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02 Nov 16 12:09
Date Joined: 26 Oct 05
| Topic/replies: 2,625 | Blogger: shockster's blog
33 Entries.

Ar Mad (FR), Art Mauresque (FR), Avant Tout (FR), Blaklion (GB), Bristol de Mai (FR) Camping Ground (FR), Champagne West (IRE), Coneygree (GB), Cue Card (GB), Dodging Bullets (GB), Don Poli (IRE), Douvan (FR), God's Own (IRE), Irish Cavalier (IRE), Le Mercurey (FR), Menorah (IRE), Monksland (IRE), More of That (IRE), Outlander (IRE), Road To Riches (IRE), Roi des Francs (FR), Sadler's Risk (IRE), Saphir du Rheu (FR), Silviniaco Conti (FR), Simonsig (GB), Sub Lieutenant (IRE), Tea For Two (GB), Thistlecrack (GB), Un Temps Pour Tout (IRE), Valseur Lido (FR), Vautour (FR), Vibrato Valtat (FR), Vroum Vroum Mag (FR)
Pause Switch to Standard View King George 26th December 2016
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Report ReaseHeath November 28, 2016 10:17 PM GMT
...and same as harry, I don't have an opinion personally on the race yet - but I don't have to tip one, unlike Pricewise.

The previews are usually worth reading for the trainer quotes plus the fact that he won't just bang on about the Tizzard and Mullins horses.
Report impossible123 November 28, 2016 11:50 PM GMT
harry callaghan

This is a King George thread hence, whatever runs here will be judged accordingly ie King George standard, and not some run-of-the-mill races; if some of the big boys do not show up eg CC and Coneygree, then it could be deemed as a sub-standard King George, and rightly so.

The 'slowest of the slow boats' is just an expression and the 3 horses in question are slow boats to me in comparison to the others entered in the race. And why are you so anti opinion on this race if you do not have an opinion yourself? This is a thread ie a platform for sharing and exchanging ideas and opinions. If it irks you so intensely use the filter facility; I'd rather read an opinion than faced with none.

Road To Riches: is not good enough for the Cheltenham and Irish Gold Cup so apart from the Ryanair where else could he go, a handicap race? And with his owner being the sponsor is there a more suitable race than the Ryanair?

Sub Lieutenant: progressive? But progressive is relative and open to interpretation. He beat Outlander who has consistently failed to deliver last season, but King George standard? I'd be absolutely astounded, if so.

Camping Ground: connections were so mesmerized by his Relkeel win that a tilt at the Champion Hurdle - what a bizarre decision?

Cue Card at 6/4 might not be value to you but he was 6/1 when this market opened and 5/2 immediately after the Betfair Chase. But come King George day if Thistlecrack and Douvan both available at 8/1 and 10/1 respectively do not show up 6/4 or even money is value to me (anyway).


Yes, VVM could be the only fly in the ointment if Douvan and Valseur Lido do not turn up, why? She's definitely progressive and her potential yet to be defined. And at 27 here at the outset (about 13 now) could be value, trade or otherwise, only doubt is will she be ready even though she's entered in two races at Fairyhouse this weekend?
Report ReaseHeath November 29, 2016 12:12 AM GMT
I'd say a much bigger doubt is whether she's actually going to run in this.
Report unclepuncle November 29, 2016 9:25 AM GMT
I123 - presumably you feel these 'slow-boats' have as much chance as Found did of winning an Arc.Laugh
Report impossible123 November 29, 2016 1:33 PM GMT
Very funny, I was just wondering when you'd turn up to remind me of that!

Is it not a case of frequency of victories and winning sp the main determinants of a profitable outcome on a selection over a period of time? As for Found everything went right for her in the Arc - even her regular jockey got it RIGHT! But she immediately started another losing sequence courtesy of same jockey again. Did you see the victory of Highland Reel especially the 'cunning' ride by his jockey in the BC Turf? That was truly sensational,........and where was the dumb-bell jockey of Found? At the back.....waiting, that is what he does best in the big races!!!!!

