pch hyped up horse- coordinated cut

Yes :^0 and will again no doubt :|

i remember a while ago that rubahunish was the next wonder horse from chapple hyams stable, it ended up being a staying hurdler.

He loves hyping them up PCH but he does sometimes get good ones as we know unlike Meehan.

The name Amaakin rings a bell here ;\

he is very good at identifying his best os at an earlt stage imho

ive laid 200ew 33 and 200ew 25 , seem daft prices to me at this stage. if he hacks up 10l 2morrow however ill be twitching

i dont remember him saying anything about this horse just on the morning line it was a nice horse

Coral reported one bet of £4,000 on Tuesday evening for the 325,000gns son of Montjeu and then "several three-figure bets". The 33-1 available soon evaporated and Coordinated Cut now shares Derby favouritism at 20-1 with four other colts, all of them unbeaten.


WALOFS :^0

You'd do well to get 4k on with em on todays price, never mind at 33/1 for the bloody Derby....
Whichever reporter is 'reporting' this really needs to give their head a shake

anyone have what the trainer said,word for word, to hand please ....

In his May Stable Tour PCH said

Co-ordinated Cut wont be out until August/September. He is by Montjeu, and we are taking things slowly with him, but I love him. Whatever you ask him to do is done with such ease, almost effortlessly. Make a note as I believe he has a touch of class.

ATR website stable tour, 7 Sep 2009.

"He's the best I've got by some way. I thought he was good in February. He's in at the Doncaster Leger meeting and Sandown on September 11. A mile at the moment and I'm very excited about him."

cheers guys.

Anone else like the Dunlop horse today?

looks the ew poke Ben

CC isn't very well connected and the relatives on the dams side didn't stay.

I like Munsarim today....

I like his breeding, I think the Montjeu influence will be enough to see him just about get 1m4f but he still gets speed from the dam side which is what you need in a Derby horse. I think the fact his 4 brothers are geldings is significant though and will use that as a reason to take him on, particularly first time out.

Got to lay abit today at evens .

ben,

If this is a windup about gelding then I have fallen for it.
But , CC's brother's aren't all geldings, according to my records.
Wild Savannah is still an entire horse at seven years old.
Cactus King was gelded at five years old, Sahara Desert was gelded at six years old to go hurdling, and Golden Sun was gelded after five racecourse runs.

I was going off RP website tbh, hardly the most researched claim ever :) :

Sahara Desert 99 g Green Desert(7.9f) 3 1 11 23,058.63 114 8f
Wild Savannah 02 g Singspiel(10.5f) 4 5 17 93,221.23 112 10f
Golden Sun 01 g Dr Fong(9.6f) 2 3 9 42,382.92 99 10f
Cactus King 03 g Green Desert(7.9f) 3 6 26 17,872.06 94 8f

I thought it might a wind up bearing his name of Coordinated Cut in mind :)

Good to see RP info as accurate as ever.

Yeah true, sorry if I misled anyone...
Out of interest where do you get your gelding information from, I've never found anywhere but I'm sure it must be something that has to be declared?

Not that good was it?

Can't believe he was actually cut again after that effort.

These bookies are laughable.

I was quite impressed, will relish the step up in trip next year

16/1 for the Derby :0 shockin price imo

you were honestly quite impressed ?.

Jesus.

Terrible price for Derby, but yes a nice debut performance.

Disagree ;\

Looks more of a national type imo.

My 2011 Triumph Hurdler. :)

^ Would he be better than Donegal though...

Taken the 33/1 for the 2011 Truimph Hurdle!! ;)

Maybe TD but it's a standard maiden, Tactician could be useful as well but there's been far better maidens this year. Needs to show a lot more imv. Talking a fair bit of sense on ATR tbf; no pace in race, ground and needs to improve.

Daft minds think alike TEN :)

For once i agree with Big Mac - if there hadn't been heaps of hype over the past 48 hours about him there isn't a hope in hell anyone watching that run would be thinking he was anything other than a half decent h'capper in the making for next year.

Yeah ben, Im not saying hes the Derby winner! Just saying he made a nice debut performance and should progress. Seen many better 2yo's though this season.

