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workrider
10 Aug 12 16:29
Joined:
Date Joined: 29 Jun 02
| Topic/replies: 28,865 | Blogger: workrider's blog
just wondering if we should start a old jockeys thread , having given us much pleasure over the years , surely they deserve some praise ....i'm sure the likes of ged, onlooker etc etc..will help with insights into their winners from yesteryear ....what i hope will happen is , everyday there is a jockeys birthday in the racing post from the 60s 70s 80s , we could review their past success ,o.k. todays birthday boy is JOHN CURANT ....do we have a starter for ten....
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Report TambourineMan. June 16, 2016 11:04 PM BST
I heard today somebody eulogising R.Moore...with the implication that we should rank Lester Scobie Stevie etal
as also rans in the Pantheon of Jockeys.
Moore wouldn't be in my top 10...sorry Modernists.
Report blackbarn June 16, 2016 11:20 PM BST
TambourineMan - Please post your top ten then. You might want to post your rough "period of experience" so that the oldies (or newies) don't criticise you for excluding their favourites.

nb - if you have Scobie in your top ten you must be as old and dim as me.
Report themightymac June 17, 2016 2:46 AM BST
Fred Archer, Sir Gordon and Lester were the top three Flat jockeys in Turf history.

The man from Wagga Wagga was good but not in their class. I always remember him in that old Arcade machine at the Fair Grounds.

When Ryan's career is over, he will easily make the top fifty.
Report Oldgit1 June 17, 2016 9:42 AM BST
Blackbarn... It was a rather tongue in cheek after thought but he did have a very high percentage of winners over timber. It was presumably in his mind to do if he could not keep his weight in range and his father would no doubt have encouraged it.
Report themightymac June 17, 2016 6:18 PM BST
I would think that the best jockey over both codes would undoubtedly be the legendary Percy Woodland. He victories on Flat included French Derby and over jumps two Nationals. He not only was a brilliant jockey but a great man. Hollywood should make a movie about him.
Report workrider June 17, 2016 6:52 PM BST
Feck me themightymac I never even heard of him...Shocked
Report geordie1956 June 17, 2016 7:11 PM BST
just checked on johnny seagrave who i remember from some years ago - he died in 2009 but was a jockey for in excess of 30 years before retiring in 1984 - in his day won the ayr gold cup, haydock sprint & the gimcrack which has always been one of my favourite races

trying to remember if he rode regularly for denys smith - maybe someone can say
Report blackbarn June 17, 2016 7:20 PM BST
Good info (as usual) on George's Jockeypedia website on Seagrave.  Here's a taster....

"In the first 17 years of his career, he rode just 81 winners. In the last 19, he rode 849".
Report workrider June 17, 2016 7:21 PM BST
Johnny rode mostly in the North , so I say he did, loved his greyhounds and I think he trained a few greyhound winners .
Report workrider June 17, 2016 7:21 PM BST
Johnny rode mostly in the North , so I say he did, loved his greyhounds and I think he trained a few greyhound winners .
Report kingG111111 June 17, 2016 7:33 PM BST
Nob jockey
Report Oldgit1 June 17, 2016 7:44 PM BST
Percy Woodland, even before my time.
https://sites.google.com/site/allsoppfredjockey/woodland-percy
Report themightymac June 18, 2016 12:47 AM BST
workrider, I posted this on another thread but worth repeating since you obviously missed it.

Percy Woodland

Tony Lake asks “Who does Vincent Cheminaud think he is, Percy Woodland?”