We could get a clue post the weekend as VVM has been entered for two races in Ireland.
Report Desmond Orchard November 29, 2016 2:00 PM GMT
I'm an infrequent contributor, but an avid reader. But I have to agree with Harry here, Imp's incessant stream-of-consciousness style of posting, much of it uninformed, is making reading this stuff increasingly difficult. However, even the guff he comes out with, is as nought on the irritant scale compared to his random use of apostropes (hair pulling out emoticon required). I gave up on the 'Arc' (arrrrgggghhhhh) thread, because I couldn't bear it any longer.
That's better.
As you were.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 November 29, 2016 2:47 PM GMT
Got to about the 2nd paragraph on each persons posts here and gave up, first sentence on imp123's Shocked

I didn't say i had 14s thistle for the feltham i have 14s thistle for the KG and 6s CC. I placed both bets relatively same time as each other knowing at that stage Thistle is 14/1 cos he is more likely to rock up in the novice race but if anything was to happen to CC then there is a good chance so a bit of insurance really. I'd be pretty amazed no one else thought that same way and did same thing seeing as one which was 100% cert to run in it was taking 17% of the book and another which still is, depending how you look at it taking out only 7%, i thought crazy bookmaking even at that early stage - Don't get me started on the markets for the festival, i can't ever remember such stingeness ShockedCrazy
Report FELTFAIR November 29, 2016 7:13 PM GMT
Moore dominates rivals to win Best Jockey award

RYAN MOORE has been crowned 2016 Longines World's Best Jockey for the second time in three years after winning eight of the top 100 highest-rated Group and Grade 1 races worldwide, as established by the Longines Rankings Committee.( 3 hours ago)More

Some "dumb- bell"
Report ashleigh December 1, 2016 9:39 AM GMT
tom segal put up thistlecrack at 8/1 l. 7/1 bf,
Report impossible123 December 1, 2016 12:01 PM GMT
"Dumb-bell" would have been given a different accolade if the racegoers/punters here were given their voice/right to vote on the rides he gave to US Army Ranger (Derby), The Gurkha (St James' Palace), Seventh Heaven (Fillies and Mares), Order of St George (Irish St Leger/Qipco Ascot), Found (Breeders Cup), and many others the season's just gone.
Report unclepuncle December 1, 2016 2:44 PM GMT
As well as the potential stumbling block of Thistlecrack another thing that may be a problewm for those who think Cue Card is a certainty is the going.
Been very dry for a couple of weeks and the long range forecast suggests a similar pattern for the next fortnight. Given Cue Card seems to relish heavy going these days could good ground be a potential banana skin?
Report ReaseHeath December 1, 2016 2:57 PM GMT
It's a good point - I also agree with Segal that Cue Card is better LH - all his form backs that up anyway. The problem in opposing him at this stage for me is that he is literally the only leading contender committed to running in the race (at least that we know about) - so it's a waiting game for me.
Report Can't Catch Me December 1, 2016 3:34 PM GMT
Im not sure he is significantly better on soft going myself. He was cantering in the GC and supremely impressive at Aintree both on decent ground. I think he goes on all going much the same myself.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 1, 2016 10:49 PM GMT
Placed    Description    Odds    Stake (£)    Pot. Return (£)    Status
11:20:17    King George VI Chase 2016
Thistlecrack - Each Way
EW Terms: 1/4 Odds | 3 Places
Betfair Bet ID O/0233312/0000093

On at 14s and now segal has put him up Excited
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 1, 2016 10:52 PM GMT
Or should a more accurate emoji be Shocked or Cry

Oh and by the way i wont cry if he don't go after all i new at time i placed bet he could only be 50/50 as did CC at 6s also WinkCrazy
Report impossible123 December 5, 2016 9:16 PM GMT
Thistlecrack could be backed at 15/8 with a run now; Douvan is still 10/1 with Paddies with Coneygree at 11/2 (no change). Just three weekend to this race.
Report ReaseHeath December 5, 2016 10:07 PM GMT
and Vroum Vroum Mag an even less likely runner than this time last week...
Report impossible123 December 5, 2016 10:44 PM GMT
It is unlikely VVM will run here or the Champion Hurdle. But I think she will run over fences next; I hope connections might aim her for the Ryanair or Gold Cup eventually.
Report impossible123 December 5, 2016 11:16 PM GMT
Thistlecrack and Cue Card are 3/1 and 6/1 for the Gold Cup respectively; the former is 15/8 (with a run) here and the latter at 6/4 to win. The question is will his price be shorter than 15/8 on the day of the race? Logically yes, if so, 15/8 (with a run) is value, no?
Report unclepuncle December 7, 2016 8:48 AM GMT
Unless Cue Card is a non runner I'd expect Thistlecrack to be at least 2/1 on the morning of the race, and Cue Card will probably be bigger than he is now as well.
Report impossible123 December 7, 2016 9:29 AM GMT
Are you implying if both Cue Card and Thistlecrack run and assuming the former is 7/4 and the latter 9/4 how could that be possible if Ar Mad does not run which, according to Moore, would be the case ie Ar Mad will not be supplemented if Thistlecrack runs? Logically, Thistlecrack is more likely to be shorter than Cue Card using the Gold Cup betting as a guide, would you not agree?
Report unclepuncle December 7, 2016 9:59 AM GMT
impossible123 07 Dec 16 09:29
Logically, Thistlecrack is more likely to be shorter than Cue Card using the Gold Cup betting as a guide, would you not agree?