Both fair points I think. On the face of it it's a decent start to his career but you wouldn't have him down as pattern class with that effort never mind the Derby. He'll be better as a 3 year old anyway so it's a bonus to have him showing something as a two year old. If there was no hype around him he'd be interesting in a Listed race (for example) with a bit of cut but he doesn't look a betting proposition at the moment.

ben,

Going firstly back to your point about gelding. The info is our/my database which comes from a variety of sources. I'm not sure what the requirement is for "gelding dates" but you do have to advise your relevant racing authority.
CC's brother's happened to have all the dates.

CC definitely looked a horse (typical Montjeu) who would prefer cut in the ground to me.

I think the form of the race will be difficult to asses in the short term and 16/1 for the Derby is "bookie money printing machine".

At this moment the key horse is the third, Muwalla beaten 2 1/2 lengths. Probably a decent horse, but no "fancy" entries from a trainer who does tend to throw "fancy" entries around like confetti!

Chapple Hyam has pretty much echoed what I just said. 16/1 is a joke price, but hes a nice horse and could now be aimed at the Racing Post Trophy, or will wait for next year.

While I wouldn't be rushing out to back him for any classics just yet, there was no early pace in this race so he possibly didn't show what he was really capable of.

the second horse is every bit as likely to win the derby next year queen hayley gave it a shocking ride imo the 16to1 for the winner is surely a contender for worst price of the decade

I wouldn't be backing him for the racing post trophy personally, a lot of others would be more ready for that. He did stand out in the pre parade ring though.

I am no great race reader, so take these comments with care. I did see the last 2f of his victory on ATR and tbh couldn't see how he was more than 2l better than the 2nd and 3rd. The TV people said he is unfurnished and would improve, but I wouldn't bet on that. IMO he won't win more than 2 more races of modest class.

Authorized didn't look too special on his debut in a slowly run race either, not that I'm saying this is another Authorized.

How many Derby winners start off running over 1 mile as 2yos ? I am sure CC has the stamina for the Derby , but does he have the speed to win ?

There's been a few, Motivator, Authorized, Galileo, Dancing Brave amongst them

Sinndar, Galileo, Motivator, Authorized...

push comes across as a shrewd cookie

Dancing Brave didn't win the Derby

But he fackin should have done !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

Brodie 15 Sep 23:01
Dancing Brave didn't win the Derby

Ok Shahrastani then ;)

Just asked the question, did not say it was impossible to start their career off over 1 mile, and still win the Derby.

Tactician did not do alot for the form of CC today.

Form looks really poor

Wasn't at all impressed by debut win and will be place laying if it turns up in the RP trophy.

Charlton2005 15 Sep 19:54
I am no great race reader, so take these comments with care. I did see the last 2f of his victory on ATR and tbh couldn't see how he was more than 2l better than the 2nd and 3rd. The TV people said he is unfurnished and would improve, but I wouldn't bet on that. IMO he won't win more than 2 more races of modest class.

Piece of sh!t imo

Wish every man and his dog wanted to be on for the Derby

Undoubtedly too short a price but a bit hasty to judge him on the evidence of one slowly run debut.

A bit harsh, it's going to be better as a 3 year old and it did win in the end, off a slow pace when most Montjeus like a good strong pace (seems to help them finish their races off). He's not a betting proposition by any means but it will be interesting to see how he gets on at Doncaster.

good boost for him yesterday Morana winning the Group 3 at Ascot. Cant get near him on the gallops

If only the Derby was run on the gallops.

^ My thoughts exactly. Straight away you think Winker Watson with this trainer

Why did they never try go back sprinting with Winker Watson?
Has he transferred out of Hyams yard now?

Went to Meehan briefly but been retired to stud now so maybe had a setback.

ah right thanks. Always thought he never stayed.

which Stud in their right mind would stand that heap of junk?

Which owner in their right mind would 'transfer' one to Meehan, unless their trainer went missing in the jungle & Meehan was their second cousin or something???????

The same one who thinks they can charge 3.5k per covering!

Here's the articles:

Winker joins Meehan in attempt to revive career

WINKER WATSON has left Peter Chapple-Hyam's Newmarket base and been sent to Brian Meehan in a bid to revive the fortunes of the talented but frustrating colt.

