General Betting
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1. In your experience, how much can you win roughly with one of the big 4 online bookies before they close down your account or restrict you? any mention of other online bookies good too.
2. In your experience, how much roughly do the high street bookies pay out as a maximum at one go, for example i cant imagine if you won over 5k they would hand over 5k there and then - do they write you a cheque? or do you have to make more than one trip, or visit 2 bookies ?
3. In your experience, is it true, that if you were banned by a high street bookie for winning too much, do they circulate CCTV picture of your to their other shops in the region, or have is that myth?
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2. In your experience, how much roughly do the high street bookies pay out as a maximum at one go, for example i cant imagine if you won over 5k they would hand over 5k there and then - do they write you a cheque? or do you have to make more than one trip, or visit 2 bookies ?
3. In your experience, is it true, that if you were banned by a high street bookie for winning too much, do they circulate CCTV picture of your to their other shops in the region, or have is that myth?
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1. Amounts don't really matter .You don't need to win anything at all actually, just betting in a non mug way will be flagged up (eg always getting on at good prices, spotting arbs etc ) My Victor Chandler account was £52 in profit when it was closed .My Skybet account was over 2k up but never closed ,in fact they still send me free bets when i go a while without using it. Never been restricted by them either (most tried to get on with them about £300 , always approved)They must figure i got lucky with mug bets and will give it all back.
2. Long time since i bet in shops . When i did have decent amounts to collect it often was 'can you come back tomorrow?' That would have been for over 2k . Anything around £1,000 usually ok .Does depend on the shop and the area though .The ones where the clientele are mostly people on the dole are going to have less money in the till .They will also expect a tip if you have a grand o more to collect although they won't say anything. 3. I think thats illegal but they may well do it anyway. |
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The ones where the clientele are mostly people on the dole are going to have less money in the till .They will also expect a tip if you have a grand o more to collect although they won't say anything.
thanks tober, v interesting this part on two fronts, 1. I wouldn;t have thought about bookies having less to hand in poorer areas which of course makes sense but 2. expecting a tip? their shirley having a laugh. I'm amazed they closed your VC account with 52 pounds in profit, you can't get more illogical than that. I had it it my head big online bookies will close accounts once they reach a certain profit level such as 50k or there abouts, somebodies finger must have slipped on the delete button at vc. |
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Certain shops will do much less business so location is important .Also worth considering location when it comes to the factor of being robbed on the way home! .Some bookies you walk in and it is like the Cantina scene in Star Wars.
Oh i think they do expect tips . Given quite a few in different shops and never seen a look of surprise , and certainly NEVER once heard 'oh we don't accept tips!' The VC thing was a huge cull about 2 years ago , there was a thread on here about it, loads of people banned by them , i'm sure some said they had lost money with them. No , bookies do not close accounts because the punter has won a lot , especially if it is in a short time .There was a story a while back of a guy who won about 10k with Hills and then he had all of that on something else which won, then he had all the winnings on something else , that won too etc .People here were saying 'oh this is rubbish they'd have closed his account!' But you could see they were just typical full bank,mug bets which happened to have won .He was putting every bet on with WH even when there were better odds elsewhere and they clearly knew he was going to give them it all back and more importantly , give them a lot more afterwards. Think his last bet was on Djokovic to beat Federer at about 4/11 in the FO . |
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Fot the CCTV it may be ok for them to do that for Pencilman type conmen and other fraudsters , but not for people who just win money from them.
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Well, I would never give a tip to a bookmaker, honestly it has to be one of the more absurd things I've heard, considering the vast majority of punters money they keep, why would one of the very few winning punters hand back money, you are very generous I have to say or maybe I;m tight
 , but then again, I'm not in the winning habit I suppose closing down accounts of big time winners would be a bad advert/image for their online business |
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I've used about 80 different accounts over the years. Only four have been closed while making a loss.
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Used to work for a big 4 firm a few years back.
Ayers, Tobermory is probably talking about the staff at these shops, not necessarily the bookmaker itself. I was given a tip from time to time by any regular punter who had a big win but I never expected one. As for the CCTV, in my experience that only occurred for fraudsters, slow count operators etc, however, winning customers would have copies of their bets sometimes sent to other shops in attempt to identify "live money/customers" and act accordingly. This was in the days before EPOS though so its probably done electronically now. Tobermory is right by the way, even more important then whether a customer is winning or losing, is how they actually got there to begin with. It doesn't take long to recognise "live" money when you're either taking bets all day or trading it at a racing room/HQ etc. |
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The tip situation makes me laugh. I also find it utterly ridiculous.