No they are two seperate entities. Cue Card is proven at 3m round Kempton, but he has yet to prove he stays the Gold Cup trip at Cheltenham - hence he is much shorter for the KG than the GC.
Obviously if these are the only two worthwhile entries the prices will be much shorter but I'm assuming there will be some half decent opposition and 6-8 runners.

Thistlecrack is too short for both races really given his limited chase CV, but clearly he has greater potential based on his age and hurdling form. He is the sexy option if you like.

Personally at the current prices I wouldn't back either unless the prospect of having a slightly bigger price than on the day is so important to you.Cry
Report impossible123 December 7, 2016 12:37 PM GMT
I'm already on Cue Card at 5/2 and 2/1 similarly Thistlecrack (saver) at 10/1; Thistlecrack, I agree, is too short for both events but I would not say Cue Card is not proven over the extra 2.5f at Cheltehnam - he looked to be going sweetly when he tipped over 2 out at Cheltenham last season.

Ar Mad could be an interesting addition (only runs if Thistlecrack is absent) but an extra mile is a severe concern the way he ran in the Tingle Creek; Valseur Lido (opens to most improvement, I fear) but unlikely to turn up, according to owner, and he is the fav for the Lexus in Ireland; Coneygree, I cannot have, and he again more likely to be Lexus bound as well, the same could be said for Douvan and Vroum Vroum Mag. The rest just do not come into my calculation.
Report impossible123 December 7, 2016 3:37 PM GMT
If anyone is interested Colin Tizzard is 5/4 to win this race with the sponsor, the same for any other trainer.
Report FELTFAIR December 9, 2016 7:37 PM GMT
Just to let you know Ryan Moore got his world`s best jockey award in Japan this evening.
Report impossible123 December 9, 2016 9:10 PM GMT
Yes, I'm sure Moore got it for his rides at Ascot and Epsom predominantly; I've yet to know a senior seasoned jokey ever performed so below par consistently in big and prestigious races.

I'd donate £500 to a charity of your choice if ordinary punters voted the same here for Moore. Hugely over-rated and undeserved that's all I say.
Report jedi sophie December 9, 2016 10:15 PM GMT
Hear Hear,Moore the most overrated obnoxious knob wearing the silks at the moment..The media pandering truly embarrassing..Some of his rides this year list as some of the worst ive ever seen at the top level of flat racing..25 yrs been punting!
Worlds best jockey my arse.
Like giving the bold Jose coach of the year.
Report impossible123 December 9, 2016 10:48 PM GMT
Frankie whipped his a*se in the SJP, Fillies and Mares and Breeders' Cup; Heffernan did the same to him in America on Highland Reel and so did Soumillon on Almanzor in the Champion Stakes.
Report FELTFAIR December 10, 2016 11:10 AM GMT
What kept you?
Report firstimevisor December 10, 2016 7:42 PM GMT
I'm thinking Douvan will run next in the KG, assuming all goes to plan tomorrow.
Report dunlaying December 11, 2016 5:52 PM GMT
if the sponsors go 5/4 Tizzard winning the race then they are of the opinion that Thistlecrack is a non starter. They would not lay 7/2 Cue Card, unless , of course , that they had that beast down as an absentee.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 12, 2016 9:53 AM GMT
Ok starting to get slightly excited by this prospect now, Thistlecrack v Cue Card in this race. This has nothing to do with my bets as when i placed them i have said on here before i did not expect both to run but looking at the market it's certainly looking likely that the only thing that is missing is the official statement from Tizzard himself Tongue Out
Report impossible123 December 12, 2016 12:06 PM GMT
I still think Thistlecrack will not line-up for this race, why? Because there is absolutely no need to heap this kind of pressure on a novice chaser this being his 1st season over fences with just 3 races under his belt; there is another perfectly adequate race for this talented novice to gain more experience until his main target in March ie the Gold Cup in March - an injudicious decision by trainer and owner if I'm proven wrong.

