General Betting
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Why are they so obtuse??
Why are they so obtuse??
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Going back to the European Swimming Championships in 2010 someone was laying the field to 200% early doors to lose approx £500 each runner and I bet into that. Perhaps part of the reason the market would be dead this time round. Takes a lot of work and knowledge to price it up safely and if you have done that work and have that knowledge you don't want to tell the market. Chciken and egg. Market dynamics and a dwindling user base ensures the market dies.
These football markets are priced up already and you can effectively get the bet on the same thing, or near as damnit the same thing on other markets. Imo they are pointless and the bets can just be placed on the busier market that amounts to the same thing. That said if there is sufficient turnover whats the problem. But if we look at Hull v Villa I've seen 3 markets with nothing at all matched. When I'm losing a market that I occoasionally play that probably matches on average £10k to £15k (I've never took much notice) that kind of pisses me off. Not too much though. |
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And going back to the swimming. When there was sufficient interest the markets used to get priced to somewhere near 105% to 110%, which is pretty close to 100% when you take away the no hopers that no one bets. Thats quite competitive when compared to 125% from the bookies.
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I've been told 105-110% isn't good enough as apparently nobody can win with that level of overround. Having spent the day backing in 125% markets, I find it incredibly frustrating they're of that mindset.
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You can't beat 105% in THOSE two markets.
For any of the prices to be that far wrong there would have to be a serious mistake in "match odds" and/or "O/U 2.5" It would be much easier to profit if you played those two markets at 100.3% but it's very difficult to beat those wafer thin margins. |
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I'm referring to the swimming markets that were culled.
Those two football markets are fine. |
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Unbelievable scenes in the swimming today, not picked up by the commentators. Never seen anything like it in any sport. Pernille Blume in the womens 100m Freestyle semi finals. Earlier in the competition she'd got beat in the 50m freestyle by 0.01 seconds, so she took it upon herself to prove that she had what it takes to have won the 50m free, by swimming the first 50m as fast as she could and touching the wall with her hands, instead of a flip turn with your feet, thereby losing almost any chance she had of making the final. Even more perplexing is that she would have been around evens to win the 100m final had she qualified.
It's a bit like having a 5 foot putt to win a golf tournament, picking tha ball up and placing it 50 foot away, because you just missed a 50 foot putt at the previous hole and wanted to prove to yourself you could have putted it. |
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btw where is the golf major markets gone?????
do u not want me to win ever |
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they had top 5,7,8,10 and now 8 gone
wtf that's the one I came in3 |
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who remembers big 5 v field
winning region winning margin |
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who remembers a time before capitalism went wrong?
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There are markets for most of the European athletics, but strangely not the heptathlon, which is very suited to betting inplay. Plus it gets alot of coverage in the uk.
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hey swimming's up...better late than never
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although I believe it's over.....
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They had a cull of golf submarkets for the US Open and despite me asking for some they wouldn't load them. So they're gone for good. They had tight overrounds and decent liquidity. I refuse to believe this will lead to an increase in profit for them.
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The last several times I've looked for 'To Qualify' markets in football tourneys there's been nothing; these were quite popular. They only put the market up for the Celtic v AEK tie after the first leg.
Most perplexing. |
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Asked for the 5000m men final and relays to be added tonight to the athletic eurochamps, no move there...good to see
the swimming that was put up after it had finished is still there... come on bf get it together! |
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lazy unreliable and pathetic!!
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Premier league outrights severely culled. I can't believe that the tricast market had
lower liquidity than the "top 6" but I'm disappointed it's gone, along with the handicap bottom, the top and bottom at Christmas, the goalscorer top 4, the relegation treble and quite a few more besides. I'm worried that they won't bother with the rest of the Cheltenham markets until after the shysters have stuck up their ridiculous NRNB offerings. |
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They've not put up a market for this morning's World Open snooker final and they've not taken players out of the outright that were beaten on Friday. However you look at it, they are half-arsing it. There have been quite a few matches this week with over £100k matched....
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I again asked today for athletic markets as they had already put up 3 markets for tonight (randomly..1500m women, pole vault and the
womens 3000m steeplechase) but omitted womens 5000m as well as other field events but most bizarrely the two 100m relays, both of which the GB team should do very well in....I can only assume monkeys are pressing random buttons as they play with themselves! |
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credit were credit is due....markets now up, thank you bf
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They are clueless- agree with the new handicap comments.
Completely killing a market, so they can milk it for themselves. Please sort it out for the nfl, and dont put the handicaps all together, spread them out to keep the interest. It's so painful. Thing is the person making the decision probably doesn't even bet, but they can name every player and talk sh1te for england. |
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I have fond memories of the relegation treble market. Managed to get the better of a bot back in 2015
 Shame though that the bot didn't make the same mistake again in following years  |
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TBH I think that market is best introduced in around late March when the picture is somewhat clearer
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they've been **** with a lot of mma markets lately. often closing way early and sometimes halfway through a fight leaving positions extremely exposed..
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feels like i hear the phrase "Appologies for any inconvenience" at least 3 times each week just from browsing my twitter timeline
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MMA has always been awful. I've lost count of the number of times in the past I had to desperately try to reach someone - was usually the helpdesk in Australia - to unsuspend markets as they'd always suspend everything at 3am. Now I'm being told they can only manage the main card fights and all prelims will now be unmanaged. The exchange is rapidly deteriorating.