Given the efforts one has to go to try and get bets on in the first place absolutely no chance I am tipping shop staff. That is especially the case when 95% of them are utterly incompetent. The good ones are good but are few and far between. I almost felt guilty recently when an Asian guy had had his 4th bet in as many minutes on virtual horses/dogs. He won £250 on the last one and tipped the staff £20. Fair play but not for me. With regards to the original question; 1. It really varies on the bookie. Ladbrokes and Corals can be decent on new accounts early on but will soon restrict if you are betting big enough. Paddys have great limits first up but they last about 1 bet irrespective of win/lose. Hills are truly pathetic from the start. Bet365 deserve a mention as they are really good if it is an old account. Skybet should not be called a bookmaker. 2. As mentioned most shops do not have more than £1k readily to hand. Some will be able to get maybe £2.5k after they have opened the safe and emptied the machines. Normally takes 15/20 mins. Big wins go one of two ways. Either come back a different day or have it put onto a debit card. 3. I am certain they use cctv pictures. They also create profiles of the bigger punters. I was shocked to see a list of all the bets I had placed in one shop. I was soon restricted despite being a big loser in that shop. The big firms do not want to take bets just take mug money from the machines. I wish there was a minimum bet that shops had to take to keep their FOBT licences. i.e. something along the lines of whatever the max bet that can be placed in a FOBT. They are all getting the machines based on their bookmaking licences... |
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Tom,
Just out of curiosity, regarding shop staff, in your view what makes a "good one?" Is it those that are good at their job or those who let you get your money on? :) |
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It has nothing to do with getting money on. It is all about them actually doing their job in a proficient manner.
I still think my favourite was a bet being phoned through that was £100 @ 10/11... |
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hi jpg, i knew he meant the shop staff, but still would not tip anyone in a bookie, i would rather walk outside and tip the roadsweeper who i would guess is on a lowere hourly rate out in the cold rather than the staff inside in the warm tbh, intersting about having bets copied and sent to other shops though,
tom with laddies and corals, what point do they begin to restrict accounts, how big do you have to bet as opposed to how much your winning, it makes you think that these stories you hear every now and again in the paper about one 'mysterious' punter whose on an amazing run and due to collect half a million form his next bet - is just a publicity stunt infact it no doubt is. |
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It obviously depends on the sport but you could get £3/4k on football although it depends how close to kick off. It all depends on liabilities. The problem is if you place a bet for more than say £200 on any sport you flag up as potentially a big punter and they will watch your account very closely. At paddys you get like one chance to place a decent sized bet and then they close it whatever. Lads/Corals last a bit longer. Lads maybe a week and Corals something similar. Others such as Stan James/VC can be ok in the short term but they close your accounts with no warning after just a few winning bets.
What was interesting about seeing the profile they had on me, when I say they listed the bets, they had copies of the betting slips I had submitted. I have no doubts certain hand writing stands out irrespective of shop. |
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My understanding was always that the Big 3 staff were on quite low wages . At least it was the case 2003-2007 ish . So i didn't consider it 'tipping the bookie' as such. The last tip i gave was because i'd been trying to have £300 @10/3 on United to win the league early in the 2006/07 season and they were about to kick off but the cashier had to phone for approval (this is seemingly required of anything that might return more than a few hundred) .She couldn't get through to whoever had to ok it but put the bet on anyway . So i gave her £20 when i collected £1300 .Most betting shop staff/managers seemed like decent people to me back then , though you would get some with zero customer service skills.
these stories you hear every now and again in the paper about one 'mysterious' punter whose on an amazing run and due to collect half a million form his next bet - is just a publicity stunt infact it no doubt is I think these are true myself .There are loads of people doing fanciful accas or having large amounts on 'certs' and rolling the winnings over .The sheer numbers mean that some of them are going to get lucky from time to time and win big.The bookies love people who bet like that and so are happy to publicize them . Such as this one that i referred to above, people may remember him 'dead cert man'  http://junk09.edublogs.org/2011/06/05/punters-winning-streak-ends-with-djokovic/ The National Lottery is poor value but it don't mean the stories of the winners are made up. |
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Tom,
The staff member who was phoning up for £100 at 10/11 was likely to be doing their job perfectly. You're right that liability is a big part but its not the only criteria that will trigger bet acceptance. Don't get me wrong, in a lot of cases its pathetic business practice but that's on the firm, not on the individual staff. If their customer service skills are terrible, then that's definitely on them... wouldn't have lasted long in my shops! The copies of your bets would be there due to simple monitoring. As long as you were recognised by your appearance or your handwriting, it would be very easy and very common practice from my experience. Even easier now with electronic capture. Ayers, Don't assume things like that, especially when you consider many retail staff (not just those in betting shops) are on part time hours who would like more. For the record, I would never think less of any customer who won and didn't tip. |
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"The big 3" will take decent limits, more so Pinny as they like a certain number of "sharp" accounts.
