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The_LUFCwaffe
22 May 16 14:01
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Date Joined: 14 Mar 05
| Topic/replies: 198 | Blogger: The_LUFCwaffe's blog
Anyone eyeing an O'Brien horse for the St Leger may want to take a look at the entries for the Gp2 Curragh Cup (1m 6f) which is run on Irish Derby weekend.

Order of St George took this one in last year before running in the Irish St Leger.

The entries for this years Curragh Cup were made on the 19th May, so it could give a steer to how AOB views his middle distance horses.

http://www.racingpost.com/horses2/cards/card.sd?race_id=652105&r_date=2016-06-26#raceTabs=lc_

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Replies: 77
By:
GREEDISGOOD
When: 22 May 16 14:04
Harzand has always struck me a St Leger type.
By:
impossible123
When: 08 Jun 16 19:49
If Harzand runs in the Irish Derby and wins he'd be unlikely to run here similarly with UAR but both are unlikely to be aimed at the 'Arc' - only one I think - instead Minding could be if UAR is beaten in the Irish Derby. However, should UAR beat Harzand then I reckon Minding will not run in the Irish Oaks let alone the 'Arc' but probably The Eclipse over 10f as I believe that is Minding's best trip despite winning the Epsom Oaks.

In a nutshell, the victor of the Irish Derby will not run in the English Leger; if the victor is UAR then Minding will be an unlikely runner in the Irish Oaks nor the 'Arc' but instead The Eclipse as AOB could call on Order Of St George and Found I believe.
By:
sintonian
When: 08 Jun 16 20:27
Only one of interest is Idaho, the rest do not look good eneough.

Cheers LUFC.
By:
knot in wood
When: 26 Jun 16 22:30
had a bit of a knee jerk reaction(usually ends badly) after saturdays irish derby and took some of the 7-1 idaho.

betting 10 weeks before the race will put you in the poor house but cannot see what the opposition is going to be.

will be very surprised if harzand or UAR turn up and the majority of the rest in the betting look average.

if he turns up and wins something like the great voltigeur can see him going off pretty short for the ledger,bit of a boost today with AOB stating that he will be a better horse over a longer trip.

just hope he stays sound.
By:
impossible123
When: 27 Jun 16 07:24
If Idaho runs he's an excellent chance on his two Derby form; I cannot see Harzand and/or UAR running here with the 'Arc' just three weeks away being their main target. Neither will Idaho be dropped in trip as he does not have the pace to win at 8f or 10f, I'm fairly certain.
By:
kincsem
When: 05 Jul 16 21:38
Sword Fighter
He will get every yard, and is genuine.
By:
impossible123
When: 06 Jul 16 16:14
I think it's fair to say this race is on the agenda for Idaho beaten twice in two Classics by Harzand, the winner in both; Idaho has been taken out of the King George VI and QE II today and his next entry is the Great Voltigeur Stakes on 17th Aug, an ideal 3 weeks to The Leger. And post winning t,he Great Voltigeur Idaho will be less than 3/1 for this race I'd imagine.

Sword Fighter, all things being equal, will run here as well.
By:
johnnyrant
When: 06 Jul 16 21:14
AOB should run Minding in this & try and make history with 1st Triple Crown winner since Oh So Sharp in 1985. Would be a great story and a major boost to the oldest Classic Cool
By:
TEN2FOLLOWER
When: 06 Jul 16 21:27
I like Muntahaa
By:
impossible123
When: 07 Jul 16 07:13
AOB will not run Minding against the colts until the 'Arc' otherwise the King George VI & QEII on 23rd July would be ideal intro. This race is not even in the consideration for neither USAR nor Harzand with the 'Arc'just 3 weeks away.
By:
push
When: 10 Jul 16 18:01
Red Verdon, still full of running at the end of the Irish Derby, and maybe one out of the King Edward at Royal Ascot, that is usually a good pointer for the St Leger.
By:
impossible123
When: 20 Jul 16 16:34
Harzand and Minding have not been entered and no doubt both be aimed at the 'Arc', and neither has Hawkbill but there is a supplementary on 5th Sept should connections have a change of heart. However, the intriguing entry from AOB are Even Song - disappointing 'fav' in the Irish Oaks - and Bhutan, a winner over Housesofparliament in April but has not been seen since. What's happened to Bhutan? Nursing an injury or something else?
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Jul 16 19:37
i still like us army ranger for this . hes had the summer break and will take in a prep race . then the target will be either the irish champion stakes or the st leger on the same day 10th september . so clearly the horse will be primed for this day , as to where he goes will be based on the going imo . i would imagine he will get better ground at donny so i think his antepost price is big as although preference will be for the champion if thats soft or worse and donny is better ground theyll go leger then breeders cup turf i think
By:
impossible123
When: 20 Jul 16 20:36
gpz6316

