Goodbye

I'm saddened by your plight cookie.  It's obvious you are a compulsive gambler that loses.  If you won on here, would you be offering the same advice ?

How did you get into that sort of mess cookie? You really should be winning  - exchanges are he only way.

This reminded me of the story of Ster....

"Hello everybody, a lot of you might recognise my name from use of this forum over the last couple of years. I thought I would make one last visit on this site to tell my story.

I've been gambling on horses since I was old enough to walk into a bookies. For the first few years it was a bit of a laugh, I lost but only small and I enjoyed the game. Along came the Likes of Flutter and eventually Betfair which made gambling a much fairer proposition and found I spent more time on these and less in the bookies.

Anyway my first year on here was reasonably unsuccessful but found I was learning new things all the time and I learned how to run 'books' whereby you can balance out a race for a guaranteed profit. I found that I could actually do 4 or 5 of these a day and actually make more than I was doing in work. Things actually went so well, I quit my job as a travel agent and went full time on here.

By the end of 2002 I had made enough to take 5 months off and go travelling in New Zealand and even become a member of the "£15,000 club" (who have made over £15000 in a Betfair year) and life was great, I was even part of the Betfair Premium Team, despite my liking for online casinos when I was bored. I did enjoy laying favourites or ones I didn't fancy but win or lose, it didn't really matter cos I was making plenty on the books

I went through money pretty quickly out there and came back pretty skint but with loads of good memories. From here on in though things started to go downhill. I borrowed money from credit cards to get me up and running again and found it much tougher and tighter to make books. I found that the margins had gone very tight and my method for making money had all but vanished.

I tried running books but found I made very little money and with bills to pay and no money coming in I spent less time running books and more time taking chances laying and betting. Eventually by the end of 2003 I had gone from running 5 or 6 books everyday to 2 or 3 a couple of times a week and not making anything on those even when I did.

The credit cards kept giving me more credit and the debt kept piling up, lying to my family, friends and girlfriend that everything was alright and that I was still making money on here. I found I had gone from an outgoing lad to a bloke who went home early on a Saturday night so he could lay US horses.

The pretence was kept up so much that I even booked 3 months away in Canada with my girlfriend knowing that I would have to borrow money from my credit cards just to get by.

Breaking point came last Friday when all of my cards were up to their limit, and I had no money to pay my rent, let alone have 5 grand spending money for 3 months in Canada in 8 weeks time. It all became too much and I cracked and told all to my parents and my girlfriend. Both were very upset to begin with but eventually we talked and devised a plan to get me back on track, away from gambling, and still go to Canada. I will be making my first GA meeting on Monday (only time I can get off work) and am really looking forward to it

I am posting this today just to let people know that even the supposedly best winners on here can end up finding themselves in the absolute pits and that help is available to those who need it.

I'd like to thank everyone who I had banter with on here, Kev, Woody, kirstie and all the Stow lot, and everyone else who I have known on here, but if I am to get my life back on track I cant come on here anymore and I will be deleting all email contacts from my inbox.

Many thanks to everyone for the crack but I wont be back.

Regards

Ster"

There are many casualties on here and on most gambling websites. Gambling is in our faces everywhere these days, hard for people with problems or potential problems to break free. Most punters on here if they were honest would tell you that in the long run they are well down but are unlikely to admit it.

Good luck Cookie, you are better off walking away and cutting your losses. Getting in deeper would be far more catastrophic.

The best part of the one or two post here are that those ppl are being honest, i lose,dont deny it, recently ive lost a lot of my zest for these places, gambling on the net is great for the bookies, and now with the casinos on bookies sites and now with the advent of mobile phones they are running smart business, gee the number of emails i get everyday from casinos etc is staggering, luckily i have a delete button to get rid, i do play once in a while on one site , and i mean only now and then.............i posted a thread a few weeks back here stating that i reckon if you break even at any form of gambling , for a day week month etc etc then in reality you have probably done ok, i still believe that, still some say they are winning this and winning that , probably in reality we are not telling the truth...........in some ways the in play betting is the one that takes the tim, its not like the old days when you took a bet before the game and that was it, but today you can spend ages online and even if you are winning , you are losing a hunk of time of your life, but that dont just apply to betting it basically applies to the internet as a whole........its nice to have these modern inventions , but we all need to strike a balance.

thecookiemonster said:

Do not bet with money you dont have

Probably the single most important message of this thread.

You can be a loser but still enjoy gambling as a form of recreation but once you start betting with borrowed money you have crossed the line in my opinion.


Dont try be a bookie on here as it cant be done for the majority. Even the experts lose.

As CLYDEBANK explained, the days of being able to make a successful book on Betfair are long gone. Very hard to lay outsiders at a price that doesn't leave you with devastating liabilities.

I think exchanges are a bad idea and can lead people down the wrong path.

I don't agree with this. I think exchange betting is the best form of betting ever devised.

However, I think the early years of Betfair were a godsend for any reasonably smart punters. Profits were easy to come by when there were plenty of not-so-smart punters around. This set up the expectation that there would always be easy money to be made on Betfair.

But gradually the environment changed as the not-so-smarties found themselves losing too much and went elsewhere for their kicks.

Then the PC came along and even the smarties were struggling.

Even some of the other exchanges which offer lower commissions and no PC will eventually suffer as the smarties scare the numpties away. Perhaps that's inevitable.

