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1970 Ayr Gold Cup
Winner - John Splendid.
Now there is a 2-yr-old running under that name.
Winner - John Splendid.
Now there is a 2-yr-old running under that name.
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45 years is a long time though Onlooker, even i can't remember that one!
I have no problem with it at all. The Ayr Gold Cup is hardly the Derby is it?
Calling that 'disgraceful' doesn't leave you much rope when something actually does happen that's not cricket, onlooker. Or is this a thinly veiled "I remember the old John Splendid" thread? 
Yes - The Headmaster - "Disgraceful,2 is an over-reaction.
I actually thought that, as soon as I saw the thread in the listings.
Disappointing - would have been a far more appropriate opening.
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As far as it, "hardly," being, "the Derby." - Johnny_Mustang -
I DO feel that certain major Handicap Winners names should/could be protected ... Many people remember them, and affiliate themselves with them, more than many Derby winners - such as the likes of the forgettable Khayasi.
The protection of Classic winners names being at the behest of the indulgent Breeding industry.
I actually thought that, as soon as I saw the thread in the listings.
Disappointing - would have been a far more appropriate opening.
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As far as it, "hardly," being, "the Derby." - Johnny_Mustang -
I DO feel that certain major Handicap Winners names should/could be protected ... Many people remember them, and affiliate themselves with them, more than many Derby winners - such as the likes of the forgettable Khayasi.
The protection of Classic winners names being at the behest of the indulgent Breeding industry.
I'm all for preserving the great names Onlooker but an Ayr Gold Cup winner doesn't even come close.
I agree with the OP, as far as handicaps go in this part of the world, it doesnt get much more prestigious than the Ayr Gold Cup, some great names have won it over the years and while I have never heard of John Splendid, the name should have been rejected.
Not only is it disrespectful, it also displays a disgraceful lack of imagination, bordering on Ballydoyle level.
Not only is it disrespectful, it also displays a disgraceful lack of imagination, bordering on Ballydoyle level.
none of us are going to be ar$ed on our deathbeds...move on
I was even annoyed when an old favourite of mine "I Say" was resurrected a few years ago. Although he only managed to finish 3rd in Sea Bird's derby in 1965.
This argument is surely a question of degree?? You wouldn't want an Arkle running at Southwell, but you might be happy with a Frankincense running at Fontwell
The below suggests that only Classic winners are excluded, but I think that (at least some) Group winners are excluded and also understandably registered Stallions are excluded. Perhaps someone could articulate the current rules.
My view is that all listed winners should be excluded AND all Heritage Handicap winners. But I could be persuaded depending on the current rules. I assume that at least one of those posting so authoritatively on here knows what they are
The below suggests that only Classic winners are excluded, but I think that (at least some) Group winners are excluded and also understandably registered Stallions are excluded. Perhaps someone could articulate the current rules.
My view is that all listed winners should be excluded AND all Heritage Handicap winners. But I could be persuaded depending on the current rules. I assume that at least one of those posting so authoritatively on here knows what they are
It's even worse when the copied name turns out to be a big race winner too. The two times Cambridgeshire hero Baronet followed by the Scottish Grand National winner of the same name being a prime example.
Well whatever - the world HAS 'moved on' - UNFORTUNATELY, though ...
- To a myriad of horses all named ... MUK, this - and MUK, that ...
which makes most of them meaningless - because they are ALL rendered 'so much of a muchness' - or, perhaps that should read, 'So much of a MUKness'.
I know which era I prefer - and you can keep your 'brave new world' - duncan.
- To a myriad of horses all named ... MUK, this - and MUK, that ...
which makes most of them meaningless - because they are ALL rendered 'so much of a muchness' - or, perhaps that should read, 'So much of a MUKness'.
I know which era I prefer - and you can keep your 'brave new world' - duncan.
Duncan - Do you know the current rules? And whatever, where would you draw the line?, unless you think there shouldn't be one.
