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was the talk in the ring after racing
a regular who attends almost everyday arround the country was just on the landing side of the last laid an even £50,000 and was matched for the lot at less than 1.5 [ some 1.02 and 1.03 ]
it's an easy game sometimes laying last fence fallers
a regular who attends almost everyday arround the country was just on the landing side of the last laid an even £50,000 and was matched for the lot at less than 1.5 [ some 1.02 and 1.03 ]
it's an easy game sometimes laying last fence fallers
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You can imagine him sitting there, pda in one hand , c 0ck in other praying for fallers, thats what this game is all about these days. sad innit
pda is not quick enough imo, must have a partner at home pressing the buttons
must be some right mugs around to be losing money like that on a faller
To be fair he'd have won the 50k whatever the price was if it was matched then. Doesn't really matter that it got matched at 1.02, just meant less liability.
Sadly the downside of Betfair,betting after the event has finished (IF YOU CANT WIN YOU CANT LOSE) legal thievery aided and abetted by a company that hopes to list on the stock exchange.
know all 30 Apr 09:33
pda is not quick enough imo, must have a partner at home pressing the buttons
Was a metaphoric PDA , i heard they are a lot faster than regular ones.
pda is not quick enough imo, must have a partner at home pressing the buttons
Was a metaphoric PDA , i heard they are a lot faster than regular ones.
Facts - how many losers do you expect when laying fallers? Legalised pickpockets imo.
i looked last night
from memory £39 at 1.01 , £4800 at 1.02 and £9500 at 1.03 for starters
from memory £39 at 1.01 , £4800 at 1.02 and £9500 at 1.03 for starters
Those who can afford to back thousands at 1.02 and 1.03 can afford losing it.
My sentiments entirely mmmalushka - thievery, no other word for it and thievery in my book is illegal. Why do B/Fair not put a mechanism in place to make such lays impossible ie scratch the horse from the in-running market once it falls ? Yes - I appreciate this requires them having a slicker faster system of working than those operating this sharp practice. Restrictions to size of single lay transactions in this 'flawed market' could be another safeguard for those who are being fleeced against those who are profiteering - I suggest this because I'm struggling for other ideas.
100k + matched between 1.02 and 1.3 and plenty more below evens so easily done.
but that would have been done before it got to the fence adge
no 1.03 before they jump nowadays
they bet 1.04 with 3 to jump at times
no 1.03 before they jump nowadays
they bet 1.04 with 3 to jump at times
No worse than the thievery Betfair package as a Premium Charge.
By the way, if he did win 50 LARGE, Betfair will no doubt be claiming £10k for themselves next Wednesday.
By the way, if he did win 50 LARGE, Betfair will no doubt be claiming £10k for themselves next Wednesday.
^
which is why they allow this practice in the first place
which is why they allow this practice in the first place
Surprising they even bother to suspend at the end of races these days, clouded leopard. Though then again, they often don't, at least not in real time.
i'm glad they do bother suspending at the end of a race 3753
it means i can watch the last half furlong on my screen without getting suckered into having a bet
it means i can watch the last half furlong on my screen without getting suckered into having a bet
what a result for that guy, on top of not having to pay to get in.....
No worse than the thievery Betfair package as a Premium Charge.
By the way, if he did win 50 LARGE, Betfair will no doubt be claiming £10k for themselves next Wednesday
unlikely. it would only be pc'd if this chap won lumps regularly. if its a one-off, it wouldn't count.
By the way, if he did win 50 LARGE, Betfair will no doubt be claiming £10k for themselves next Wednesday
unlikely. it would only be pc'd if this chap won lumps regularly. if its a one-off, it wouldn't count.
If he's laying fallers on course, I doubt he escapes it, Grappler.
Simple solution democrat,put GMT clock on televised pictures all transactions struck after event has finished are voided.
better off in the house playing from ATR, not joking either....
Thats true, leading to last and looking like winning, will trade 1.03 and 1.04, and all of that will have been posted as soon as the race came up the day before and the keep button used?
Good thinking mmmalushka - surely in B/Fair's interest to ensure their markets are as clean squeaky as possible.
Betfair don't give a flying one how clean their markets are, as long as people keep pouring their cash through the system.
I have posted about this issue on numerous occassions.How can it be BET FAIR when a horse has fallen and someone is scooping up bets that are impossible for the backer to win I.E horses that have fallen.The layer has won 50k but obviously the backer if the playing fields were level would not have had his 50k on if he knew the horse was on the deck??
The gambling commission investigation concluded; those with fast picture and tracks players help to ensure those playing inrunning from home get fair prices :)
Caveat Emptor.
Plenty of fools actually believe what they see is happening as they see it.
Sat watching @ home every fallers already hit the deck as you see it approaching the fence.
Plenty of fools actually believe what they see is happening as they see it.