When the champion French jump jockey, Vincent Cheminaud, won the Prix du Jockey Club to add to his victory in the Grand Steeplechase de Paris thoughts turned to Percy Woodland. Not only did the English champion jockey win two “French Derbys” and two Grand Steeples, his glittering career also included two Grand Nationals. Still in his prime when the Great War broke out, he then volunteered to do his bit and then… reports of his death were exaggerated.
As soon as the son of the Hendon trainer started race-riding he started being noticed. “a word of attention is due”, wrote the Standard’s correspondent, “a juvenile member of the Woodland family…won” the Cowden Selling Chase at Lingfield “cleverly” on 3/1 joint favourite Crepu. It was 16 December 1895 and Percy Maurice Woodland was 13 years old. (A late starter compared to his brother Herbert, who rode his first winner at nine.) Within eight years, in 1903, he was the youngest ever champion NH jockey, with 54 winners.
Early in his career he teamed up with the horse that he was to say was the best he had ever ridden: Leinster. In 1903, Leinster won the Grand Sefton Chase under 12st 7lb, and three other races, and the next season was unbeaten in four races, including Liverpool’s Champion Chase. In France, the partnership won two steeplechases in the 1904-05 season, and in 1910, they won three races, including the Valentine Chase and the Champion Chase for the second time.
Woodland first tasted big race success in the 1903 Grand National. Drumcree, the runner up in 1901 and favourite in 1902 only to finish outside of the top four, returned as favourite again at 13/2. With his booked jockey Hugh Nugent injured, Woodland was hired as deputy. Giving a textbook ride, he hunted around the first circuit, then steadily made ground to join the leaders at the last to run out a cosy winner. Percy followed up by winning two of the three jumping events the following day; steering Hearwood to victory in the Liverpool Handicap Hurdle and Rose Wreath in the Champion Chase.
In those days it had become customary for top jockeys to leave England after Manchester’s Easter meeting to ply their trade in Europe. Woodland went further than most, however, by setting up a training yard in France. He sampled big race success in France for the first time in 1904. M Eugene Fishcof had supplemented Dandolo in the Grand Steeplechase de Paris and booked Woodland to ride. “Beautifully ridden” he took up the running fully a mile from home in the 4 mile contest worth £5,000 to win by a length from Gascon II and Spa III.
In the 1905 renewal, Woodland was aboard Canard owned by one of France’s premier owners, M Jean Stern. Following a downpour the Auteuil surface was slippery and seven of the 13 runners came to grief, including Dandolo. Canard was always running well though and “finished in excellent style” to win by three lengths. Cheered to the echo, Woodland was then presented to King of Spain and the President of France.
Woodland’s first Prix du Jockey Club victory came the following year on Maintenon. After WK Vanderbilt’s colt had finished second in the French 2000 Guineas he was made a 7/1 chance in a field of 17. In a driving finish Woodland got the better of Johnny Reiff on Querido.
Within days Woodland was back in the winner’s enclosure after a big race, this time taking the “French Champion Hurdle”, the Grande Course de Haies, with Fragilité. Remarkably, Percy was not only the rider of Fragilité but the owner and trainer too.  Sold to André Delbos, in 1907,  the horse and rider went on to win the Prix du President de la Repubique at Maisons-Laffitte.
The Grand Course de Haies was a feature race of “Grande Semaine d’Auteuil” and there, as well as Longchamp, Deauville and Nice, or wherever elegance reigned in France, the English jockey was in demand. Described in the Encyclopaedia of Steeplechasing as a “loved character of dry wit, suave manner and debonair appearance,” he featured as much in the gossip pages as the racing pages.  This culminated in 1906, when he married Emilienne d’Alençon who was one of the “three most notorious courtesans of the age”.
Woodland won his second “French Derby” in 1910, on the Willy Carter trained Or du Rhin II. Winning the £7045 prize for M Gaston Dreyfus, the partnership came home a length clear of Renard Bleu.
Although spending most of his time in France, when Ernie Piggott injured his hand days before the 1913 Grand National, Woodland was called-up to deputise on Covertcoat. Owner, Sir Charles Assheton-Smith, was seeking his third National, after success with Cloister and Jerry M, and Covertcoat obliged. Only two of the 22 runners had clear rounds and the joint second favourite coasted in by a distance. An advocate of the American style of riding, he rode short and had superb balance. He “put his horse in most painstaking fashion at every fence” and it has been said that he had the “smallest percent of falls” of any steeplechase jockey riding.
