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17 Sep 12
15:46
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05 Jan 10
These scammers will promise to provide you with gambling tips that will win you a fortune. Remember the only person guaranteed to win is the bookie!
By Tony Levene | lovemoney.com
Pete, one of my oldest friends, is a racehorse owner. That's a slight exaggeration – he owns a bit of one leg via a racing syndicate.
In early September, he was at Goodwood to watch the animal. It was a 50-1 outsider so it did well to finish seventh in a field of eleven.
But as Pete puts it, the horse is young and might improve. “In any case, racing is not about making money – it's a day out with friends and a few drinks. I spend money on this, others buy a season ticket at Chelsea or take a dozen short breaks a year. It's just my choice which I budget for and can afford.”
Others, however, try to claim the racetrack is the route to instant, easy, wealth. Now, call me an obsessive if you like, but I file away schemes which come in the post or email.
Make good money quickly, without risking your cash
Three years ago, a guy we'll call Raymond wrote to me out of the blue saying he had “a personal involvement in certain events which will be financially beneficial to you. I will explain how you can make good money very quickly – without risking any of your hard earned cash”.
Now the only connection with racing was the Newmarket address (which turned out to be a sweet shop), his claim that his father was a jockey (almost impossible to verify as his surname was hardly rare and, in any case, so what?) and that he “had decided to allocate a percentage of the money I'll be raising from this offer to support the Injured Jockeys Fund”. The fund is a genuine and worthy registered charity but the percentage could be 0.1%.
“I sincerely hope you give me the chance to prove myself”, he concluded. Looking a little further into the offer I could choose between a four-week trial of racing tips at £37 or a two-year plan at £347. The second promised to return my money if his recommendations did not produce enough winners.
There was a facsimile of a bookmaker cheque for £6,250 which he claimed was from one race two months earlier. This is easy enough to forge, but, if genuine gives no indication of how many losing bets he made. Equally, anyone can compose a list of winners simply by working through past editions of The Racing Post (or many websites) just as phoney share tipsters can use back numbers of the Financial Times to create an impressive success record.
He also promised “over £500 of goods and services” which turned out to be “free” bets bookies offer if you open an account.
Delving further, you needed £500 in cash to start with as each bet had to be £100, a very hefty amount for most people.
Winners and losers
So what happened to Raymond (almost certainly not his real name) and his horse tipping service? Certainly he took some money in – helped by the charitable reference although the good cause was not aware of his “generosity” - and he texted some tips over the next month or two.
According to some posts on betting sites, these tips were all winners.
But there were also complaints that they were all losers. They can't both be right so it could be that those stating he was a turf genius were sent by himself or his friends.
He did then eventually send out one or two winning tips. That's not difficult as all you need to do is to name enough favourites at very low odds (so your winnings for each pound bet may be as little as 10p) and you are bound to find winners after a time – it's virtually a statistical certainty. I could do that. So could anyone else.
After that, the tips stopped. He did not refund any money, telling people that they had to wait two years for this. He apparently told one punter that he had received an offer from a syndicate and “moved on to other things”, but promised a “super premium” service for £649 in return for another cheque.
Finding a serious tipster
There are, of course, genuine tipsters. Some work for newspapers – others provide more specialised services. So how do you separate the real from the phoney?
•Look for consistency of adverts. Someone who buys space in The Racing Post on a regular basis over a long period is serious.
•Check specialist racing and football betting websites. There are often posts praising the good and damning the bad.
•Avoid unsolicited mail. People who write to you out of the blue may disappear with your money.
•Be sceptical of “guarantees” - the only guarantee in racing is that bookies always win.
•Be especially wary of past records that are not independently verified as related to real tips.
•Ignore claims that you could make big money or easy money. You can't.
By Tony Levene | lovemoney.com
Pete, one of my oldest friends, is a racehorse owner. That's a slight exaggeration – he owns a bit of one leg via a racing syndicate.
In early September, he was at Goodwood to watch the animal. It was a 50-1 outsider so it did well to finish seventh in a field of eleven.
But as Pete puts it, the horse is young and might improve. “In any case, racing is not about making money – it's a day out with friends and a few drinks. I spend money on this, others buy a season ticket at Chelsea or take a dozen short breaks a year. It's just my choice which I budget for and can afford.”
