General Betting
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Is it still possible to make a living from Betfair?
Is it still possible to make a living from Betfair?
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Replies: 79
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It can be done,fortunately .
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artie wins a fortune by backing Thommo's tips
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Whoa big aitch.
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No-one seems to have maxed out the 'always lay Liverpool' strategy yet. Pretty sure that one must have worked since the 90s started.
I think becoming profitable on Betfair is a bit like getting reverse swing in cricket. You have be bowling to get in the game and you have to be working hard on the ball. Might not work out at all, but if it does the rewards are great. My ball does not reverse yet but I'll keep polishing away. It's re-assuring to remember that most of the money that funds the world's gambling markets comes from people who decide to bet because a team is good at home, player x has lost 3 of 3 meetings versus player Y or a stable has won two previous races on the day. |
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correct - watch the football markets - correct scores - how the odds react to a player sent off or a goal or a substitution -
Watch how a top 4 team trades in the half hour before a game , playing a team in the bottom 4. The opps are endless but without discipline and an edge you are doomed . |
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It's easy
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The only people who are saying its not possible to make a living on here are the losers.
It's 100% possible to make a living on here. Some people want everything handed to them on a plate, the information is out there, research research and then more research. |
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not possible.
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Well said Roker_Park, spot on mate.
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ditto..of course its possible, im not for one minute saying i make a living on here but i know plenty who do
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Yes of course it is possible, the only people who say that it isn't are the ones don't understand the meaning of the word "possible".
The important questions are "Can I make a living from Betfair?" and "what's my back-up plan if I can't or if it stops working?" Even if you have no idea what the answer to the first question is make sure you know the answer to the second one before you give it a serious attempt. |
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The answer to the second one is to have enough savings to last a couple of years without an income . Money in the bank is the only safety you can get when doing this.
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depends what you call a living ?
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good point..somebody on the dole, who makes 30 quid a week on here on top of his giro is making a living, relatively speaking
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It's way, way harder than it used to be. One of the basic laws of economics is you can't make a supernormal profit in the long run, unless you have barriers to entry. Betfair appeared, lots of people were making money from it, and other people wanted that money (other punters, + Betfair themselves). So now if you want to clean up on certain markets you are up against teams of PhDs, or teams of people sitting courtside betting with high tech devices.
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"It's way, way harder than it used to be."
I agree but also maybe I'm just less disciplined. I certainly wouldn't recommend that anyone who has the intelligence to make a good income from betfair does that full time, they could probably make more elsewhere in a more stable job. If you've a large gap in your CV doing this and then either BF or the government or just someone doing what you do better does a move that removes your inncome ... well that's not good. |
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Allowed BOT use makes it harder and opens the window for corruption...
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Bots is the biggest threat to the markets. Totally killed set winner in tennis and totalpoints markets in basketball. I would pay my PC gladly if the bots were removed.
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If bots are so profitable,why don't you get one ?
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would you trust a bot with your bank?
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i haven´t said that they are profitable, just that they kill the markets in more than one way. Visually because you cant watch that jumping figures for very long. Try one total points market in basketball and you will see what i mean.
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Totally killed set winner in tennis
yep, all the sub markets in tennis have pretty much died |
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+1 to that. But not sure you can blame bots entirely for that. In-play there's absolutely no money in them, not even bot money.
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True, money is gone and bots is just one of the factors.
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Feel your pain swedebank.
Problem is with bot driven markets, like basketball points, everyone knows that the bot prices are crap. So people don't look anymore, any manual layers left go through hell competing against a leapfrogging £15 bot for non existent money. High profile euroleague games can go entirely unmatched in-play. |
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Competing against a bot in a total points market is pure pure agony.... Very sad when a former good market goes down the drain. Wonder how runs that fecker...
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I wouldn't mind so much if they put the same prices up for £500/£1000, then at least it might stimulate some interest, but annoying the hell out of everyone for £15 is a bit sad.
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I have mailed bf about it in frustration but of course they have no plans to do anything. When the lay bot first appeared in the moneyline markets last year i thought that things can go any worser but they sure can. That one is a friend if you compare them.
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Of course you can still make a fairly decent living on here. Always the way that the profit gets harder to come by. Just got to work harder than the next person. There are still enough errors, crazy bots, plunges to keep people in clover.
