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11 Jan 13
08:17
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07 Jun 04
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My ex was Public School...............A well spoken woman
^ He says - BEFORE FOBTS - he would bet about $£20 a week on, say a couple of BIG races and/or a Football bet at the weekend.
NOW - he is addicted to the machines.
He now tries to NOT carry ANY CASH - so that he is not tempted into the Shop.
NOW - he is addicted to the machines.
He now tries to NOT carry ANY CASH - so that he is not tempted into the Shop.
The professional fobt player is interesting says he can wait a couple of hours watching over peoples shoulders until a machine is full up says the machines are programmes to pay out at certain times and he knows the sequences
This caller going BANANAS
He once lost £4,500 in 25 minutes.
He once lost £4,500 in 25 minutes.
no one is making the point that these are bookmakers and not arcades so should be reclassified as such if they're are dependant on the income from the machines. There would be a bigger outcry from the public if the high streets were full of arcades
Presumably, Know All, this punter is playing the fruit machine version of FOBTs. Roulette part is random number generated.
Academic Ar8ehole now trying to defend them - and saying they are no worse than Mobile Phone and Internet Gambling.
debbie knows it all,but only worked in shop since may.
No restrictions on phones or Internet! On casino games!
Well how come they can do it on horses!
Well how come they can do it on horses!
"We've got a button behind the counter where we can turn the machines off" 
campbell 'have you ever turned a machine off Debbie?'
Debbie 'Yes' ...... every night just before I lock up
Debbie 'Yes' ...... every night just before I lock up
I have just rung, the lady wanted me to go on air to discuss them not accepting horse bets. I bottled it but they are willing to put someone on if anyone fancies ringing.
I have already saddo. Spoke to a female. Se said she would tell the studio I had phoned and would ring me back if needed.
I guarantee no one will get on and mention the refusal of bets.
I guarantee no one will get on and mention the refusal of bets.
Presumably, Know All, this punter is playing the fruit machine version of FOBTs. Roulette part is random number generated.
If it was random they could lose a lot of money, the machines are programmed to pay out 97% thats not random, they are also programmed to pay out the professional fobt player then just nips in and takes the pot
If it was random they could lose a lot of money, the machines are programmed to pay out 97% thats not random, they are also programmed to pay out the professional fobt player then just nips in and takes the pot
they are also programmed to pay out the professional fobt player then just nips in and takes the pot
Were you ranting, alex? She wanted to put me straight through, took me by surprise I'm afraid.
Cheryl Coles mam is on now. Poor Cheryl I hadn't realised she was addicted to FOBTs
Woman from Newcastle -
"My DAUGHTER has lost EVERYTHING - Her Flat, She has had to sell everything "....
"She goes in the Shop at 9 o'clock in the morning - and can be there at 10 o-clock at night."
"My DAUGHTER has lost EVERYTHING - Her Flat, She has had to sell everything "....
"She goes in the Shop at 9 o'clock in the morning - and can be there at 10 o-clock at night."
these machines are riggged my mate was a shop manager he showed me that when you press start the winning number shows up instantly on screen behind counter but takes 30 secs for ball to stop on that number.
and they say that these fobts pay out 92% this figuire is calculated over millions of spins
not u put 100 in and get 92 out
dont ban them the government should take 50% tax so a least the money goes in the tax pot
and they say that these fobts pay out 92% this figuire is calculated over millions of spins
not u put 100 in and get 92 out
dont ban them the government should take 50% tax so a least the money goes in the tax pot
Thinking about it saddo I was probably sounded like I was ranting. Either that or mother just didn't want to bring up the possibilities of bookmakers refusing bets. Probably the former though.
Yet again a chance to get the truth out there is missed by the media.
Yet again a chance to get the truth out there is missed by the media.
these machines are riggged my mate was a shop manager he showed me that when you press start the winning number shows up instantly on screen behind counter but takes 30 secs for ball to stop on that number.