Schedule 1 - Registration of horse names
1.1 The following names are not available for registration for a horse
1.1.1 subject to Paragraph 3, a name already registered in the register of horse names under Part 2;
1.1.2 subject to Paragraph 4, a name followed by one or more numbers;
1.1.3 a name on the International and Domestic Lists of Protected Names;
1.1.4 a name of more than 18 characters, including signs or spaces;
1.1.5 a name made up entirely of initials, or include figures, hyphens, full-stops, commas, signs, exclamation marks, inverted commas, forward or backward slash, colon and semi-colon;
1.1.6 a name that starts with a sign other than a letter;
1.1.7 a name containing more than seven syllables;
1.1.8 a name the pronunciation of which the Authority considers to be identical or unacceptably similar, to
1.1.8.1 a name that is on the International or Domestic Lists of Protected Names, or
1.1.8.2 a name that is already registered for a horse foaled in a year that is within 10 years of the year of foaling of the horse to which the application relates;
1.1.9 a name which the Authority considers
1.1.9.1 is suggestive or has a vulgar, obscene or insulting meaning,
1.1.9.2 is in poor taste,
1.1.9.3 may be offensive to religious, political or ethnic groups,
1.1.9.4 may otherwise cause offence,
1.1.9.5 may cause confusion in the administration of racing or betting, or
1.1.9.6 is the name of a well-known horse.
1.1.10 a name already registered to a sibling or parent of the horse in question;
1.2 For the purposes of Paragraph 1.1, the use of the definite or indefinite article does not constitute a different name.
2.1 The following names are available for registration for a horse if the conditions specified are met
2.1.1 the name of a public Person may be registered if the Person or his family have given permission;
2.1.2 a name which the Authority considers to be of commercial significance may be registered if appropriate permission has been obtained;
2.1.3 a name which the Authority considers to be that of a prominent company, product or trade name may be registered if
2.1.3.1 the written approval of the company or body associated with the name has been obtained, or
2.1.3.2 the Authority is satisfied that the name has an alternative meaning in common usage.
3.1 A name which has already been entered in the register of horse names shall become available for registration for a different horse at the end of the month of the relevant year during which it became available, as determined in accordance with Paragraphs 3.2 to 3.4.
3.2 Where the name was registered to a brood mare, the relevant year is whichever of the following first occurs
3.2.1 10 years after the mare's death,
3.2.2 10 years after the last recorded year in which the mare was covered or produced a foal, or
3.2.3 when the mare attains 30 years of age.
3.3 Where the name was registered to a stallion, the relevant year is whichever of the following first occurs
3.3.1 15 years after the stallion's death,
3.3.2 15 years after the last recorded year in which the stallion covered one or more mares, or
3.3.3 the year when the stallion attains 35 years of age.
3.4 Where the name was registered to any other horse, the relevant year is whichever of the following first occurs
3.4.1 5 years after the horse's death, or
3.4.2 the year when the horse attains 20 years of age.
3.5 An exception may be made where the name of a horse which has been reported dead and has not raced is sought for re-use by the same applicant.
4. Where a name is not available for a horse, a numeral may only be added to the name if
4.1 the horse was foaled in Great Britain, Ireland or the Channel Islands, and
4.2 it is not in the Stud Book maintained by the Stud Book Authority of Great Britain and Ireland.
5. If the same name is simultaneously claimed for two horses, the order of priority shall be determined by lot at The Racing Calendar Office.
1.1 The following names are not available for registration for a horse
1.1.1 subject to Paragraph 3, a name already registered in the register of horse names under Part 2;
1.1.2 subject to Paragraph 4, a name followed by one or more numbers;
1.1.3 a name on the International and Domestic Lists of Protected Names;
1.1.4 a name of more than 18 characters, including signs or spaces;
1.1.5 a name made up entirely of initials, or include figures, hyphens, full-stops, commas, signs, exclamation marks, inverted commas, forward or backward slash, colon and semi-colon;
1.1.6 a name that starts with a sign other than a letter;
1.1.7 a name containing more than seven syllables;
1.1.8 a name the pronunciation of which the Authority considers to be identical or unacceptably similar, to
1.1.8.1 a name that is on the International or Domestic Lists of Protected Names, or
1.1.8.2 a name that is already registered for a horse foaled in a year that is within 10 years of the year of foaling of the horse to which the application relates;
1.1.9 a name which the Authority considers
1.1.9.1 is suggestive or has a vulgar, obscene or insulting meaning,
1.1.9.2 is in poor taste,
1.1.9.3 may be offensive to religious, political or ethnic groups,
1.1.9.4 may otherwise cause offence,
1.1.9.5 may cause confusion in the administration of racing or betting, or
1.1.9.6 is the name of a well-known horse.
