Ruby Walsh - Decline setting in

did you back toubab ?

never short of entertainment bobby

Poor Ruby......must be tough knowing Willie has about 20 grade 1 winners ready to rock.......Nicholls the same and any other trainer lucky enough to get him if they have one good enough.

Poor AP Stuck over in the UK unable to ride a finish due to crazy rules.

ttt

...just getting practice in for November to March.

Gant

bobby, how was qatar? thats where you were isnt it? the forum has ben lackin entertainment, theres muppets around alright but most are boring fools. you on the other hand are comedy gold

readers of this forum will know that I never back Nicholls/ Walsh, they are my bogey team!

I just think that Walsh is a pale imitation of the jockey riding 2 years ago, like all sports there are only so many injuries you can endure and stay at the top. They all catch up and the decline starts. Has for Mullins and Nicholls I think both are thin on the ground this year, and henderson is the man to be riding for eg Geraughty/ McCoy.

Nicholls yard is on the way down believe you me.

Reve, great to be back love the jumpers, been away cos the Flat is Frankel apart abysmal.

i thought dickie / hobbs was the bogey team[:(] nicholls will win the championship again i think! what were you up to out there? money good?

Herbs the problem is the value has gone. Dont be bitter about it.

Did you know that if you backed Barcelona in every game last season then you would had lost money.

Thats how odds work and bookmaking. Backing Barca 2 years ago showed a 27% profit.

Value changes, every year.

Hey up Reve

Probably the most boring and hot place in the world after week 1, so 3 months out there was painful to be honest, but yes the wedge was decent and I avoided the worst flat season in memory Frankel apart.

Love the jumpers so much more interesting.

Has for Hughes good riddance he's only whingeing cos he is the weakest jockey in the weighing room and knows hes stuffed under the new rules.

I think he lost the race because he kicked for home a bit soon, if there is a bit of physical decline I wouldn't be surprised, but with Ruby, it is the stride and the mind on good horses that one is looking for. He is taking fewer rides since he came back, a good move imo.

yeah love the jumpers myself! neill i see ruby isnt going to britain for average meetings, just if its at good tracks / if theres good prizemoney! i see willy twiston davies broke his collabone today, he really should be a flat jock

Yeah reve saw your thread, really bad luck, you couldn't say he has much future over jumps anyway,would he be light enough? Ruby only seems to be riding for a select few trainers at the minute, even in Ireland.

lowest weight in last 1 months was 8-13 according to rp, im sure hecould do lighter!

what age is ruby? u think hes comin to an end?

He's had a shocking run of injuries, here's hopinh for no more, he is magic to watch (32 y/o)

http://joe.ie/sports/horse-racing/the-injuries-of-racings-iron-man-ruby-wals...

oops,,,                       http://joe.ie/sports/horse-racing/the-injuries-of-racings-iron-man-ruby-wals...

fck it... il type em

Broken legs (1999)

Fractured wrist (2000)

Dislocated hip (2001)

Fractured hip (2003)

Dislocated shoulder (2007)

Emergency operation to remove spleen (2008)

Broken arm (April 2010)

Double leg-break (November 2010)

Crushed vertebra in neck (July 2011)

Reve

Bad injuries catch up and in each of the last 2 seasons hes had bad breaks. Dont get me wrong I think he is a fine rider but in my opinion the decline has started and he will never again be the jockey he was 3 years ago when he was at the height of his powers.

Herb

he must be bricking it coming from an authority such as yourself

hes lasted longer than adrian maguire already! i see your beloved choc has changed agents in hope of more rides while you were slogging it for the arabs bob!

Yeah more injuries than age, I'd say he is one more real bad one away really. I think you'd want to be 8 10 or something to ride at 9 stone so he even if he can do lighter, he wouldn't want to be getting heavier.

that weight for willie td was including all gear!

itll be interesting to see who walsh and the likes will use to ride their horses when they start training!

ah right sounds promising so, good luck to him, he clearly wants it anyway.

Townend or Cooper I'd guess

i like cooper alright, paul will probably be tied up alot!

Oh yeah forgot about that[smiley:crazy], there is a generation coming up though, the future owners for whom Ruby is the man, the guy who paid for yer Saturday night with the Hennessey winner or whatever so he'll be fine. He'll get some backing I'd say and he has already shown an ability to source good horses, laughing lashes and am....... can't think, Godolphin bought it.

Heskin, a lot of people speak highly of him I hear.

Ruby

yeah, i like him too. doesnt get enough rides i think!

