Shame on you McCoy

Surprised no-one has considered the punters here. May not be many of them but its a disgrace for anyone who backed Sunnyhillboy ante post

cooper must have known he wasnt getting the ride, else he would have have got the call after the last race yesterday....

Agree joey if Davy was available Sunnyhillboy would still be in the race and thats a fact.

What's the official reason for Sunnyhillboy not running?

Dirty scope

They've done ante post punters a favour as Sunnhhillbiy backers will get money back as it was declared

Sunnyhill Boy had no chance. Of course Mccoy should switch. Crazy that anyone would think otherwise. A good gesture from Jonjo and JP to go along with it but for Sunnyhill it would have just been a warm up for the national.

Why is Lester not a good comparison?.

McCoy is the greatest national hunt jockey ever in terms of winners.

I am not actually his biggest fan, but anyone would have done the same thing in his position.

phuck, i would rather have Timmy Murphy on board Sir De Champes

Personally i think this is fantastic news for Bobs Worth backers like myself

I didn't know that was the case Baracouda. Still don't agree with it though and I'm a huge McCoy fan

Lack of morals. Not the 'right' thing. Similar to some Lester events.

So,Joey, having been asked to ride the horse should Mc Coy have said 'no thanks'?
Why would any jockey refuse the ride?

But I did actually like Lester lol

I didn't know that was the case Baracouda. Still don't agree with it though and I'm a huge McCoy fan THAT IS NOT THE CASE ANTE POST IS ALL IN RUN OR NOT ENTERED OR NOT DOSENT MATTER IT WAS DECLARED ITS A N/R BUT THINK A LOT OF FREE ADVERTISING WILL BE USED HERE WITH GOODWILL FROM BOOKIES

Horse must be odds on to fall with McCoy on his back - Bobs Worth is now a triple maximum.

I don't agree with it either Nutkins but you can see why McCoy's not going to turn it down. I just think it leaves a bad taste in the mouth for racing's image

no way he is doing this without JPM's say so

Apologies, my bad regarding ante post. I thought if they were declared overnight and then pulled would be deemed a non runner and bets refunded. #idiot

18 times champion takes ride on 2nd fav?..wow sensational news?!!?

That's the lay of the week gone       

dirty scope ffs how they pull that off

will be quite funny if mccoy hasn't got the ride

18 times champion only has ride on 2nd fav because a perfectly healthy horse was pulled out of the race.

Someone has already laid Sir Des.

with mccoy up there will be forum meltdown this afternoon whether he decks it, gets beat or wins

This place gets worse everyday. Joey you are a gormless moron

I think most people are missing the point here. What has happened is that what appears to be a perfectly healthy horse (unless you believe the convenient scope story) has been withdrawn to enable AP to ride SDC.  That is basically wrong. Its wrong for the punters who put Sunny into various bets and its wrong that in the greatest jump race of the year they can pull a horse out like this to manipulate a result. Of course AP is going to want to take a more fancied ride but that doesnt excuse the fact that this is wrong and should SDC win it then it will leave a sour taste in the mouth of a lot of racing fans.  This is Cheltenham not some flappers hurdle at Fakenham.

I meant Sunnyhill Boy.
Sir des Champs is/was a possible winner.
McCoy is a bit similar to Piggott. I hope he doesn't end up at Her Majesty's Pleasure but wouldn't be that surprised.

"McCoy is a bit similar to Piggott. I hope he doesn't end up at Her Majesty's Pleasure but wouldn't be that surprised"

What's that based on, you f***ing ****?

morning tony

Oh God I have a stalker         

a/p confirmed as the rider.

Spot on Wallis.  I have more distaste for JPM and Jonjo for colluding in this manipulation than I do for McCoy.  It's so blatant yet the BHA will be unable to do anything because they have their convenient excuse lined up.

Whatever the result there'll be a bad taste afterwards.

McCoy is one of the greatest riders of all time. Townand whilst a brilliant jockey has never won at the course or festival and to put that pressure on him would be unfair. best of luck Tony

Agreed Jeze. I have nothing against AP but there are so many scenarios now where something detrimental to the sport could happen. What if he wins it in a driving photo finish - how many newspapers and knockers of horse racing are going to say "well that wouldnt have happened if..".  What if he decks the horse ? The AP critics will have a field day.  Cooper or one of the Gigginstown jockeys should have been given what could be a life changing opportunity. Instead its become a farce of dirty dealing down behind closed doors. As I wrote earlier , if this had been at Fakenham or somewhere on a midweek fixture and a horse was withdrawn , AP moved to the 2nd fav and then it hosed in this forum would be in meltdown.