The son of Piccolo has failed to get his head in front in seven starts since winning the Group 2 TNT July Stakes in 2007 and his owners, the Comic Strip Heros, are hoping that a change of scenery will help him to replicate his morning work on the racecourse.

Part-owner Andrew Black said: "He went to Manton earlier this week. Pete and Brian are pretty good mates and I already have horses with Brian."

After a three-year-old career in which he failed to win in four starts, Winker Watson was the subject of rave reviews on the gallops earlierthis year where he was repeatedly catching pigeons but he has so far failed to deliver in three starts, including on his seasonal reappearance in a Warwick conditions race where he finished fourth of five having been sent off at 8-15.

Black continued: "Pete thought a change of scenery might work. He is a real morning glory horse. He looks immortal on the gallops and then on the track he travels well but never puts it in at the end.

"When you have a horse like this you know you are kind of beaten but you don't want to give up although you have to accept that the chances of him turning around are pretty slim."

Peter Chapple-Hyam says there is no ill-feeling between himself and Winker Watson's connections saying: "It was my suggestion to move him. You have to do what is best for the horse, not what is best for yourself."

***********

Winker Watson retired to Norman Court Stud
By Martin Stevens3.01PM 9 OCT 2009

WINKER WATSON, one of the leading two-year-olds of the 2007 Flat season, has been retired to stand at Norman Court Stud near Salisbury, where he will begin his career as a stallion next year at a fee of £3,500.

The 16.1hh son of Piccolo was purchased as a yearling for 56,000gns by Blandford Bloodstock on behalf of The Comic Strip Heroes syndicate, who named him after a character in The Dandy.

Trained by Peter Chapple-Hyam, he was unbeaten as a juvenile, winning his maiden over 5f at Newbury, the Norfolk Stakes at Royal Ascot, and the July Stakes, in which he produced a devastating turn of foot to overcome a low draw and come from last to first to score. He was also carrying a 3lb penalty in the Newmarket Group 2 event.

Those efforts earned him a Racing Post Rating of 116 and quotes as low as 10-1 in ante-post betting lists for the 2,000 Guineas. Though he missed the first Classic of the season, he posted a highly creditable effort when beaten three and a half lengths into fourth by Henrythenavigator in the Sussex Stakes. This year he has failed to find his true form, finishing unplaced in three starts.

Norman Court Stud co-owner Tania Trant said: "Winker Watson showed outstanding form as a two-year-old, with two Group 2 wins to his credit, and he was a worthy fancy for the 2,000 Guineas.

"He is a nice, strong individual, tidy and well put-together. He was described by Peter Chapple-Hyam as one of the best two-year-olds he had ever trained, while his regular jockey Jimmy Fortune said he was genuine with lots of speed. We feel that his nomination fee of £3,500 is highly competitive."

Winker Watson joins 2006 St Leger hero Sixties Icon, who covered his first book of mares this year, and fellow Group 1 winner Imperial Dancer onthe Norman Court Stud stallion roster.



Don't know who else the stud stands but they must be desperate!

3 and half k is peanuts really though compared to what these foals can make in the sales

Not really when you take into account costs of keeping the foal and mare. Plus the fact there's a good chance that a horse just won't make the grade and is therefore worthless, especially with a poorer sire.

That the stud stand Imperial Dancer and Sixies Icon says it all. £3.5k looks expensive. If you are going to be breeding a racehorse and putting it in training then you would most certainly spend an extra £3-6k to send your mare to either a proven sire or one that at least achieved a lot more on the track.

WD Perp

:)

Joining Michael Bell along with Monitor Closely.

Looks like it was a wise switch

just saw the race & not sure what it beat but WOW !!

incredible scenes!

New Chums ordered for layers?...

a few people on here are looking very silly now arent they .

Is he going to the Dante next, was that stated after the race? Got an antepost voucher on this fella still for the derby hoping that is the aim for him looked alright the other day and probably wants the extra 2 furlongs of that race.

Not really, the horse he beat the other day was rated 100, so he still needs to improve by about 20 lbs to win the Derby.