
When: 29 Feb 24 17:06
whadda fo0k does this have to do with horse racing please?
By:
impossible123
When: 29 Feb 24 17:12
I agree with Dame Esther, and I can also understand the concerns of those against assisted dying. This could pave the way for abuses and even murder if the ill individual is coerced, bullied or forced into it.

Whatever, it is a very sad and scary scenario for all concerned.
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 29 Feb 24 17:13
How it started in Canada?

How it's going....

A Paralympic army veteran told stunned lawmakers in Canada when she claimed that a government official had offered to give her euthanisia equipment while fighting to have a wheelchair lift installed in her home.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/christine-gauthier-paralympian-euthanasia-canada-b2238319.html
By:
duffy
When: 29 Feb 24 17:13
If she needs any help I'd happily give her a hand.
By:
acey deucy
When: 29 Feb 24 17:19
Yes i agree with Esther.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 29 Feb 24 17:24
Current laws in England mean her family cannot join her in Zurich if and when she decides to take that step without facing criminal investigations.

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utterly despicable imv.
By:
1st time poster
When: 29 Feb 24 17:26
we already have a version of assisted dying,in DNR notices,
esther lived a life of privilidge hit a problem right at end of it and wants to use her priv to help change the law to suit her needs,what does that say for families whove fought pain/disruption/jumped hurdles all their life
her daughter even said this morning they dont want it for so call mental illness,ie dementia/alzim,which for those involved are the worst types pf pain,frustration you can ever imagine,
she also said 100s of countries now offer it and uk is a backwater/luddard for resisting ity,if that were the case why/how are dignitas  making a fortune selling  their option ?
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 29 Feb 24 17:27
There's clearly an attack on farming in the name of saving the planet, and there have been protests in several countries, with it kicking off in Wales now as well.

So here's the big question, how comes migration is being allowed to increase populations while at the same time the land that feeds us is under attack from legislation / incentives?

We know there has been some deregulation in the GM industry, so maybe all food will be grown in factories, or we'll get our protein from insects.

But we also know that AI is estimated to possibly take over 95% of jobs, so what to do with the "useless eaters", eh? Disease X?
By:
leif
When: 29 Feb 24 17:47
Ada, have you heard? Esther wants to end it all.

Well, That's Life Cissie!


By:
GEORGE.B
When: 17 Mar 24 18:24
PETER HITCHENS: We've dehumanised the unborn. Now it's the turn of the elderly and the ill

"Many feel guilty about the burden they place on their loved ones. As a society we badly fail to provide the palliative end-of-life care which would surely be the best answer to the needless suffering visited on so many in their final months.

But I think it is worse than that. These changes are a retreat from Christian civilisation into a Brave New World where all who get in the way become disposable.

We have dehumanised the unwanted unborn and are about to dehumanise the inconvenient old and ill. Who’s next?"

https://mol.im/a/13204819
By:
duffy
When: 17 Mar 24 18:30
Plenty happy to sacrifice the elderly and sick during covid.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 18:33
utter nonsense from PH imv.
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 17 Mar 24 19:17
duffy 17 Mar 24 17:30 
Plenty happy to sacrifice the elderly and sick during covid.


Any names?
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 17 Mar 24 19:27
Not nonsense at all, HH, Hitchens is a devout Christian, so why wouldn't take that stance?

And his point is where does this end up?

I've given the example above of how it's going in Canada, request a stairlift from the authorities and they write back asking if you'd rather be euthanized!
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 19:27
nite nite GEORGE.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 19:29
if you want to see your loved ones having a slow/painful death then fair enough...

i don't...

and i don't want one myself thank you very much.
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 17 Mar 24 19:30
This gives force to the warnings of those who argue assisted dying in this country will rapidly copy the frightening system in Canada. By 2022, that country was ending the lives of 13,200 people a year, 4.1 per cent of its annual deaths.
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 17 Mar 24 19:31
Hitchens answered that in his comment about palliative care.
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 17 Mar 24 19:40
Let's hope then, HH, that the day doesn't arrive when you're knocking on a bit and need assistance from the state in order to improve the quality of your life, say for example, a bungalow, mobility scooter or even...a STAIRLIFT!

Because the reply may come back:

Sorry Mr Hibby, unfortunately we can't help, but I'm pleased to say is that what we can do for you, is send someone round with a lethal injection. Would you care to phone 666 666 666 and make an appointment?
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 19:48
need assistance from the state in order to improve the quality of your life

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

social care in the UK is a total fkn disgrace imv...

i'm dreading getting old and being unable to cope...

and if i am in constant pain and suffering i will be on the first plane to Switzerland...

trust me...

and if the UK wants to be a backward thinking country and not let people end their own lives on their terms to relieve the pain and suffering then so be it...

it won't stop me.
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 17 Mar 24 19:53
Legally assisted dying won't happen in this country, not while big pharma can make a fortune from drugs that keep people alive.