SJ, sky bet, coral, lads, VC etc or just PR fronts, not bookies anymore. Ignore them.. |
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are ladbrokes partner friendly
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Ayers,
Don't assume things like that, especially when you consider many retail staff (not just those in betting shops) are on part time hours who would like more. For the record, I would never think less of any customer who won and didn't tip. it's because i assume like in some restaurants, that tips are shared equally between them and the company/business |
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Ayers you make a lot of assumptions and almost all of them are wrong. I'd take good odds from your posts that you are 21 or under.
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I'm over 21 but that has nothing to do with anything.
Assuming this that or the other is harmless. |
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AyersRock 25 Jul 13 19:38 Joined: 27 Oct 11 | Topic/replies: 3,839 | Blogger: AyersRock's blog
Well, I would never give a tip to a bookmaker this numpty and that other starving tw4t tom dont have a clue,tipping and tipping well is in YOUR best interest,shop staff can be your best friend or worst enemy,you pair of starving fkers deserve to get rolled by them when their chance arises,and it will |
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lol what is with the hostility, I never even go in to bookies I bet online, I was wondering about limits that is all, calm down.
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PS,
Instead of being abusive why not just say 'In my experience I find it much easier to get bets on if I tip the staff'. We all have different opinions and viewpoints. |
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HOW come you never tipped us then patrick?
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I think the hostility from my end came from your apparent hostility to min wage shop staff,who receive little to no training...Tom put what i wanted to say very eloquently ,thanks for that and accept my apologies please.
Lanza,i never bet any winners with you! |
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as far back as i remember, every bet you've had has almost felt like iv made a rick.
remember that 5 for 1(tho that wasnt me) to wideboy (even acer fancied betting that price) to the bitch beaming babe in the final... to snowy last month. you'r like my rick highlighter. lol |
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lol mate,we should go into business together,if only we had a proper track to do it at!
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it wasn't hostility towards the staff at all, it was the thought of tipping the bookie not the staff, as i say i thought all tips like in many companies are shared between staff and company, no need for aggression i know the staff themselves face that from losing punters like this muppet http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3aDO8P-BAM
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Hahahahahahahahahahaha!!!
"I want my money back!" "I want my money back!" "I want my money back!" |
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I don't think it was the fact that some people on here wouldn't tip, rather the disdain you gave for the very idea, which to me I find a little irritating. My kids would say a similar thing and my immediate thought when I hear them say it is to grow up. I'd have said a similar thing at their age too. Roadsweepers will, I'm pretty sure, get a better wage than the majority of shop staff. Tips may get shared (with the company) in restaurants or they may not, it depends on the restaurant, that is a business where tips are standard and plentiful. I can assure you if you tipped the binmen or betting shop staff, there is not a cat in hell's chance that they'd share them with the company itself. And most absurd of all is the assumption that a bookie wouldn't close your account until you won £50k. If you managed to win £50k in total, from every single reputable bookie available before every single one of those bookies effectively close you down, you'd have done a very good job indeed.
There's nothing wrong with making harmless assumptions, just it can irritate people who know more about the subject when those assumptions are way out. I shouldn't get irritated I know, I just can't help it sometimes. |
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Any more lessons in life forthcoming Clyde ?
Always good to read on a betting site. Hope tomorrow turns out to be a better day for you. Now don't go ballistic. Just taking the michael. " I just can't help it sometimes ". |
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I find it hard to believe that some people think "the firms" have a share of any tips the staff get. Its ridiculous beyond words. They may share it between all members of staff there on the day, but the management wouldnt have a clue. Many many years ago, a firm I worked for actually sent a message out that staff shoudlnt accept tips......this was treated with utter contempt. The job can be unpleasant and occasionally ones faith in human nature is restored when somebody wants to share a bit of their good luck.
