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Mighty Whites 2008
12 Aug 13 14:16
Date Joined: 27 May 06
| Topic/replies: 14,439 | Blogger: Mighty Whites 2008's blog
Its August the middle of the summer and for the third straight week no event on European soil.

You have to feel for the average tour pro.
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Report ReaseHeath August 12, 2013 2:41 PM BST
Then two decent events in the Johnnie Walker and Wales Open but scheduled to coincide with start of play offs on US Tour.

I know the Johnnie Walker has a pretty much fixed spot in the calendar but can't help thinking they'd be better off playing the Wales Open this week, albeit the week after a Major.

Either way, as you say a blank week in high summer is just wrong, surely they could juggle the calendar a little more effectively.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 12, 2013 2:45 PM BST
feel for the guys who not good enough for the majors/wgc events. one event in 5 weeks (in russia) for these guys as many wont have made the open.
Report brain dead jockeys August 12, 2013 2:49 PM BST
the euro tour really has disintegrated.......only one event each year guaranteed to be played on english soild.......the irish open now a micky mouse event.
america fully deserves 3 of the 4 majors. big crowds each week for their events, the sun is shining and millions of dollars up for grabs.
Report Deplasterer August 12, 2013 3:45 PM BST
You coould almost nearly call it another Asian tour at this rate of going, but I suppose they have to follow the corporate money.
Report Ski-Wiz August 12, 2013 3:55 PM BST
I was thinking that today as noticed that there was no Euro tour this week. Many do not play at the WGC or PGA 'major' so no reason why there can't be some tournies for them.

It would not require a huge prize money since there would be no point trying to attract players when players are in the WGC and PGA 'major'.

In August, no schools, holidays, thus two tournaments in England. One in the South and one in the Midlands.
Report stonecold- August 12, 2013 3:56 PM BST
yeah not good cant remember it being this bad last year.
Report brain dead jockeys August 12, 2013 4:04 PM BST
there is no interest in golf on mainland europe..........yes spain have produced top plyers but their population has no interest.....same with germany, france, italy etc. your talking about british isles and asia. thats basically the european tour. im still baffled though by the demise of the english open and british masters. they need to b brought back.
Report Kelly August 12, 2013 4:09 PM BST
The European tour has fallen from lofty heights not many years ago . Sponsors hard to come by , and with more and more of "our" stars" heading for USA its going to get worse . One of the side effects of playing in USA also is that  you only have to play reasonably well to keep your position in the top 125 , and if you are in that top 125 you are guaranteed a hefty income without actually having to win an event , just make the cut is enough .

Irish Open is hardly Mickey Mouse bdj . Especially if they play it within decent distance of the north .
Report brain dead jockeys August 12, 2013 4:11 PM BST
kelly.........other than the irish players, no world class players turn out for it anymore. harsh truth.
Report Fallen Angel August 12, 2013 4:29 PM BST
You can see why most players of any calibre end up heading across the Atlantic. The European tour has really struggled this year in competing quality wise with the PGA in the majors. Have always wondered myself why there isn't more than one English venue on the European tour. At least they know the crowds would come out regardless.
Report hearts1874 August 12, 2013 7:40 PM BST
agree with fallen angel a event in England on a links course would be brilliant imo
Report xmoneyx August 12, 2013 8:31 PM BST
my next golf bet@the masters

only bet majors now

wish the last major was September
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 12, 2013 9:19 PM BST
The euro tour should be seeing itself as a development tour with a few prestige events. The economic downturn has hurt the tour a few years ago there were seven events in Spain alone. The tour won't sanction events with purses below a certain level. I can understand why they do this but it is becoming counter productive as there are too many blank weeks. This the third week with no event yet there are challenge tour events. Why they don't have some co-sanctioned events or smaller purse events. At the Scottish open Chris Doak was in the final group on sunday last week he was playing a euro pro tour event as he had no where else to play.