Sat watching @ home every fallers already hit the deck as you see it approaching the fence.
bf should do something about the outrageous delay on SIS but imo turftv players cant have too many complaints.
par 30 Apr 09:33
must be some right mugs around to be losing money like that on a faller
Was it you par - on your toadstool at the last :^0
must be some right mugs around to be losing money like that on a faller
Was it you par - on your toadstool at the last :^0
If this scenario of laying fallen horses were to be discussed in a court of law surely the matter would be regarded as illegal and once a decision was made the necessary vehicles for such activities ie Exchanges would need to take the appropriate action.
Many years ago, before there were any dedicated racing tv channels, I placed a bet on a horse in a hurdle at Exeter via my Tote credit account. The girl said that the race is off and she would have to check.
About 15 seconds later she returned saying bet confirmed and ran through the usual procedure.
A few minutes later on teletext I was advised that my horse had not placed.
In the RP the next day I saw that the horse fell at the first hurdle - which I calculated was about 10 to 15 seconds away from the start: I do not see any difference whatsoever between what the on course boys are doing now and what the Tote did.
The only difference is that when I phoned the Tote they re-credited my account with my stake.
This may be a tongue in cheek question but can't the losers contact Betfair (who claim they are bookmakers acting as the interface) and claim their stake back?
No laughing please.
About 15 seconds later she returned saying bet confirmed and ran through the usual procedure.
A few minutes later on teletext I was advised that my horse had not placed.
In the RP the next day I saw that the horse fell at the first hurdle - which I calculated was about 10 to 15 seconds away from the start: I do not see any difference whatsoever between what the on course boys are doing now and what the Tote did.
The only difference is that when I phoned the Tote they re-credited my account with my stake.
This may be a tongue in cheek question but can't the losers contact Betfair (who claim they are bookmakers acting as the interface) and claim their stake back?
No laughing please.
what a load of rubbish check the total amount bet in play in running and you will find that 50k was not left to back a horse at 1.03 and 1.04 coming to last and anybody trying to back it at any bigger price would be crazy not to realise if they got bigger than 1.05 then the horse has fallen.
tendulkar
I think you'll find he was laying it not backing it and he put it in at evens knowing he would scoop lowest first. You might be able to watch it happen but there is nowt you can do once your bet has been scooped.
I think you'll find he was laying it not backing it and he put it in at evens knowing he would scoop lowest first. You might be able to watch it happen but there is nowt you can do once your bet has been scooped.
Two wrongs dont make a right Billy. Imagine a punter unknowingly asking an on-course layer for a bet in-running on a horse that had fallen - not one in the land would lay him !! So why should punters on here be robbed and different 'rules' apply ? In a word 'they shouldn't' !!! Ooops that's two words !
Imagine a punter unknowingly asking an on-course layer for a bet in-running on a horse that had fallen - not one in the land would lay him !! So why should punters on here be robbed and different 'rules' apply ? In a word 'they shouldn't' !!! Ooops that's two words !
People aren't forced to bet in-running. If you do bet in-running, then expect to be robbed.
People aren't forced to bet in-running. If you do bet in-running, then expect to be robbed.
I agree with you democrat.
I would like to see some form of action taken to prevent the theft.
I would like to see some form of action taken to prevent the theft.
Noone seems to have mentioned the most important point in all this.
There is a basic betting maxim "If you can't win, you can't lose." Any bet which breaches this, should be voided.
Before remounting was banned, despite the inherent unfairness, supporters of the present system had a valid point that fallers could be remounted. There was the famous AP business at Southwell in the early days of BF.
Now, anyone backing a faller can't win, so legally the bets should be voided.
There is a basic betting maxim "If you can't win, you can't lose." Any bet which breaches this, should be voided.
Before remounting was banned, despite the inherent unfairness, supporters of the present system had a valid point that fallers could be remounted. There was the famous AP business at Southwell in the early days of BF.
Now, anyone backing a faller can't win, so legally the bets should be voided.
that is true , but the GC and betfair are not interested in this argument
moral of the story dont bet in running, if you cant stand the heat keep away.
how is that the moral of the story ....people having a bet that cant win
in running betting on Horse racing is OPTIONAL - if you don't like the rules just jog on :)
i seen one the other day travelling well in ireland was about a 1.2 shot to place at the time, hit the fence for a moment looked like it was going to hit the deck, layers falling over themselves to lay up to 10 to place, stayed on its feet , lobbed up.Sometimes you can get matched by these lunatics desperate to lay fallers, swings and roundabouts, if you are say asking for 1.5 about a horse that is clear and has 1 fence to jump, you must realise the only way you are going to be matched is if the horse falls or looks like falling surely
must be the 64-1 place layer when the clear leading fav fell last (nap) 1.0123456789 gubbage
No mention of that guy who backed Metal Detector at 1000 when Derek Thompson said it had fallen.Neither of Golden Silver more recently,another 999/1 winner for a lucky someboby.
these threads always end up with the "if you dont like it fcuk off"
MANCHESTERSKYTRAIN 30 Apr 15:01
i seen one the other day travelling well in ireland was about a 1.2 shot to place at the time, hit the fence for a moment looked like it was going to hit the deck, layers falling over themselves to lay up to 10 to place, stayed on its feet , lobbed up.Sometimes you can get matched by these lunatics desperate to lay fallers, swings and roundabouts, if you are say asking for 1.5 about a horse that is clear and has 1 fence to jump, you must realise the only way you are going to be matched is if the horse falls or looks like falling surely
Stupid comment.
