"Special tiara was going to get passed me"

He said "I thought Special Tiara was going to get past me" as in "I thought it was going to happen but it didn't because my horse toughed it out" not "I thought it was going to happen so I deliberately barged him out of the way in mid-air to make sure it didn't".

Half way up the run in so did I but Sire was going away again.

was a certainty beat if ever you seen one, nice move from Jamie Moore to try and steal it, caught Fehily sleeping but Fehily had kept a bit and if he wasnt hampered on the bend and at the last he would have won comfortably

Nonsense! Winner waiting in front and going away at the line.

The winner blundered at the last badly interfering with the second.

If the second had been allowed to jump the fence straight without interference, I'm convinced she would have landed running and been in front and away before the winner had recovered.

She rallied anyway and was catching the winner towards the finish.

If there were any justice, the winner would have been thrown out.

I'd got the third in the scoop six.
That was my only interest in the race.

The second closed on the winner until 100 yeards out when Sire started to go away again. Won a length so since when did a length winner get thrown out in English racing?

sage you are pocket talking, grow up

Not particularly. Tell me when a winner by a length or more was disqualified.

when the jock weighed in light, when banned substances were found

Well you've got that wrong, it was 3/4 of a length.

was only 3/4L

Special Tiara was about half a length down at the last, would have probably jumped to the front at that point if he didnt hit a brick wall mid air

there is no known universe in which Special Tiara did not lose less than 3/4L due to interference

he was cost the race 100% but because the winning margin and the fact the interference was mid air he was never going to get the race on our rules

Absolutely oneyallbeenwaiting4, and with the winner blundering the second would have been up and away before the winner had recovered from the blunder.

Special Tiara was two lengths down two out had closed to within a length going to the last.  Was definitely not closing last 100 yards SDG was on top from halfway up the run in.  A more accurate description of what happened:

SDG - 1L up when jumped left last, bumped rival, lost momentum, driven and held on gamely flat
ST - 1L down when hampered last, kept on well but always held last 75yds

If both had jumped the last without the bump SDG would still have been 1L up and ST did not make ground after the last.

If both had jumped the last without the bump SDG would still have been 1L up and ST did not make ground after the last.

spec savers mate..

I never thought I would be agreeing with the above 2 posters but as much as it was great to see Sire De Grugy win it was really harsh on the 2nd who was almost certainly an unlucky loser.

I was referring to Dr Crippen and oneyallbeenwaiting4

I can sympathise with backers of Special Tiara as he looked unlucky but Sire did jump the fence cleanly, if crooked, and he was as much unbalanced by the collision as the second. Which horse would anyone now fancy for the QM? Un De Sceaux probably desreves to stay fav. until he runs but I would still make Dodging Bullets my selection assuming he recovers from a setback in time to have a prep run.

It was the winner that blundered not the second.

Why should the second have to recover from the winners blunder?

That's the key to it.

I think the correct decision would have been to have thrown the winner out but it was long odds on that the Stewards were never going to be brave enough to make that decision.

Backed the second and thought the incident at the last took the attention off what was for me a poor ride from Fehily. He just allowed the winner to pass him without trying to hold his ground and then challenges on the outside when he knows Sire jumps out that way.

Sire De Grugy didn't blunder the last he jumped clean and to the left as he did at several fences.  The bump inconvenienced the winner as much as the second no matter how unfair that is on the second.  The second was clearly held in the last 75 yards.  I can't think of an example of a 3/4L winner losing a race in a steward enquiry because of interference in the air jumping the last fence.

Spec savers LOL, some of you clearly can't even race read, maybe you got confused by the confused by the camera angle.

I think Special Tiara would have been a shade of odds on to win without any interference.

He obviously did make ground on the run in but was being held in the last few yards. That was hardly surprising as few horses will manage to rally twice in a race.

Yes, tactically inept of Fehily to challenge on the outside.

Exactly right Storm Alert.

The bump inconvenienced the winner as much as the second

The 2nd had the stuffing knocked out of it....

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The winners jockey nearly fell off and the horse was unbalanced when he yanked the reigns up to avoid going out the side door...

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You still dont get it.... the 2nd was broadsided, it stands to reason that the collision would have taken more out of the 2nd than the winner..

They never will get it koikeeper, because they have no concept of what is fair and reasonable.

It's like what they call the professional foul in football.

These kinds of people think it's okay as long as their side benefits from it.

Professional foul, ffs!

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The horse does not have the intelligence nor inclination to commit a professional foul.

And anyone who thinks the interference was intentional due to the rider's actions has never ridden anything mote animated than an armchair.

st was mullered over the last

There seems to still be a misunderstanding of what actually happened.

1.If you are asking whether a horse that bumped an opponent should keep the race then I would say no but under the Rules of Racing, the right verdict was given.
2. If Special Tiara had been on the other side of SDG or farther behind, SDG would have still jumped left but would have landed claeanly and would not have been unbalanced or nearly unseat the rider. That was all caused by the collision with ST. ST also jumped cleanly and was unbalanced by the collision. It was not his fault so under natural justice he should have been awarded the race and in any other country he would have been. But our rules say different. They ask whether you can be sure that the interference was enough to change the result.

Spot on sageform.

We have probably all done this to death now, but the St Ledger disciplinary notice is worth a read to understand how the stewards have to interpret the rules:

http://www.britishhorseracing.com/disciplinary_notices/disciplinary-panels-written-reasons-regarding-a-successful-appeal-against-the-reversal-of-placings-in-the-ladbrokes-st-leger/

In the UK interference when jumping a fence (in the air) is always considered accidental and is never given as a reason for reversing placings/disqualification, is that different in Ireland?  Can somebody give me an example of a horse demoted/disqualified when the reason given was accidental interference when jumping a hurdle or fence?

I see loper and his supporter can't distinguish between an analogy and the real thing.

The horse does not have the intelligence nor inclination to commit a professional foul.

There's the evidence.

He hasn't left kindergarten yet as far as his comprehension s concerned.

Yes Storm Alert the stewards apply the rules as they understand them, and who's to say they interpret them wrongly anyway?

It's the rules that are wrong and need changing, as clearly illustrated yesterday.

When a horse in in the process of getting beat, he should not gain any advantage by interfering with the progress of the one that is challenging him.

I've clearly done my brains on this I can't even spell St Leger correctly

Incidentally based on what I have seen so far this season I have backed Sprinter Sacre for the Queen Mum (clearly going to be laid out for the race and still 5/1 with one bookmaker). I will back Un De Sceaux on the day if he makes it and still looks as imperious as he did as a novice.  Much as I like SDG and DB their best performances only match SS performance last time and he won so easily.

Too often in these scenarios you have some people arguing what morally should be the case and others arguing based on previously poor moral outcome decisions and so that's where the problem lies.

One thing I never get the logic of though is when horse A bumps or hampers horse B, is someone saying "Yeah but horse A was hampered just as bad, if not worse than horse B" as if that makes it OK then and all is forgiven.  If horse A even does come off worse in it all, that's too bad as it was the one causing the problem to begin with.

Isn't that a bit like footballer A fouling footballer B but A comes off worse so we should all feel sorry for him and he shouldn't get a card for the foul?