Why take the risk when the risk is so wholly unnecessary? The target is in March!
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 12, 2016 12:13 PM GMT
I'm not sure i agree. I would certainly pitch him into a race that as a whole is an easier assignment than to that of what would be an ultra competitive renewal of the CGC in March! Not only to see if he was up to the task but also to gain as much experience as possible! The blue riband in march can be a blood bath of a race and this years renewal at this early stage imo is already looking like a cracker where as this years KG, think there will be about 7 runners, of which only 3 i would give a realistic chance to!
Report impossible123 December 12, 2016 1:32 PM GMT
Horse Racing is all about opinions and I do appreciate a reasonable alternative response to any of mine no matter how absurd out far fetched (at times) without recourse to personal insult, obscenity or infantile behaviour from either party.

The Cheltenham Gold Cup could be a blood bath, I agree, and last year was no different hence more experience is required for Thistlecrack. But from the same stable of the deserved/solid favourite Cue Card, a race or two too soon and with the ultimate target in March is wholly unnecessary, in my view.

Why go to battle if one's chances of victory could be enhanced with more preps prior to engagement? Thistlecrack is a very talented horse and if the Gold Cup in March is his main aim and fences his new discipline for the future there is absolutely nothing to be gained rushing and running him in this race this year.

It'd be lovely for racegoers and racing enthusiasts if Thistlecrack turns up but never take one's eye off the ball, that's all I say to connections.
Report cyclops December 12, 2016 1:53 PM GMT
impossible, I agree the KG is unlikely for Thistlecrack.
But I also believe his best chance of Gold Cup glory is to compete in a full blooded race against seasoned, top class horses beforehand. Trotting up against three novices in the Feltham will teach him nothing and, with the possible exception of the Cotswold Chase, I can't see him gaining relevant experience that will aid his cause. In addition, were he to run in the KG and not perform well, there's still the chance of re-routing to another Stayers Hurdle.
It would be a brave call but I can see why they're considering it.
Report unclepuncle December 12, 2016 2:16 PM GMT
I123 - seems to me just want Thistlecrack to be aimed elsewhere so that your antepost bet on Cue Card has more chance of collecting. Presumably you were hoping to be able to lay off your stake at a really short price so you could have a nice free bet, but Thistlecracks participation is preventing that.

If you genuinely feel Thistlecrack should not be running as he isn't up to the task yet, then you should welcome his participation as you will be able to back Cue Card again at a much bigger price than would otherwise be the case. CC might not even be favourite on the day.Shocked
Report impossible123 December 12, 2016 2:51 PM GMT
I had not backed Cue Card prior to the Betfair Chase at over 6/1; Cue Card at 5/2 and 2/1 is no feasible and/or profitable proposition to lay despite what others may think of my m o.

I am sick and tired of reading posts that the antepost value for races is long gone; it has been reduced (significantly), but one has to deal with it and try to extract and/or enhanced value by taking a position early (earlier) thus accepting/taking on associated risks as a result. But my personal views about the participation of Thistlecrack is totally genuine and not pocket induced!

The present price of Cue Card after his last win is not reflecting his triumphant victory over Coneygree, the rightful 2nd fav and uncertain runner without Thistlecrack, is great value.
Report impossible123 December 13, 2016 10:38 AM GMT
Sara Bradstock, the trainer of Coneygree, has been reported not to be afraid of Thistlecrack - she is (very though) of Cue Card. Of Thistlecrack, she said he is jumping over fences rather than racing over them; Cue Card could be beaten if Coneygree could stretch him early in the race and not allow him to lop along behind waiting to pounce.

Coneygree will only run if the ground is conducive. The present forecast is little or no rain until Boxing Day itself at Kempton Park.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 14, 2016 10:19 AM GMT
Josses Hill, shortening on here yet not one bookmaker has any prices for him. Is he being aimed elsewhere?
Report ReaseHeath December 14, 2016 10:55 AM GMT
comments from Henderson yesterday to the effect that they were strongly considering supplementing him - in contrast to what he said after Josses Hill won the Peterborough.

