More Grand National changes

The Grand National does more harm to racing's image than any other single race, and yet a couple of days ago there was a thread about quiz contestants not having heard of the race.

As a racing fan, I'd be happy to see the field reduced. Even in its heyday, the National was contested by a dozen or so serious runners surrounded by no-hopers, whose falls and deaths would later bring racing into disrepute. The irony is making the National a better quality race has also made it harder to solve.

Will end up being a mascot race.

Britain will be lucky to get 5 in the race now.

Another victory for the animal rights mob. Every concession leads to another demand.

The Chair and Foinavon fence to be reduced to a
PEDESTRIAN CROSSING

in 25 years time i don't think they'll be any NH racing.
the powers that be keep bowing down to the minorities.

These are sensible changes:  There is no need for such a long run to the first fence and 34 runners is bound to make it safer.  And safety is so important.  But from a laying perspective, this will make it harder to make a balanced ante post book due to more horses with significant chances being ballotted out and layers being out of pocket after returning these stakes to the backer (without any reduction factor, or rule 4 even).

Good for selling booze

The Bland National; a shadow of the race it used to be when it was contested by proper chasers. But of course it used to be five times more lethal than other steeplechases.

Marksman -they'll be back for more -nothing will satisfy them until there is no National, then no races over fences, then no races over hurdles , then no PTP then no flat races . Appeasement never works.

Oct 12, 2023 -- 1:47PM, Manoleeds wrote:

Marksman -they'll be back for more -nothing will satisfy them until there is no National, then no races over fences, then no races over hurdles , then no PTP then no flat races . Appeasement never works.

The bigger the fences, the slower the horses will go and the more they will respect them.
The smaller the fences, the more likely the horse will take liberties with them.

Manoleeds, 10 years ago I would have thought you were unduly pessimistic. Now I am not so sure. The Gambling Commission are merely the visible part of a group who see gambling/horseracing as an affectation of the "upper classes" (daft though that view is). The ratchet effect of constant changes has already changed the race beyond recognition and, in my view, has made it no safer (better horses go faster and they all crowd up on the inside rail - no advantage in going wide now). The near inevitable next Labour Government will need some "red meat" to throw at the hard-left elements (whilst elsewhere pursuing a Blairite, centre-left agenda) and will choose low-hanging fruit like...... gambling/horse racing. Last time in power it was hunting. Something else this time I fear

its the speed of the horses that creates falls and deaths so a shorter run to the first is probably a good move not sure a reduction in the field size does a lot

I doubt these concessions will stop any actions from the tiny tiny minority like animal rising  next year as they know it gets them on the telly and the grand national is an easy target. The national media seem happy to give air time to these extremists who believe people should not have pets and blind people should not have guide dogs. How do you appease that??

The course have done all they can to make the race safe but until people get it into their heads that these animals are not pets but are bred to race with all the potential risks of them breaking down, falling etc

Just to note that the racing time is being moved from 5.15 to an earlier slot - thank heavens for that although Aintree wont be happy given the oncourse sales

It's not just the horses taking liberties with the fences, it's the jockeys who go charging into the first fence, and the jockeys who head for the rails on the widest racecourse. The one good change in recent years is jockeys are now more likely to pull up once all chance has gone rather than continue on a tired horse.

law of unintended consequences Ramruna. When the fences were higher and the drop on the inside greater, there was a choice. Save ground but possibly fall ; lose ground ground on the outside but more chance of getting round. Now there is no difference,  as a jockey, you may as well go on the inside = more crowding, hampered horses and brought downs.

Might as well call it " THE JUST STOP OIL HANDICAP CHASE"..that will baffle them..

The race is finished, i would say if run on soft/heavy ground the Welsh Grand National is a stiffer test..

The RSPCA - "We are looking forward to the announcement of further changes etc...". There is no appeasing these people. And they are the least militant of those who want to stop it altogether.

Spot on Clerkmore.

Just given them a bit more air time.

Fools running racing for years.

Now we have idiots.

Oliver Sherwood on Farage- fears for NH racing, I agree it will come.

Ted Walsh sums it up well in his comments on Sky Sports Racing.

Oct 12, 2023 -- 1:26PM, dambuster wrote:

in 25 years time i don't think they'll be any NH racing.the powers that be keep bowing down to the minorities.

Like i said and i stand by it.

Ted Walsh's comments here https://www.skysports.com/racing/news/12426/12983164/ted-walsh-grand-nationa...   includes
"Grand National-winning trainer Ted Walsh says the changes to the Aintree showpiece race are just the next step in the abolition of jump racing."It's only a continuation of what has been happening in England for the last 20 years," Walsh told Sky Sports Racing.
"The animal welfare groups are gathering more momentum and the Jockey Club are slowly giving in and are on the back foot.

"They have to appease those people to allow a race like the Grand National to continue but it is what it is and this is another step in the abolition of jump racing as we know it.

"I got one ride in the Grand National and didn't get that far. When I was growing up, it was an achievement to get a ride in the National and even bigger to get round in the National.

"If your horse is any way adaptable to jumping now, you'll get around. It used to be a bit special but now I don't think it is.

The Grand National has been diluted out of existence . It's now just one more  very long race with a large pot of money attached. More like the Bland National.

As one discipline falls away the BHA should be trying to develop another to replace it.

The Cross Country chases are laughed at by the vast majority of racing people in the UK but if they did it properly these could possibly become the "spectacle" that formits here think people want to watch......

Eventually the Grand national will be run over medium sized spruce fences, and the BHA have no imagination to replace it with a different race that when that does happen they have filled the gap.

Jump racing is attritional, doesn't matter how it is buttered up.

It is so far removed from what it used to be that I would not care if they ditched it now.