He'd a bad aul injury I heard, a lad I was in college with is his cousin and apparently Hourigan likes to keep his claim to himself by all accounts, I think it was even said in an interview. Winter really is here isn't it

thats scandalous not letting the lad ride others horses. heskin could get a better job than with mickey hourigan

Heskin is a fine rider but sadly he rides for a dubious and ordinary trainer, so the lad is lucky if he rides 5 winnners a season............ Hourigan is a disgrace as an individual on and off the track, horrid man!

jesus don't quote me on that, I might have just imagined it but I'm sure I remember it being said, he got some nice wins on Church Isalnd if I recall, claim v handy for when Hourigan has one layed out

[;)]

thats v selfish though. if heskin went to britain he could go further than conor ofarrell

I'd definitely agree with that

maybe he has his eye on the Gigginstown job when Davy finishes though

if he stays with hourigan theres every chance he wont even be considered when davy does retire!

3 place only,6/4,6/4,6/4,easy money,the wworlds greatest jockey.

I woudn't be writing off Ruby just yet. This time of the year Nicholls's horses often seem to run out of puff after looking all over the winner.It happened at Chepstow last year, and last week too.Unfortunately for Nicholls's rivals, he has an alarming habit of churning out winners relentlessly a few weeks into the season. And Ruby will be riding them. On Daryl Jacob, well, as Nicholls no.2, he is cursed.Tizzard,Brennan,Heard,Thomas....none have exactly thrived in the position.

cork today,2 at 6/4 place?.

heard and brennan werent number 2 were they? i think theres a logical explanationfor the ones that have been sacked tbh. nicholls wanted sam thomas to be a success, but the reality was he didnt want a jock on his horses that couldnt stay on. christian williams was just shoite and nicholls didnt want to get rid of joe, his owners also did. he says hes he wasnt in a position to make a stand, he didnt pull the strings then. i think its also beneficial to jacob that he wasnnt a conditional with nicholls, so hes percieved as a good professional rather than a learner

her the fact that you made a comparison between mick fitz and ruby is a joke in it self, ruby is far superior, andin terms of winners mcoys has rode more winner than ruby, but the big meetings the valuable races, ruby is hands down the greatest, he won more big races than anyone else in history, streets ahead of any one at the festival and still loads more to come, mccoys far better at riding poor horses, put himv on a top horse and he'll ge it beat, rubys a much better horseman FACT

denman,agree, mcoy total grafter110 per cent commitment,ruby,clock in his head all distances,likes to play late.

utter rubbish McCoy is head and shoulders above Walsh who simply rides a huge amount of steering jobs. The ride on Toubab yesterday was quite frankly pathetic

For a man of 32, Ruby looks old. Completely grey, starting to go bald, stooped back. It all looks to have caught up with him.

However, he's the number one jockey for the champion trainers of Britain and Ireland - he's still going to get a lot of crack rides.

met ruby in dub airport last night buying milk, he had a face like thunder, wasnt very freindly when we asked him did he have any luck :)

herb,chelt 2012?.

Im surprised Ruby is as straight as he is, when you consider his father couldnt lie straight in bed.
Ruby has been picking and choosing his mounts for some time now, and who can blame him.
One for the future is Eddie O'Connell, will be very good one day.

herb u are an idiot, mccoy is totally a mon -friday jockey, rubys the man on the weekends at the big meetings, thats why mccoys only been top jockey once at the festival and ruby wins it nearly every year


mccoy= quantity
walsh= quality

end off discussion

Some right rubbush on this. Ruby gets many, many high class steering jobs and is all class. Imagine the confidence he gets from riding those. AP is outstanding, we have been lucky to have him, the idiots who knock him have an axe to grind, when he quits only then will people respect him and his achievements. He is a fantastic jockey and anyone denying them must be ignorant.

As for Christian Williams, I did not mind him RDS, although i think the final straw came on a ride at Huntingdon which looked quite bad on Predateur - he did not ride very many after that (not sure if that was the reason why). Heard was quite ordinary and Tizz was (and remains) anything other than a top class jockey.

r  carver- there is a reson why he gets top ride, cos he is the best horsman on the planet, that why nicholls and mullins chose him to ride for them,  i think mccoy is great at what he does no knocing him for that, but 90% off his winners throughout his career have been in nothing races, where as rubys the man for big races, look at the times when mccoy got rubys steering jobs on the likes of denman, were did he steer them stright on the floor!  can i ask you one question if you had the favourite for the gold cup, who would you want on it ruby or mccoy? i think 99% of people in racing i.e trainers, owner and shrewd punters would say  walsh! as i dont think mccoy is as good over fences as hurdles just my opionion

Denman85 - I think you are talking rubbish. Who does Henderson put up after Barry Gerraghty? Who did Nicholls turn to when his jockeys were injured last yr?

