September Stakes (Kempton 14:05)

I believe this will only concern Enable and Crystal Ocean


Really you don't fancy Enable's pacemaker then? Or the 150/1 or 200/1 poke?

Enable a big lay surely?

The best horse in the race receiving 8lbs from her danger and on a surface she has proven she can handle but her danger has not.

Even allowing for her enforced lay off I am really struggling to see how she is even a lay @ 4/6 (probably have to lay bigger I ain't looked) let alone a big lay

Well it's good the OP has whittled it down to two, that makes it easier so disecting the form .....

BHA

Crystal Ocean	129
Enable	128

Weight

Crystal Ocean	9 st 10 lb
Enable	9 st 2 lb

Crystal Ocean has to give 8 lb away yet is only 1 lb ahead on ratings, so Enable is actually 7 lb well in.

8 lb = over 5L

Crystal Ocean has never won a group 1 - Enable has won 5 and all at 12f (save a few yards)

Crystal Ocean unproven on an AW surface - Enable has won on Tapeta.

Enable has a decent pacemaker to ensure a strong pace (and it wouldn't be a big shock if he won).

John Gosden 32% winning strike rate at Kempton AW this year.

Enable was ready to run in the Juddmonte, but JG thought the extra time would be a bonus.

I wouldn't say Enable was a big lay, far from it in fact.

can anyone remember who won the first running of the september stakes and what was the odds on favorite beaten in the race ?

Was the fav the previous years KGQE winner.?

correct cork

Won't spoil it for others, that clue should help jog someone's grey matter.!

if as impossible says it looks between the two then which ever does win will be by some way the best horse to win this race in its history.

the thing is nowadays cork people can cheat by going on the internet shame really i know when we would have debates in the pub either sport or anything else it could take all night to sort it out ,now somebody just goes on the goggles and its there.

true foxy, have to admit it only remains fresh in my mind as I was big into the stable at the time and remember it was one of the only times I saw the trainer shocked

pretty sure the winner ran in troys derby cork still the best performance in terms of form achieved on the day itself by any derby winner i have ever seen.

I can remember Slip Anchor getting turned over in it.

shernazar beat him andriy then the great pebbles beat him at newmarket.

It did foxy, had the legendary "Shoe" aboard and finished a respectable 8th in a field of 23

memory tells me the 2nd had won the irish 2000 and later won the eclispe the 3rd won the champion stakes the 4th won the following years king george ,and the 2000 guineas winner finished down the field.

i know the shoe rode hawian storm also for barry hills in the derby cork did he ride glacial storm ?

No foxy, think son Michael rode it

thanks cork its a shame barry hills never won a derby i think he deserved it on his cv.