The BHA - A TRULY PATHETIC ORGANISATION.

"Excited at the news of another AW track at Newcastle"

Oh, and the ridiculous cramming of nearly every race on to Saturdays. The Sport is dying a slow, painful death and they seem powerless or disinclined to even try and stop it.

Above should say nearly every high quality race.

Banning the exchanges would help.

Barton Bank, the problem is that the money isn't in maintaining the integrity of this sport any more.

Under the gross profits deal, the money is now in making life as difficult as possible for those betting on it...

There's some truth in that. However there might be more gross profits if they sorted out the fixture list and dealt with some of the integrity issues. People know what is going on and are turned off from the game as a result.

1830 that would be a way forward no question about it.


when we had the jockey club many wanted to get rid of them its a case of be careful what you wish for.

The horses raced 4 wide and no questions asked.
The blatant drugs issue.
The misuse of pacemakers.
The inconsistency over stewards enquiries, some thrown out some keep it for very similar offences.

Barton Bank, the more I see this sport being devolved to suit the commercial agendas of the bookmakers, the more I think that the over matched executives who run British racing now believe they shouldn't really care much about anything other than increasing betting profitability - especially now the bookmaking industry have managed to get their own man heading up the BHA...

when we had the jockey club many wanted to get rid of them its a case of be careful what you wish for.


The Jockey Club may have been amateurish, but they at least understood the importance of the history and heritage of this sport.

The BHA, with a former bookmaking industry executive and the woeful Rod Street at the helm, are dismantling it on a daily basis, imo...

millhouse

I wasn't  knocking the jockey club .

You can add in inaccurate going reports as well.

I realised that Foxy, apologies if it comes across otherwise...

nrs in handicaps is a bug bearer of mine 8 to 7 runners 16 to 15 runners happens to often in my point of view

You forgot........

the blatant misuse of price changes to create/increase rule 4's.

The above two things are financially beneficial for British Racing...

seriously disillusioned with Racing for at least 4 years and many times I've said the BHA is merely a High St puppet that isn't fit for purpose. Appointing Rust merely confirmed it and that they don't care how blatant it looks. Misleading going reports, far too many meetings ergo pisspoor prize money that encourages stopping and laying as opposed to trying to win. Three day decs and the proliferation of A/W meeting as a staple diet for the punter. Two meetings per day Mon-Fri and four on Sat-Sun, summer season excepted when one evening meeting will suffice with two on a Saturday. Less meetings, more competitive races and larger fields for more prize money. Racing is run like the Greyhounds Bags service from yesteryear and will end up the same way.

I can't stand all this bollocky racing with 5/6/7 runner races - despite virtually all midweek racing being piss-poor in quality, at least when there are sizeable fields it can be competitive, so you can sometimes sniff out a bit of value!

This shíte like today is ugly & unappealing stuff

Racing is run like the Greyhounds Bags service from yesteryear and will end up the same way


Unless someone does something to halt the ongoing annexation of this sport and its media by the bookmakers, if you want a vision of horse racing's future, check out the greyhound racing industry now, imo...

PH - there are many people on here who've been real enthusiasts for years saying the same as you, in becoming disillusioned (over the last few years) with racing nowadays...myself included

exactly, the festivals apart its nearly there millhouse.

the bha have a cash co now from qatar.more money than sense bha pander th their every need and while they have them wellwe are just the mugs

Can anyone think of anyone worse to lead our sport than Nick Rust? He's excited at the AW going in at Newcastle

I don't follow the sport anywhere near like what I used to...it WAS a religion to me!

ATR really pissed me off a few years ago in totally changing their scheduling with those inane 'updates' (which were repeated on the hour, every hour) instead of the regular featured programmes which I could keep track of and set my timer for.