It is true, AP has always been motivated to win the title (a numbers game and as you say, GL to him for that) and has consequently put himself about, riding rubbish at Catterick of Fakenham, riding at Worcester through the summer evenings. AP rode for Pipe when his yard was crammed full of hanidcappers with the odd graded horse. He rides for Jonjo whose yard is mainly full (and has been for yrs) of rubbiush.

Ruby rides for the 2 most powerful (in terms of quality) yards in Europe. Every Saturday he is not scratching round on jonjo's rubbish but riding 2 lovely novices, something fancied in the big handicap and if it is a conditions race, usually the favourite. Do you really, honestly believe, the only reason Kauto, Denman, Twist Magic, Neptune, Master Minded, Taranis, Big Bucks etc etc etc etc kept on winning was because Ruby was on them? If so mate you are deluded. They were just quite simply the best horses.

And do not say AP gets Denman floored because it is simply untrue - Denman fell for Sam T at Aintree and UR for AP at Newbury (when Nicholls said he was undercooked) but AP finished 2nd to Impreial Commander at Cheltenham when Kauto - ridden by Ruby - had made 1 serious error and had fallen (I am not blaming Ruby, but these are facts). AP next did a magnificent job steering him around Punchestown when the horse hated it there.

In careers where they have both ridden thousands of horses, of course you can point to many bad rides. But I could be irrational and start blaming Ruby for - kauto falling in the gold cup, kauto's terrible + costly error at Aintree 3 yrs ago, Master Minded's terrible + costly error at Aintree 3 yrs ago, his error at Cheltenham in March this yr. I do not do that because racing is not so black and white.

Who would I want on either in a gold cup? My view is irrelevant but lets look at what Nicholls and his owners thnk because in the yr when everyone thought it was a match between Denman and Kauto (but Imperial won) and Ruby chose Kauto, who did Nicholls and his Denmans owners chose? AP, not Sam Thomas.

i do beleive if mccoy would of rode every horse rubys rode at festival in his career he would of rode less winners, thats just my opionion, i just dont think mccoys take a horse over a fence like ruby, hurdles they aint much between the two, but over fences walsh is the better horseman, that just my view , and i aint knocking mccoy, just think walsh is better over fences, im sure im not alone in this view.

i do beleive if mccoy would of rode every horse rubys rode at festival in his career he would of rode less winners, thats just my opionion, i just dont think mccoys take a horse over a fence like ruby, hurdles they aint much between the two, but over fences walsh is the better horseman, that just my view , and i aint knocking mccoy, just think walsh is better over fences, im sure im not alone in this view.

Fair enough Denman, we disagree but are entitled to hold opposing views. I suspect lots of people fall into either side on this one. I actually try to sit on the fence saying they are both brilliant. I think it is certainly true that they have differing styles, AP does make horses minds up more (IMO) that Ruby, who is quieter over a fence. I do not think it helps that some of Jonjo's look like they have been schooled in the dark (going back a long way too, that is!), whereas some of Nicholls are so well schooled his debut novices look like seasoned handicappers.

I dont care who you are,any Jockey who has a bad run of injuries will start to think twice before firing a novice chaser into a fence.

I backed Toubab yesterday,and thought Walsh done nothing wrong.Horse pulled and refused to settle early,he gave it his head and let it bowl along at halfway(correct decision imo).Admittedly he met the last 2 wrong,but in mitigation,the horse was running on empty.

tony mcoy,nicolls,denman1/6 fell king george,kauto star 4/7lost.?

Deadbrain - It is hard to know what that meant, but I suspect your name is apt.

Do you mean Denman was beaten at 1-6 in the AON? He did not fall btw, he UR, and anyone backing horses at 1-6 in a prep is not smart. In the King george Kauto was sick and was beaten by a superstar - he was also beaten when he made his error 2 out.

ruby walsh, nicholls, kauto - 8/11 gold cup (fell), 10/11 Gold Cup (beaten), Aintree 4/7 (beaten), QMCC 2/1 (fell), Exeter 2/11 (fell, remounted, fast finishing 2nd, injured in the process).

Ruby Walsh, Nicholls, Master Minded - Aintree 2/5 (beaten), QMCC 4/5 (beaten), QMCC 2/1 (beaten)

Anything else sensible to add?

Anyone who knocks this chap is a fool.