At the call to arms in August 1914, Percy, along with weighing room colleagues including George Heasman, Jack and Owen Anthony, Jack Drake, Peter Roberts and Lord Torrington, went to London to enlist in the 19th Reserve Squadron of Hussars.
Promoted to corporal within a month he clearly took to military life. By March, he was attached to an armoured motor car division and on his way to Gallipoli. At the Dardanelles, he was shot in the foot by a sniper, however, by June, when this was reported in the Sporting Life, he was not only “practically well again” but promoted to lieutenant in the RNAS.  Indeed he must have made a good recovery because we next hear of him amongst the winners again, somewhere in Egypt, riding “in races got up for the general amusement”.
It was in Egypt that he was put in charge of a naval motor contingent and took part on a raid that resulted in reports of his death. In December, the Sporting Life carried the headline ‘Death of P. Woodland. Famous Cross County Rider Killed in Egypt’.
In January, however, the Sporting Times clarified that he had been taken prisoner in Palestine. “He had been flying some 25 miles inland from Alexandretta, in the neighbourhood of Aleppo, on a hydroplane. Flying at a height of 5,000 feet, he suddenly became the object of heavy anti-aircraft fire. His plane was riddled, and his propeller shot away. Bullets tore into his knee; such was the agony that he fell into a merciful unconsciousness. He should have died, but astonishingly woke up in a Turkish hospital instead. Apart from a fractured knee, his only other injury was a broken collarbone.”
Lieutenant Woodland spent the rest of the war as a POW but was “in very comfortable quarters and is being well-treated by his captors” according to the Sporting Life. In July, from his camp at Cozgad, in Asia Minor, he wrote to his sister and her husband, Vic Tabor, the Epsom trainer, claiming to be “fit and happy, but longing to get home”.  However, by August, he was wondering “if he will be able to ride at all again, as he has not seen a horse at all for six months, except a few ponies in the district, mounted by old men in dressing gowns.” He seemed in good spirits though admitting “to learning all sorts of trades, plain needlework, boot mending, etc.”  A man from Mexico, said the Sporting Life, “is also trying to teach him Spanish.”
He was a prisoner for 18 months and his weight fell to eight stone.  On his return to England he convalesced with the Tabors and by the middle of February it was reported that “P. Woodland was getting fit.”
A fortnight later, 4 March, he was back in the winner’s enclosure  – but his mount attracted more attention than him. By winning (actually dead-heating) the seller at Wolverhampton, Wild Aster was proving to be an exceptional horse as he was winning as an 18-year-old.  The jockey was renewing an association that went back to 1905, when he first won on the son of Victor Wild at Leicester.  In 1909, the combination dead-heated for a £4000 prize in Nice and around that time Charles Assheton-Smith’s gelding was considered the best hurdler on both sides of the Channel.
Gradually, Woodland wound down his riding career and eventually, settled at Grateley, near the Hampshire-Wiltshire border, to train.  Although his training career was not as successful as his riding career – it was never going to be – he had plenty of winners.  After finishing runner-up (partnered by Woodland) in the 1920 Champion Hurdle (run at Gatwick), his dual-purpose colt, Furious, pulled off a 33/1 shock in the Lincolnshire Handicap.  Reviving his military connection he trained three winners of both of the premier military races – the Grand Military Gold Cup and the Royal Artillery Gold Cup. Foxtrot (1926), Scotch Eagle (1927) and Drin (1929) winning the former and Snapper (1926 and 1927)and St Roy (1929) the latter.
He trained two horses of immense promise but both came up against all-time greats. Gib, after shouldering 12st 9lb and thrashing some decent horses in the Troytown Chase at Lingfield, was well-backed at 13/8 to maintain a year-long unbeaten sequence and beat Easter Hero in the 1930 Cheltenham Gold Cup. Ridden by Fred Rees and after going a cracking gallop, he was still upsides at the second last when he fell.  He was never the same again. French import El Hadjar, after some sparkling form in France, was well-fancied at 11/4 to beat Golden Miller in the 1934 Cheltenham Gold Cup. However, the 75,000Fr purchase was no match for The Miller and fell when weakening at the second last; next time out, in the Champion Chase, he suffered a fatal fall.
Woodland’s training career was curtailed by the Second World War and he died in 1958. “Field Steward” in the Sporting Times said, “In his heyday, Percy Woodland, was the best steeplechase rider I had ever seen.” In over a century no one has come near to matching his achievements…so good luck to Vincent Cheminaud.
Report ged June 18, 2016 11:46 AM BST
Great read about Percy Woodland.