Any bet matched would have been valid. Waht's the problem?!!!!!
Bets on a horse that CANNOT win the race under ANY circumstances legally should be voided.
i seen one the other day travelling well in ireland was about a 1.2 shot to place at the time, hit the fence for a moment looked like it was going to hit the deck, layers falling over themselves to lay up to 10 to place, stayed on its feet , lobbed up.Sometimes you can get matched by these lunatics desperate to lay fallers, swings and roundabouts, if you are say asking for 1.5 about a horse that is clear and has 1 fence to jump, you must realise the only way you are going to be matched is if the horse falls or looks like falling surely
Stupid comment.
Any bet matched would have been valid. Waht's the problem?!!!!!
Bets on a horse that CANNOT win the race under ANY circumstances legally should be voided.
The track players have no other arguement, in hell.
wizardofoz
if it was practicle and workable i would agree totally with you but when is the horse out of the race, someone could genuinely match your bet a split second before the horse is out of the race and might not get paid as the timing of the fall in relation to bets struck would be too grey an area, i have played about 50,000 markets in running over the years and even allowing for the fact i am watching delayed standard pictures on sky i don't believe i have ever baccked a horse that has already fallen in some other time dimension, in fact i would view it as extremely careleass if i had.
if it was practicle and workable i would agree totally with you but when is the horse out of the race, someone could genuinely match your bet a split second before the horse is out of the race and might not get paid as the timing of the fall in relation to bets struck would be too grey an area, i have played about 50,000 markets in running over the years and even allowing for the fact i am watching delayed standard pictures on sky i don't believe i have ever baccked a horse that has already fallen in some other time dimension, in fact i would view it as extremely careleass if i had.
Fair points Manchester (sorry for being rude!) but it is for BF to introduce a workable solution as, at present, bets are being settled illegally.
It's surely no more difficult to decide when a horse has definitely fallen than for them to press the suspend button when they go past the line.
As others have said, it's in their interest to keep the status quo.
It's surely no more difficult to decide when a horse has definitely fallen than for them to press the suspend button when they go past the line.
As others have said, it's in their interest to keep the status quo.
Who really cares,these bets were matched by the higher food chain in running punters,at that stage of a race the bets were between the fast pics offices and the oncourse operative,so he took 50k of them,they take 50k of sat at home in running punters in due course.
and the 20% prem charge on 50k is 10k to the bf champagne cellar.
So somewhere a champagne grape grower is raising a class.
and the 20% prem charge on 50k is 10k to the bf champagne cellar.
So somewhere a champagne grape grower is raising a class.
in hell 30 Apr 15:16
these threads always end up with the "if you dont like it fcuk off"
No more need be said on this.
these threads always end up with the "if you dont like it fcuk off"
No more need be said on this.
Virgin 29 Apr 17:49 (Huntingdon 5.40 Native Bob fell at the last )
1.01 :0 £78
1.02 :0 :0 :0 £15,620
1.03 :0 :0 :0 £18,618
_________________________
1.01 :0 £78
1.02 :0 :0 :0 £15,620
1.03 :0 :0 :0 £18,618
_________________________
There is only one rule on bf horseracing;
Connections cannot gain from the knowledge that their horse is not going to run well.
everything else,fallers,trap bets,ramps,earthquakes,tipsters,etc, are all acceptable,why do people on here not get it,the site is owned by city types not your local church roof wi fund.
.
Connections cannot gain from the knowledge that their horse is not going to run well.
everything else,fallers,trap bets,ramps,earthquakes,tipsters,etc, are all acceptable,why do people on here not get it,the site is owned by city types not your local church roof wi fund.
.
Sound comments wizard - if betfair wont take action some body with authority should make them. The princilpes of in-running better are fine as a whole there are just individual aspects that are abhorrent and to those who can be considered fair minded and impartial, unacceptable.
Clause 9 of the Gambling Act states: -
9 Betting: general
(1) In this Act
9 Betting: general
(1) In this Act
''Why do B/Fair not put a mechanism in place to make such lays impossible ie scratch the horse from the in-running market once it falls ?''
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Thanks for that, Doctor. I hadn't realised they'd changed the law. Who on earth advised them on that?!!!
According to this legislation, if BF fail to suspend the race after they've gone past the line, bets can still be matched legally.
My recollection is that, when this has happened accidentally, BF have refunded matched bets. Why do they bother doing that if there's no need?
According to this legislation, if BF fail to suspend the race after they've gone past the line, bets can still be matched legally.
My recollection is that, when this has happened accidentally, BF have refunded matched bets. Why do they bother doing that if there's no need?
people putting 50k on will have fast pics thinking theyve got the edge just not as quick as others
right, if they don't pay if you lay a faller at the last, what happens to the winning bets IR on the horse that was second at the time and goes on to win?
Surely all the fast pics boys would just start hammering into these.
Surely all the fast pics boys would just start hammering into these.
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