Of course, the cause isn't helped by people like that silly old **** who insists things like the payout percentages aren't displayed anywhere, then calls someone a liar, when they (rightly) point out that they are.
the first half hour was promising with the cynical targetting of shops in certain locations in the spotlight and the shift of bookmakers focus toward this more lucrative form of gambling.
unfortunately the 2nd half hour was typical of these phone ins and did nothing to add to the debate. it was just the usual predictable series of hard luck stories interspersed with mr angry type saying it is their own fault and they have to be responsible for their own actions etc etc.
unfortunately the 2nd half hour was typical of these phone ins and did nothing to add to the debate. it was just the usual predictable series of hard luck stories interspersed with mr angry type saying it is their own fault and they have to be responsible for their own actions etc etc.
Nobody got on then to question why you can only have £10 on the 11/10 fav in the first but can sit all day on a FOBT feeding it twenties?
A few figures from Sadbrokes:
Between 2006 and 2011 their 'gross win' on bets placed over the counter in UK shops fell by 23%. In the same period, their gross profit from machines in UK shops rose by 76%.
In 2006, machines generated 28.7% of gross profits in their UK shops. By the first half of 2012 the figure was 49.5%
In 2006, each machine in UK shops generated a gross profit of £538 per week. By the first half of 2012 the figure had reached £970 (an increase of 80%)
So in a shop with four FOBTS, the machines are now raking in around £200K a year in gross profits. They boast to shareholders that investment in new shops is now being recouped in less than three years. No wonder they are "pursuing further expansion of the UK retail estate" (their aim was to open around 70 new shops in 2012.
Between 2006 and 2011 their 'gross win' on bets placed over the counter in UK shops fell by 23%. In the same period, their gross profit from machines in UK shops rose by 76%.
In 2006, machines generated 28.7% of gross profits in their UK shops. By the first half of 2012 the figure was 49.5%
In 2006, each machine in UK shops generated a gross profit of £538 per week. By the first half of 2012 the figure had reached £970 (an increase of 80%)
So in a shop with four FOBTS, the machines are now raking in around £200K a year in gross profits. They boast to shareholders that investment in new shops is now being recouped in less than three years. No wonder they are "pursuing further expansion of the UK retail estate" (their aim was to open around 70 new shops in 2012.
Nobody got on then to question why you can only have £10 on the 11/10 fav in the first but can sit all day on a FOBT feeding it twenties?
And the BBA rep who was happy to give a soundbite earlier in the day was conspicuous by his absence. Anyone would think they don't like answering proper questions...
And the BBA rep who was happy to give a soundbite earlier in the day was conspicuous by his absence. Anyone would think they don't like answering proper questions...
Why would they discuss bet acceptence policies?
The debate was around the potential harm FOBTs cause. The only harm the knocking back of bets causes is to the blood pressure of people on here.
The debate was around the potential harm FOBTs cause. The only harm the knocking back of bets causes is to the blood pressure of people on here.
Because they blatantly lied Clive. Debbie said there are no restrictions online, on phone or on the Internet. Of course there aren't on casino products, gaming machines etc etc because they don't want to restrict those people!
She said they can't restrict people who don't bet in the shop but that simply isn't true. They soon restrict u if u take their overnight prices, win or lose.
And as for stopping people when they have lost too much, that is the biggest lie have ever heard!
She said they can't restrict people who don't bet in the shop but that simply isn't true. They soon restrict u if u take their overnight prices, win or lose.
And as for stopping people when they have lost too much, that is the biggest lie have ever heard!
clive82 - sounds like you work in an arcade youself lad? is that right?
clive82 is the big three's answer to Dr Goebbels.
(Along and his alter ego, Banned_Banks.)
(Along and his alter ego, Banned_Banks.)
SirAlex for your own sake it's probably best you didn't get on. I fear your direct comparisons between the mechanics of betting and gaming machines and the approach operators take to managing liabilites on each would have but you in the 'nutter' bracket.