Others, however, try to claim the racetrack is the route to instant, easy, wealth. Now, call me an obsessive if you like, but I file away schemes which come in the post or email.
Make good money quickly, without risking your cash
Three years ago, a guy we'll call Raymond wrote to me out of the blue saying he had “a personal involvement in certain events which will be financially beneficial to you. I will explain how you can make good money very quickly – without risking any of your hard earned cash”.
Now the only connection with racing was the Newmarket address (which turned out to be a sweet shop), his claim that his father was a jockey (almost impossible to verify as his surname was hardly rare and, in any case, so what?) and that he “had decided to allocate a percentage of the money I'll be raising from this offer to support the Injured Jockeys Fund”. The fund is a genuine and worthy registered charity but the percentage could be 0.1%.
“I sincerely hope you give me the chance to prove myself”, he concluded. Looking a little further into the offer I could choose between a four-week trial of racing tips at £37 or a two-year plan at £347. The second promised to return my money if his recommendations did not produce enough winners.
There was a facsimile of a bookmaker cheque for £6,250 which he claimed was from one race two months earlier. This is easy enough to forge, but, if genuine gives no indication of how many losing bets he made. Equally, anyone can compose a list of winners simply by working through past editions of The Racing Post (or many websites) just as phoney share tipsters can use back numbers of the Financial Times to create an impressive success record.
He also promised “over £500 of goods and services” which turned out to be “free” bets bookies offer if you open an account.
Delving further, you needed £500 in cash to start with as each bet had to be £100, a very hefty amount for most people.
Winners and losers
So what happened to Raymond (almost certainly not his real name) and his horse tipping service? Certainly he took some money in – helped by the charitable reference although the good cause was not aware of his “generosity” - and he texted some tips over the next month or two.
According to some posts on betting sites, these tips were all winners.
But there were also complaints that they were all losers. They can't both be right so it could be that those stating he was a turf genius were sent by himself or his friends.
He did then eventually send out one or two winning tips. That's not difficult as all you need to do is to name enough favourites at very low odds (so your winnings for each pound bet may be as little as 10p) and you are bound to find winners after a time – it's virtually a statistical certainty. I could do that. So could anyone else.
After that, the tips stopped. He did not refund any money, telling people that they had to wait two years for this. He apparently told one punter that he had received an offer from a syndicate and “moved on to other things”, but promised a “super premium” service for £649 in return for another cheque.
Finding a serious tipster
There are, of course, genuine tipsters. Some work for newspapers – others provide more specialised services. So how do you separate the real from the phoney?
•Look for consistency of adverts. Someone who buys space in The Racing Post on a regular basis over a long period is serious.
•Check specialist racing and football betting websites. There are often posts praising the good and damning the bad.
•Avoid unsolicited mail. People who write to you out of the blue may disappear with your money.
•Be sceptical of “guarantees” - the only guarantee in racing is that bookies always win.
•Be especially wary of past records that are not independently verified as related to real tips.
•Ignore claims that you could make big money or easy money. You can't.
Show More
Check specialist racing and football betting websites There are often posts praising the good and damning the bad.
He did then eventually send out one or two winning tips. That's not difficult as all you need to do is to name enough favourites at very low odds (so your winnings for each pound bet may be as little as 10p) and you are bound to find winners after a time – it's virtually a statistical certainty. I could do that. So could anyone else.
lol
He did then eventually send out one or two winning tips. That's not difficult as all you need to do is to name enough favourites at very low odds (so your winnings for each pound bet may be as little as 10p) and you are bound to find winners after a time – it's virtually a statistical certainty. I could do that. So could anyone else.
lol
Someone who buys space in The Racing Post on a regular basis over a long period is serious.
Another big LOL
Another big LOL
Urrrrm now let me think - Raymond, **** tips, daddy was a jockey, cwap agent, loafs around newmarket in his silver mercedes, taste for the high life on daddies pocket money, likes a dabble on the gear - I'm absolutely clueless who this could be!!
very interesting and thought provoking thread anaglogs . Thankyou . However , may I just add a slight alteration to your statement , the only one guaranteed to win is the bookie . Technically , all layers on here are "bookies" but of course we are not laying a balanced book and laying singles at exaggerated odds is very difficult to win long term ..as you no doubt know. I certainly do being a layer only on this site !