I'd like to see USAR running here but I've serious doubt given the proximity of this race and the 'Arc', his main target I firmly believe; I could not see him running in the Irish Champion either with the race being 10f - he needs at least 10f+ - but Minding is a possible, I hope. Also, I do not believe USAR will stay 16f either otherwise he'd have galloped away in the Chester Vase when challenged by Port Douglas or outstayed by Harzand in the Epsom Derby.
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Jul 16 21:09
123 . i dont think a . o,b has targetted this race over the last few years . or ever at all,  hes only won it once with dylan thomas . i think he will send over a decent rep ie found but i doubt it will be a serious challenge . surely he would have freshened up a top colt with a summer break etc in the past . we,re now talking about one that does look high class that could be fresh and he could just aim him there . i dont think he will though as hes  got no outs (alternative races ) if it comes up soft for peaking him . hes not gonna bottom him to try and win the arc and fok up breeders cup imo so irish champion or st leger is where it must be . to sum up you think hes prepped for arc and i disagree . opinions , opinions , i think im right but will be happy to say well done and mean it if im wrong
By:
ReaseHeath
When: 20 Jul 16 21:27
Sword Fighter for me at this stage, similar profile to AOB's last winner of the race Leading Light and out of his 16 entries strikes me as the one most likely to turn up.

On his form, you'd think he might swerve it on fast ground but chances of that should be dimishing by mid Sept.
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Jul 16 21:35
this race being the arc ( reference your comments )not the st leger as of the thread
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Jul 16 21:43
he was very green at chester a baby they said and had less runs than fingers on one  hand .so i dont buy into the fact he wont stay . a 3yo colt is a whole different animal in terms of strengthening up and learning how to race in september
By:
impossible123
When: 20 Jul 16 21:52
Idaho and/or USAR could have been entered in this saturday's King George but did not hence I hope this is the race AOB has in mind for Idaho along with another 3/4 stablemates but not the well bred, USAR. However, USAR has been entered for the Ballyroan Stakes at Leopardstown on 4th Aug but not Idaho who is in the Great Voltigeur at Goodwood next month, usually the prep race for the St Leger; I also believe USAR do not stay 14f either.

As for the Irish Champion Stakes I believe Minding will follow the path of Found last year and use that as a prep race at Leopardstown on 10th Sept prior to the 'Arc'.
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Jul 16 21:56
ref reaseheath and swordfighter , he has a great looking profile and i wouldnt put you off him . at every stage through the season top trainers see horses come to themselves and exude wellbeing . come september if your fella looks in rude health he could well be the numero uno for this race in their yard  but nobody knows. thats why were guessing to try to get a bigger price than available on the day . i got 16-1 on a fresh horse that came second in the derby and im happy with it . you pays your money and you take your chance . and good luck to ya .
By:
impossible123
When: 20 Jul 16 22:08
I think we can all agree Sword Fighter is a near certainty to be amongst AOB's contigent for this race as he'd won over the distance and more - he's also in the Great Voltigeur next month.

I'd expected Bhutan, not seen since victorious in April, to be not in today's declaration but he's not. What's happened to him since April? Anyone's any idea?
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Jul 16 22:27
not sure why you think a 1 race runner and winner is a suitable candidate for a st leger . they couldnt get a race into him as a 2yo and didnt fancy him but ran him anyhows and he won . the signs are the horse is not sound by a long chalk
By:
impossible123
When: 20 Jul 16 22:38
If you are referring to Bhutan I believe he was reported having a setback some time ago hence, I'd expected him to be scratched today. But he was not, and he did beat Housesofparliament who won at Ascot last week, easily.
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Jul 16 22:49
ya 123 im going sleep now but 1 race ? plus anything they can get into him pre september . my opinion is that hes not sound and wouldnt be able to give its best.be that on firm ground (legs ) or soft ground (breathing )
By:
impossible123
When: 23 Jul 16 16:41
Wings Of Desire ran a very good race in the King George & QE Stakes however, he looked to have come to the end of his tether despite the slow steady pace dictated by Moore on Highland Reel very similar to the impression he gave me in the Epsom Derby. Be interesting if he takes his place in the Great Voltigeur, giving 3lbs to Idaho.
By:
impossible123
When: 25 Jul 16 07:56
Despite the manager of the owner of Wings Of Desire (WOD) - who was 2nd in the King George & QE Stakes - stating they might consider the Juddmonte or the Prix Niel - both 10f races - WOD had been backed into favouritism with 'Laddies' for the St Leger.
By:
gpz6316
When: 25 Jul 16 22:24
ya well its cos theres a lack of class at the highest level . wod has done his running and i very much doubt he can win a st leger . imo if us a r with a mid season break heads there then breeders.cup i think w.o.d could be 30 lb behind at that point in the season .
By:
gpz6316
When: 25 Jul 16 22:34
you simply cant go on and on ,wings isnt improving . im not saying us army ranger will win it as your far more knowledgable  than me with intentions . i think that i had a read where the gurkha would run  common sense . i was right got 16-1 about a odds on loser . and i see usar coming to doncaster . then breeders cup , they wont bottom  him in ireland or champion stakes . for me he goes st leger . breeders cup and not the arc .its just my opinion
By:
impossible123
When: 26 Jul 16 07:13
gpz6315

USAR is heading for the Juddmonte and has been backed to near favouritism; in my opinion this is why he's drifted to 20/1 for the 'Arc' unlike Minding who's been backed into 5/1 here. As such USAR is very highly unlikely to be campaigned over 14f ('Arc') now with AOB having Found, Order Of St George and Minding), certainly not the Leger; USAR has an engagement in the Great Voltigeur as well (same day as the Juddmonte) but unlikely to take his place given AOB stating he's being aimed at the Juddmonte.