It's reached the stage for me whereby I'm only really interested in the quality stuff at the weekends nowadays (with a few exceptions) and I can easily just walk away from the humdrum plums on offer every day...even though every now & again I get hoovered into it (mainly through boredom) on shítty days like today

Adamski, he's excited about the additional betting revenue he thinks all the extra meetings will generate - he doesn't give a flying one about the heritage of this sport...

well horse racing betting turnover is down in shops and on course as punters are marginalised and disrespected by the BHA racing programme. Once the current over 40s babyboomers give up then thats it, the younger generation don't want horse racing at Towcester, Carlisle,Hereford,Hexham etc on a cold winters day. The High St doesn't want your money unless your a machine regular and honestly the enjoyment has gone from the game for me. It happened with the dogs around 2000 and the horses don't excite very often nowadays.

no worries millhouse


adamski

it takes a different type of person to get excited about aw racing at Newcastle or indeed anywhere.

ph, what got you interested - probably backing a winner.

How do the next generation get that first excitement when virtually every single race covered on terrestrial TV is now an impossible 15 runner handicap where they're 8-1 at best to find the winner...?

all you here crowds up take the bands away in the summer and things would be a whole lot different

ph: Even if the younger generation did want racing at Hereford, the opportunity's gone now.

Is the BHA really to blame for the fixture overload though? I thought legal challenges from the racecourses meant the BHA had lost control in that area.

my Dad, two Grandads and having 2 bob on the ITV 7 in mid 70s from the age of 8 or 9 developing to 10 x 5p trebles out of my paper round money from 12 onwards. The old man loved The Pig, the others were Joe Mercer and Dr Vincent fans. Trips to Warwick ,Stratford, Leicester and dogs at Brandon, Perry Barr,Hall Green and Hinckley were fairly regular as a kid.

for the moderate stuff we need a 'random jockey selection' , all those wanting rides are drawn out of a hat the day before

why do the bha havew a 'contact us' email address?  last 2 ive sent didnt even get a responce...pathetic service imo.

Jockeys failing to ride out for the best possible placing.
Far too many none runners, day after day. Especially where there is a draw bias.
Handicap banding not wide enough.
Horses given handicap ratings that have no right to be on a racecourse.
Class 7 races.

The courses could help as well by offering better facilities for owners (some notable exceptions) and not ripping off their customers with outrageous food and drink prices.

ok its ireland but nr 16 down to 15 runners what a surprise

'failing to ride out/insufficient effort' slap an instant 7lbs on as if it was the winner. it'll stop em overnight

I have been punting on racing for over 20 years and owned horses for over a decade. The state of the game has never been more parlous. I honestly believe that it is heading the way of Greyhound Racing and doing so rapidly.
Fewer and fewer people want to bet on it and the fixture list being flooded with more and more low grade bilge is not going to entice peole to do so. It seems as it the Bookmakers/BHA actually believe that more racing means more turnover. It really doesn't. People only have a limited amount of cash to bet with and having more races does not increase that. Then there is the matter of people who are turned off by the sheer amount of wall to wall racing and decide to switch to other sports. Stupidity, dogma and ineptitiude plague the sport at every turn. It is doomed.

horses pulling out of 16 and 8 horse fields at the last minute a shocking ommishun imho

Yep, has been going on for years and it is generally a rag. Doesn't really affect me as I couldn't get an each way bet of any value on but you're right.

Drifting odds on shot 8.10 Newbury

SURPRISE SURPRISE

The ride on the one from that yard that went from about 1.6 to odds against was an absolute peach. Could not have asked it to go any harder.

Last night at Bath, that one.

Light Breaks, that too drifted alarmingly from 1.57'ish before the race and low and behold ran the race it did

How come these things are not being addressed

THE GAME IS BECOMING A JOKE

The Racecourses are doing very nicely out of this and that is a big part of the problem. They are paid for every race they put on and keep the bulk of it instead of putting it into prize money. They all want to race on Saturday and on other days that suit themselves and not the Industry. Result is too many meetings with very low prize money. ARC have become masters in the art milking the system.

I read somewhwere about Qatar putting more money to racing, well it only benefits the table they sit at and does little for racing in general.

Digging up turf tracks so there can be twilight racing under floodlights was warmly approved by Nick Rust as it will provide more betting opportunities for his ex employees. That is the nub of the matter.

Horse racing  is run for Racecourses and Bookmakers alone. Anyone who thinks any different is living under a rhubarb plant.