Though I find that his Furious actually finished 3rd in the Champion Hurdle Cup at Gatwick, not 2nd, having not jumped well. There were just 4 runners, but the 3 principals went into the race undefeated, with White Heat winning from Planet, and Furious. As for the Lincoln, he made all the running at 33/1 - but a couple of days before his Gatwick hurdles effort, he had been 20/1 6th fav in the ante-post betting for the Lincoln, so presumably it was thought the hurdles race had lessened his chance.

If anyone is interested in battleships - as well as reading an analysis of the 1920 Lincoln, you can read a 3-column discussion on the design of the then brand new HMS Hood (she was commissioned on 15/5/1920) in light of the then fairly recent battle of Jutland. p10/11.

https://news.google.co.uk/newspapers?nid=GGgVawPscysC&dat=19200325&printsec=frontpage&hl=en


Also of note is the ante-post list for the 1920 Grand National. Poethlyn is 3/1 fav to complete a hat-trick in the race, despite having to carry 12-7. He didn't do it, of course. He fell early on, and there were only 5 finishers.
Report ged June 18, 2016 11:51 AM BST
As for Gib, he'd won 9 in a row prior to the Gold Cup, was up with Easter Hero early on, dropped back looking beaten, then rallied to rejoin him, then fell. He was a 7yo to Easter Hero's 10.
Report ged June 18, 2016 12:17 PM BST
As for the 1920 Grand National, and Poethlyn .... that was his first defeat for 3 years - he'd won the race the year before under 12-7. The fences that year were 'strengthened', and in light of that, Ernie Piggott, who'd won the big race on him the previous 2 years, gave up his only ride on the Thursday so that he would be sure to be able to ride Poethlyn in the big race on the Friday. In the steeplechase on the Thursday, the Stanley Cup, only 2 of the 9 got round (the top weight carried 13-3) - the rest of the card were flat races.
Report workrider June 18, 2016 12:48 PM BST
Quite a lad was our Mr Woodland ,some incredible stats weightwise in there as well ...
Report ged June 18, 2016 1:36 PM BST
Picture here of the 19th hussars in 1914 before leaving for the front, including Percy Woodland, 'Jack' Drake, George Heasman, Lord Torrington, Peter Roberts....

http://www.diomedia.com/stock-photo-jockeys-as-troopers-in-the-19th-hussars-ww1-image18041932.html
Report themightymac June 18, 2016 3:44 PM BST
Great photo ged.
Report Meyer Lansky June 19, 2016 12:10 PM BST
Some terrific contributions on this thread ...

I'd just like to add a little tale of my own I recall hearing about Scobie Breasley, I think it came from Lord Oaksey.

There was a posh raceday dinner at one of the southern courses ,Scobie and his wife were there.Mrs Breasley was sitting next to one of the senior stewards of the Jockey Club.He had been reading the days' racecard and turned to Mrs B to ask if Scobie was " having a bet that afternoon " to which Scobie's wife replied " Oh no,he's not had a bet since he stopped riding " Laugh
Report TambourineMan. June 21, 2016 1:23 PM BST
Been a while now since Lindsay died not sure if it was marked on here.

http://www.gazetteherald.co.uk/news/13634077.Racing_pays_tribute_to_former_North_Yorkshire_jockey/
Report TambourineMan. June 21, 2016 1:25 PM BST
Destined for greatness...
Report LordMoore1 June 21, 2016 2:10 PM BST
Stanley Clayton who rode for the Queen.
Report themightymac June 21, 2016 9:43 PM BST








Report workrider June 21, 2016 9:48 PM BST
Whos that with the blonde themightymac ?
Report blackbarn June 21, 2016 9:52 PM BST
Is it Ron?
Report dambuster June 21, 2016 10:06 PM BST
whos the top jockeY in those photos MM ?
Report blackbarn June 21, 2016 10:07 PM BST
Geoff Lewis.
Report blackbarn June 21, 2016 10:11 PM BST
Just in case Mac's asleepLaugh Geoff Lewis, Ron Barry, Arthur "Scobie" Breasley, the Great Greville Starkey, and finally, I think it is Ron Hutchinson.(I don't remember him being that small, but it could be very big blonde)
Report dambuster June 21, 2016 10:15 PM BST
He looks like he's sitting on her knee, i can imagine her saying
''Gottle of geer''..Laugh
Report blackbarn June 21, 2016 10:20 PM BST
or "Do you, Ron, Ron.
Report workrider June 21, 2016 10:36 PM BST
On reflection it does look a little like Hutch.
Report themightymac June 22, 2016 1:57 AM BST
Thanks Blackbarn for covering the bases. 100% right of course with all five.

The blonde is Jaimee Rogers the Australian sports presenter known as the TAB girl. Ron was getting inducted into Australia's Hall Of Fame. Here he is as we know him.