Someone has to lay them Pablo have you ever tried to get £100 e.w on a 16/1 shot in the bookies?
yes...touche my friend ..good point . I have tried many times .....especially ante post in the old days for events like the cheltenham festival........the number of times i have heard.....yes sir thats right , the advertised price is 25/1 you are correct . However , i have to ring all these 100 each way bets through and my manager says you can only have 20 each way on it , the rest at 16s. Not my fault , sir. I am only the messenger.
Anoglogs here my advice and its for Free
zips been in this game since 1960 tipsters come and go.
ALL of em are CON merchants.. why if they could make the game PAY why sell tips .....END OF
zips been in this game since 1960 tipsters come and go.
ALL of em are CON merchants.. why if they could make the game PAY why sell tips .....END OF
Nothing new about this sort of thing.Hardly worth a mention.
The goose that lays the golden eggs is & never will be for sale.
Anaglogs Daughter
Someone has to lay them Pablo have you ever tried to get £100 e.w on a 16/1 shot in the bookies?
well yes you just split it to 2x50ew but remember when they win always tip them 10 or 20 you will get on no problem
Someone has to lay them Pablo have you ever tried to get £100 e.w on a 16/1 shot in the bookies?
well yes you just split it to 2x50ew but remember when they win always tip them 10 or 20 you will get on no problem
WHY DONT YOU INVEST IN THE TIPSTERS AND THEN JUST PICK OUT THE GOOD ONES ,THEVE NARROWED IT DOWN FOR YOU ,JUST PICK THE ONES YOU THINK THAT WILL WIN FROM THEIR SELECTIONS
IVE FOUND OUT IN LIFE TO LOOK AT THINGS FROM ALL ANGLES,IM NOW AN ISOSOLES TRIANGLE
YIME I KNOW WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT ,AND YOU KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT
I have a friend with experience running a genuine service. The biggest problem he had was distinguishing from the scamers when advertising. He did the whole Racing Post proofing and advertising thing, but realised that the most cost effective way, was to go private. The racing post do restrict a tipping service on what they can advertise, based on what the tipster has proven to be true. However if you tipped 50 loosing horses, and 8 winners , you only have to declare what is true. IE " 8 monster winners this month , out standing tipping, best tipping service is the world". When the reality is 0.75 p profit on level stakes from near 60 bets. (Don't forget to minus the cost of using this amazing service. )
For a honest service to compete with this is very hard, especially against tipping lines who don't pay advertising fee's because they are owned by the paper they advertise in. In addition ,certain "tipsters" appearing on TV, adds to their image as a all round good guy with inside information.
Any genuine tipping line will never ask for much up front. Your first few should be free really. No one can pick 5 winners every day 365 days a year, so don't pay for 5 tips a day. A professional will give you from 3- 10 a month, that's the reality. Also, favourites and short priced winners don't count as premium information.
For a honest service to compete with this is very hard, especially against tipping lines who don't pay advertising fee's because they are owned by the paper they advertise in. In addition ,certain "tipsters" appearing on TV, adds to their image as a all round good guy with inside information.
Any genuine tipping line will never ask for much up front. Your first few should be free really. No one can pick 5 winners every day 365 days a year, so don't pay for 5 tips a day. A professional will give you from 3- 10 a month, that's the reality. Also, favourites and short priced winners don't count as premium information.
one very simple bit of advise.............NEVER PAY MONEY FOR A TIPSTER/RACING INFORMATION UNLESS THEY PROOF THEIR RESULTS TO A VALID REPUTABLE INDEPENDAT SOURCE AND THEY CAN SHOW YOU ALL THEIR PROVEN PROFIT AND LOSS FIGURES OTHERWISE THEY ARE MOST LIKELY CON ARTISTS. THERE ARE A HANDFUL OF GENIUNE TIPSTER BUT THEY ALL PROVE THEIR RESULTS FOR INDEPENDANT SOURCE..................IF YOU ARE EVER THINKING OF JOING A SERVICE ASK THEM WHO THEY PROVE THEIR RESULT TO A ASK TO SEE ALL THE PREVIOUS RESULT IF THEY CANT ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS OR TRY TO AVOID THE QUESTION THEY MOST LIKELTY ARE CON MERCHANTS.....