I concur with your views on ARC.Horrid organisation that is running their courses into the ground.

Nick Rust/ARC.....The shape of things to come. Seems obvious that Bittar took a very
short time to realise the absurdity of the whole set-up. Has taken only days at the
helm for Rust to nail his bookmaker colours to the mast.

I think his appointment was just about the final nail in the coffin for the sport.

If you sell the Tote to a bookmaker, then appoint a bookmaker to head the BHA
your objective should be obvious to all.

A day will come in the not too distant future when the bookmakers decide they are no longer turning over sufficient profits on the wall to wall diet of dross racing that they have essentially created and that it is not worth paying so much money for. Amd then the sh1t really will hit the fan. The Sport does not have another generation of punters brought up on betting on the horses to tap into and when the high street bookies pull the plug we are going to see one hell of a mess.

Barton Bank 02 Jul 15 17:07
The Sport is dying a slow, painful death and they seem powerless or disinclined to even try and stop it.

I fully agree and with most of the other supportive comments on this thread. It's a generation thing with we oldies, but life goes on. The young 'uns haven't the same interest as we had at their age and are more aware of the "irregularities" and would rather bet on the many markets offered in Premiership Football where they know the teams are trying.It's my main focus now. From once being a 24/7 horse racing and greyhound owner and better, I now have very little interest in either. They were a "working mans" hobby, study form and placing bets during their twice daily tea breaks and lunchtimes. Those days have gone. I read this forum as if it were a newspaper.

I also think that Exchange turnover gives a false impression of interest because most of it is bot v bot.

A very valid point regarding the exchange turnover. If 250k for example is traded on a race, how much of that is actual proper bets and how much is robot wars? I honestly don't know the answer to that question. But the speed the prices collapse and multiply tell me that the markets are as weak and as volatile as they have ever been.

Another thing I would agree with is that it is more enticing for young people to bet on Football etc. If I was starting out as a punter now and I got restricted as soon as I managed to win any money, I would be tempted to can it. The sheer volume of racing would probably have put me off trying to keep on top of it as well.

It's been going downhill for the last few years and nobody seems to care. The BHA are only interested in their own ridiculous salaries and pensions, and it is a closed shop so anyone with a view about change will be kicked into touch. NOTHING will change with the current bunch in charge, they are not here for the sport. May as well have FIFA and Blatter in charge imo.


Roida - regarding the 'contact us' page. I know someone who had dealings with the BHA and contacted them and had no reply. Rang them 10 days later and was told to resend the email (to her directly) and would get a reply within 48 hours as she would pass on directly to the relevant department herself. Long story short, he got some actual internal emails from the BHA and after the second email was sent the internal email said "****** has contacted us again regarding this matter, shall we bother to reply this time". The bottom line is they do not want to interact or listen to actual punters - we are beneath them in their eyes. The trouble is when it really goes t1ts up, the ones who made the mess are drawing their huge pensions no doubt. Vile organisation who are definitely not fit for purpose.

barton - it's easier to bet on football, despite the multiple options (Asian, HT/FT, etc etc) on basic terms there are only three possible outcomes, win/lose/draw and with wall-to-wall coverage of the EPL then even the most educationally challenged know that mr overpaid foreigner just signed for loadsamoney city whereas trying to keep up with racing form haha don't make me laugh!  whats also blatantly obvious is that the odds on football betting are much worse than they were 20-30 yrs ago, particularly for draws so the bookies are making money hand over fist (despite the freak run of winning favs at start of last season) and no levy to pay! happy days

for all the moaning on here about winning accounts being closed, i've got several online accounts in profit (and a few which aren't!) since opening and still able to place relatively modest wagers although if i were staking amounts akin to 'professionals' then it may be a different story of course

magic_days - many people DO care but there is not (and can't see there will be) a single voice speaking up for these issues, you only have to look at the differing opinions (and the levels of disrespect amongst posters) on the dancing meadows thread to see that

something else the bha should look into if they want to attract more betting turnover.


royal ascot week sid james were advertising a free bet up to £25 if your horse came second a punter has £25 win on all 30 races not much in it by the end of the week but did manage a couple of 2nds including one on Saturday,monday morning account closed and you cant have the free bet as promised in there racing post advert and of course there lies another problem the racing post is so weak and terrified of upsetting anybody you cant even appeal to them for carrying the advert.