Report themightymac June 22, 2016 1:58 AM BST
He was easy to follow during a race workrider with his famous bobbing head, lol.
Report themightymac June 22, 2016 2:07 AM BST












Report themightymac June 22, 2016 2:49 AM BST
DK
JG
WC
DS
TC
KL
GF
Report Catch Me ifyoucan April 6, 2019 1:16 AM BST
ttt
Report onthejim March 26, 2020 10:49 PM GMT
ttt again, brilliant read, done half over last two and half hours, finish rest tomorrow.
Report RothmanMike March 27, 2020 5:52 AM GMT
Edgar Britt,Scobie Brealey,George Moore, Ron Hutchinson,Australians do well when they come over here.
Report blackbarn March 27, 2020 8:54 AM GMT
Bill "Weary Willie" Williamson was Australian!!  - Hutchinson said Breasley and Williamson were the best two (Australian?) jockeys he ever saw.  Lester Piggott had a firm view on that subject!
Report onthejim March 27, 2020 9:12 AM GMT
loved the story of Geoff Baxter decking Piggott.
Report dambuster March 27, 2020 5:12 PM GMT
Wasn't Geoff Baxter the one who married Willie Carsons mum Violet ?
Report foxy March 27, 2020 6:10 PM GMT
Behave yourself Laugh
Report onthejim March 27, 2020 6:50 PM GMT
Have you read thru this Foxy?, got from page 31 to read tonight, different class to the dross on TV at present, I wonder how many of the contributors are still with us?
Report foxy March 27, 2020 6:54 PM GMT
Not yet onthejim but I will do.

Hope you and the family are keeping well.
Report foxy March 27, 2020 6:56 PM GMT
Good grief frankel hadn’t even ran at York when this thread started,at least when I’ve finished reading it the Coronavirus will be over.
Report onthejim March 27, 2020 6:57 PM GMT
Yes we're ok thanks , trust you and yours are as well.
Report onthejim March 27, 2020 6:59 PM GMT
I found it again by accident whilst searching for something else, thought it just had to be bumped up to current page.
Report EvgenyKissin September 15, 2020 5:29 PM BST
Does anybody remember Edward Hyde? I think he won **** of the North sixteen times.
Report EvgenyKissin September 15, 2020 5:30 PM BST
*Sorry - 'Hide', not 'Hyde'.
Report onlooker September 15, 2020 5:38 PM BST
Yes - Eddie Hide always considered to be the Top Northern Jockey - although some Joe Sime supporters would put up a case for him.

Hide's brother  William trained the Lincoln winner Ben Novus.
Report themightymac September 15, 2020 5:43 PM BST
Eddie won the Derby of course on Morston for the Budgetts.
Report EvgenyKissin September 15, 2020 7:46 PM BST
Jock Skilling was a good work rider.
Report driver2 September 16, 2020 10:19 AM BST
Back in 1967 I took a week off work with my gf and went to Epsom for the 4 days, I had a great week, backed Royal Palace and Charlottown and a couple of others, but I missed the Oaks winner, Pia, ridden by EDDIE HIDE, great jockey.
Report EvgenyKissin September 16, 2020 2:46 PM BST
Paddy Broderick was a good jockey - gave up the inside to nobody.
Report LoyalHoncho September 16, 2020 4:07 PM BST
Eddie Hide was **** of the north for donkey's ages.  I seem to remember he held the distinction of being jocked off a Derby fav. by Piggott.  Could be wrong.  John Gorton.  My first ever classic winning jockey. South African?   Sleeping Partner, Doug Smith, Oaks, late 60's?
Report workrider September 16, 2020 5:29 PM BST
Great to see this old thread making it back on here, so many wonderful memories of some great jockeys...
Report themightymac September 16, 2020 5:33 PM BST
Sleeping Partner was indeed trained by Doug Smith and Gorton was South African. Actually, it was Sleeping Partner`s owner Lord Rosebery who convinced John Gorton to come to the UK and ride as his retained jockey.

