race planning in uk for flat is pathetic

Pathetic is too kind a word for it.  It is an absolute shambles.

Totally agree, the flat racing fixtures are based on a time and era when there were no All Weather fixtures or Dubai Carnivals and National Hunt had a summer break. A total shake up of the racing calendar is called for.

that would be quite a project imo and, at the end of it, you may find that you've swapped your fiddle for a gewgaw

Saturday's fare not very appealing either

It's the p1ss up and brewery syndrome,and it's even worse for National Hunt.

The start of the flat turf season has definitely become more low key during the past few years or so. I remember the time when we would have had twenty five to thirty flat meetings by this stage with several decent cards including guineas trials. Even Thirsk, Redcar and Stockton had a guineas trial. Furthermore, racecourses now seem reluctant to stage races for two year olds. They don't interest me from a punting aspect but the owners of those small early types that would rarely win after the end of May now have little opportunity to run their horses. How many two year old races have we has so far this year ? Any advance on five.

A radical rethink is required ...I don't think there should be any turf racing in March;the season to start at the beginning of April giving 4/5 weeks before the Guineas which is enough time for the trials. The only race that would probably be scrapped is the Lincoln ,but this is no loss whatsoever as the draw plays too big a big part. Scheduling must ensure that from the opening meeting there should be at least one turf meeting per day.

Posy, I agree about the one turf meeting per day from the outset but to say that the scrapping of the Lincoln would be no loss whatsoever is a bit naïve. To rid the sport of the first traditional big handicap of the season and also the long standing 'spring double' would go down like a lead balloon with all sections of both the racing and betting industries. If flat racing is to begin around April 1st then simply move the 'Lincoln' meeting to suit.

and national hunt end april as well

One of the problems is Easter changing dates every year, what you should have is the flat starting with Doncaster then Thursday it's Aintree the Sunday could then be 1 really good flat card then Newmarket Wed and Thurs

I think the main reason why the Lincoln has lost it's buzz is due to a combination of the Dubai Carnival, and a Winter of AW racing.The fixture used to be the first time we'd seen the Flat horses/trainers/jockeys since November and there was an air of anticipation surrounding it all. Now it barely causes a stir.

Another early season fixture not mentioned was the Ascot GNS trials. I think Gairloch won the 2,000 trial on the day Red Rum won his third GH.And Cloonlara refused to enter the stalls in the 1,000 trial on the same day.

onlooker...makes you wonder how and why this logical programme was dropped

just noticed today theyre running the doncaster mile, wasnt this on the opening day of the flat  previously

Thank you for your interesting response Anorak...in a nutshell what you are saying is that the reality is due to both the weather and market forces...in this instance I think the market has got it wrong and the race scheduling body should step in to ensure there is at least one turf meeting a day once the season has started. With regard to the weather aspect with approx 60 courses up and down the country it shouldn't be too difficult to if necessary 'allocate' racedays to ensure there's one meeting a day from the commencement of the season. As I said earlier starting the turf season at the beginning of April would help.
I remember Grey Mirage well as I knew the owner.

one of the top tracks in ireland stage 2 listed races and 2 group races tomorrow, including derby trial, what the hell do we get

cantthink, sorry i meant the whole flat season, just that it still really havent started over here, but group races are in full swing in ireland , and as i say they have a proper derby trial tomorrow, while were waiting for a gns trial which is run in less than 3 weeks

Posy,

Agree about the Guineas and Derby, as those dates would also fit with changing the St James Palace Stakes and Coronation Stakes into 10F Group 1 races for 3-y-olds that could form the the middle leg of a proper Triple Crown. I'd also shift the King George to the end of August as the first leg of a triple with the Arc and the Breeders Cup with appropriate bonuses to encourage horses to run in all three.

The irony of the current schedule is that it was designed to avoid the best horses running on rock hard ground in mid summer in the days when watered tracks and AW gallops were unknown. That's why the Guineas, Derby and Royal Ascot are all finished by mid June. The 'season' was designed to fit around the racing, not the other way round.

Clacton great you posted about Hurst Park as I remembered the name but nothing more about it.Having looked it up have discovered that it was at West Moseley and had it remained open it would have been the nearest course to where I live.It seems the Triumph hurdle was run there until it closed in 1962.Must have been a decent course with both that race and the Victoria cup.

I suspect it is obvious to them, but it's easier to spend their time and money introducing bigger numbercloths and changing round the draw positions.

It would of course be a major upheaval - all the tracks that run trials would want to move as well, but there's no doubt it could be done if they really wanted. The biggest isssue would be fitting in with the existing program in France and Ireland - in effect the Irish classic schedule is pretty much the one we're proposing, but you can be sure the trainers would protest if they lost the option to run in both.

One of the major anomalies of the current program is that 3-y-old milers get three goes at a Group 1 win (Nmkt, Curragh, Royal Ascot) without having to take on older horses. The mile and a half horses get two goes (Epsom and Curragh). But the poor old mile and a quarter specialists, of which there are a great many these days thanks to US breeding influence, don't have a single 3-y-old only Group 1 race in the UK or Ireland.

I first proposed these changes in a column in Odds On about 15 years ago, but I don't really expect to see any changes in my lifetime. There are just too many vested interests amongst the alphabet soup of racing's controlling powers.