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It is possible, however p/c is slowly but surely killing liquidity, as most sport specific traders who carry reasonable size banks bet elsewhere to avoid P/C on their recreational bets, as only a clown would pay minimum 22 percent to a maximum of 60 percent on any profit made from sporting punts whilst losing 100 percent of loses
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That doesnt make sense PTTT - losses offset pc winnings, so it is largely irrelevant to recreational bets.
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it is possible but it is getting harder, and i believe that the harder it gets the more it is likely to be cause of betfairs demise. betfairs unique selling points aspects of betting which can probably help make a profit for the punter. their target customers are the ones who are a little experienced and who aspire to make a profit. and as such,word of mouth advertising should be the main strategy of their marketing campaign. just advertising better value( which should theoretically click with potential customers) might raise interest for a few weeks to months but not more than that. what will sustain the interst for more than few weeks is the hard evidence that it might be possible to make a small profit with a little bit of effort. people will hear about it without fancy and expensive tv adverts if it was possible to make money. but the reality on the markets doesnt bode well for this strategy.
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gerard 12 Dec 13 20:03 Joined: 28 Aug 02 | Topic/replies: 1,589 | Blogger: gerard's blog
That doesnt make sense PTTT - losses offset pc winnings, so it is largely irrelevant to recreational bets. There are lots of people who have paid PC in the past and started struggling more recently though. Let's say I win £500k and pay £150k PC. Then I lose £300k. The only way I get the PC back is if I win at the level where you pay PC in the future. That can't be taken as a given. In fact, I would even suggest that if you become a very big player, paying PC becomes less likely. Maybe after this I win £1Million but pay £500k commission. I never get that 'overpaid' PC back. |
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I don't dispute that - but if you have always paid PC and always will (in as much as you can be sure of these things) then you would not be "a clown" as PTTT suggests, to make recreational bets.
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Investor - PC should be paid on withdrawls
the way its paid currently is grossly unfair ,win one week lose the next  |
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Intriguing suggestion. However, I've had periods where I might make two withdrawals a week for a few weeks and then not make another withdrawal for at least a month. And that is because of winning/losing runs.
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i win for a yr, get my account up to xxxx thousands, then do a money switch with a 'mate' (no pc) in a quiet market ...who cant believe his luck.
 betfair get nothing bar the 2nd lot of com. pc payer saves 15%... And as a result that wont happen. As a small time gambler / trader / ferengi flith haha ...whatever.... Id much rather see a sliding scale of pc (weekly basis is fine to me) with a weekly allowance built in, into a sliding scale of profitable weeks. if betfair said.... look 25k per year is an ok amount to take out of the system without doing much damage and gave an allowance of 500per week over which i would get charged pc... at a set out rate... then as a small timer...id be much more happier. win 1000 a week.... 500 allowance..... 500 charged at 25k+ xxx rate....... win 2500 a week.... 500 allowance..... 2000 charged at 100k+ xxx rate..... cant see it happening.... but i would like to know tho... what betfair class as someone who is a drain on the system? is it someone taking out 10k per year? 20k per year? 50k per year? anyone with a profit? |
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recreational bets are / should be placed with the view to win, well that is what i do. The point therein, is why would you place transactions in the knowledge that if you are fortunate enough to win you will be paying between 22/60 percent P/C, when you can place these transactions elsewhere at 0 / 3 percent commission on your winnings at relatively similar odds.
whilst assuming most P/C clients are most likely to have the largest banks and are placing their recreational transactions elsewhere, that inevitably is impacting expontentially on less liquidity in many markets. The clown reference admittedly was a bit strong, however it is a question of choice |
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PTTT:
whilst assuming most P/C clients are most likely to have the largest banks and are placing their recreational transactions elsewhere, that inevitably is impacting expontentially on less liquidity in many markets. Two points: 1. PC payers are, by definition, winners. Getting set "elsewhere" is not easy for winners. 2. Maybe Betfair has decided that there are 2 types of liquidity. "Smart" liquidity and "dumb" liquidity. Maybe they've really thought about this and decided that the dumber the liquidity, the more attractive the exchange will be to the dumb punters. Or perhaps I should say, the not-quite-smart but not-completely-dumb punters, such as myself  Then, on the other hand, my second point may be way off the mark, because they've confused the issue by bringing in the Sportsbook and promoting that to the newcomers rather than the exchange. I dunno. The powers that be in Betfair land have got me baffled  |
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no
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