Get real everybody, if you are O'Leary and Mullins, wouldn't you want the winning most jockey of all time on board if there was a chance he was available?

I think the Sunnyhillboy withdrawal is kosher. Why wouldn't it be? JP/Jonjo don't need a 'reason' to allow McCoy to ride SDC they just have to permit him to do so and replace him on Sunnyhillboy. Sunnyhillboy doesn't have to be withdrawn for that to happen.

Let's be honest, they would have had the choice of every other jockey in the weighing room to ride Sunnyhillboy if he was fit!

DJQ, to be technically correct PT has never had a chase winner at the Festival.  He won the 2011 Fred Winter.

Plus every jockey has to have his first winner somewhere.  It's not as if he's never had a ride in the GC either.  He stepped into Ruby's shoes on the big stage in Ireland coolly enough when RW was out injured.  And he's attached to the yard so is more likely to have seen SDC working, schooling, etc.

i stand corrected jez

I wonder how Sir Des Champs backers feel about this. Does this move, whether morally right or wrong, REALLY improve his chances?

betlarge - can they do that ?  On the morning of the Gold Cup can they just decide that AP can move to SDC and then put another jockey on top of Sunny ? Surely there are some rules to stop that happening , you cant just shuffle jockeys round for no reason.

its good news ap on place lay for me now might not even complete

betlarge - they can't.  The Rules only permit a rider declared to ride another horse in the same race to switch horses if his original mount is unfit to run.  Hence the convenient dirty scope.

Correct Wallis, rules state can't change jockeys from one horse to another when no known previous association with the stable. To prevent the likes of say a Richard Johnson replacing a conditional in a tin pot race at say the likes of Hereford. In this case a bit stupid as hardly going to be not trying in a Gold Cup.

McCoy has always been an easy target for two bob numpties on this forum,

all you are any good at is criticize the man, he has achieved more than the lot of you put together !

Thanks Big_Issue.

Plus every jockey has to have his first winner somewhere.

not at the gold cup mind

McCoy is undoubtedly a good jockey but he is no saint and neither are some of his connections.

betlarge - can they do that ?  On the morning of the Gold Cup can they just decide that AP can move to SDC and then put another jockey on top of Sunny ? Surely there are some rules to stop that happening , you cant just shuffle jockeys round for no reason.

Good question Wallis, I'm not actually sure of the rules as it stands. But that would be key certainly.

It's just that I've seen this happen in loads of races over the years (big and small) where a champ gets to replace a lesser-known when the champ suddenly becomes available. As some have mentioned, this was Lester's party piece!

volontiers , this is exactly my point - it has nothing to do with anyones opinion of AP (well , not mine anyway). This is about conveniently withdrawing a horse in the morning to shuffle a jockey around in the greatest jumps race of the year and affecting punters, owners and the running of the race.  As big_issue said the only way he could do this is if Sunnyhillboy was withdrawn. So it comes down to whether you believe something is wrong with that horse or if its all a bit too suspicious. I fall down on the side of the latter.

betlarge - absolutely. Ive seen it happen and when it does this forum explodes and everyone screams "cheat" when they land a touch. The horse with the rag on is punted off the boards , then suddenly has toothache or whatever it was when that welsh trainer did it , then Johnson steps in and the horse wins by a postcode.

Now its not the case here but the principle of pulling out a horse to move a jockey is wrong. They should have stuck with one of their own and given someone the chance of a lifetime.

wrong betlarge...the only way ap can ride sir des champs is to withdraw the horse he was originally declared for.
he's doing sunnyhill backers a favour as the horse had no chance and they'll get their money back.

what if there is something wrong with Sunnyhillboy,

coincidences do happen in life you know !

Have just been debating this on another forum and got this response:

"As long as Sunnyhill Boy remains in the race, the rules of racing would not allow Tony McCoy to switch mounts, and ride another horse"

BHA's Robin Mounsey, last night.

In which case my previous post was definitely wrong and I would agree this does not look good.

voluntiers , it comes down to whether or not you believe it to be true or an orchestrated plan to free up AP and I know which I believe.

We know McManus and O'Leary are as straight as they come.
Nothing to see here. Please move on.

posy , the antepost backers wont. Nor will anyone on here who punted it in the ante post markets at treble figure prices and were looking to lay off.

wallis is totally correct

Worse than a gaggle of old women some on here.

I aint no fan of AP, to be honest the boring kant irritates me, but what has he done wrong here? Officially the horse has scoped dirty.