As Millhouse has pointed out a million times the Racing Post serves the bookmaking industry and not punters, which is such a shame because they are the ones who could be speaking out on all these issues. Imagine a paper that didn't mind upsetting jockeys and trainers! We need another Sportsman to come along but obviously as the game is dying out no one's going to waste their money on a new racing paper.

the fear

I bought the sportsman every day it was a great paper never given a chance by those who moan about the racing post but because they didn't like the form lay out in the sportsman rather than trying to get use to it they just gave up.

i know it cannot be easybut where is the betfair police in all this.they must see as we can the big market drifters that seem to fall out or the other things that go on.

Jul 3, 2015 -- 1:39PM, nellie1970 wrote:

i know it cannot be easybut where is the betfair police in all this.they must see as we can the big market drifters that seem to fall out or the other things that go on.

As long as they all get their cut they will maintain the status quo; it is as it has always been, and will remain so.

Gordon63 - sorry I meant nobody cares at the BHA, plenty of punters obviously do - but that number will be getting less and less.

You're right foxy people don't like change. I think the Post deteriorated a lot in the meantime.

I remember when the chron went the life was difficult to get in the north on the bigger race days,then the post came along and the life got its finger out the sadly the life went now we has as pretty pointless trade paper who have yet to ask anybody a tricky question.

the post is owned by godolphin (in a different form) and heavily sponsored by bookies and tipping lines, cloud cuckoo land to expect/hope that they rock the gravy train.

ref below extract from recent articles quoting BHA bod Nick Rust - has anyone put their name forward and if so, what has been the response?


On Monday, Rust will issue a general call for punters to put themselves forward for the eight places on the forum. No strict timetable is in place but the hope is that it might hold its first meeting around the end of August.

“I’ll be interested to see how many people come forward. I would hope a lot of people will.” This is a key point and anyone with the interests of punters at heart would hope for a large response, now that Rust has opened the door. If the forum fails for lack of support, gamblers can expect to be back out in the cold for a long time.

One of the targets Rust recently set himself was a 5% increase in betting on racing, which would reverse a long-term decline, and he is therefore keen to know what punters want, what would make them more likely to bet on racing more often. There has not been a body to speak for punters since the cash-strapped National Association for the Protection of Punters folded in 1999, so Rust is inventing one.

Foxy, I'm sorry, the Sportsman was dire - there just wasn't enough info in it, but not as bad as the cheap rag that comes out every weekend.

Must say I have found a couple of todays threads very enjoyable reading, you lot owe yourselves a collective pat on the back for your insightful and accurate assessments of the problems regarding the integrity (or complete lack of it) within horse racing. Its encouraging to read a thread whereby the majority accept there are huge integrity issues affecting race results, which need to be addressed and ultimately kicked out of the sport if it is too recover its place as a genuine punting medium, rather than the complete and utter farce it has become for most punters.

The BHA chairman, himself a career bookmaker, wants to hear from punters what they want...you couldn't make it up

The Mover, its Laughable mate....the new chairman of the greyhound racing board is Tom Kelly, the previous B.A.G.S chairman. You couldn't make it up and expect it to be believed, real life is stranger than fiction where the bookmakers are concerned.

I was giving serious consideration to applying for Nick Rusts call for a punters forum, but in realising his history within the sport there is about as much chance of him addressing the sports ills, as there is of me getting stuck up Kylie Minougue.

It will be chaired by Simon Rowlands, probably not a bad shout, but can't ignore the Timeform link and somehow think it's not quite going to be as independent as one would like! If the BHA want a Bettors Forum maybe the first suggest would be let it be run by Bettors

some Bettors could for example recommend Timeform get less TV coverage because they are putting away potential future bettors...not sure that would get passed with Rowlands chairing the meeting

the more punters lose the more money the BHA get...I'd change that to start with!