Bookmakers probably don't have prices because he currently is n't entered.
Report ReaseHeath December 14, 2016 11:12 AM GMT
don't want to put you away - what the article actually says is 'not completely ruling out' which is very different from 'strongly considering', anyway link below

It was from the media launch on Monday -perhaps Henderson needed a sound bite about potentially having a runner so that he could enjoy the free lunch. Grin
Report Can't Catch Me December 14, 2016 1:38 PM GMT

Sounds about right Rease (hic)!
Report sixtwosix December 14, 2016 5:04 PM GMT
How many are going to turn up , Coneygree  , Cue Card , Thistlecrack ??? , Tea For Two .....can't see many more even running.

Mind Wayward Lad , Burrough Hill Lad and Combs Ditch put on quite a show with only 3 runners.
Report impossible123 December 14, 2016 6:19 PM GMT
Latest from Collin Tizzard on Thistlecrack's participation: "50-50 call...should the going be really soft it would increase Thistlecrack's chances of going for the King George."

From the above I'd infer the chances of Thistlecrack lining-up is lesser than not.

The present weather forecast for Kempton Park is about 25mm but no precipitation until 23rd Dec - the Confirmation Date is 19th Dec.
Report ReaseHeath December 14, 2016 9:51 PM GMT
I can see Conti running - I know Nicholls said he might not, but he'll surely look at it as an opportunity to pick up some place prize money if it cuts up. I think Irish Cavalier might run too, his rating will surely make it just as difficult for him in handicaps?

And I reckon Gigginstown might have a runner, Road to Riches maybe if he's not still sidelined after the kissing spines operation.

But,yes, we're probably looking at 7 runners max.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 14, 2016 11:05 PM GMT
Hope Irish does run, think he has an outside chance of running into the three without troubling the winner or even 2nd if they go hard from the get go and with the promise of Coneygree going to go out at a million miles an hour at 100/1 it's cheap enough to find out
Report dunlaying December 15, 2016 9:10 AM GMT
My guess is 9 , 10 if Road To Riches can run.
Report ReaseHeath December 16, 2016 2:49 PM GMT
So, according to Nicholls' quotes on RP, Conti is another who could be scared off by Thistlecrack!

Tizzard must be giving serious consideration to running Thistlecrack solely on the basis that it could end up being two from his stable vs Coneygree! (and even Coneygree runs with proviso that ground is no quicker than Good to Soft).

It's interesting that, given all the media and public debate about the merit in Thistlecrack running in the race as a novice, that there's a few in the industry who seem reluctant to take him on. They don't say that about Cue Card.
Report impossible123 December 16, 2016 7:33 PM GMT
Nichols: "If Thistlecrack didn't run and there were only five or six in it, we might be tempted."

I think he was more interested winning some good prize money. But I still doubt very much Thistlecrack will run; the Bradstocks are leaning towards this race now rather than the Lexus (travelling, I think) especially if the ground is suitable - the present forecast is not favourable though with little rain expected.
Report dunlaying December 16, 2016 8:42 PM GMT
He wants to win the Kauto Star .
Report dj876 December 18, 2016 11:32 AM GMT
11/4 (PP) on CC to win the KG and TC to win the Feltham (KS).

I think they will be kept apart as does the market on here.

Not an official contingency but it almost should be.

It's likely the SP on the double would be 11/8 or shorter, the turning up part of the double is long odds on for me.
Report harry callaghan December 18, 2016 1:03 PM GMT
coneygree out shame for the race it needed him...i think he'll definitely run thistlecrack now myself
Report tony2914 December 18, 2016 1:06 PM GMT
i hope so, cos if thistlecrack doesnt run i cant remember a poorer king george in my 30 yrs of watching the race.
Report dj876 December 18, 2016 1:22 PM GMT
If Colin Tizzard does as he says and makes the decision based on the best interest of each on an individual basis, then the withdrawal  of Coneygree makes it more likely that TC runs in the KG. Coneygree setting a searching pace would have tested more a novice's jumping.

Most trainers would want to win both prizes both Colin comes across as an authentic gent.