An event in England post the open would be great but even the challenge tour event has gone now.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 12, 2013 9:25 PM BST
One of the side effects of playing in USA also is that  you only have to play reasonably well to keep your position in the top 125 , and if you are in that top 125 you are guaranteed a hefty income without actually having to win an event , just make the cut is enough .

The PGA Tour has become harder every year the standard is so high now however the rewards are so much greater than anywhere else. Making the cut each week is tough.

Currently Peter Hanson, Nicolas Colsaerts, Padraig Harrington, Bud Cauley, Paul Casey, Chad Campbell, David Toms, Vijay Singh, Ryo Ishikawa, Ben Curtis, Robert Karlsson, Ross, Fisher, Sean O'Hair, YE Yang are outside the top 125 and a week from their pga season being over not to mention countless 'journeyman' who were once regulars on tour.

With the migration of top world stars and the procession of good youngsters it is becoming harder than ever to make it in the states.
Report ReaseHeath August 12, 2013 9:49 PM BST
Fisher entered at both Gleneagles and Celtic Manor so probably expecting the worst this week!

He would possibly be better served by building some confidence contending and/or winning a few regular Euro Tour events anyway - that's how he broke through initially.

Colsaerts another who has probably regressed whilst on US Tour, hy would claim to learn a lot from the experience of playing on the PGA Tour but when was the last time he was really in the hunt on a Sunday?

Even Ishikawa might benefit from a spell on the European Tour, I bet it serves the likes of Uhlein well in the longer term.
Report therhino August 12, 2013 9:57 PM BST
1 event in England, and 1 in Australia for the European Tour. It is madness. Nothing more than a feeder tour now. Gutted they scrapped Hong Kong, was a big fan of that particular event.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 12, 2013 10:01 PM BST
when you consider colsaerts is in the 4 majors and the wgc events its been a disappointing year.

Its tough the first year as you are going to courses you dont know most weeks.

You can't blame players for going stateside it is harder but the rewards are so much greater. David Lynn has shown what can be achieved.
Report Fallen Angel August 12, 2013 10:43 PM BST
To me personally and this is only an opinion the European tour go to too many countries / courses where the interest level is lacking. I can't believe they are better served by going to SA three times than England more than once, know the weather has an impact but some of the initial European tour events had extremely poor quality fields.

There are too many trips to far flung destinations in Asia a long way from many of the core players although this might have to do with who sponsors the events. To me it lacks the narrative of the PGA and lacks the personal battles that go with it. Plus there are too many events where a home favorite contends strongly and then dissapear's as quickly, to me the true world class golfers are the ones that can turn up at any course and perform.

It has certainly bled big names recently, no matter how much the commentary teams want to praise the organisers.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 12, 2013 10:52 PM BST
they cant find sponsors in england that is the problem. The events in south africa are because they cant play in europe at that time of the year.
Report Ski-Wiz August 13, 2013 9:40 AM BST
Currently Peter Hanson, Nicolas Colsaerts, Padraig Harrington, Bud Cauley, Paul Casey, Chad Campbell, David Toms, Vijay Singh, Ryo Ishikawa, Ben Curtis, Robert Karlsson, Ross, Fisher, Sean O'Hair, YE Yang

Peter Hanson, Nicolas Colsaerts, Padraig Harrington, Paul Casey,  Robert Karlsson, Ross, Fisher should be back at the euro tour where they had a chance of winning something, like PC did. Others should move back to the euro tour. Too many are out of their depth in the PGA tour.

Sometimes i do wonder if winning is important to those golfers or losing but still pick up a nice cheque.

