Camelot-Zero chance of winning the Guineas.

I agree, has no chance, mugpunters backing this camel!

If he does go for the Guineas , i think he will have a better chance of winning his 2000 Guineas than  St Nick had of winning his Guineas.

My opinion of his last 2-y-o race (8f) - he beat a bunch of sprinters.  His entries indicate middle distance is his game.

The price confirms Chruchill's observation about how he knew that democracy didn't work. Spending 5 minutes with the average voter. A whole bunch of idiots actng on ill informed opinions. And that will be the case even if it wins.

How long are you going to wait to get balls deep in CleverName??? Love to know how far you`re in already!!!

Incredible to think someone with a clever name obviously hasn't got a clue what's the driving force behind the decision to run Camelot in the 2000gns.It's not rocket science folks,have a think and ask yourselves why Maybe is now connections main runner in the 1000gns and not Wading.A clue,with the recent death of Montjeu connections still have a vested interest in promoting him as a sire of sires hence Camelot running at HQ,connections feel as sure as they can be he is plenty good enough to win the Guineas and so enhance his appeal as a stallion,but they also stand Maybe's sire Galileo they also want him to all being well bag a classic winner this year.
Montjeu has a reputation of siring top class colts but his fillies have until very recently been mediocre in comparison to the colts,now with his death they no longer need to enhance his commercial appeal as a sire of top class fillies,if Montjeu hadn't died I'm sure as eggs are eggs Wading would be their No1 runner in the 1000gns as it is she can go to Epsom and win the Oaks.Its a classic but not as commercial as the GNS and remember Galileo is still with us.like CleverName says its not rocket science,but granted some find it hard to understand!

prima, you have misunderstood the op. he is not saying its incredible that people think he should run in the race. he is saying its incredible that people think he is capable of winning the race.

No Charlton2005,I understand the OP alright,its just I find it incredible some people think he can't win just because he's a son of Montjeu.I'm sure their judgement is based on St Nicholas Abbey's run back in '09.O'Brien is no fool and has been careful not to make the same mistake again with Camelot.
Montjeu is known for getting quirky temperaments with his stock St Nicholas Abbey was no exception,they are horses not machines by the time of St Nicks guineas run he was over trained and basically 'chucked it'as he was given far too much work prior to his run as his connections started to believe what was being said at the time about Montjeu not being able to get a GR1 miler at 3.
I think its a very brave man indeed to say it is impossible for Camelot to win the 2000 just because he's a son of Montjeu,one things for sure Camelot won't be there just for the day out..........he's there to win and nothing else!

prima,how many Montjeus have won a Group 1 over a mile at the age of 3?
i cant think of too many mate,thats hardly a coincidence is it?

But that's a lot different to saying he can't win just because he's by Montjeu,what you all may not know is Camelot is from a crop of Montjeu's were his connections supported him with better mares,when they finally had faith in him as a stallion!

Well i for one hope he does it,as i love Montjeu as a sire,Quirky but Quality in abundance

We agree then as I too hope he wins and I for one think he will,Montjeu was a fantastic stallion he is a massive loss to the bloodstock world,Coolmore are hoping Camelot can become a worthy replacement for him,winning the guineas will be the first step on the road to greatness this year......and don't say you weren't told!

iirc this is verbatim what you said 2 days before SNA ran unplaced at 1/4 a place.  gl with your bets

and don't say you weren't told!Grin

sorry forgot to post what you said!!

Charlton2005,good luck with your bets and there's an old saying'There's none so blind as those that will not see'.SNA was back in 2009 this is another horse and another year,and I'm sure another result!

will camelot still run if all this rain continues?who knows with mr o brien though

Surely increases the chances of success?

Will win by half the track under these conditions.

If he flops the headline is "Camelot the camel".
Why would they pick a name that is ripe for ridicule?

No the headlines will be Camelflop imo

yeah camelflop sounds about right i agree

Do you guys breed budgies ?

Blog that goes into some detail on the Montjeu stat amongst others things on the Irish Field website: http://www.theirishfield.ie/site/article.php?id=1822&cid=5

camelot IS brilliant AND will WIN the guineas

I can see a lot of valid and well informed reasons especially by Prima Donna for siding with Camelot, and it makes good sense to pay attention to whats happening in the breeding world, however I am of the belief that Camelot will win the Derby, as his dosage clearly indicates that the 12 furlongs of that race will be much more to his liking, and the guineas will in fact be a bit on the short side for him... and on that factor I find his price currently is not reflecting the minuses of the situation, it seems his price is based on pluses only, and for punting purposes that is not fair play.... so I look to O'Brien again for the answer to this race, and one with more honesty about its price looks to be Power, who also appears to be in this race as a contender who should get the utmost respect.... imo .....anyway, gl to all....

Camelot looked good beating Zip Top?

19/04/12 Trumpet Major beats Crius 5 lengths in Craven Stakes
22/10/11 Camelot beats Zip Top 2¼.
08/10/11 Parish Hall, beats Power ½.  Trumpet Major in 5th beaten total of 1½.
22/09/11 Crius beats Zip Top 2½, hd.

I know they are now 3-y-os but the Racing Post "form" looks paper thin.