He has previously stated that the ground will be a major deciding factor as soft ground wouldn't put as much pressure on TC'S jumping. Dry weather gives him an out and could allow him make the decision he surely wants to. 

Very poor field if the stable match doesn't materialize.
Report ReaseHeath December 18, 2016 1:34 PM GMT
If Colin Tizzard does as he says and makes the decision based on the best interest of each on an individual basis, then the withdrawal  of Coneygree makes it more likely that TC runs in the KG. Coneygree setting a searching pace would have tested more a novice's jumping.

I agree with this - Thistlecrack's presence is also likely to limit the opposition from other stables based on comments from Nicholls (Silvianaco Conti) and Gary Moore (Ar Mad - though that one is not going to run anyway now).

It's not a key factor - but also worth pointing out that last year prize money for 2nd in King George was a few £k more than for 1st in the Kauto Star.

But I also agree with your observation about the ground giving him an out, dj876. I suspect the match won't materialise, will be presently surprised if it does.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 18, 2016 2:18 PM GMT
I actually don't think there will be a small field anymore. With Coneygree now out which is a sad thing on it's own, every bookmaker are still offering 3 places at either 1/4 or 1/5th and looking down them on oddschecker at what is blue and what isn't it is clear to me who these bookmakers think will actually run.

Think there be 10-12 runners personally and not without a chance of a turn up at a big price.
Report unclepuncle December 18, 2016 2:30 PM GMT
Surely Henderson must supplement Josses Hill now?
Report layingisthewayforward December 18, 2016 2:36 PM GMT
Where is the 11/4 CC Thistlscrack double ? Cant see it on paddys website.
Report dj876 December 18, 2016 2:43 PM GMT
It wasn't a special but was available this morning when I posted (prior to the Coneygree announcement).

CC was 6/4 and TC was 1/2 with PP so 11/4 , a related bet that you can get away with it
Report dj876 December 18, 2016 2:46 PM GMT
It's shorter since the announcement as CC is now odds on.

I am not that pleased about the announcement as explained previously I think it increases the likelyhood of TC running in this if you take Tizzard for his word that it's a separate decision.

I didn't fancy Conegryee on goodish ground at Kempton and my main dockets are waiting on CC so not all that pleased that TC is a more likely contender imo
Report impossible123 December 18, 2016 5:13 PM GMT
Despite Coneygree having been ruled out and Cue Card into odds-on Thistlecrack is still easy to back and little demand similar to last night where Thistlecrack was generally available at 6 and even matched at 8 here.
Report impossible123 December 18, 2016 9:57 PM GMT
Someone is still laying Thistlecrack - I wonder who? 7 at the moment.
Report Mr Eboue December 18, 2016 10:02 PM GMT
Assuming Thistlecrack doesn't run we face to prospect of:

Cue Card
Tea for two
Josses Hill
Silviniaco Conti
Irish Cavalier

Have I missed any others? SadCryShocked
Report johnn December 19, 2016 9:39 AM GMT
For the sake of the race I'd like to see Thistlecrack take on CC, for personal punting reasons I hope he goes to the Feltham.
I'm sure CT would prefer the chances of winning both, but will be interesting to see how it pans out.
Coneygree took the big prize after the Feltham, so it's not without precedent.
Report Can't Catch Me December 19, 2016 10:51 AM GMT
Thistlecrack runs.

That has saved the race.
Report impossible123 December 19, 2016 11:00 AM GMT
Good for connections, better price for Cue Card supporters and racegoers. Bring it on!
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 19, 2016 11:07 AM GMT
Great for the race, brilliant for boxing day racing, amazing for my pocket hehe Excited
Report ReaseHeath December 19, 2016 12:26 PM GMT
So with this morning's great news we're looking at:

Cue Card
Tea for Two
Josses Hill
Irish Cavalier

plus 1-2 from Gigginstown - Elliott quoted as saying Outlander might go this morning - I'd say it could be any 1 or 2 of him, Sub Lieutenant, Valseur Lido and Road to Riches
Report sixtwosix December 19, 2016 2:35 PM GMT
Don't think there will be an irish runner , the ones mentioned aren't good enough , far more likely to stay at home and go for the Lexus.

Apart from the interest of seeing how Thistlecrack does against his stablemate , it is a sorry looking field.
Let's hope that neither of them go missing before Monday.
Report impossible123 December 19, 2016 6:53 PM GMT
This race is nrnb with Slybet.