"clive82 is the big three's answer to Dr Goebbels"
A curious comparison given 2 of the big 3 have such strong Jewish heritage.
A curious comparison given 2 of the big 3 have such strong Jewish heritage.
An accident of history. Next you'll be telling us you're NOT a propagandist for them, clive.
What "management of liabilities" is required on FOBTs please clive?
What "management of liabilities" is required on FOBTs please clive?
None. That is why the point below is so ludicrous.
"Nobody got on then to question why you can only have £10 on the 11/10 fav in the first but can sit all day on a FOBT feeding it twenties?"
None. That is why the point below is so ludicrous.
"Nobody got on then to question why you can only have £10 on the 11/10 fav in the first but can sit all day on a FOBT feeding it twenties?"
clive82 11 Jan 13 14:20 Joined: 06 May 10 | Topic/replies: 395 | Blogger: clive82's blog
"clive82 is the big three's answer to Dr Goebbels"
A curious comparison given 2 of the big 3 have such strong Jewish heritage.
Clive82(His Master's Voice), you have a short, selective and obviously defective memory, not too long ago, an offensive post by you, comparing a forumite to Hitler was deleted by Betfair.
You lie on a daily basis for a living, I suggest that your string pullers look to replace you, as along with your attrocious spelling, bad grammar and you now showing a lack of what every liar should have, a good memory, it looks like you aren't the brightest bulb in the chandelier, now run along and collect the script that your Master has written for you to recite verbatim tomorrow, as to how much you have laid the favourite to lose, or how you have taken monster bets(all imaginary)on a variety of events.
"clive82 is the big three's answer to Dr Goebbels"
A curious comparison given 2 of the big 3 have such strong Jewish heritage.
Clive82(His Master's Voice), you have a short, selective and obviously defective memory, not too long ago, an offensive post by you, comparing a forumite to Hitler was deleted by Betfair.
You lie on a daily basis for a living, I suggest that your string pullers look to replace you, as along with your attrocious spelling, bad grammar and you now showing a lack of what every liar should have, a good memory, it looks like you aren't the brightest bulb in the chandelier, now run along and collect the script that your Master has written for you to recite verbatim tomorrow, as to how much you have laid the favourite to lose, or how you have taken monster bets(all imaginary)on a variety of events.
Parispike,why the comparison?Ask yourself what you would do if you were running an LBO.I guarantee you would restrict constant winners,and welcome the highly profitable machine players.
I repeat,nobody is forced to enter an LBO,and nobody is then forced to play the machines.
I repeat,nobody is forced to enter an LBO,and nobody is then forced to play the machines.
I thought the whole Nazi thing would flush out our nosey neighbour from across the border.
As you are big on avoiding untruths, are you ready to share how you lose you lose £14k an hour on an FOBT? That was the figure you quoted wasn't it?
As you are big on avoiding untruths, are you ready to share how you lose you lose £14k an hour on an FOBT? That was the figure you quoted wasn't it?
I believe I've seen £18k p/hour (possible) quoted clive. How long does a roulette spin take, for a £100 bet? I'm sure you know, so the calculation from there is simple.
unbiased, we know that nobody is FORCED to play FOBTs, but I'm sure there are those that would use force if it was possible. As it is, "they" do all in their power to create new addicts daily. After a lifetime of punting, I never thought I'd sound like this, but those damned things are immoral, simple as that.
unbiased, we know that nobody is FORCED to play FOBTs, but I'm sure there are those that would use force if it was possible. As it is, "they" do all in their power to create new addicts daily. After a lifetime of punting, I never thought I'd sound like this, but those damned things are immoral, simple as that.
In one post you prove everything I have stated to be true about you.
Not only is your Diploma in P.R. useless, now your claims to have a geography degree are also looking dubious.