Here is the race Honcho: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrV9sIsCsaU

He later became 1st jockey for Bruce Hobbs and they struck up a wonderful partnership.
Report themightymac September 16, 2020 5:39 PM BST
Regards Morston, Eddie Hide was very fortunate to ride him. Budgett`s stable jockey Frankie Durr had rode Mon Fils to win the Guineas for Richard Hannon and Mon Fils was fav or 2nd fav for the Derby and he rode that one in the Derby. Initially Durr had opted to ride Morston but changed his mind on the morning of the race and Eddie Hide got the mount.
Report workrider September 16, 2020 5:46 PM BST
Good man themightymac, always insightful and helpful...
Report Oldgit1 September 16, 2020 5:49 PM BST
onlooker
" Yes - Eddie Hide always considered to be the Top Northern Jockey - although some Joe Sime supporters would put up a case for him."

Billy Nevett (probably had mentions on this thread before) was better than both of then though a bit earlier.
My Granny used to often stay at the Stair Arms Hotel outside Edinburgh where Nevett stayed if riding in Scotland. She once asked Margaret the waitress if he had given her any tips. Yes, she replied but he's no good. He told me to do all of his mounts last Monday and only five of them won.
Report workrider September 16, 2020 6:03 PM BST
Laugh  Brilliant Oldgit1.
Report EvgenyKissin September 16, 2020 8:41 PM BST
Terry Lucas - apparently very quick to work how good a horse was.
Report punchestown September 16, 2020 9:12 PM BST
From my early days at the track,George McGrath,Ray Carroll,Oliver Gray,Paddy Sullivan,Johnny Roe,John Corr,Paul Jarman.RF (Buster) Parnell amongst a lot of others...
Report workrider September 16, 2020 10:19 PM BST
George McGrath and Sweet Mimosa , Ray, father of Gary his Mother Sally was part of the I.N.S. Johnny Roe and Mick Connolly always got the flat off to a great start on St Patricks day. Buster was English, I brought a Stallion to cover a mare for him one day , not as much as a fiver did he drop me...
Report EvgenyKissin September 16, 2020 10:41 PM BST
Nick Bampton had a great relationship with Stepherion. Used to ride for the 'sprint king' Jack Holt.
Report themightymac September 17, 2020 7:19 PM BST
I always wonder what happened to Compton Rodriguez who made the angry ant look like the hulk. They used to carry his saddle for him when laden with lead to make up the official weight. Rode for Bruce Hobbs and he rode the huge grey Scallywag one day, which was arguably the biggest horse in training. He was a very good light weight but disappeared off the radar.

Another great apprentice who seemed to disappear was Robert Sidebottom, who was attached to Denys Smith stable, and rode many for Lionel B. Holliday the famous owner. Lester regarded him highly and tipped him to be the next great jockey. I don`t know what happened but it might have been weight problems as he was tall for a jockey.
Report skiptoomaloumacari September 17, 2020 7:42 PM BST
robert sidebottam  is senior instructor at the british racing school newmarket.....
Report onthejim September 17, 2020 8:14 PM BST
Ekissen , I heard the same ( from a good source) that Lucas was a very shrewd judge and definitely new the time of day !
Report FELTFAIR September 17, 2020 9:33 PM BST
Duncan Keith.
Report LoyalHoncho September 17, 2020 10:34 PM BST
Many thanks Mighty MacSleeping Partner race - so good to see the race again.  And your other bits of knowledge are so accurate and memorable.  Great stuff.  I think me and my mate were only about 12 when we both had a bob each way on at 20/1 as I recall.  What I vivdly remember is that his big brother, who wasn't to be messed with, was raging mad when we shouted it home, as he was on the runner up.  "You two koonts shouldn't be flucking betting anyway" !We scarpered smartish not before he'd kicked my mate a beauty up the rss!  Can't remember for the life of me how we got it on ( or out ) but I do remember it was in the days just before standard betting slips came in ( or pens ) and we wrote the bets in pencil on a torn out page of a school exercise book!  In these days you opened a bookies door and a whole stoor of smoke came belching out.  You could barely see anything above six feet high.
12 years old and I'm loaded, with a £pound and some in my pocket!  Laugh
Report brians September 18, 2020 12:05 AM BST
I was 10 when my Dad took me to York for the ebor meeting in 1960.
I remember stopping Lester on his way to the paddock and asked for his autograph. He stopped and signed my racecard and thanked me !
It was only later that I marvelled at his politeness given that he is known for his craggyness  . He was one of the great jockeys even then and I was just a snotty nosed kid in shorts.
Eddie Hide also gave me his autograph and naively I asked if he was going to win. He said” You'd better ask the horse ,son “.
Great memories.
Report workrider September 18, 2020 9:14 AM BST
Feltfair I think Duncan had huge weight problems , very good jockey and ended up running a pub somewhere I believe...
Brians, great story, a smiling Lester now there's a thing of beauty..
LoyalHoncho, another wonderful story, bet, pardon the pun you were hooked from there on in!.
Report sageform September 18, 2020 10:39 AM BST
I remember being on a plane back from Deauville around 1970 when Duncan Keith and Peter Walwyn were also on it. Some more names from the past who rode for Jim Old in the days when I was an owner. Sandy May rode my first winner as an owner and Clive Candy and Paul Richards also rode. Clive later became assistant trainer. Later Guy Upton rode for a few years as did Tom Grantham.
Report FELTFAIR September 18, 2020 12:33 PM BST
In 1966 I was working as a student in Battersea and had the following bet, I Say (Coronatioin Cup) ridden by Duncan Keith, trained by Walter Nightingall and a horse called Lampus as I recall trained by Fred Armstrong but don`t remember the jockey.

