Self Service Tills - Betting Shops

I think they accept and pay out 'safe' amounts. Anything out of the ordinary will be met with a message referring the user to the counter staff.

The 'safe' amounts will be able to be set by the shop manager.

I guess the prices will be adjusted down accordingly. It does seem that the bookies now purely employ staff to be FOBT minders.

Hills have them and are rolling them out although I still think they are having problems with them as currently they only offer tennis and football.  I'm lead to believe Horse Racing will be added next but I suppose they need to make sure their current content is working before adding more.

In terms of restrictions, any PTL customer can have what they want on them (what I was told) but I would suspect they will be to a similar level of restriction that the majority of accounts that are not limited online have.  That said, they are monitored at Head Office level and sooner rather than later, you will probably be banned from using them in some way if you begin to show a decent profit.

Does any other Country operate this ?

THE ARTICLE FROM THE RP

Self-service tills: racing the next big thing
By Bill Barber 3:33PM 1 MAR 2016

THE increasing importance of self-service betting terminals (SSBTs) was a feature of last week's results announcements from Ladbrokes and William Hill and horseracing is set to provide the next big opportunity for the sector according to John Pettit of SSBT supplier Best Gaming Technology (BGT).

The terminals give customers an online experience within a betting shop, giving them the chance to bet in-play and choose from thousands of markets, with accumulator betting very popular.

Ladbrokes have multiple SSBTs in every shop having last year signed a long-term contract with BGT for their British, Irish and Belgian retail estates in 2015.

The bookmaker's chief executive Jim Mullen last week described SSBT performance as "strong", growing from three per cent of over-the-counter staking in the last quarter of 2014 to ten per cent at the start of this year.

Mullen said incremental staking was around 30 per cent, slightly ahead of previous guidance, while acting chief financial officer Richard Snow said average margin was 20 per cent to 25 per cent.

This has been achieved without horseracing or greyhound racing, with more than 75 per cent of Ladbrokes' SSBT staking on football. However, that is set to change and the Racing Post has linked up with BGT to provide this content for the terminals.

Pettit, who joined BGT last year as managing director for Britain and Ireland, said: "We want to help develop racing so we can start bringing it to different people who enjoy a digital format.

"We want to take the growth we've seen in sports and in-play, and through the deal with the Racing Post do the same thing for horseracing and greyhounds.

"We see it as a huge opportunity both for our business, bookmakers and the customers because the world is moving to self service."

BGT was founded in Vienna in 2005 by Armin Sageder and had its first live terminal in Britain with Coral in 2007. The company now operates on four continents and has more than 14,000 terminals in Britain and Ireland with Ladbrokes, William Hill, Coral, Betfred, Paddy Power and smaller independents, although Hills are set to roll out t heir own proprietary SSBTs this year.

BGT opened a London office in January and Pettit said the ambition was "to get a terminal or more in every betting shop". He added of the new London base: "It was opened to provide a dedicated focus to British customers to work together to look at ways in which we can develop revenues for both our customers and ourselves, which is the beauty of our revenue share model.

"That is the purpose of the British team and also to illustrate how seriously we're taking the British market."

Pettit described SSBTs as the industry's "best kept secret", adding: "Moving forward, we hope people see there are opportunities to grow their sports betting business."

Pettit was also keen to emphasise the terminals are for betting rather than gaming. "These are betting terminals and we think betting terminals in betting shops is a good mix," he said.

"We are, in reality, self-service tills. We have developed sophisticated trading systems that allow us to manage risk from anonymous retail customers. We also work with sports betting integrity departments and can identify when and where a suspicious bet is placed.

"These are betting terminals and we hope we can help reinvigorate retail over-the-counter betting and traditional sports betting. We've shown we can do it already with football and in-play and we're very excited to take those learnings to horseracing and greyhound racing."

Presumably fed with credit/debit cards( not cash) ?

No, they do take cash !

I've worked in a shop with one, most people still like the personal touch at the counter !

Bookmakers bet on so many markets now... still need someone at the counter who understand what the customer wants to bet on !

Most over the counter staff no little about anything to do with betting.