I hope WPM/RR will take a leaf out of Tizzard/Snook's book in the future.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 20, 2016 1:00 PM GMT
Down to just 7 already that has shocked me even though i was reading on here people posting what they thought would be left i thought perhaps there be more to it, even Irish Cavalier has gone Shocked

Usually i love each way thievery, this year i've completely missed the boat with that. Time to lay a couple points back on Thistlecrack and Cue Card me thinks as can see only other strategy to lessen the risk
Report impossible123 December 20, 2016 1:25 PM GMT
Yep, a paltry 7 in the race including 2 rags from Ireland; Josses Hill will probably take them along with Road To Riches just behind.
Report duffy December 20, 2016 2:50 PM GMT
Tizzard has the whole credibility of the race hanging around his shouldersSad
Report Mr Eboue December 20, 2016 4:05 PM GMT
Imagine the scenes if the Tizzard horse box breaks down!

Be the worst field for a Grade 1 in the history of horse racing!
Report sixtwosix December 20, 2016 4:18 PM GMT
Struggling to think of a field that has looked so thin for this magnificent race .

Compare it with 1980 , for example.
Silver Buck , Night Nurse , Anaglog's Daughter , Tied Cottage , Diamond Edge , Chinrullah , Bachelor's Hall
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 20, 2016 5:15 PM GMT
See i don't understand quotes like them, thinnest field in history, weakest this and strongest that. Surely a horse can only win against what is put in front of them and if you as a racing enthusiast win money even betterConfused I mean, fundamentally, isn't that why we are all on here to do? Bet, gain an edge and winConfused
Report impossible123 December 20, 2016 7:15 PM GMT
It is understandable but a shame unless the Lexus is rescheduled. It is great shame about Vautour and Don Cossack otherwise at least one would show. Nonetheless, still find it difficult to comprehend WPM is not sending any.

Can one imagine if we had last year's main protagonists ie Vautour, Don Cossack and Cue Card with the new kid on the block, Thistlecrack, running? A rehearsal to the Gold Cup.

It could be only six because Road To Riches is only 50/50 to show up. Let's hope racegoers are treated to a race to remember, nonetheless.
Report mary hinge December 20, 2016 8:35 PM GMT
Thiknk Thistelcrack will go off favourite.  They know its better than Cue Card.  Stronger stayer and not as soft
Report dunlaying December 22, 2016 10:38 AM GMT
It seems that the books will take on Cue Card. That comes as a surprise to me but could be another Christmas present.
Report marychain1 December 22, 2016 6:11 PM GMT
Thistlecrack to go off favourite here? That would be a big surprise for me. When you've got a known quantity against a maybe hard to justify the maybe being considered more likely.
Report the bloob December 22, 2016 7:31 PM GMT
although Cue Card has wins at Kempton he seems to be best round Cheltenham, I would be lumping on if it was Cheltenham at 6/4
Report Can't Catch Me December 22, 2016 10:12 PM GMT
Amazed Thistlecrack is shorter than Cue Card. Cue Card is a solid high 170's horse, who seems as good as ever. Can Thistlecrack really put in a 180 performance at this stage of his career and only his third run over fences? I know he looks special, but will need to be extra special to do that.

I will be having a good bet on Cue Card if I can get on at 6/4.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 22, 2016 10:41 PM GMT
Am sure 6/4 will be available on the day, perhaps Xmas eve somewhere but admittedly to restricted stakes. 6/4 was available on the exchange briefly over last 24 hours hard to gauge whether it will drift back to that again
Report ZenMaster December 22, 2016 10:56 PM GMT
4th run Can't Catch Me

The small field is a massive plus for Thistlecrack, he should get plenty of sight at the open ditches. I think that he will go well odds on after a fence or two once we are reminded of how natural he is over fences.
Report sixtwosix December 23, 2016 11:26 AM GMT
As predicted , disappointingly not a single Irish runner  nor in the Christmas Hurdle .
Report impossible123 December 23, 2016 8:05 PM GMT
This is the latest from Tizzard in the Sportinglife today about Thistlecrack if anyone is still not convinced that should Thistlecrack prove an over-ran here he'd be switched back to the World Hurdle.

