Hard Times

I agree with you and the article and judging by lack of activity on the forum so do betfair users. The killer was the POC tax and losing pinnacle, sbobet and 12bet (ibcbet clone you could use without need of an agent).

There is an established profitable market for peer to peer betting which will come again in the future through new innovative entrants.

There is no future on this website since it was taken over by Paddy Power Mgt.

i love that article -  so funny in ways too

Good article. Shame about "pouring" and "adverse", because it's mostly well-written.

Steve needs to get a wider perspective than his pro-punter mates on twitter.

Its true its much harder on horses (early price) but certainly not impossible to make a good living but I think any dreams of doing a Patrick Veitch is next to impossible.

That was a good read. I don't bet on horses but could identify with the rest.

Veitch managed to get up to £50k on a strong fancy a few years back, albeit with a team of agents, he worked 20 hrs per day in his prime with cracking results through military analysis, probably a one off genius punter and would love an update on what he's doing now, guessing something to do with hedge funds...Good luck to all pro punters out there, had a go myself as a layer for a short while which went ok but realised that a losing run would finish me so bottled out after a couple of bad days [:sad:  Fair play to Nevo for lasting so long and enjoying his work, many on here would have swapped with him for those years, and a mention for Harry for changing the thinking of value re lumping on shorties..gl all.

But in all reality the only way to make money over time in this game is to invest in manipulating the odds by fair means or foul into your favour - an edge to swerve the premium charge and bookie knock backs by plotting under the radar. Let's face it, mature punters can live with dodgy racing as they've grown up with the task of identifying when 'they're off' for certain trainers, although these punters wil be long term losers with the occasional pay day to keep them going, but the big winners will be Veitch like owner/punters who can control a lot more than the mugs..and it's legal

Nevo stated that value is securing 7/4 over a 5/4 chance or something similar, which over time will reap the obvious reward, however 'time' could run out quite easily for the averagely funded pro way before the 'value' kicks in, therefore what is value? Many go for winners over value as it keeps the critical turnover going, albeit a long death in some cases, so is Nevo, Harry or Pricewise correct? Follow Pricewise and you're doing just the opposite as the value has already gone, lump on a shortie a la Harry and the only 1/10 shot to lose this century will occur...so what is the secret?

Over time the bookies margin or the exchange commission cannot be beaten, so what now? Time for a wider view given no inside info...my preference is for a simple system with no form study....a combo of prices and maths for single/trixie punts..

Patrick Veitch claimed £10M profit for 7 years punting, which I believe, so wd that man - those were the days

As an aside taking a wider view one thing I've noticed from my own punting is that if you concentrate on footy correct scores you may not get it right regularly but you will get the correct result more often than the odds suggest, so before lumping on that double/treble just imagine the potential correct score and you won't be far away..gl

What Veitch was getting on enough in a short space of time at odds ahead of the"real" price. Nowadays you just can't get those sort of sums or anywhere near before the early price markets collapse, whether you have his level of skills, infrastructure or not.

All credit to him but he was ahead of the game at the right time and place.

So to be a successful pro punter as a backer in the ring without inside info is a non trier, the winners seem to be the big layers on here with huge liability accounts, albeit pc charged, there may be Nevo's out there and good luck to them but it's a hard game...for myself still working on producing the perfect system....

Very easy to make money as a backer with no inside info...........very very easy. Hard part is getting enough on. The scalability is just much harder now than it used to be unless you have the holy grail of making decent margins  at the odds 5 mins before the off to race time.

Nice town Norwich.

If its of use from my many years of data and using Betfair SP's
you need to beat ISP 22% laying and 10% backing after staking 2% of your bank.