Sponsors in England? I find that hard to believe. Are the tour's chiefs asking for too much? I do recall when the tour got expanded and spread over different countries like the Far East and SA, the chiefs said that the aim was to raise the profile of the games and attract new youngsters into golf. Fair enough but Matchplay in Bulgaria is daft, should be in England. Reno Tahoe was a secondary event that week and stableford, wouldn't mind seeing that in England when the PGA 'major' is on.
Report Ski-Wiz August 13, 2013 9:41 AM BST
Perhaps Betfair should sponsor a tourney in England during August.........
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 13, 2013 11:43 AM BST
The problem is sponsors. Mainland europe is really struggling to attract sponsors to hold events just look how few senior tour events there are now compared to a few years ago. They probably should allow lower purses but they are loathe to do this as they fear that other events will see the prize fund fall.There have been efforts in england to restore the english open and british masters but both have failed.

Why would any pro be on the euro tour when they have a chance to play on the PGA. At the end of the day this is a job for these guys. Golf isn't a win or lose game like many sports 156 guys tee it up most weeks and only one wins. Whether the guys above would win in europe isn't certain. If its wins you want why not go back to the challenge or europro tour?
What the majority want is to play at the highest level possible and make as much money as possible. Wins are a bonus.
Report irishro August 13, 2013 11:44 AM BST
I believe one of the main stumbling blocks to tournaments in the UK is the tax situation. Players are not going to enter events where realistically there are playing for 50% of the overall pot. The Irish Open has been hanging on by a thread with no main sponsor and only the lure of our major champions keeping it going. The Irish tourist board/govt have heavily subsidised the last couple of years events which is fine to keep it going but it is not a long term solution.
The regular suggestion of a 'links swing' around the Open should be explored more and really pushed by the European tour. I'm sure tax issues could be easily sorted if the European tour had the desire to promote this.
Report Fallen Angel August 13, 2013 12:13 PM BST
Its interesting that this thread has started up as I really think the European tour bigwigs have their heads in the sand on this matter. All they get is praise from skysports on the variety of countries they visit, no comment whatsoever on the fact that the match play in Bulgaria was attended by one man and his dog. My Sunday league team had more fans. The events in Dubai are well attended, the Malaysia event to be is a bit of a waste of time and it's perennially affected by torrential rain. Betfair should definately consider a sponsorship. The liquidity on here was great during Wentworth and the exposure would be good for non-exchange punters who might bet with the competition.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 13, 2013 12:21 PM BST
In fairness to the tour they are really up against it. The minimum prize fund in europe is 1 million euros. The bulk of that comes from the tournament sponsors.

The tour should look at having some events where the prize fund is 500,000. They do this in the co sanctioned events with the challenge tour and should look to do it more where there are blank weeks.

Ultimately the players in europe are going to have to accept that baring the big events they will have to play for less.
Report Kelly August 13, 2013 2:59 PM BST
The links swing is a good idea and has been mooted before on here .  Should be an Irish , Scottish , English , and /or Welsh "Open " on links courses , with good purses and hopefully good weather .  Nobody wants to play Royal Dornoch or Ballybunion on a wet and windy April day , but in June , July , and August most of the excellent links courses on these islands would be fine . And a big percentage of those playing would not have exhorbitant overheads re travel / accomodation etc .

Not like going to South Africa or Singapore , or Hong Kong or China .  Plus these events would all be well supported .  Some of the European tour people have got way ahead of themselves in terms of risk / reward in the planning department .  Time to reconvene and rationalise and get back to where there is good support on the ground .  The Spaniards generally , while they produce great golfers , do not embrace golf as a sport .  OK they have the weather , and events there should be fashioned accordingly .

The USA have all the aces in their deck , good weather ( outside of thunderstorms etc ) , big variety of courses , plenty of sponsors , a stranglehold on domesticity for the worlds elite golfers  , and lots of professional back up . Thats something we all have to live with , including the European tour officialdom .

One event outside of the Open in England is ludicrous given the number of golfers and interest compared with continental Europe . Get onto your MP's lads , remind them that a lot more people play golf than ride bikes to work ! And most of the golf courses are self sufficient thanks to the historical efforts of those who love the game !
Report Ski-Wiz August 13, 2013 3:19 PM BST
The minimum prize fund in europe is 1 million euros.

