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Gordon Elliot dodging interviews again
Gordon Elliot dodging interviews again
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he doesnt cheat as such but irish racing apart from big meetings is uncompetitive,a trial race yesterday o'brien had 3 out of the 4 runners,are they really all going to push each other trying to win that race and you see instantances all winter like that
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But you can give an average horse to a small trainer and they will get a lot more out of it than a big trainer will. Give a group horse to a small trainer and they probably wont get it to achieve what a big yard will as they dont have other horses like it at home to help it progress.
About as correct as it gets regarding group animals, The bit about owner interference too, Many a potential great horse been ruined by wanting to run before they could walk & when you're in a small yard the problem is if you don't run they just move them to someone who will. For me the best trainers do well with bad stock, Those mid range horses with bad knees who you have to nurse along every morning, Those who get them to win a few on the bounce due to attention to detail & considerate handling would be the top trainers but they'll never get the stock as it's rarely about ability more about who you know & how much c@ck you're willing to chow down on. ( Not knocking those at the top btw just stating what I've seen as there's many a clueless trainer proclaimed as geniuses when majority of the time it's down to good staff & decent riders, Something else which is hard to come by nowdays ) |
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The "placing" horses praise is a bit silly...he's got so much firepower he can place them anywhere.
Praising someone for "placing" is better served when talking about someone with a lot less ammo and needs to really dig out a win or two. |
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That'll be why I don't praise O'Brien, Not saying he isn't good at his job but with his backing he can throw 3 or more at every listed / group race in the calendar year if he wants to.
That's not genius imo that's just a numbers game. |
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@Duffy
In order to win the amount of handicaps at any level, which he does you have to be good at placing your horses. Placing your horses isn't just about winning with them, it's about getting them rated correctly and so they can win races. It's far easier to win a Group race with a very good horse, than it is to win one of the biggest handicaps in racing with a horse of similar ilk. If you want to look how not to place your horses, take a look at Sir Michael Stoute, John Gosden, Roger Varian and in many ways Aidan O'Brien. They ruin over 50% of the horses they have in their care of over facing them, however those horses are often retired or given away with NRA to save face when it lands with a small trainer and progresses. If you ever want to see how to place good horses correctly, I advise you to take close notice of William Haggas, the man is a genius, who does everything just right. He can place his horses correctly, rarely wastes good entries and can win races even with very average horses. He however rarely gets given the top bloodlines, but if you gave him Stoute's and Gosden's horses he would do far better with them on the whole. |
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@gutfeeling
I personally think your last paragraph sums up Richard Fahey, Mick Appleby, Mick Channon and Brian Ellison to a T. Brilliant trainers, who can win with a lot of bad animals and do very well with what they've got. Some will question me including Channon, but he doesn't have anywhere near the firepower he once had. The Sheikh's abandoned him and the majority of his horses are cheap homebreds. Yet they win in their grade and the way his cheap 2yos have hit the ground running this year somewhat suggests he's gone back to what he was like in his Lambourn days before the Sheikh Ahmed and Jaber Abdullah days came. Mick has also produced any number of decent trainers. Paul Deegan, Mark Wallis, Mark Walford, Joe Tuite, George Peckham, Tony Coyle, all hail from the school of Channon. |
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Who 'Places' Gordon Elliott's horses FOR him ...because the bloke, by his own admission, can barely read or write.
He HAS to have a 'right-hand man', therefore. |
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Used to be Olly Murphy, but think Ian Amond and Zoe Winston most the entries now.
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Correct, and they are also responsible for the ordering of pizza.
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An awful lot of poor trainers in the UK now.
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While someone else will make the entries onlooker it'll be the trainer who tells them what races to look for (Ie the trip, Type of track, Likely going ect ect) as between what he see's at home & the input from staff around him they should be able to work out a horses optimum conditions.
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@domino14
If you're a photographer round the gallops I'd guess you know Chris Bourchier, Used to see him around but not so much nowdays. |
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Where did this bloke come from? I've not followed in a while, and within ten years he and his girth appeared?
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I'm sure Gordon E must be pretty handy at what he does - but I wouldn't buy a used car from him.
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Why is the fellow so packed with lard at such a young age?
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Why is the fellow so packed with lard at such a young age?
You have obviously not had much recent experience with schoolboys, cutie. How long has it been? |
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The last time I was on here, the bloke didn't even exist, so where has he come from, Mouse. Which owners have backed him?
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He's the son that Martin Pipe wishes he'd had.
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(not in that sense)
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I can't see such a big fellow being produced from such a small fellow?
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He produced a tall fellow, but he taught G.E. how to train.
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Well, G.E. has done well then, as all learn from their teachers. Michael Dickinson didn't though.
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Gordon Elliott was with Harvey Martin and then Pipey, scarily he then went to Ted Stanners in Compton and was overlooked for assistant for Daniel Mark Loughnane. Gordon decided to head to Ireland to originally train pointers, whilst Mark was assistant for Ted before training in his own right. Ted Stanners was clearly an excellent judge!
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Michael Dickinson was sent some of the best horses around.By a smart Irish man.
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Yes, that is well known, Clown, but he had to train them, and bring out the best in them, and all trainers and those in the know, this is the hardest task, and the guinness was one of those little benefits, which brought out the best of English training and Irish investment.
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Thats good you know that cracker.I wont ask you to name him.
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Was talking to a shrewd Irish racing professional recently who said he has not seen such a genius as GE in Irish Racing in the last fifty years and he didn't exempt either O'Brien or Mullins from that assessment
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They are probably right stellar.He also has a great team around him and knows how to campaign his horses.
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The literacy issue with Elliot has been well aired but I remember a friend of mine who worked with APOB while at Coolcullen being withering in her assessment of him at that time - the bottom line is that handsome is as handsome does , and results speak for themselves as racehorse trainers ( even if the individuals in question don't inspire confidence in certain respects or don't fit the prototype of what we consider 'genius' in other spheres )
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Why I think he is so good,is if you look back to his early days how he placed his horses and got wins out of them.
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workrider 14 Apr 18 18:33
Ye all should be ashamed of yourself's ffs, guy admits to be barely able to read or write, so expecting him to be media savvy is unfair. One thing for sure is he can train horses better than most plum sounding English Pr1cks .... Well said. Disgusting and ignorant comments on here. |
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Terrible workrider though
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blimey this aged well haha
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give him a life ban
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On the subject of Gordon's utterances, it should be noticed that after his initial disastrous statement last weekend, Gordon employed a PR firm to issue his contrite statement after the hearing.
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Or at least, his statement was issued through a PR firm, whether Gordon's idea or the IHRB's.
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and straight back to a pish taking statement tweet today which they had to remove the last line
i,ll be around to assist and offer help |
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Absolute class tweet here:
David Johnson @davidjohnsonTF Sneezy has taken over the licence, but seems Dopey is still doing the PR. Take a bow son   |
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LOL
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Gordon Elliott illustrates David Cameron's maxim that too many tweets might make a ****.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3Mrfut-FSw @davidjohnsonTF wins the internet though. |