Tizzard: "We have always said if he was going to go to Cheltenham as an over-ran he'd switch back to the World Hurdle, but he hasn't looked like that yet, he's looked equally as good over fences."
Report lewisham ranger December 24, 2016 11:14 AM GMT
Can't Catch Me 22 Dec 16 22:12 Joined: 02 Apr 03 | Topic/replies: 23,891 | Blogger: Can't Catch Me's blog
Amazed Thistlecrack is shorter than Cue Card. Cue Card is a solid high 170's horse, who seems as good as ever. Can Thistlecrack really put in a 180 performance at this stage of his career and only his third run over fences? I know he looks special, but will need to be extra special to do that.

I will be having a good bet on Cue Card if I can get on at 6/4.

problem is you are taking short odds about a horse who has run in the race four times, only won once and is approaching 11. For that reason of the two of the market leaders I prefer thistlecrack.
Report dunlaying December 24, 2016 11:57 AM GMT
When Arkle met Mill House in the Cup their riders saved a suit on the result. Will Brennan and Scudamore be doing the same?
Report sixtwosix December 24, 2016 4:37 PM GMT
My view is that Thistlecrack will win and win well.

I am not convinced one jot that Cue Card is as good this season.
His first run behind Irish Cavalier was poor , tactics or no tactics.
His price is based on beating up Coneygree and a french horse we have never heard of at Haydock.
We have seen very little of Coneygree and I am of the view he is simply not the horse who won the Gold Cup.
Report impossible123 December 24, 2016 7:15 PM GMT
I think the bookies are still not convinced by Cue Card's performance in the Betfair Chase despite the beating he gave to Coneygree hence, the 6/1 still available for the former in the Gold Cup despite going well when falling last season. Otherwise he'd be no more than 7/2 now; he already had the measure of Djakadam when he fell.
Report twonky December 24, 2016 11:50 PM GMT
This race is screaming shock result... Cue Card beat a chaser who is fragile and having his 1st run at Haydock, and who will proberley not be seen again. Exactly what has Thistlecrack beaten to earn such a price, plus look at his form going right handed. He could well win the GC but 3 miles around Kempton does not play to his strengths..

Teafortwo ain't good enough, Conti is sat it, yhe only value is Jossies at 12s..
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 25, 2016 12:09 AM GMT
My book has the 3 at cc6/1 thistlecrack 14s Jossies 20s all 3 places so I'd be happy with that.

Is it me or am I the only antepost punter on here that actually found this year's kg the easiest to read? Best ever book on a race at final Dec's and I only backed 3!

I asked earlier on in this thread why no one had priced up jossies Hill, did a bit of homework and seen that Henderson said after its last run they would look at this closer to the time, with no other real option and it steadily shortening on here when b365 put up 20s the day after I posted it snapped it up.

Cc I backed before the betfair and thistlecrack I took 14s about not expecting him to run it was more a safe bet that if something happened to cc seeing as he's fav for gold cup 14s is too big.

Vautour was dead rip and there was nothing else I  old see would go, the Irish rarely send any worthwhile over and after Irish cavaliers last run it was mooted he'd have a break and miss Xmas.

Good luck one and all and hope u Xmas can be paid for on boxing day mine always has been since kauto star days ExcitedTongue OutWink
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 25, 2016 1:20 AM GMT
●then vautour died in should say.

Report FELTFAIR December 26, 2016 10:46 AM GMT
Backed Cue Card win and Josses Hill each way.
Report A_T December 26, 2016 10:54 AM GMT
if it gets round Thistlecrack wins
Report impossible123 December 26, 2016 3:11 PM GMT
Thistlecrack is fav and Cue Card is friendless, talent and potential over form perhaps.
Report impossible123 December 26, 2016 3:24 PM GMT
That was sublimed from Thistlecrack, definitely one to beat at Cheltenham, I'd imagine.
Report SEATHESTARS....NO1 December 26, 2016 7:51 PM GMT
Have I not posted a boom yet?

Though getting 14/1 I have not yet tried to place another bet on the sports book as yet pmsl guess Vicente at 18to1 will he the next attempt tomorrow morning at 830 pmsl
Report twonky December 26, 2016 9:07 PM GMT
The proximity of Conti to Cue Card puts a dampner on things, plus no Irish runners in the race tampers the result....sad fact is, like Coneygree last year, it's another poor year in the staying chase department.
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