Simon Rowlands has the best interests of racing at heart I am sure. The key issue is how much notice the BHA will take of the findings of the forum.

We can now add racecourses being unable to get a working set of stalls in place for Flat racing to the list. Another rank fiasco.

Rust doesn't want to help punters, he wants to understand how he can make more money out of them.

Horse racing UK makes more cash from the gross profits deal the more punters lose, and anyone who joins the BHA's farcical punters forum will be like a turkey giving advice on how to best re-merchandise the Paxo, imo...

Simon Rowlands has the best interests of racing at heart I am sure

Barton Bank, what do you think will happen once the details of the membership of this 'punters forum' is released?

My bet is that on day one the bookmaking industry will do everything possible to try to get into the people involved.

Just like the racing media, many of whom I am sure had the 'interests of racing at heart' when they first started out, the members of this 'forum' will inevitably be offered hospitality, lunches, junkets and 'advantages' until eventually, like virtually every member of the racecourse press room, the bookmaking industry have them exactly where they want them. 

I've no doubt Rowlands is already on the invite list for the Goodwood hospitality boxes as we speak...

I don't really like commenting on people that I know on public forums tbh but I would be confident they would find him a difficult person to "get at" and that he will do a thorough job of the punters forum. Whether the BHA bigwigs will listen to the findings however I would be less convinced.

Does anyone know the figure that was spent on Racing For Change? What else did we get besides the well thought out BIGGER NUMBERS???

Millhouse, I nominate you as chairman

35 races in England today, 44 none runners so far. It needs sorting out BHA.

What also wants sorting out is we had another BENT RACE earlier at Lingfield.

which race barton bank??

Lingfield seller. Two horse race on paper. Winner 4s on and the second fav given a very unusual ride.

as a matter of interest did the bha ever ask the coc at Cheltenham why he gave the official going for the supreme novice hurdle as good to soft ?

No idea. Would hazard a strong guess at no.

times say almost good to firm but obviously of no real interest to the coc or the bha plenty of clever money around about 10 days before for opening going been good.

Accurate going reports are not a priority.

A partial answer to the question of the cost of Racing for Change can be found in a report in the Post on April 15th,2010. In amongst details of a fall in the Levy and corresponding cuts in prize money is a sentence that reads:

'Funding for Racing For Change in 2010 will be cut by £100,000 to £350,000.'

From which I conclude the Levy Board spent £800,000 over a two year period on sending racing the wrong way up a one way Rod Street.

The Anorak, if you contemplate what could have been achieved with that spend it's a total scandal the way the money has been wasted.

We've had the ham-fisted 'Sovereign Series', the completely misguided 'Order of Merit', the shameless destruction of the heritage of the sport by moving around its greatest races without any real direction (we had the three biggest two year old races of the season one after the other on a Friday afternoon not so long ago), the total mismanagement of the television rights which led to the departure of the BBC and lost the sport millions of viewers, and worst of all the squandering of a heaven sent opportunity in Frankel, which was woefully under promoted at every turn.

Ultimately, imho, it's very simple - it's not about the manipulation of the product, IT'S ABOUT THE HORSES, but if you randomly pluck a bunch of racing celebs, all of whom would have had no ability or experience in promoting anything, and ask them to set the agenda for Racing For Change, as Street and the BHA did, all you are going to end up with is directionless mess, unfortunately for racing...

Using the newest high profile trainer as a scapegoat for the obvious performance enhancer problem the sport has was very clever, lets not forget he did say in his defense that he thought it was the norm in this country.

Quickly brushed under the carpet and a year or so later the dramatic improvers trend on flat/jumps begins its upward curve again.

Vile from top to bottom but good entertainment.

Presumably those behind the "Racing for Change" programme have met with the sack?

Don't be ridiculous BB, Racing For Change simply shed it's old skin and re-emerged as Great British Racing, identified on the BHA website as the marketing and promotions arm of the sport.

And to complete this tortured metaphor, the same snake in the grass that ran the original, is now Chief Executive of the new body, which still survives on a steady diet of subsidy soaked in gravy.

I stand corrected!
Best post on the thread that one, TheAnorak.