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22 Jul 11
00:01
Joined:
Date Joined:
12 Mar 07
anybody on here has actualled modelled a gambling exchange operation to try to assess really what level of revenues are needed by BF ( or anybody) to operate and grow one successfully.
For example, someone else posted up the very simplistic example that a bettor on even chances with a 6% edge and a 5% comm. rate would effectively pay commissions to BF equal to 44.1% of his gross profit.
Is that a " fair " reward to BF for providing and administrating the platform and growing the betting pool ?
Of course we are all achieving different strike rates on different markets, but should this circa 40% to GP ratio be something that all of us should expect or be required to pay to BF for providing and growing the platform ?
If so ( and I'm not saying it is or isn't) then isn't that sort of what BF is trying to do with the, albeit rather convoluted and clumsily implemented, PC ?
For example, someone else posted up the very simplistic example that a bettor on even chances with a 6% edge and a 5% comm. rate would effectively pay commissions to BF equal to 44.1% of his gross profit.
Is that a " fair " reward to BF for providing and administrating the platform and growing the betting pool ?
Of course we are all achieving different strike rates on different markets, but should this circa 40% to GP ratio be something that all of us should expect or be required to pay to BF for providing and growing the platform ?
If so ( and I'm not saying it is or isn't) then isn't that sort of what BF is trying to do with the, albeit rather convoluted and clumsily implemented, PC ?
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imo, that's not the right way to look at it.
imagine BF as a barrel full of water, with holes in the bottom. the big hole in the middle is BF, the others represent winners.
at the top are losers pouring in more water.
BF's object is for as much money as possible to end up going through their hole as possible. the mistake comes in becoming fixated on how much is going down the other holes and trying to plug them up accordingly, rather than to look at the system holistically and figure out how different types of activity affect the volume flowing through their own hole.
in other words, BF need to become less obsessed with winners' holes and pay more attention to the best interests of their own.
imagine BF as a barrel full of water, with holes in the bottom. the big hole in the middle is BF, the others represent winners.
at the top are losers pouring in more water.
BF's object is for as much money as possible to end up going through their hole as possible. the mistake comes in becoming fixated on how much is going down the other holes and trying to plug them up accordingly, rather than to look at the system holistically and figure out how different types of activity affect the volume flowing through their own hole.
in other words, BF need to become less obsessed with winners' holes and pay more attention to the best interests of their own.
Yu stated somewhere that they currently take 76% of their punters wallets and remember they managed to grow into a company valued at £1.5B starting from small userbase and the fact the majority of their larger players were on 2% comms. For them now to need 40%-60% they must have **** up massively somewhere along the way.
As I've said before, and will say again, you do have a way with words Viva.
Much better than my holier than you verbal style.
Much better than my holier than you verbal style.
Ghetto
You don't mean you as in me do you ?
I've certainly never said anything like that.
Anyway this thread is asking a question, to which I do not have the answer.
I'm just wondering if anyone out there does in fact.
You don't mean you as in me do you ?
I've certainly never said anything like that.
Anyway this thread is asking a question, to which I do not have the answer.
I'm just wondering if anyone out there does in fact.
yes, there's no one who can match me when it comes to crafting a childish, innuendo-ridden metaphor.
that is my proud boast.
that is my proud boast.
As you also said before " One does one's best ".
i dont know about the charges, but now they are listed on stock exchange, they have to maximize there profit potential, which means all possible avenues of revenue will be exploited to max. profitible business is essential for survival of the company in the long term, financial markets coined the phrase , sweating the assets.imo
David Yu, frog, I wouldn't dream of implying you'd said anything negative about Betfair [:(]
It still would be sort of nice to know when the bs starts kicking in on the BF public announcements on why they are doing things as basically important to their customers, such as radically revising the pricing structure.
Some claim it is all bs, others sort of give them the benefit of the doubt.
The trouble seems to be that nobody knows enough about the basic true requirements of setting up, running and expanding a gambling exchange, to give an objective, fully reasoned non-company viewpoint.
Some claim it is all bs, others sort of give them the benefit of the doubt.
The trouble seems to be that nobody knows enough about the basic true requirements of setting up, running and expanding a gambling exchange, to give an objective, fully reasoned non-company viewpoint.
To thankyoumugs of course.