Regards Wings Of Desire, despite what connections have stated and betting market, I find it difficult to see him run in the Leger because I think he does not stay before 10f+ as demonstrated in the Derby and King George & QE Stakes. As always horse racing is mainly about opinions and as such can differ greatly amongst racing participants.
By:
impossible123
When: 17 Aug 16 16:54
Idaho was given a tender ride to win the Great Voltigeur today obviously with this race in mind; he is best price at 2/1, but could start odds-on again on race day if the race cuts up like it did today.
By:
gpz6316
When: 19 Aug 16 16:20
im sticking with us army ranger . i know the intention is to run in ireland on that day , but , if the ground comes up heavy there im sure hell be rerouted as hes entered in the leger also suggesting its an out given unsuitable  ground in ireland . if so he has a favourites chance and is available at 20 plus to one
By:
impossible123
When: 19 Aug 16 21:06
gpz613

I hope USAR runs for you however, I think 'Coolmore' will want Idaho - rested with this race in mind since the Irish Derby - to win a Gp1 race ie The Leger, to enhance his stallion fee. With The Gurkha on the sideline and possibly career ending due to an injury, USAR, if successful convincingly on sunday's Royal Whip, might take up the mantle of The Gurkha and do battle over 10f leaving Minding, Found and Order Of St George free for the 'Arc'.

I think if USAR is not a convincing winner on sunday then USAR might target the 'Arc' instead with Minding focusing on 8/10f races eg Irish Champion Stakes (10f) and/or QE2 Stakes (8f) at Ascot. If so, Minding - entered for the Matron Stakes (8f/11/8 'fav') and the Irish Champion Stakes (10f) but both on 10th Sept - could be rerouted to the latter instead. Hence, Qemah, a certain runner in the Matron Stakes, could be a value/risky bet even at 5/2 now.
By:
gpz6316
When: 20 Aug 16 15:05
gpz 613 ? how dare you  , that guy is a fool ! im gpz 6316 a far superior number ! a joke . i think minding has run her best races now . it will be  fresh horses for the st leger and arc imo obviously idaho looks all set but is no price and therefore no interest to me .if it comes up soft or heavy in ireland for the champion then usar may well head to donny i know its unlikely but at over 20s for the race when hell be favaourite if he runs its worth a point or two  . no opinion regarding the matron but 5/2 is not a antepost price  imo . best of luck to ya "impossible 122"
By:
impossible123
When: 20 Aug 16 19:32
gpz6316

Apology, old age approaching and/or a trip to 'specsaver' a necessity soon.

With The Gurkha out of action 'Coolmore' need a credible representative for 8f/10f, and at the moment Minding is the only one unless USAR hoses up tomorrow. If not, Minding could be rerouted to the Irish Champion Stakes rather than running in the Matron Stakes, and very possibly the 'Arc' too. But I'm almost 100% certain USAR will not be pitched against Idaho in the Leger - stamina doubt - and both competing stallions in the future unless Idaho is unwell then possibly but reluctantly.
By:
impossible123
When: 21 Aug 16 15:32
gpz6316

On 2nd thought USAR could end up here - there is no other prestigious middle distance race (I think) - after the disappointing run at the Curragh today over 10f. It is very unlikely the Irish Champion Stakes will be on the card for him - Minding perhaps. However, USAR needs at least a Gp2/3 scalp on his breeding cv otherwise he'll be as cheap as chips, immaculate breeding or not.
By:
unclepuncle
When: 21 Aug 16 18:58
No chance he goes for Leger.
By:
impossible123
When: 21 Aug 16 19:25
unclepuncle

That was my earlier assumption/conclusion, but not too sure now post USAR demise in the Royal Whip this afternoon. He is still in the Leger in case something untoward prevents Idaho making it, I guess - it is plausible.
By:
gpz6316
When: 23 Aug 16 21:04
hmm its a boiling pot right now , i dont think usar can win a bc turf nor a arc  , he doesnt look like a champion stakes winner , hes been the cherry all season now where can i pop him ? doncaster !maybe  and idaho ,  well his cv doesnt read much at all so let the one with the profile win the leger and lets say idaho is injured .
By:
gpz6316
When: 23 Aug 16 21:17
im thinking aiden wants usar to win a big one , if idaho wins it what use is that hes got a nh pedigree at best but if you let usar loose you can have a stallion and then you can give idaho a 4yo career wherein he wins the tattersalls gold cup , coronation cup , king george thats my opinion at this moment . i know nothing though its just my imagination
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