Seriously..........don't they know there's a recession on?
Report Ski-Wiz August 13, 2013 3:22 PM BST
I'm not sure i would want all the tournament to be on link courses. The Open yes, but the rest i would like it to be in the middle of the country where most people live. Belfry, Woodhall, etc
Report Fallen Angel August 13, 2013 3:37 PM BST
I am not trying to limit the English swing to a links course....... any course would do. It could be my local pitch and putt and more people would turn up to watch the pro's practice than turn up for the final round at some of the these events on the current schedule. I know I have banged on about the level of supporters but for the long term health of the game supporters and their kids are the most important element. Again had no idea of the minimum prize fund.... astonishing and completely absurd.
Report Kelly August 13, 2013 4:25 PM BST
Appreciate the point Ski-Wiz .  Maybe not in England , but the Lancashire coast has  most of the premium " Open " type courses and unless the Open is also there that year I would be looking at those venues . Plus there is a big population nearby in Liverpool and Manchester .There are plenty of good courses in England , but the concept of playing the Belfry as a warm up for the Open stretches the imagination a bit ( I have played the Belfry ) . Chalk and cheese golf wise .

Most golf fans have no problem driving 50 miles or more to or from a decently served golf venue roadwise . Or training it .  And if I was a pro I would appreciate my feelings re course quality / interest being on board the venue selection process . If population nearby were the ultimate criteria , all tournaments would be close to London , God forbid , M25 here we sit .
Report Wok August 13, 2013 8:55 PM BST
Heard from a guy who plays at Good wood that Lord March wanted to get a Euro tour event on the course and that the Euro tour quoted the fee as several million quid. Thats hearsay of course as I dont have the facts but comes as no suprise if its true. Its only the wealthier nations and clubs that can afford to host a Euro event, then have to pay appearance fees to get some decent players, and then get half a doz spectators attending the event. Euro tour is pretty much a dead dog now and should be put down.  I think thats why they have this obsession with the Ryder Cup as it make sthem feel that Euro is important, but reality is most of the Euro team live and work in the USA. They only have to make it a qualification rule that to play in the Euro RC the player must play the Euro tour, trouble is sof course, the big names would all say sod it and continue to play the PGA. No amount of Sky TV and Euro tour hype is going to alter the fact that the Euro tour really has no real place in golf now.
Report brain dead jockeys August 13, 2013 9:27 PM BST
the major european countries like spain, germany, italy and france have no interest in golf. the european tour should revolve around the british isles. there should be minimum 10 events per year in british isles. if u play the irish open in the "right course", 30,000 will turn up each day.
i am amazed that england has only one tournament per year - wentworth.........this is mind boggling. the european tour should hang their head in shame in this regard. its total failure.
Report Mighty Whites 2008 August 13, 2013 9:38 PM BST
brain dead jockeys they cant get the sponsors for one event let alone ten.

There is no way an event can be viable on gate money alone unless they substantially reduce the purses.
Report BazWeb August 14, 2013 9:41 AM BST
The PGA Tour Explores European Tour Takeover The Wall Street Journal     August 13, 2013, 6:22 p.m. ET

Has is already happened? The European Tour website is currently unaccessible.
Report ReaseHeath August 14, 2013 12:25 PM BST
interesting read
Report brain dead jockeys August 14, 2013 1:36 PM BST
i dont understand why the PGA tour would want to to this. they have started an event in malaysia which has attracted a lot of american players. i think they should try and do the same with specific events in the british isles and maybe china. outside of america these are the two other cash cows for golf in my opinion. continental europe doesnt give a monkeys about golf and the events held in middle east are just a cannot grow in that region.
Report Ski-Wiz August 14, 2013 1:55 PM BST
The player 100th on the American money list has won £650,000, while the same-placed golfer in Europe has won £170,000.

