GREAT VOLTIGEUR (York Wednesday 20th)

I think the ET 5-1 with jam staines was just too good a price to refuse for this race.

Alleged, I can see where your coming from, if EAGLE TOP runs here, he wins.

If he runs in the International he has a pretty good chance of going close too.

Granddukeoftuscany wins this before going on to win the leger

deadmurph, Interesting horse GRANDDUKEOFTUSCANY, to win any 12F race by 19L means a mismatch, and difficult to get a handle on the terrible form of the placed horses since against a Great Voltigeur candidate.

However AOB has plenty of stayers in his stable and this must be high up the pecking order to turn up at York.

His maiden win looked like a Bumper Race, in distances between the horses up the finishing straight, and he was given a fair bit of encouragement in the last half-mile, I imagine to learn how to race.

I think he may be short on proper experience to win next week, but if I am wrong then he would indeed  be the likely St Leger winner.

Really looking forward to the race.

No Eagle Top I see.
Moore booked to ride the fav.
Ground drying out all the time & a mainly dry forecast until Fri (some showers)
Set fair for a gd wk of racing

Can't believe Kingston Hill is comfortably odds against here. An odds on shot? One of the best bets of the season? Ground not an issue for me in this company. Any other trainer in the race would regard coming second as a very acceptable outcome.

Marzocco e/w for me.

If Kingston Hill produces his Derby run he should be winning this imo.
Not my kind of bet at the price (approx 6/4) tho.
Dark horse in the race would be G D of Tuscany, diff to know how gd he is, but AOB does have plenty to gage his against at home, so an interesting one.
Gd luck with your bets lads

If Kingston Hill reproduces any of this last 3 runs, he wins this comfortably on what the others have shown so far .... should be a 4/5 shot and is my nap of day one

Hope KH can win this on the way to taking the St Leger, as he looks like the further the better for him.

Agree that on past form KH should be odds on, however I can see why layers are out to get him. In the past this race has often been run at a slow early pace and even though there's a bigger field than usual I still wouldn't be sure there's going to be much pace on. Fanning may be allowed to do his own thing in front again. KH could get caught out in such a scenario, he didn't show much instant pace in the Eclipse. Also with a decent size field there's more danger of one of them improving. I'm sure if KH wins then his price will look an opportunity missed but I'm happy to sit it out.

I actually agree with Grendel here apart from the nap of the day bit. Clearly the best horse by some way and at 6/4 too boot.

i don't think pace should be an issue figgis...

hartnell and the o'brien horse seem likely to be on the speed and odeon also likes to be up there...how fast they go is another matter but these should at least be up in the van and ensure a decent pace and certainly not a crawl

i'm not as keen as others to take the 6-4 myself...i have reservations about the derby and in all fairness atzeni gave the horse a superb ride without winning to finish as close as he did...i am happy to watch him win and will be coupling some horses against him

Maybe, harry, but often once Fanning gets in front they let him slow things down, they let him get away with a very slow pace last time on Hartnell.

I don't think a steady pace will be a problem for KH. He ran in the 2000 Gns and the Eclipse plus quickened well to lead in the Derby. Can't think you can say that about any of the others. I will be surprised if he doesn't outclass this bunch. (I have been surprised before though not often).

is the ground a worry for KH backers?

The Guineas, Eclipse and Derby were all well run races.

won't be any faster ground than he ran on in the eclipse

he was withdrawn from the irish derby due to the fast conditions

That's good to hear Fig. I was led to believe the Guineas and Eclipse were not well run. It doesn't matter because he obviously has speed for a Gr1 and I'm not worried about the ground either. If something outruns their form they may beat him but if they don't they won't. Pretty obvious I know.

Led to believe by who?

Gallops watchers. They have got to start paying now to watch the gallops.

Never paid in my life to watch the gallops. Sad day when they are trying to attract newcomers.

Hello brigust, agree, it is a sad day when enthusiasts warned off for being just that.

Kingston Hill clearly got the best form but virtually all the others are potential improvers.

I'll take a chance on Marzocco at 18/1 ew based on the circumstantial evidence, trainer would have had any number of possibles for a race he has a great record in, plus application of first time blinkers (I think he's usually fairly judicious in the use of head gear).

Hopeful rather than confident, I think Indian Maharaja is interesting too.

kingston hill out...disgusting really 20 minutes before the race...beautiful ground as well

these connections seem obsessed with something no one else that reads the form of the horse thinks is an issue. Would have gone perfectly well.

^agree, trainer even said himself at the beginning of the season that he was a good moving horse and no reason why he should n't be just as effective on quicker ground.Not sure what's changed.

ran a great race in the Derby and actually being that day it was fairly firm. Very disappointing to say the least

I can understand why he pulled it but why leave it till 20 mins before the race when you know it is good/firm...horrible stuff imo

Been campaigned very poorly since Epsom, imo.

I think York's problem is grass cover. Their grass is very short and R Charlton criticised them about it last season. I think if there is good grass cover it makes a huge difference.

WD Deeping.

well done OP...a pleasing race

yeah agree Figgis, a bizarre entry in the eclipse (fine if they thought it was the right entry) and then held up to use a turn of pace which he doesn't have and runs on into 4th when hes the best stayer in the field, personally i think he's a grinder and was given a shocking ride. Then they find a 1m 4f race which seems ideal and then withdraw him.

You were right, harry, the keen going Odeon ensured a good pace.

Fallen Angel, yes and on early impressions of the times it doesn't look like the ground is any faster today than in the Eclipse.

well done, OP - first two well clear, AOB's St Leger options diminished after that.

Kingfisher might be his best chance.

Well done, deepingfox.

yes figgis he can't help himself that horse...if they could get him to settle he is very unfurnished but they just can't get him to drop the bit...thought postponed was a little free and ran up the back of horses early but he is clearly a nice improver as is the second

Nice call deep
Classy performance from the winner 2day, very much a 3yo colt on the up.
Stand out on looks in the paddock as well.
Well done

That Odeon has an engine - head of a lunatic though unfortunately.

Disgusting from Varian. Mugged punters right off, the twOt!

Cheers Miller, the profile was progressive, stamina-laden pedigree for step-up in trip, and visibly impressive on video.

He also looked a very good-looking and strong colt back in Craven in April.

Its good when the homework pays off.

I think Johnny G could have a handicap winner or two later in the week, if the entries are confirmed.

Cheers Figgis, Brigust.

As well as being convinced this horse would improve again for the trip, I was convinced we wouldn't see Eagle Top here, and there wouldn't be enough juice for Kingston Hill.