Liquidity tumbling faster than the share price!

Hopefully something more significant.

I was having a look at the early horse markets around midday and couldn't believe how little money there was about.

people go on holiday.....ir always suffers this time of year

I know for sure that a number of greyhound traders have gone to the purple place, and they had their first £25,000 traded race recently.

Goodwood last Friday would make a difference. Could you do the comparison again leaving out Goodwood Artisan?

The **** turnover calculation is different/deceiving.

it hard to take 1 day last week and look at today and say it drop 30% , because their can be other factors ...but, when you see betduck up , and betfair down, then it's highly likely to be significant factor

MS, Artisan was comparing betfair to betfair.

You also have to factor in the duck are completely making up their early traded figures by self matching.

Very good point Feck.

The figures without Goodwood give an average last Friday of £696K. So the drop is a mere 13%

liquidity is one thing , matched bets is another.


the Shark factor will have everything to do with the low volume of matched bets.

Artisan, that would be a significant drop nonetheless as you'd be comparing 1 afternoon + 3 evening meetings (last Friday) against 2 afternoon + 2 evening meetings (today) and today's figure is currently based on mostly the afternoon figures (which are generally better in my experience) as today's evening meetings haven't finished. As Coachbuster says though, it means nothing. A few big ping-pong players leaving could have that effect on turnover without having any effect on real liquidity.

Ping-pong money is something that is never mentioned when comparing exchanges. There must surely be a lot less of it on betd@q which would bloat betfair's seeming advantage.

Artisan, that would be a significant drop nonetheless as you'd be comparing 1 afternoon + 3 evening meetings (last Friday) against 2 afternoon + 2 evening meetings (today) and today's figure is currently based on mostly the afternoon figures (which are generally better in my experience) as today's evening meetings haven't finished. As Coachbuster says though, it means nothing. A few big ping-pong players leaving could have that effect on turnover without having any effect on real liquidity.

Ping-pong money is something that is never mentioned when comparing exchanges. There must surely be a lot less of it on betd@q which would bloat betfair's seeming advantage.

you can never really judge how much ping pong money their is, with out working at betfair or betdq

Feck

I'll do a fuller analysis tomorrow morning when all of the figurs are available from BF, and we'll see what the drop offs are for the afternoon and evening.  I'll also do a few other days.

The point about holidays, and as you say a few ping pong players makes sense, but I also just get the feeling (and it is no more than that) that there are significantly less people hovering over the back button IR.

gotta say, money in the hull game minor markets seems pretty sparse tonight.

yep

Hull vs Blackpool

Betdq       $504,352 USD
Betfair   $2,571,879 USD

Betfair   $2,234,983 USD  (using betdq matching method of liability)

Liquidity was brilliant on the Hull v Blackpool tier 2 soccer match .

Better than last year

correct score i will add, wasn't paying  attention to  other minor markets Viva

Doesnt really mean a deal taking into account isolated events unless you do a proper study of quite a few over a period of time.

Some very big players could just happen along here or there on any given night surely.

obviously need to start looking at CS.

Norwich V Watford same date, fixture etc last season opening game matched £4,155,870.

Artisan     05 Aug 11 20:58 
Feck

The point about holidays, and as you say a few ping pong players makes sense, but I also just get the feeling (and it is no more than that) that there are significantly less people hovering over the back button IR.


IR surely has to be affected by ATR delaying the pictures by another 2.8 secs and people giving up betting at home inrunning

4 ruk meets last friday

If the fall is significant and real and you were Betfair watching this unfolding, what would you do next if you were them? And how quickly would you react?

Bluenose     05 Aug 11 22:17 
Norwich V Watford same date, fixture etc last season opening game matched £4,155,870.
------------------

Bluenose , where do you find this data ?

bring in PC 3 as fast as you can   I think that what betfair will no next

I wouldn't panic or overreact as many of you seem to be doing.
I'm pretty sure they have made some projections on the likely impact of PC2 on many variables, and will monitor those very closely to see if their forecasts are looking reasonably accurate.
I think they might perhaps give it a full season of football or racing or whatever, befre they review things, wouldn't you ?.

my sentiments FAFH ...  only a complete bunch of morons would bring in another charge so soon without looking at the bigger picture

I'm glad I don't have to face you in a coutroom full of gullible jurors Coach.

fracsoft using the free search

FAFH- i get by   

cheers nose

I don't think betfair care about liquidity any way....when betfair bring there new sportsbook online the mugs will just bet there anyway

I still believe PC2 is all about getting rid of the smart accounts before befair become the bookmaker

When Betfair bring the "new sportsbook", they'll be left wishing they hadn't done with a few years.

We are on PC3 now btw not PC2, blinking amateurs

I just wanna make the football bets I like.
And currently BF is the only place that gives me that full wide ranging opportunity.
So until that changes, I'm stuck anyway.

what was PC 1?

FAFH

you bet what agian?

PC1 was 250 markets/year
PC2 was 250 markets/lifetime

oh right....PC2 didn't matter for me...as i was alredy f-cked at PC 1

f-ck me dead.....and we didn't see PC 3 coming   onward and upward for betfair and their new PC 4

don't knock pc2. compared to pc1 it rocked.

Not for everybody it didn't.  I lost most of my allowance overnight on PC2 when they went from rolling to lifetime

Oh I see what your try to imply, that the big players are moving to other exchanges to make ten times less profit but pay less charges, and that liquidity is dropping here, wow have you seen any spaceships with little green men in lately?

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it's the gift that keeps giving!

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take me to your market leader artisan

the president has nothing to offer me but his silence

bff (troll) wrote: Oh I see what your try to imply, that the big players are moving to other exchanges to make ten times less profit but pay less charges

So, how can they make less profit if they only pay 2% commission compared to giving away 60% (a massive chunk) of profits? Something not adding up in that head of yours?

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I have noticed a real slump in liquidity on the horses of late (last 2 weeks). Don't think it's just holidays either as this time last year it didn't seem as bad. Will have to wait and see, but it's clear that things are changing and people will not accept paying such a premium when they can make similar (or same) profits with much less risk.

If there was a 60% Government Goods and Services tax on all items such as food, clothes, electrical items etc, there would be absolute anarchy. No tax should ever be over 50% of any form of earnings.

Parkison said that the 40% tax rate is fatal to civilization. I think it is right, because in Europe (thanks to VAT) in total we pay even more than that and Europe slowly die.

that's why the scandinavian countries are such a hellhole.

eh? is that a joke viva?

that was my famous dry wit, investor. loved throughout the fora

I think a negative income tax rate would be good.

It's crazy that many people with no key areas of expertise are in the position where they are receiving benefits, and would end up worse off if they went out and got a (menial) job.

It's one of those situations where reducing tax would end up saving money.