There's not much profit in assisted dying. They can only administer the stuff once in a lifetime.

Money is at the root of everything that happens in medicine just like everything else.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 19:59
flights to Switzerland are quite cheap imv.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 20:04
https://www.easyjet.com/en/cheap-flights/switzerland

------------------------------------------------------------

will be the best £15 i've ever spent if i'm in constant pain and agony.
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 17 Mar 24 20:08
It's the chronically ill that usually seek assisted dying.
But they usually need help to carry it out.
Anyone who helps them to get to cuckoo clock land might find themselves in the dock on a charge of assisting suicide.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 20:10
which is an utter disgrace in itself imv.
By:
casemoney
When: 17 Mar 24 20:27
with the Increase in Dementia summat going to have to Be Brought into play , Will be impossible to Provide care
By:
HappyHibby
When: 17 Mar 24 20:31
Will be impossible to Provide care

------------------------------------

change 'will' to 'is' casemoney...

NHS/Social Care is on it's knees NOW...

God only knows what it will look like in 30 years (if i am still here).
By:
LoyalHoncho
When: 18 Mar 24 02:47
I find it hugely ironic that there is such resistance and opposition to women being allowed to choose death during chronic illness in old age and little or no resistance to wee lassies who haven;t even learned what life is all about being able to walk in to a doc. and book an abortion.
Don't allow the old to kill themselves but do allow the young and inexperienced to kill their potential bairns.
By the thousands and thousands and thousands.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 28 Mar 24 07:56
Could assisted dying be coming to Scotland ?

-----------------------------------------------

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-68674769
By:
Latalomne
When: 28 Mar 24 09:29
In case you've not seen, and to at least give it an equine angle, some of you may have seen the story of Caroline March, 31, an event rider and sister-in-law of Piggy March, elected to go down the assisted suicide route last week after a fall left her with a spinal column injury and confined to a wheelchair.  She penned a letter in her own words explaining her decision. 

While I have never had suicidal thoughts, there is something comforting about having the control - the option - to choose when you've had enough, if, for whatever reason, your body is failing in some way.  I don't see how anybody gains anything from seeing loved ones suffering unbearable pain or in a zombified state just because it's better than them not being here.  Frankly, I'm not sure it always is...  We would not subject our pets to it...
By:
HappyHibby
When: 28 Mar 24 09:40
correct Latalomne.
By:
sparrow
When: 28 Mar 24 09:43
duffy 17 Mar 24 17:30 
Plenty happy to sacrifice the elderly and sick during covid.





Too true.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 28 Mar 24 09:43
i've had to end the lives of two of my pets...

hardest thing i've had to do...

but it would have been 10 times harder watching them slowly evaporate in front of my very eyes...

watching them in pain every second of every day...

not being able to eat...

not being able to control when they go to the toilet...

that would have been utterly humiliating for them and soul destroying for me.
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 28 Mar 24 13:37
duffy 17 Mar 24 17:30
Plenty happy to sacrifice the elderly and sick during covid.


sparrow 28 Mar 24 08:43 
Too true.


Oh, you mean the government telling people to "STAY HOME AND SAVE THE NHS"?

Yes, if you restrict access to medical facilities or / and scare the sh*t out of people to prevent them leaving their homes, then yes, you will kill people, as their report informed them after the first lockdown, but they still went ahead with further lockdowns anyway. The excess death figures since, largely not attributed to covid, would seem to confirm this.

Even if you believe there was a deadly disease on the loose which could kill millions, and there was evidence early on to suggest this wouldn't be the case, they didn't have any right to say, we're going to sacrifice this large group of people over here because we think we may be saving this larger group of people over there. But that's what they did.
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 28 Mar 24 13:47
And not forgetting, there was a pandemic response strategy which had been carefully thought out over many years and which advised none of what they actually imposed, but we're asked to believe that this was dropped on a whim in order to mimic the Chinese authoritarian response.
By:
SlippyBlue
When: 28 Mar 24 15:11
I would definitely vote in favour of assisted dying in the U.K.
Having been one of his carers and seen my Dad go through and what mesothelioma did to him, well you would not wish it on your worst enemy. When he eventually did pass away at home, I had no tears left, I was just thankful that his fight was finally over.
By:
HappyHibby
When: 28 Mar 24 15:24
totally agree Slippy...

it's inhumane asking people to suffer like that...

and for their loved ones to have to sit and watch it.
By:
acey deucy
When: 28 Mar 24 16:02
Absolute no brainer in my book.
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