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Been deteriorating for 10 years
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Unusual happenings on the Super cup final.
Method of victory market didn't go "in play"(all the other markets went in-play)--- can't remember that ever happening before It then went "in play" for the first period of extra-time only. The "To win" market was in-play during the 90mins but not re-opened for the extra-time period-------again never happened before. |
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Snooker markets for today (admittedly niche, but they put ALL of yesterday's up) total just four, and three of those appear to be for matches that don't even exist, so far as I can see! I've been told that they won't be putting any others up.... Even though a load of them appear on the BF Live Video schedule....
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BTW, the matches are all on BFSB.
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That is an odd one. As you say, you can watch them on the exchange but if you click on 'Bet' then you're taken to the Sportsbook. Culling a lot of markets will certainly benefit the sportsbook so moving mugs from exchange to sportsbook will be a large part of what's going on.
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That's the way it looks to me....
My account manager is off this week and there was no-one available for me to talk to when I called. I just want some clarity. There's no consistency. Even though BF is now responsible for generating only a part of my income, I am still planning as much of my time around the schedule as I can, and this just ***** me off, TBH. |
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And now they are there!
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I'm awaiting a response from my account manager as well. I'm aware of their culling project but there's been a significant downturn in performance recently. Loading of markets, such as these snooker markets, has been all over the place. Markets going inplay too late or too early too.
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apparently , ( from what i read on a thread on chit chat , how long will betfair last?? ) betfair are giving 50 PC payers a £500 allowance on their PC each week , which if will be rolled out to every PC payer, is a good start to improving the charges on here .
but if it doesn't get rolled out to everyone , this is not going to work from a customer point of view , where by betfair pick and choose who pays PC depending on how you play/bet , and not as to how much commission you pay/generate . i think it's for mostly layers as they are providing liquidity , but , if i am a backer , aren't i providing liquidity for people who want to lay ? imo they really need to reevaluate the whole PC thing . charging anyone 40%-60% no matter how they play ( fast pics, bots etc ) can never be right or a good selling point for future wanna be customers . |
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Indeed there has, TP. Either do it and do it properly, or let everyone know that you won't be doing it and don't bother. You can't expect people to sit around for hours waiting for markets to appear or not appear when they should have been up hours previously.
I've read that, too, PF. I primarily lay, but I'll gladly back if there is value in doing so. The problem, as I see it, is one that many of us predicted a long time ago.... It's an ever-decreasing circle. If no-one is there to match the other side of the bet (whichever side that may be), there is no incentive to put up prices. Liquidity always was, and still is, king. BF have been guilty of punishing those who put liquidity into otherwise illiquid markets (PC). It HAS compounded the problem. They need to decide whether they want the little fish for themselves (BFSB) or whether they want the Exchange to flourish. |
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And the site goes down. Could see this coming a mile off.
As you say, Latalomne, it's the lack of communication which is unacceptable. Markets I've seeded for years were just taken down with no notice. I'd spent months improving spreadsheets, etc and all of a sudden they scrap markets without a word. No 'will you put more money in the markets?' or 'will you seed to 103% instead of 108%?' Just pulled them. I wouldn't even consider doing the necessary work on other markets now as no confidence they won't be pulled with no notice. Many of us predicted the site was going to suffer as people were forced to move away because of PC and the Sportsbook stealing customers. Happened more slowly than expected but even the CEO and CFO admit growth is now non-existent with no signs of improvement hence them culling markets and now offering PC allowances and more free bet incentives. |
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To their credit, this morning's snooker markets appeared about 40 mins ago as I was on a live chat asking if they would appear or would not appear. The agent didn't get as far as submitting the request, so BF got their of their own volition. High five! Will see how long it lasts!
TP - I am looking to reduce the amount I do anyway, as I grow a business completely unrelated to this, TBH, but you're right, there is no incentive to invest in expanding "your" operations here under the current status quo.... In a lot of ways, I think the damage that has been done away from the main markets is almost irreparable. There used to be good liquidity across the board, even on the side markets. Tennis handicaps used to be brilliant, and I'd happily play to 103% on a point-by-point basis while the backers were there. Then, all of a sudden, they weren't so many in number.... And so the natural inclination was to keep a bit more back for yourself, and it all becomes a death spiral.... |
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Same here. Moved into property the last couple of years and completed on another yesterday. The tennis handicaps are a great example. When I first started I'd trade them on a regular basis, that's how liquid they were. As you say, all of a sudden there was a drop and so they became less viable for trading and so I'd leave and others too which causes prices to become poorer and more to leave. Probably caused by the PC and then Sportsbook. Many of us predicted this death spiral yet were mocked. Betfair then admitted there was a problem and brought in the new format which many of us told them was not fit for purpose. As ever they ignored us, the market became even worse and now they admit the new format wasn't the solution.
I'd have no PC on any of the submarkets. That's the way forward. People are willing to pay 20-60% on markets where they can trade in size they can't anywhere else, scalp, courtside, etc where they're all but guaranteed green but why would someone pay 40% on a pure punt on a side market? Chances are with these markets you can probably get on somewhere else if you just want a bet and whilst odds might be slightly lower you obviously aren't paying a huge fee if you win. |