Great piece on England Job
http://www.thesocialgambler.com/2012/05/01/why-harry-redknapp-didnt-get-the-england-managers-job/


Power for the 2,000

Great piece on England Job
http://www.thesocialgambler.com/2012/05/01/why-harry-redknapp-didnt-get-the-england-managers-job/


Power for the 2,000

All class.Well done Joey

Now win the Derby !

Can he wipe out the memory of The Senor getting beat.I think he will.

CleverName,I do hope you saw the 2000 yesterday.........hope you didn't loose too much,next time try looking beyond the end of your nose!

Great ride by young O'Brien. Congrats.

It tends not to pay giving it the bigun on here , it can well result with egg on your face.

It amazes me the research people do before predicting how a certain horse performs in a certain race, and they p ss me off. Aidan O Brien is on record saying that the computer he has recording his horses work couldn't recognize some of the fractions Camelot was doing at home. But more to the point relating to the original author he assumes that just because no other montjeu horse won such race in past Camelot couldn't. I for one wouldn't have believed that a 3 year old + horse by Galileo would be fast enough to win over 6f but now I believe Frankel would be capable of such a feat. I thought when there were many similar posts relating to the belief that hurricane fly couldn't win at cheltenham because no other montjeu horse had done so before that people would learn their lesson about reading into past reords. I'm glad I was a backer of Camelot. May the short sighted clowns continue to lay horses even if it means we have to listen to s..t.

but the layers are surely winning this battle. hurricane fly got beat this yr and camelot is the 1st montjeu to win at a mile at 3.

nice aftertiming btw.

O.k but the dog in the street knew Camelot was special and persons were laying him on strength of other horses failing. Please keep laying the special ones because some backers only wait for em, thnx

same dogs knew st nic abbey was special too.

gl

ilikewavingatbuses,the fact is St.Nicholas Abbey was very special.....that is until he was given so much over training in the spring of his 3 y'old year,by the time of his guineas run he'd had more than enough and was over the top.It took him a long time to recover and spent most of that year turned out.His connections knew he was special and very talented and kept faith in him,their patience paid off because his form returned,since then he has gone on to be a true GR1 horse.I know its hard for some to accept his trainer ruined his chance of classic success.They have been very careful not to make the same mistake with Camelot.

yes i love st nic prima, have always been a fan , how could u not after his 2 yr old season. i even remember his maiden where he was backed as tho defeat was out of the question and was very very impressive.

the reason i mentioned him was because BANJACKST implied camelot couldnt be beaten or was special. whether he is or not i dont know but it was the usual day at the office  for aidan spinning his yarns! i was impressed with camelots guineas and didnt think he'd win tbh but he did and i can live with that but its no good BANJACKST telling us the dogs knew AFTER hes won

i look forward to his derby run, i hope he wins handsomely!

Banjackst didn't imply what your saying Waves, he states its lunacy to lay a certain horse on the strength of a different horse failing ( in this case a montjeu horse winning a 3yr + mile race ) . thats what this topic is about and he makes sense. You completely miss the point.

Monks it wasn't even the laying part that was disturbing, everyone is entitled to an opinion but when a reported special horse is given a Zero Chance of winning egg should be splattered on their face because the foundation of the argument didn't apply to this specific animal. Theres always another bus to come round the corner to wave at though.

baNjackst,did u also read Camelot would win a July Cup,You MUG!!
i think he will be beat on saturday,his price is a joke,far too short

theres being braindead and having an opinion, face up to it. who mentioned july cup. Im simply telling they gobshhh1ts who said camelot had zero chance know zip. freshie

Zero Chance and there still arguing, how long you out for?

this topic is over because the original posters proved they know Zero. and boxfresh finish school, not a good idea to drop out at junior infants

Monksfield79
29 May 12 22:08
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Banjackst didn't imply what your saying Waves, he states its lunacy to lay a certain horse on the strength of a different horse failing ( in this case a montjeu horse winning a 3yr + mile race ) . thats what this topic is about and he makes sense. You completely miss the point.
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baNjackst

baNjackst
29 May 12 22:40
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Monks it wasn't even the laying part that was disturbing, everyone is entitled to an opinion but when a reported special horse is given a Zero Chance of winning egg should be splattered on their face because the foundation of the argument didn't apply to this specific animal. Theres always another bus to come round the corner to wave at though.



i didnt imply the camelot COULDNT win the derby. but u (BJ) were talking (after the race) that the dogs were barking about how special he was (again all this AFTER hes feckin won pmsl). u obviously thought the same thing about st nic abbey too as he was as impressive in winning the RP eased down, so please dont imply u are some sort of judge

you obv back all the ballydoyle hype machines on the back of your 'even the dogs knew' theory.

let me guess you didnt back OR lay so abbey ffs u after timing ****. i post on the main forum, stick your opinions/ tips up there BEFORE  the race so we can all have a good laugh, cheers.

My opinion nothing to do with horse, I stating obvious. Zero chance means under NO CIRCUMSTANCES. No wonder some people cant read form.

For the persons who need some of the six inch space filled between their ears, I never stated after the fact that I believed Camelot would win the Guineas nor did I have an expressed opinion before the race. I have simply stated since the race the reasons why I believe it was not very clever to go down the road of stating a strong favorite had Zero chance.
At least the original posters are embarrassed but some just won't let go and the best way of describing em type are CHASERS and professional losers

i never stated he had 'ZERO' chance, this isnt my thread and i always had the utmost respect for Camelot.

its funny u talking about dogs barking after hes won tho

u sound shrewd