You should have ended that post after the word information, daz550.
agree sparrow
i find the ones who are profitable charge a firtune and when you take out the payments you are struggling to make anything worthwile
i find the ones who are profitable charge a firtune and when you take out the payments you are struggling to make anything worthwile
TBF....people that need to pay for tips & cant sort out their own, are on a loosing wicket straight away!
No-one forces anybody to join a tipping service.
Naive people have always been conned.
move along now, nothing to see here
Naive people have always been conned.
move along now, nothing to see here
swift tuttle is right but just like every other financial service they should not be allowed to make claims about past or future profits that are in anyway deceitful or without a basis in fact.
If swifty has a pension I wonder if he would be so liberal with his attitude towards someone that promises xxxxx but deliver zzzilch, after dazzling with figures and graphs and getting him pished and layed...
If swifty has a pension I wonder if he would be so liberal with his attitude towards someone that promises xxxxx but deliver zzzilch, after dazzling with figures and graphs and getting him pished and layed...
Haven't really met one of these con artists who lay on that kind of hospitality FD, at least you're getting something for your cash ....
and u sayed murray would never win a grand slam yet here we are...
it's a saying daz have you never heard it before? Perhaps you are naive
fat dodgy, you said swift tuttle was right and then criticised him for his attitude!
in a way u are right, but if people see something in a reputable publication be it the RP or some section of the FT there is an element of trust there is there not that someone is checking the claims being made in those adverts, now the FSA try to see to it that this is done and will issue fines, bans or even prosecute individuals for fraud on our behalf to protect our pensions, a lot of time you wouldnt even know yourself, so why even on a smaller scale should these people be allowed to tell whopping lies in so called esteemed publication etc.
i am not really blaming the RP, although if it was me, i think i'd lose these con men for the little they bring in in ad revenue, the publicity isnt great, but can u imagine what would happen if they had actually colluded with the criminals on their scams, its a bit like the FT owner using this esteemed publication to tell evryone to invest in a ponzi scheme that he set up...
i am not really blaming the RP, although if it was me, i think i'd lose these con men for the little they bring in in ad revenue, the publicity isnt great, but can u imagine what would happen if they had actually colluded with the criminals on their scams, its a bit like the FT owner using this esteemed publication to tell evryone to invest in a ponzi scheme that he set up...
i was talking to daz550 about murray, he is right in the sense that if people just join bad tipping services thats their look out but if they have been bamboozled and lied to thats different
I like to think of that process as Darwinian FD
I totally agree FD, I have always thought that the RP and media people within racing should not have anything to do with so called tipping services. I remember when Derek Thompson started his and thought channel 4 should sack him. Suppose I was just being naive in expecting that.
we ceased to be subject to those rules a long time ago swifty and u know it, i like to think of it as it actually is and thats fraud.
the other thing it is is very damging to a sport that is really strugling
The adverts in the racing post, the claims are valid.
but a lot of the tipsters only show the winners for example DEREK THOMPSON WILL HAVE AN ADVERT SAYING 5 WINNER THIS WEEK 3/1 2/1 2/1 6/4 5/4 yes fair enongh but in wont tell you he had 17 losers and his £600 down to £100 stakes. Plus the racing post will not give information on all the tipsters previous bets it will simply claim all our adverts are checked for validity but a tipster will only show the information they want you to see.
but a lot of the tipsters only show the winners for example DEREK THOMPSON WILL HAVE AN ADVERT SAYING 5 WINNER THIS WEEK 3/1 2/1 2/1 6/4 5/4 yes fair enongh but in wont tell you he had 17 losers and his £600 down to £100 stakes. Plus the racing post will not give information on all the tipsters previous bets it will simply claim all our adverts are checked for validity but a tipster will only show the information they want you to see.
Derek thompson is just using his name the sell tips hes a lousy tipster
yes it's terrible isn't it? he gives a tip and it doesn't win
shocking
shocking
backing a loser that tw@t charged you for would be now move on
i have a fool proof laying system.will i sell it?no..cause i want it all for myself!
Just had a mail shot from S.L.H. a nice guy but a lousy tipster, if he was as good as he claims why not back them himself, you can get on on here so you don't need accounts with bookies.
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