But I really don't think the problem is exchange betting per se. I think the problem is the expectation that arises when there is a period in which a particular exchange provides steady profits for a particular type of punter. Too many people fall into the trap of thinking this situation will last forever.

it like 9 winning pc players on a same table of poker  all paying 20 to 40%  the only winner is betfair as time goes on as the weeks goes by  it not there betfair got it all    finding  it hard  on 10 % rake poker games  but 20 to 60%   give over   no wonder smarties were struggling

all bets are elsewhere in trillions that betfair lost out in 4 to 5 % of any bets due to pc to a winning pc player

sorry was talking to PittsburghPhil

thecookiemonster  this game  can play tricks and  make a bigger hole and start to chase  and  it all opps at the press of one click

if u cant do it    just stay away and  before the hole get too deep

wise words  good luck in what u do take care

For me, the fact there's a LAYING option can cause me to lose more money, cos it makes me feel like I've got some kinda safety net causing me to back more things.

Good luck Cookie, I'll soon be joining you!

PittsburghPhil said

thecookiemonster said:

Do not bet with money you dont have

Probably the single most important message of this thread.

Totally and utterly agree. And while there may be some truths in the rest of the opening post, I think you can end and heed all the advice in that one sentence.

If Betfair Got rid of the PC charge,then Liquidity would return and people would have a better chance of winning.
Unfortunately Betfair want 60% of many peoples winnings.Looks like the cannot stand people winning on here.
A once great company now a greedy corporate monster.Agree with Bongo Betfair themselves will suffer in the long term.

Mar 5, 2014 -- 1:08AM, pmbets wrote:

If Betfair Got rid of the PC charge,then Liquidity would return and people would have a better chance of winning.Unfortunately Betfair want 60% of many peoples winnings.Looks like the cannot stand people winning on here.A once great company now a greedy corporate monster.Agree with Bongo Betfair themselves will suffer in the long term.

remmber ,no betting site likes winners.

Firstly, I don't agree with the PC charge, but I wish I could make enough money to be eligible for it.

Secondly, I've always been a bit confused over why people would get themselves in that situation. It seems easy to use other sites to help avoid this.

For example, if you know you're gonna win £1000, then why not lay it and then back it with another site. You may lose a bit but not as much as the PC charge???

PHEW! I know nothing compared to the people that get it so I'm sure if it was that easy you'd be able to do it, so I appologize for insulting your intelligence.

''For example, if you know you're gonna win £1000, then why not lay it and then back it with another site. You may lose a bit but not as much as the PC charge??? ''

what happens if you lay it on here and it looses,you now have more winnings on here subject to the higher premium charge further more if you come up with a method to lay on here(giving net losses) and back it elsewhere to win, why bother laying it on here in the first place just let it ride on the other site and you will only be subject to say 3% on your winnings

Yes I see your point. It's sods law isn't it! If you want something to lose it'll probably win!!!

I think exchanges are a bad idea and can lead people down the wrong path.

I think the problem is with some peoples expectations of the chances of winning on an exchange.

On the surface there appears to be far more opportunities to make a profit, the reality for most is that it is just a more intelligent and inventive way to lose.

Mar 5, 2014 -- 4:07PM, Thin and Crispy wrote:

I think exchanges are a bad idea and can lead people down the wrong path.I think the problem is with some peoples expectations of the chances of winning on an exchange. On the surface there appears to be far more opportunities to make a profit, the reality for most is that it is just a more intelligent and inventive way to lose.

very true.
The difference between exchange betting and traditional bookies, it takes longer to lose on an exchange.

One thing that's dawned on me recently (slow learner!) is how much more I spend on Betfair than other bookies. And this explains why I lose more money.

For me, a bookie is a place where I'd put a bet on a few times a week.

BUT... I find myself literally living on Betfair. As soon as my pc boots up I'm on it. It's like an online game almost where there's so much going on???

I definitely think that a lot of people, definitely including myself, need to have a good think about how to control the situation before it gets out of hand.

Think that's similar to me. It's not just money but also time and stress that you have to take into account.

Mar 8, 2014 -- 9:10AM, sheppy123 wrote:

One thing that's dawned on me recently (slow learner!) is how much more I spend on Betfair than other bookies. And this explains why I lose more money.For me, a bookie is a place where I'd put a bet on a few times a week. BUT... I find myself literally living on Betfair. As soon as my pc boots up I'm on it. It's like an online game almost where there's so much going on???I definitely think that a lot of people, definitely including myself, need to have a good think about how to control the situation before it gets out of hand.

ive changed recently to mainly pre match accas on overs, mainly games all being played at same time, simple fact is it takes less time, as long as you have cashout option , its easy to manage, the exchange is fine if you have heaps of time or are spending big , but it does consume a lot of time.

one of the things i dislike on exchange is you cant take multis on overs once the games started,

The reality is that it is harder to win on here than it was a few years ago. The main reason (as has been hinted at above) is that most of the mug punters have gone skint, packed in, gone back to the bookies or been railroaded on to the sportsbook. Hence there is a greater proportion of shrewdies and insiders all fighting over an inexorably declining market.
A few years ago you could have a couple of grand at 5s or 6s at one of the gaff tracks without moving the price. Nowadays forget it, it ain't gonna happen.

You fancy a horse at say 9/2 which you think should be 2/1. In the previous evening before the race, punters and arbers will be all over this rick like a rash, knocking it in to maybe 5/2 for a total of a few hundered quid matched and marking the cards of every bookmaker in the process. And then you have the robots, programmed to follow the money and skim off pennies as the price moves downward. The ones you get wrong obviously you will be accomadated at 9/2 as the price drifts the next day.

Will liquidity improve? The answer is no unless a miracle happens. Betfair making a major breakthrough in the Far East would be the best hope for strengthening the markets on here.

hope things in the future work out better for you  cookiemonster

Comeback one day cookiemonster and update us how you've got on, all the best.

i wonder if cookiemonster is still staying out of this place.