Two and sixpence win each and a two and sixpence win double. Both won at 10/1 and 100/8 respectively.Couldn`t believe my luck getting what was a months student wages at the time.

Sorry about the aftertiming.
Report ged September 18, 2020 1:39 PM BST
Lampus was trained by Jack Watts and ridden by Brian Taylor. Those 2 winners formed the daily Double, though as it paid £57 9s (to a 10/- stake), you were better off at SP.
Report FELTFAIR September 18, 2020 2:20 PM BST
Thanks for that I would have never got the trainer and jockey.
Report workrider September 18, 2020 6:09 PM BST
Feltfair a millionaire for a few weeks after collecting that bet, its incredible to think how short money was in those days...
Report themightymac September 18, 2020 6:28 PM BST
No problem LH.

Thanks skip for info on Robert Sidebottom.

Cheers workrider.
Report themightymac September 18, 2020 6:30 PM BST
Great thread.
Report LoyalHoncho September 18, 2020 6:40 PM BST
Cheers workrider.  It did and I was.  In the same year my old man wanted a bit of company on the bus ( I worked out later ) and he took me to the dogs on a Saturday night.  Unbelievable, just by looking at the dogs on the way by/parade ( and I followed them around almost, I picked the first three winners on looks and appearance.  Pure co-incidence, who the flyck knows, but I know I was hugely disappointed when my old man hadn';t backed them!  Then this noise filled the air and I had no idea what was happening.  He told me later he stood and watched me, not having told me, to see my reaction.  Then six dogs, with multi coloured jackets flashed out of the boxes, heads up and down, round the bend, flashed past me ( and hundreds of others! ) on the spectator rail and the rest is history!  Absolutely hooked.  The pie and bovril and having my old man to myself for ten minutes later on was magic too!
Report FELTFAIR September 18, 2020 7:23 PM BST
Workrider, when I graduated in 1968 I started my first job at £1400 a year and was living the dream.
Report workrider September 18, 2020 9:17 PM BST
More great stories lads thanks, I was engaged at 17 and me and my girlfriend went to bingo in Liberty Hall in Dublin I won the top prize which was the princely sum of £100 in Ireland at the time . The talk was about the engaged couple who won the huge prize Laugh. I thought I was a millionaire....
Report MJK September 18, 2020 10:39 PM BST

Sep 16, 2020 -- 9:12PM, punchestown wrote:


From my early days at the track,George McGrath,Ray Carroll,Oliver Gray,Paddy Sullivan,Johnny Roe,John Corr,Paul Jarman.RF (Buster) Parnell amongst a lot of others...


I was in primary school and used to write to Christy Roche and Raymond Carroll(the penpal thing was in full swing then). The jockeys used to have their phone numbers and addresses in the phone book then. Still have some of the letters.