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Good post by Pounf. I was in the betting shop business for around 25 years and
and can assure anyone that punters tipping staff simply doesn't happen, except when someone has a big win, say £500+ for small stakes, then perhaps a fiver may be proffered. |
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CLYDEBANK29 28 Jul 13 23:53 Joined: 10 Jan 02 | Topic/replies: 3,678 | Blogger: CLYDEBANK29's blog
[i]rather the disdain you gave for the very idea, which to me I find a little irritating You must of missed the part where I said it wasn;t about the thought of tipping an ordinary worker but having that tip(s) shared with the employer - the bookmaker. And most absurd of all is the assumption that a bookie wouldn't close your account until you won £50k. why is that absurd, you make the mistake of assuming that everyone is a gambling expert thats why i asked, because i dont know. But now I do, |
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roadsweepers get paid more than the pittance we are on believe me!
Having worked online and now part time in a shop I can confirm that: We will always be happy to accept a tip. Some customers are monitored. This is when the stakes are £100 + which I think is laughable. I generally put most bets through unless you are looking at paying a grand or more on a monitored punter. Sometime there isn't enough cash in the shop so we can put some on your debit card or ask you to come back tomorrow or recommend going to another shop. This is dependant on the win as we can pay out most money. Winning accounts. When I worked online punters who were beating the price, arbing etc were restricted. Punters who had large wins but on generally favs etc we always felt that we can take him on and win in the long run. In shop the only info that gets sent out is about fraudsters, slow counters and general buggers. I have't seen anything to say joe bloggs has won X so we cant serve him. |
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hedge, good post, nothing unreasonable
from what I can see. |
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hedge, whats the biggest bet you've ever taken?
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Perhaps the 'biggest liability' bet taken
may be a better question. |
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Some laughable "phone for bet acceptance" from memory were:
£30e/w on a 15/8 fav (early morning price but come on!) £5 win on the local county to win all 4 cricket competitions that year at 20,000/1 £500 on a single number on the Irish Lottery. All three bets were accepted and were all winners for the firm We layed £3k on Celtic to win the Scot Prem in 1997/98 at 7/2 which promptly came in for the punter. Once managed to move a ante-post cricket market on the local county without even taking a bet! Customer wanted £1k on at 7/1. He was a completely unknown customer to us... phoned up for "permission to lay," they offered something like £200 at 7's, £200 at 13/2 and the rest at 6's. Customer said no and walked off... 5 mins later, the firm reduced the odds to 6's anyway! The biggest liability of "live" money I ever faced myself was another unknown customer who wanted to place £10 combination tri-casts of 6 or 7 selections (out of 17 runners) for a 5f race at Lingfield on their grass surface, not the a/w. The draw bias was/is notorious. I just knocked the guy back completely without even bothering to phone up. Once had a customer who everyday placed a £1 acca on four horses at sp. One day, the first three came in at 6/1, 10/1 and 14/1. Didn't even realise the situation until just as the opening show for the 4th selection came through.... opened at 33's! A quick emergency phone call and the board price tumbled to 12's within 2 minutes (it was a mid winter meeting at a minor track on Tuesday, something like that.) Horse finished 3rd in a blanket finish. Other notable memories: Spending nearly two hours on Sunday with only one customer the entire time who was betting £20 and £50 every single dog and horse race - he was a known Premiership player at the time. A trainee cashier who on their interview, apparently asked "how much does a bet cost?" (and we still hired him!) The same cashier shortly after, got hit by a slow count team but he was so bad at his job, he actually prevented the con from happening. Various "Cilla Black" type moments of people meeting up with each other after decades mixed in marriage proposals, banned ex-snooker pros kicking off for not getting served, power cuts lasting multiple hours and shop still getting busier(?!) two staff thrown off the premises for fraud, regular trips to the police station with syringes found in the toilets, a CS gas attack, constant epileptic fits from the same customer who insisted playing the fruit machines. Ive forgotten far more. Happy days  |
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In the shop biggest bet I've personally taken was £150 on a horse in the region of 9/2 or thereabouts. nothing crazy, hence the reason i just took it (naughty boy that I am.) When i worked online it was £16,000 on a football match. No problems laying it as it was Arsenal / Man Utd and from one of our preferred clients (general loser. If its a football match then there was usually no probs accepting teh larger stakes. especially a big game as it doesn't skew the book too much and most info is in the public domain. Horses were different as there is the chance of someone knowing more than the traders etc etc. However our Horse team did like to take the punters on. Everyone may moan but the traders have to answer to management.
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