1.1.10 a name already registered to a sibling or parent of the horse in question;
1.2 For the purposes of Paragraph 1.1, the use of the definite or indefinite article does not constitute a different name.
2.1 The following names are available for registration for a horse if the conditions specified are met
2.1.1 the name of a public Person may be registered if the Person or his family have given permission;
2.1.2 a name which the Authority considers to be of commercial significance may be registered if appropriate permission has been obtained;
2.1.3 a name which the Authority considers to be that of a prominent company, product or trade name may be registered if
2.1.3.1 the written approval of the company or body associated with the name has been obtained, or
2.1.3.2 the Authority is satisfied that the name has an alternative meaning in common usage.
3.1 A name which has already been entered in the register of horse names shall become available for registration for a different horse at the end of the month of the relevant year during which it became available, as determined in accordance with Paragraphs 3.2 to 3.4.
3.2 Where the name was registered to a brood mare, the relevant year is whichever of the following first occurs
3.2.1 10 years after the mare's death,
3.2.2 10 years after the last recorded year in which the mare was covered or produced a foal, or
3.2.3 when the mare attains 30 years of age.
3.3 Where the name was registered to a stallion, the relevant year is whichever of the following first occurs
3.3.1 15 years after the stallion's death,
3.3.2 15 years after the last recorded year in which the stallion covered one or more mares, or
3.3.3 the year when the stallion attains 35 years of age.
3.4 Where the name was registered to any other horse, the relevant year is whichever of the following first occurs
3.4.1 5 years after the horse's death, or
3.4.2 the year when the horse attains 20 years of age.
3.5 An exception may be made where the name of a horse which has been reported dead and has not raced is sought for re-use by the same applicant.
4. Where a name is not available for a horse, a numeral may only be added to the name if
4.1 the horse was foaled in Great Britain, Ireland or the Channel Islands, and
4.2 it is not in the Stud Book maintained by the Stud Book Authority of Great Britain and Ireland.
5. If the same name is simultaneously claimed for two horses, the order of priority shall be determined by lot at The Racing Calendar Office.
the protected names list, not checked if this is the full monty but there are supposedly about 3000
.
http://www.horseracingintfed.com/resources/NP_2015.pdf
.
http://www.horseracingintfed.com/resources/NP_2015.pdf
dont know the rules, blackbarn...seems to work ok whatever they are, as there has never been an instance that i thought was very wrong...certainly doesnt bother me if they use the name of a handicap winner from 45 yrs ago...some would see it as a compliment anyway that they revive the name
Don't think anyone would have been rushing to name a horse M-lolshan whatever the hell it means. Ryan Price horse in the orange and black sleeve colours of Essa Akhlif ( or similar name). Still, brings back fond memories.
Great info Elise, I'll have a good look at that later.
blackbarn 11 Jun 15 17:23 Joined: 02 Jan 05 | Topic/replies: 5,361 | Blogger: blackbarn's blog
This argument is surely a question of degree?? You wouldn't want an Arkle running at Southwell
Unbelievable coincidence - I checked & Arkle IS running at Southwell tomorrow & what's more unbelievable is that 14 of the Premier Comp have picked it as their nap
(this from someone wheo could never get out of the bottom div btw)
This argument is surely a question of degree?? You wouldn't want an Arkle running at Southwell
Unbelievable coincidence - I checked & Arkle IS running at Southwell tomorrow & what's more unbelievable is that 14 of the Premier Comp have picked it as their nap
(this from someone wheo could never get out of the bottom div btw
)
Like a complete tool I just checked the runners at Southwell tomorrow.
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