Back when I worked in the City in the 90s the only pleasant Joe C's branch in the universe (the one in a huge basement right by the Stock Exchange tower) had one or two of these - I remember doing my yankees and lucky 15s on them.   Haven't been in bookie's shops much since - I bet online like most on here - so did they really vanish at some point after I remember them in the 90s and only reappear nearly two decades later?

Surely it will be like a self service till in the supermarket they will need someone on hand all the time to help the technologically-challenged?

the ones in ladbrokes used to have horses and dogs on them they used to switch themself off if they didnt like your bets. went in week after horses and dogs removed. the limits in the ladbrokes ones were set up the same as the then limits online.

Checker, lot's of markets on oddschecker...


I suppose it's about training of the staff, the firm I work for staff are pretty clued up !

Facts. Tote self serve machines have been in operation at racecourses and off-track betting outlets in America

and Canada for at least 25 years (horse racing only). They work very well.

< (re:tote machines in U.S.) They take vouchers and winning bet tickets only.

They also have them in France.

Halcyon:: it is about training, they are trained to use the tills and empty the fobts, not there fault just cashiers now.

What about prevention of gambling by under 18s, those with a gambling problem or vulnerable people.  Doesn't there need to be human monitoring?

I've worked in one of our shops where we have one of these.  Did three shifts and didn't take a penny through it, including a Saturday.  I don't see what niche they're filling.  If you know enough about them to use the technology you'd just be betting online via your phone or computer.

And yes, like Halcyon Days, most of the staff I have worked with have been pretty knowledgeable about things (maybe we work for the same firm ).  Can't say the same for some of the opposition, I'm afraid.

If you know enough about them to use the technology you'd just be betting online via your phone or computer.

This is what i don't understand - they want to give the 'online experience in the shop' well thanks but I'll stick with the 'online experience' at home or in an agreeable eatery nearby!

no no - the whole point is that these machines allow you to bet in cash and preserve your anonymity

completely different from on-line

If that was the case how would you stop someone having repeated scores on pricewise on a saturday morning, for instance?

have used these machines a few times and have noticed the prices are sometimes shorter than at the desk though...

I can't think of any reason why I'd want to bet anonymously with cash unless it was to launder money.  Anyone with the view that these machines are going to let you have an unlimited amount on at the advertised price is incredibly naive.  Any big bet will be put through to head office, they'll ask the staff in the shop whether it's a known customer and if it's not they'll be limited.

I wouldn't want to

I can imagine it now, if you try to have more than 20 quid or back something that just happens to be top price, an alarm will sound, shutters will come down and an armed bunch of heavies will appear, you will then be blindfolded and taken away to be tortured and interrogated.

Have to agree with Sergeant and spyker

Thanks for the info. roggrain

polab-

'What about prevention of gambling by under 18s, those with a gambling problem or vulnerable people.  Doesn't there need to be human monitoring?'


Wassie, it's a legal requirement now... see Paddy Power thread !

"Human monitoring" is something that sounds simple but it's hard to do in practice.  You can raise concerns but how do you go up to someone and suggest they might need help or have a problem?  You're almost always going to get a hostile response to that.  Closest I've come is telling some bloke I wouldn't load credit onto the machine because he'd already said "this is my last one!" on the prior transaction, but it's a bit different.

@ Polab's comment..

But the thing is, hes bang on in some regard.  I'm restricted in a few shops, (the ones I use the most) and became frustrated at the constant phone calls to Head Office to get on.  I fancied a game in France and wanted £100 on it at 15/8 but couldn't be arsed with the call, gave a mate the £100 told him to put £95 on for me and keep a fiver for himself.  They won 1-0, scored in the 75th minute... were 4/1 in running at that stage so plenty of time for me to get bigger.  I thought nothing of it though and a winner is a winner...

Upon collecting a few days later..... the shop staff snarled at me in disgust.  My Client Manager or Management had checked the camera's, seen me pass the money on to another guy and him putting the bet on for me.  I don't know what went on behind the scenes but the member of staff who put the bet through wouldn't talk to me for weeks declaring that I had tried to get them the sack !!  For the next few days, I felt like I was a little Al Capone with everyone keeping their eyes on me.  I was put on PTL all bets so decided to have a load of 50p each way's at Portman Park which had to be rung through.  When the dust settled, I was put back to PTL £25 and above but that only lasted a month or so although I'm back to PTL all again.