For true safety optimisation they should release the horses one by one off level weights compensated by time x distance.

Just cancel the shambles ffs

Like many on here I suspect, the Grand National is what first got me into racing. Indeed, I'd look forward to the next one as soon as the latest one had finished.

Racing doesn't exist in a bubble, however, and other sports are having to adapt to safety concerns too. Rugby has made changes to try to reduce the possibility of head injuries and in football there is increasingly discussion over banning heading the ball.

Times and sensibilities change, and I think the GN is very much a race out of its time (similar comments apply to NH Racing, in my opinion). As Ramruma said earlier, the race is now more trouble than its worth for racing - I think it should be allowed to die naturally. Can we really say that the race is getting safer despite the changes? I'm fairly certain that the last four or five renewals have all had fatalities.

Just another four and a half mile chase,they are scattered across the Uk over the normal course fences and Aintree is much the same….countless tracks have a national which are fodder pulling cash cows..

The Grand National gives the animal rights nutters an opportunity to act like the morons they are

on a National stage with guaranteed wall to wall media coverage. Once the race is over they crawl

back into their bubbles of self-righteousness and ignorance and horse racing can continue unhindered.

If The Grand National and jumps racing fold they will go the Epsom in June. So let them have their

day in the sun , fine them a few thousand pounds, and tell them next time it will be jail!

The only thing that's changed is twatter, and racing's great and good caring about the freaks who populate it are crying about. Millions still tune in to watch the race, millions still bet on it, attendance live at the racecourse appears to be buoyant. It would be the same next year, changes or no changes. Until of course the salami slicing will have hollowed it out to such an extent that it will just be another race and the once a year punter will no longer be interested.

RSPCA and BBC loving all this,and they won’t be happy until the race is abolished.BBC hypocrites of the first order,after milking the ratings for screening the National for years.Ted Walsh got it spot on.

I’ve emailed Aintree with the RSPCA and PETA in cc with my suggestion.

We do this like F1 with the sprint races.

So we have 4 sprint races of 10 horses over 2 miles on the Wednesday with the top 2 from each qualifying for an 8 runner grand national on the Saturday which is run as solo time trials with robot camel jockeys because it’s unfair for horse to carry a jockey that far.

-

Sometimes I just like starting sh*t lol

I'd go further and reduce it to 30 max plus horses must run in qualifying races (here) with criteria attached eg finished in 1st 3 or 4. And, the National regulars that do not qualify - tough; give the newcomers a chance despite out of the handicap.

Countryfile now on racecourse deaths…..Another hatchet job ?

If safety is their mantra,no horse should be allowed to run out of the hcp.clearly this is dangerous.
You could argue that no horse in any race should be allowed to run out of any hcp,has they ve failed to meet the criteria for that race.

What would happen if a class 6 horse runs if carrying 2 stone more than its rating.

Other criteria
Must of run 3 times that season,must of finnished in first 6 last time out,to prove fitness and well being.

Again what would happen if been off track for 4 years with injury,then it dies.

Must of run once since start of year.

Completed 10 chases

If they’re serious about safety then why not.

If an 'up-and-coming' and improving horse finishes 1/2/3 in a qualifying race then I think the horse can be allowed to take its chance. As for the regulars running for a day-out for owners once is ok; give the others a chance. Similarly, owners with entries with different trainers should be restricted to 3 max, and must qualify too.

Could have. If ran in it before once or twice. And failed to Finnish,can’t enter again.

If ever fell twice over national fences,can’t run.

If fell more than 3 times in a chase,can’t run.

The list is endless,there’s enough entries,so weed some out.

The whole fun of the National is a big field handicap full of horses of wide varying ability all battling it out over an untested trip, with dodgy jumpers getting fantastic rides, on variable ground etc. Who wants another compressed handicap of fit proven sound jumping stayers, that could be just any other Saturday handicap. It's supposed to be a spectacle. 99% of non-racing people I watch with say 'Ooh, he fell will he be alright? then they move on and think nothing more of it. A tiny tiny minority ruining it all for the rest of us, that's big horse racing fans and the once a year punters alike.

Indeed. Oxbridge uni entrants know the drill. Why not horses too? Apply the ethos "Cruel to be Kind", I say.

I agreed. However, one (punter or once-a-year race enthusiast) does not want to witness or be told of regular fatality annually; cruelty in any sport ain't acceptable no more these days.

impossible123, I don't disagree with that at all, we all hate seeing fatalities. But the fences are no longer what they were, the spectacle is the number of horses lining up, there's plenty of space for 40 runners, there were 66 in 1929, so we're now looking at half that number.

BBC hypocrites of the first order,after milking the ratings for screening the National for years.

ahh yes, the good old beeb.

didn't it used to be on just before Jim'll Fix It.

Sibton Abbey won the Hennessy from around 21LB out of the H'cap
when he beat Jodami.

BBC wont even show a hook in a fishes mouth on "Gone Fishing"

So the sight of a horse falling must be off the radar scale for them.

Should be competing for their custom like the rest of TV Companies instead of taking public money.

For the entry, possibly they could do it like the Peagsus race they have in the US...

Owners buy an allotted number of entry slot at a very high premium and, to within reason, they can run whatever horse they want

And other races are win and you're in.
The Hennessey, Welsh/Irish/scottish National, King George, Eider, 4 mile NH, Foxhunters, Gold Cup, Sun Alliance, Leopardstown GC, Grand Prix de Paris, The Betfair, Charlie Hall, Whitbred, Thyestes ....

Participation ought not to be based on ability to pay, but solely on ability only eg criteria qualification; ability to pay exorbitant prices at sales must not come into the equation of participation for this race.

Win and you're in races would be very interesting in this context.