Says it all really.
Report ReaseHeath August 14, 2013 2:18 PM BST
Instinctively a takeover by the PGA Tour which would also give them access to Ryder Cup rights does not sound great for the game - their dominance would start to edge towards a monopoly giving them a bigger say in terms of rule and regulations, tournament schedules etc.

Good to see Paul Casey getting involved - far more constructive use of a leading pros time than launching a drunken rant on Twitter.

Tend to agree with most on here that European Tour should look to develop a bigger footprint in the UK where the game has the foundation of tradition - and also be more selective about their expansion plans, particularly in Eastern Europe.

Take the point about sponsorship though.
Report brain dead jockeys August 14, 2013 2:27 PM BST
holding the matchplay event in in gods name did they think this was a good idea? some of the things they have done are very daft indeed.
Report Ski-Wiz August 14, 2013 3:46 PM BST
Good to see Paul Casey getting involved - far more constructive use of a leading pros time than launching a drunken rant on Twitter.
Report Ski-Wiz August 14, 2013 3:49 PM BST

Aug 14, 2013 -- 2:27PM, brain dead jockeys wrote:

holding the matchplay event in in gods name did they think this was a good idea? some of the things they have done are very daft indeed.

Simple really as they thought that it will expand the game among the youngsters hence why they are all over the place. Can't see how the poor countries citizens can afford to play golf. They are too busy coming over here to abuse our welfare.

The tour should go where the fans are.

Report brain dead jockeys August 14, 2013 6:24 PM BST
the fans are in the UK and ireland, australia, south africa and maybe china/HK/singapore. that about it for european tour. i attended teh singapore open 3 years in a row and there was a massive prize fund. they had barclays as teh sponsor. there was maybe 8k people there each day........not much but a hell of a lot more than u get in italy, spain, portugal.
Report Fallen Angel August 14, 2013 7:29 PM BST
holding the matchplay event in in gods name did they think this was a good idea? some of the things they have done are very daft indeed.

I cannot agree with this more. It is in the name of the user "brain dead". The match play is one of the premier events on tour. It was honestly a laughing stock this year.
Report Kelly August 15, 2013 11:33 AM BST
Brain dead , the events in Singapore which you attended , did you pay to get in ? My own experience re golf in Asia is that there are so many freebie entry tickets floating about it was hard not to be offered free ones if you were known as a golfer / golf fan , particularly someone who might actually go and watch . Interesting to know gate receipts vs attendance .

As against that , paid £40 myself for a season ticket ( 4 days plus practice days / pro am day ) for the Irish Open in 2012 , 120,000 plus there over the tournament .  Proper attendance and probably for a lesser prize fund that they were playing in Singapore ( and a better course ) .

£40 for a season ticket is phenomenal value , compare that with the cost of a Premier league soccer match ( 90 minutes ) .  Heck it even costs £45 for a Friday night ticket to watch Ulster play in the Rabo -Direct I am told  .  Know where the value is !
Report Deplasterer August 15, 2013 11:39 AM BST
Yep, Kelly that Portrush event was special only went the saturday I think, but £25 was value too for the weekend.
Report brain dead jockeys August 15, 2013 1:10 PM BST
hi kelly............yes i paid in, think it was 25 sing dollars each day which is about 15 euros. they had very strong fields for those events........mickleson, ernie, adam scott, ian poulter to name a few.
Report sewter lives again August 15, 2013 6:18 PM BST
I couldnt beleive that there is no Euro event this week, surely there is room for a British event of some description.

Perhaps it is because the football is starting and Skysports dont want any competition to their opening day.
Report ian merseyside August 17, 2013 5:31 PM BST
I wish Sky would start telling us what is really happening rather than all this needless hype, which is bordering on pure lies.  For the last couple of years they have been spouting on about the Euro Tour being really strong when the facts are suggesting something far different.  If the tour is so strong then why have the likes of McIlroy, Westwood and Kaymer deserted it and why have there been no events over the past 3 weeks?
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