As I told you before Mr. W., my dog has a Diploma saying he is obedience trained, but the difference is, that my dog actually completed a course and put in the work to obtain his, as opposed to purchasing it online after a couple of alleged online study hours.
Oh, my dog obtained his through Irish and also comprehends English commands. Looks like he is smarter than you in his linguistic skills also, as you have trouble writing, spelling and comprehending your native language.
Teacht anseo/come here Fido. Woof Woof.
Not only is your Diploma in P.R. useless, now your claims to have a geography degree are also looking dubious.
As I told you before Mr. W., my dog has a Diploma saying he is obedience trained, but the difference is, that my dog actually completed a course and put in the work to obtain his, as opposed to purchasing it online after a couple of alleged online study hours.
Oh, my dog obtained his through Irish and also comprehends English commands. Looks like he is smarter than you in his linguistic skills also, as you have trouble writing, spelling and comprehending your native language.
Teacht anseo/come here Fido.
Woof Woof.
live82 - sounds like you work in an arcade youself lad? is that right?
Yeah, he cleans the bogs
Yeah, he cleans the bogs
I believe I've seen £18k p/hour (possible) quoted clive. How long does a roulette spin take, for a £100 bet? I'm sure you know, so the calculation from there is simple.
£18k is correct. 20 second interval.
Clive is apparently as good at maths as he is at everything else, aside from talking shyte obviously.
£18k is correct. 20 second interval.
Clive is apparently as good at maths as he is at everything else, aside from talking shyte obviously.
If it would be easier ask your dog then? How do you lose £14k or £18k an hour on FOBTs?
You stated that so presumably you know? The only other explanation is you were lying which i know you're dead against.
You stated that so presumably you know? The only other explanation is you were lying which i know you're dead against.
Dr Gonzo's helped you out there clive. £18k p/hour possible losses, given a bad run. I think most fair minded people would agree that 10% of that would be too high.
Dr Gonzo's helped you out there clive. £18k p/hour possible losses, given a bad run. I think most fair minded people would agree that 10% of that would be too high.
Joined: 28 Jul 02 | Topic/replies: 2,502 | Blogger: Alias's blog
Dr Gonzo's helped you out there clive. £18k p/hour possible losses, given a bad run. I think most fair minded people would agree that 10% of that would be too high.
It would be the mother of all bad runs, given that it would be 180 consecutive spins without a return
Dr Gonzo's helped you out there clive. £18k p/hour possible losses, given a bad run. I think most fair minded people would agree that 10% of that would be too high.
It would be the mother of all bad runs, given that it would be 180 consecutive spins without a return
Thank you Nirnaeth... I was waiting for the penny to drop with the 'experts' on here.
Just a quick calculation to help quantify this.
If we agree that you need to cover 7 numbers to get the max stake on and that you load the £18k on to the machine before you start playing with a view to getting this run of 180 straight losers let's see how likely that is.
If we assume that every adult in the world is tasked with trying to do this every day of their life and each person lives to 80 then on average it would take over 13,000 years for someone to hit that streak.
If we were to restrict it just to UK adults as I suspect the logistics of extending it worldwide would be too awkward, not least because goons like Gandalf would probably try and claim he did it on the first attempt, then we would be looking at someone hitting that streak once in the next 1.8 million years.
Nevertheless let's use it as a basis for hysteria.
If we agree that you need to cover 7 numbers to get the max stake on and that you load the £18k on to the machine before you start playing with a view to getting this run of 180 straight losers let's see how likely that is.
If we assume that every adult in the world is tasked with trying to do this every day of their life and each person lives to 80 then on average it would take over 13,000 years for someone to hit that streak.
If we were to restrict it just to UK adults as I suspect the logistics of extending it worldwide would be too awkward, not least because goons like Gandalf would probably try and claim he did it on the first attempt, then we would be looking at someone hitting that streak once in the next 1.8 million years.
Nevertheless let's use it as a basis for hysteria.
NOBODY is saying it's likely. It IS possible.