Report brians September 18, 2020 11:29 PM BST
When I was about 9 in 1958 , My Dad used to take holidays in Devon and used to take me and my Uncle Fred to Newton Abbott, Devon and Exeter and the now defunct Buckfastleigh.  Now Uncle Fred was a very dour Yorkshireman and never used two words where one was due. 
I think it was at Buckfastleigh one day that Uncle Fred had backed the favourite on the tote in a 3 mile chase. This horse ran away from the field with ease but it wasn't Fred's nature to cheer it on or even shout as it came to the last fence where we were stood, on its own and well in front.
With an enormous noise of breaking branches The horse ploughed through the fence and the jockey was catapulted into the air , arms and legs flailing like a cartoon character as the horse got up and galloped away. After several impressive somersaults the jockey landed near us .
He staggered to his feet , covered in mud and Fred beckoned him over.
This dishevelled , limping soul  looked over to Uncle Fred who calmly said , “ Tha owes me 4 bob. “.
Report LoyalHoncho September 19, 2020 2:40 AM BST
Laugh  Well done Brians.
I've got another story like yours workrider but it's kind of at a tangent to the thread really.  Suffice it to say that a greyhound ( mine ) paid for my wedding away back in '79.
Sometimes I look back and wonder what would have happened if it has got beat? SadMischief
Good old freckles!
Report workrider September 19, 2020 6:19 PM BST
Can just picture him Brians ...Laugh..Another jockey from yesteryear was Johnny Murtagh late 60s 70s could do very low weights and rode some nice winners
Report onlooker September 19, 2020 6:38 PM BST
Forgive my interjection - workrider - But  ...

"Johnny Murtagh"   - "late 70s 70s" ?

Do you not mean .... John ROE.

No mention of a Murtagh  on Jockeypedia - other than the recent one.
Report workrider September 19, 2020 6:43 PM BST
No Onlooker , he was a lightweight long before the present Johnny, think he could do 7.12.
Report San Quentin September 19, 2020 6:45 PM BST
Not old time jockeys, more no longer with us.
2nd Sun in Oct 2012  on the train back to Prague from a great day at Pardubicie sits in a carriage with this deflated unassuming young man turns out to be Treds. One of the best evenings in my life. Sadly missed Kind, good man.
Report onlooker September 19, 2020 6:50 PM BST
I will have to delve into my old books - workrider - and try to find some info/confirmation.

"7st 12" - was far from being a proper lightweight in the late 60s   - as the bottom weight was still just 7st dead - with apprentices riding at 6st 7 lb. with their claim  Happy
Report workrider September 19, 2020 7:11 PM BST
Johnny rode in Ireland I hope that helps...
Report onlooker September 19, 2020 7:15 PM BST
^ - I think we have taken that as an obvious given  HappySad  ... as, of course,  did John Roe - other than when he was riding some for Bernard Van Cutsem - from memory
Report blackbarn September 19, 2020 7:22 PM BST
Possibly no connection, but for the 1962 season, a J Murtagh was an apprentice to W (Dick) Hern. His registered weight for the coming season was 5st 10lbs
Report workrider September 19, 2020 7:30 PM BST
Johnny Roe was one of the best ever Irish jockeys never to ride regularly in Britain , spent most of his riding life in Ireland , a few short trips over for the odd ride in the Camb etc would have been about his limit...Johnny used to visit the pub were my uncle used to drink and would tell him about his rides , usually a winner on St Patricks day for Connolly would get the flat season up and running, Johnny ended up training in Asia before returning to Ireland were he was to be seen racing most days at the Curragh , sadly he died around a year ago..R.I.P.
Report workrider September 19, 2020 7:37 PM BST
I see what you mean Onlooker , tried Googling him not a mention ...
Report sageform September 19, 2020 8:04 PM BST
Apart from ptp amateurs, the first jockeys I saw live were Derek Ancil and Bob Turnell among others at what was called the Beaufort meeting at Sherston which was under NH rules and nothing to do with the Didmarton ptp course. Must have been around 1955 at a guess.
Report workrider September 20, 2020 10:55 AM BST
Wow sageform, that's a long time going racing...
Report MJK September 20, 2020 1:06 PM BST

Sep 19, 2020 -- 7:30PM, workrider wrote:


Johnny Roe was one of the best ever Irish jockeys never to ride regularly in Britain , spent most of his riding life in Ireland , a few short trips over for the odd ride in the Camb etc would have been about his limit...Johnny used to visit the pub were my uncle used to drink and would tell him about his rides , usually a winner on St Patricks day for Connolly would get the flat season up and running, Johnny ended up training in Asia before returning to Ireland were he was to be seen racing most days at the Curragh , sadly he died around a year ago..R.I.P.


My old man always said Johnny spent too much time in the pub...

Report workrider September 20, 2020 2:59 PM BST
Johnny seldom put you wrong , him and Connolly were lethal with early 2 yos...
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