Just to make it clear guys, I think Ruby is magnificent and undimmed - i am just trying to stop the Ruby-lovers unfairly knocking 7 bells out of AP.

herblington with more utter clueless rants- bellend! end of story, why waste time on fools like this

Reports of his demise are a ridiculous but I wouldn't be surprised to see him a bit more selective with his efforts as time goes by, as with Eddery before, Frankie today and many others, the top jocks tend to develop a bit of a 'first or nowhere' type style in their later years ........

Anyone else notice how overbet all his mounts have been recently ?

Right on cue  ..............masterful ride on de Valira,  who I wouldnt have given a prayer of beatin First Liutenant.

Two class acts,Ruby for me though!

nothing wrong with that got him up 11/2.Boooooooooooooooom.

Great WD, ignore the sustantive post & concentrate on aftertiming. GL.

carver- ignore ruby's winning rides and post his few loses. wd. gl

You have clearly not read any of my posts about Ruby Taipan? I think he is wonderful, flawless.

I was merely reversing the technique the brain dead Ruby fans/AP knockers use against Ruby himself. Ruby is flawless but how anyone can knock APs whole career on the basis of his rides on Denman (which were not bad IMO) is beyond me - i tried to demonstrate how irrational that is by doing the same thing to Ruby (selecting a few times the horse got beat at odds on and blaming Ruby).

lowest weight in last 1 months was 8-13 according to rp, im sure hecould do lighter!

you need to able to weigh out under 8 stone easily to be a apprentice to get any rides

not knocking tony ,unlucky for nicolls stable?.

minted for years ,,cheltenham festival,tony ruby and barry

Oh dear.

The return of Bobbytampax.

flying bolt,benefit office opens monday,make you a bit happier ,eh.

deadbrain

I haven't a clue what you are talking about.

My post as anyone who has been on here 5 minutes would know was aimed at the opening poster.

I haven't the faintest idea who the feck you are.

Its super sunday and its bolty

Blunt Chisel ??

I thought you were a brickie ?

I aint the sharpest tool in the box

A lot sharper than most on here.

Be lucky bolty keep them in chex.

To get back on topic...bit of a slap in the face for Ruby after his defeat of the odds-on favourite, when de Valira's trainer all but said he would have preferred Paul Townend to have been on board!

Herblington is very hard on jockeys but there is merit in what he says,he doesn`t say Ruby is a bad jockey he just says a decline has set in and he is right.Ruby will retain the guile,he will retain the poise and all the abilities that made him the best but his broken body can`t take another fall and this will manifest itself when going into the last two fences.
Neither i or Herblington are slagging Ruby Walsh just noticing a fact and not apportioning blame.

Wildman thank you for pointing out what the masses of loons on here failed to see.

Bolty pleasure as always I'm sure we will have some fierce debates this winter.

Denman if you truly believe that Walsh is better than McCoy I suggest that your fave football team is Man Utd, your fave tipple is Guinness and you while away your days laying she-ite driveways for old Grannies then demanding an extortionate fee.......... oh and you believe in Fairies!!!

Herblington started this thread with the following,

"His ride on Toubab was to be quite honest a gutless piece of riding, the one by a man who is now frightened of asking fro the big one! If he had asked the horse for a decent leap at either of the last 2 fences it would have dotted up, but walsh played it safe and lost."

My question is, when did you ever see Ruby ask a horse for a stride?

I cant ever remember him doing it. He just sits there and lets the horse do the lot.

His injuries reflect the stat that he falls off more than any jockey since Carl LLewellyn.

i dont think he does fall more than most loper, but when he does somethin breaks!

loper you obviously know nothing about riding horses to say that.hes the best man ever to see a stride and shorten or lengten a horse 10/15 yards from a fence..hes as good as the best showjumping riders at it..your statement is incredible.his falls percentage is no higher than any of the top jockeys and the injurys are prob due to his tallness..hes the best nh horseman i ever seen in my lifetime..

I'm a Walsh fan and have to say that over the last few years he is riding his horses a lot more "safely" than in previous years. Sure he can still give the gem rides that only he could do but too many times he's wide giving horses a better look at the fences even in small fields. The ground he loses is lost forever. Its something to factor into his rides as his horse will need to be so much better than the field.

Kavvie I agree he is mustard but Dunwoody the best I have seen. He has no flaws (like Ruby). Williamson was also marvelous, as was Mick Fitz at his best (neither had flaws for me). Timmy Murphy at his peak was a top class horseman though never (IMO) the absolute strongest.  I cannot split the top 5 or 6.

ruby suffering from a lack of confidence at the moment