Anyway, the point is that the potential for fast, big losses exists, and is often attained, unfortunately.
Incidentally Banned, that's a hell of a long way of defending "harmless entertainment."
Anyway, the point is that the potential for fast, big losses exists, and is often attained, unfortunately.
Incidentally Banned, that's a hell of a long way of defending "harmless entertainment."
Not defending just showing how ridiculous the whole debate has become on both sides.
A lot of rubbish spouted on both sides indeed.
Bloke on radio 5 said u can lose 250 per spin, someone said all machines are by the door, someone said all bookies are by a bank. Debbie said staff trained to stop people spending too much.
All of that is codswallop.
What is fact is that they have comfy chairs for the machine players, u get free tea and coffee, they have competitions to get u addicted, there are no limits as to what u can lose.
This is the same online or on phones. Debbie also said no way of restricting people playing roulette online which is a complete lie.
They CHOOSE Not to restrict gaming betting as its a guaranteed income.
Bloke on radio 5 said u can lose 250 per spin, someone said all machines are by the door, someone said all bookies are by a bank. Debbie said staff trained to stop people spending too much.
All of that is codswallop.
What is fact is that they have comfy chairs for the machine players, u get free tea and coffee, they have competitions to get u addicted, there are no limits as to what u can lose.
This is the same online or on phones. Debbie also said no way of restricting people playing roulette online which is a complete lie.
They CHOOSE Not to restrict gaming betting as its a guaranteed income.
was only half listening, but bookie rep on phone in stated average spend on FOBT machines was £10/hour - he seemed to think this was OK/good but no attempt to reconcile this with Geordie mum whose daughter is in shop from 9 in morning to 10 at night so average spend in this scenario is £130/day.
Many of the players must by definition be on limited income/benefits - otherwise what are they doing in there in the day? So it's money they can't afford.
Note this is an average figure so many spending more than £10/hour.
I'm not one for bookie bashing on a whim and I'm all for personal responsibility - but this scenario surely cannot sit comfortably with anybody who has a reasonable moral compass.
The debate was stimulated by a Labour politician acknowledging they had made a mistake in the passing the bill which enabled the proliferation of these machines on the High Street - how often do you hear politicians admit policy errors? Should be enough to set alarm bells ringing in its' own right.
Many of the players must by definition be on limited income/benefits - otherwise what are they doing in there in the day? So it's money they can't afford.
Note this is an average figure so many spending more than £10/hour.
I'm not one for bookie bashing on a whim and I'm all for personal responsibility - but this scenario surely cannot sit comfortably with anybody who has a reasonable moral compass.
The debate was stimulated by a Labour politician acknowledging they had made a mistake in the passing the bill which enabled the proliferation of these machines on the High Street - how often do you hear politicians admit policy errors? Should be enough to set alarm bells ringing in its' own right.
these FOBT are ruining the high streets and taking away the money from the poorest.. they should be banned or limited to arcades where those on benefits cannot bet... i have seen people spit or punch machines after they have lost the last tenner.. a society on welfare like England does not need such recreation
ReaseHeath seems to be alot more reasoned then most of the posters. A word of caution though, the MP you cite as being the stimulus to the debate also claimed these machines are in arcades. Such basic factual errors make you question whether he is genuinely worried about the issues or has simply identified an opportunity to get himself some media coverage in an attempt to get back in the shadow cabinet.
Can't read clive ( scum ) as I have blocked him but nice of him to pull his c0ck out of D Williams to partake in another three about bookies
Hopefully one of the loonies who blow thier lot on these vile machines will end him in a fit of rage
The poetic justice would be worth having a party for
clive you are scum, utter scum and simply default to the same old sh1t every time
GFYYFC
Hopefully one of the loonies who blow thier lot on these vile machines will end him in a fit of rage
The poetic justice would be worth having a party for
clive you are scum, utter scum and simply default to the same old sh1t every time
GFYYFC
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