Respect to Joey what a haul

The authorities hands are tied as all the vets are in collusion with the trainers, all Jonjo did last night was to ring Joe Vet and tell him he needs a vets cert for the morning, job done and the authorities can't do a thing about it, a vets word is final even if the vast majority of vets certs are fake.

and the word of the forum nobodies is also final,

if they say it's all fixed etc, then that must be the truth and everything else is a conspiracy

Jezebel     15 Mar 13 11:02 
betlarge - they can't.  The Rules only permit a rider declared to ride another horse in the same race to switch horses if his original mount is unfit to run.  Hence the convenient dirty scope.



But isn't this exactly what Piggott used to do in prestigious races ? i.e original riders 'jocked off' to allow him the ride.

silvergreaser     15 Mar 13 11:52 
The authorities hands are tied as all the vets are in collusion with the trainers, all Jonjo did last night was to ring Joe Vet and tell him he needs a vets cert for the morning, job done and the authorities can't do a thing about it, a vets word is final even if the vast majority of vets certs are fake.



Absolute rubbish you prat

If anyone believes there's some kind of conspiracy, then you really are complete and utter mugs.

But isn't this exactly what Piggott used to do in prestigious races ? i.e original riders 'jocked off' to allow him the ride.

Facts  The rules have been changed  since Lesters days

Sad that Davy R misses the big 1 2day on Sir`s he knows the horse inside-out.
Great super-sub with AP taking over & hope they storm 2 Victory in the Gold Cup.

^ oh - ok - didn't realise that. Thanks.

to haplessamatuer

you can jock off if you are the trainer's son like Joseph did last year but the rules have changed

so the withdrawals of Ballycasey from the AB and Sunnyhillboy are unrelated

Rules may have changed but there are always ways round them       

Methinks that O'Leary has a large part in this somewhat murky decision...


G C on this mornings M L... 'there was a heated discussion yesterday (weighing room) about the possibility of A P riding SDC!'


I'd like to think that Willie would of been loyal to Paul or Bryan !

But, he who pays the piper calls the tune !

Get the feeling that either way this will end badly

yes that could be the way it goes steamship

I am shittt scared

Just seen all this. Wallis, a belated well said on your various posts for recognising the real issue here.

There's a vet out there who presumably has signed off what would appear to be a hooky sick line for SHB. Years of blood, seat and tears to become qualified to pull a fast one, crazy.

As soon as the AP for SDC rumours surfaced "dirty scope, bruised foot" was 1.01 to happen. FACT. Everyone knows it, but it wont be mentioned on C4 or RUK will it? You cant blame AP for taking the ride but the rules forced connections into pulling out the stops to get him on SDC.

If JP and Jonjo can "find" a reason to pull a horse from the biggest NH race of the season then the game would appear to be fooked. It openly adds to some peoples perception that racing is less than 100% straight.

Mullins would have had nothing to with it.
I would have thought it was cooper who has missed out as I understood he was Gigginstown`s 2nd jockey. Townend is attached to Mullins. As has been said,whatever the truth of this scope,if I had backed Sunnyhill Boy ante-post I would be SEETHING

Somerset Sam     15 Mar 13 13:00 
There's a vet out there who presumably has signed off what would appear to be a hooky sick line for SHB. Years of blood, seat and tears to become qualified to pull a fast one, crazy.



I hope you have the proof to justify this statement ? - or else I can see you being in big trouble !

mullins was in the stewards room asking questions before davy was admitted into hospital ,and as they just  stated on the tv the stewards can allows jockey changes under extreme circumstances , so they could have run sunnyhillboy after all

Praying this horse falls (but gets up unharmed) and McCoy breaks a leg or something.

oi! not on uncle

Sorry Judo.

Shame on you uncle.

Very silly uncle

yes its a toss up being him worth fortunes or you worth 4 quid doing yankees in the local bookies

Why - the whole affair is rancid and I hope it backfires on all concerned in a massive way. It's called karma.

I'll break your leg see how you like it

plenty of scope to talk about whatever happens

wont matter wont win

My personal wish would be for SDC to lead over the last and get done a sh hd.

They should have just booked Brian Cooper - different gravy to long face.

yes!! that would have been a story

bet they wished they had put cooper up now !

Judo - I think your pocket is talking.

You started the thread on the Cheltenham forum suggesting it was a very dubious set of circumstances - cheats shouldn't prosper.

win or lose mccoy will get trashed

yes but keyboard warriors like you should not be wishing horses to fall and jockeys to get injured, specially with JT McNamara in critical condition you fecking tw@t

mine was a goodnatured tease at the shennanigans of the powerful connections at work

you were wishin ill so don't fecking have a pop at me

nothing to do with pocket you prick, now phuck off little boy

Judo having a bad Cheltneham (NAP).

Facts:

Using words like presumably and appear to be show that I know as much as you. No need for you to stir it.