I'll see what happens when these machines hit town, although why I would want to take the online price (available on the machines) of 6/4 on a team when I can get 2/1 on the coupon is still beyond me.

So if I'm in a shop and want to put X amount of £s on a bet up at the counter and get told I can only have half of what I want on, so I accept that and go to put the other half on via one of these self-service machines, will someone run out from behind the counter and spread themselves across the machine to stop me from doing so?

Did a little test when i first spotted these in a local Joes. Put a potential footy acca into the machine to see what the odds where then put the same bet online through my phone. There were 15 points difference!!! Online being by far the much better odds obvs rather then the inshop machine

Coupons and online with Joes is nothing short of legalised theft imo, they know they have the mugs on the coupons who do not even care about prices so will rip them off at ease. I placed a bet in shop for a mate of mine probably 5 years ago on a coupon, slip paid just under 11/1 and when I got home I added the same with Joes online - was nearly 17/1 (50% difference). I even emailed them just to basically be told "it's 2 different businesses and that's how it is".

Luckily we have Racing Post journos who are reporting all of these underhand tactics to the unsuspecting 'victims'.


Back to the machines - I would be amazed if you can get the same prices as online, and if you can it will probably be £20 max or a message to go to the counter. There certainly won't be anything in the punters favour when it comes to getting a bet on the nags.

i dont even think the prices on the machine are as good as the ones at the counter,last twice iv been in JC I used the machine to get prices to save time at the counter,went back for winnings & both times amount paid was reduced,thieving ********.

The machines in paddies will only take bets on the horses at sp so i will be amazed if they let u take a price!!! And as has been pointed out, the prices generally are way worse than on line and sometimes even worse that on the coupons, not that the mugs in betting shops care about price.

these machines that they use are run by a company lads etc pay rental. hills roll out their own ssbt's from April. all their internet prices will be available on sports betting in shop.

Hi dealer. I find it hard to believe that the shops which i am sp only in will allow me to bet on a machine at the same price as online or in the shop. Not that it matters as i cant be bothered with it anymore. Had 5 good years and will probably pack it in After cheltenham.

really not sure how they will work EP's on horse racing, have saw them though and they did cover all sports at internet prices

Exactly, if betting 5 minutes before the off or at sp then they will probably let u have a fair whack on but putting a bet on at 9.30 in the morning simply wont be allowed if i wanted £50 each way at 6/1 say.

would guess that to be true

Ladbrokes in Ireland have plenty of these in each shop (sports betting only) and they seem very popular, especially among the foreigners betting on obscure soccer leagues. There's a €300 max bet, but nothing stopping you from shoveling in cash and doing as many €300 bets as you like, I suppose.

Certain prices are much shorter, especially first goalscorers and correct score betting on football matches, but anytime goalscorer prices are often much better than you'll get in the shop.

One big problem is the machines tend to malfunction a lot, and are forever breaking down. Personally, I like using them for soccer and sports bets as it saves dealing with increasingly inept staff.

Thats like the machine in ladbrokes already over here, they have a £300 max but the footy isnt the query, anyone who bets in a shop obviously isnt price savvy, what u want to know is can i put £50 each way on a 6/1 horse at 10 o clock in the morning and i guarantee the answer will be NO!!!
If however i want tol put £100 on at sp or at 6/1 five minutes before the off when it is trading at 8/1 on here then i would imagine i can!!!!

I understand that the rollout for Billies hasn't been as successful as they hoped and the SSBT's haven't taken anywhere near the volume.  I could have told them that myself and did so when quizzed by the shops they trialled them in.  Why would a decent size punter who is PTL all not put anything in them, easy answer, why would I take 6/4 when I can get 2/1 somewhere else.

I have heard tales of some trading / arbing going on with them in certain shops, guys sat there with a laptop connecting to free wifi from a shop next door and arbing everything.  They however were warned and now I'm lead to believe they have been barred from every single Billies shop ! 

With tales like that, it's no wonder nobody dare use them !!

The shop where I've worked the biggest bet's are a ''tenner''... not sure if they're geared up to take big stakes ! And, as above most people prefer the human touch...  work for a small firm and, the staff are very well trained !

Bookmakers bet on so many markets now, the staff do need to be ''clued up''...


there are lot's of L B O's on the High Street... un-trained staff = diminished T/O !!!!