To Ghetto
I'm neither knee jerk pro or anti.
I have a fence paling right up my hole as Viva might succinctly put it.
To Ghetto
I'm neither knee jerk pro or anti.
I have a fence paling right up my hole as Viva might succinctly put it.
as has been said before, where is the evidence of the problem this is solving?
investor posted their year on year profit figures, it's basically a continuous upwards trend. so where's the counter-evidence pointing to a crisis?
investor posted their year on year profit figures, it's basically a continuous upwards trend. so where's the counter-evidence pointing to a crisis?
Viva
Profit figures don't necessarily reflect operating cash flow needs particularly projected ones.
Or coming back to your current word preference, cash flow holes.
The point of the thread remains unaddressed, does anybody on here really know what they are talking about in relation to the running of a gambling exchange ?.
Has anybody even had the remotest of hands on experience, or has even bothered to do the remotest of serious financial modelling ?
Profit figures don't necessarily reflect operating cash flow needs particularly projected ones.
Or coming back to your current word preference, cash flow holes.
The point of the thread remains unaddressed, does anybody on here really know what they are talking about in relation to the running of a gambling exchange ?.
Has anybody even had the remotest of hands on experience, or has even bothered to do the remotest of serious financial modelling ?
also worth bearing in mind, gambling is essentially a discretionary form of spending, and disposable incomes are at an all time low.
positing anything other than continually increasing profit growth as a crisis in that environment is the mark of an unrealistic business model.
positing anything other than continually increasing profit growth as a crisis in that environment is the mark of an unrealistic business model.
I thought that in time of recessions, drinking and gambling are not affected ?.
I'm certainly trying to do my best in both these areas.
Let's focus on the 18th century one.
That would most relevant and appropriate perhaps.
None of those bothersome computer thingys to worry about.
That would most relevant and appropriate perhaps.
None of those bothersome computer thingys to worry about.
You know one thought always keeps recurring to me when I read all these anti BF posters on here saying what they think BF should be doing instead of implementing the PC.
It is best summed by a famous writer who once said " For ever complex problem there is a solution which is simple, neat and wrong. "
It is best summed by a famous writer who once said " For ever complex problem there is a solution which is simple, neat and wrong. "
Another thread full of Mr. FAFH: "Guys, it's a fair business decision" and of course it is left as an exercise to the reader to challenge the axiom.
Because: more crap being developed, less budget in advertising, larger yearly profit and others aren't enough evidence.
Because: more crap being developed, less budget in advertising, larger yearly profit and others aren't enough evidence.
BF's object is for as much money as possible to end up going through their hole as possible. the mistake comes in becoming fixated on how much is going down the other holes and trying to plug them up accordingly, rather than to look at the system holistically and figure out how different types of activity affect the volume flowing through their own hole.
Betfair supplied the drill that bored most of the winner's holes. A sensible firm would've plugged them up and took back their drills instead of stressing out those without holes with the thought that if they ever manage to get one betfair will be looking for 40-60% of the water that flows through them.
Betfair supplied the drill that bored most of the winner's holes. A sensible firm would've plugged them up and took back their drills instead of stressing out those without holes with the thought that if they ever manage to get one betfair will be looking for 40-60% of the water that flows through them.
Yu stated somewhere that they currently take 76% of their punters wallets a
Joe, what he meant was the average member spends 76% of his betting budget here and 24% with bookmakers and that betfair want him to spend that other 24% here. He didn't mean betfair were taking 76% of every pound deposited.
Joe, what he meant was the average member spends 76% of his betting budget here and 24% with bookmakers and that betfair want him to spend that other 24% here. He didn't mean betfair were taking 76% of every pound deposited.
Option #1:
Allow punters to be fleeced.
Take a cut.
Punters disillusioned.
Short-term profit increase.
Option #2:
Create an exchange which works for all.
Prevent punters being fleeced.
Makes a sustainable long-term platform.
Long-term profit increase.
Which is the best business decision?
Allow punters to be fleeced.
Take a cut.
Punters disillusioned.
Short-term profit increase.
Option #2:
Create an exchange which works for all.
Prevent punters being fleeced.
Makes a sustainable long-term platform.
Long-term profit increase.
Which is the best business decision?
Feck, I think you may be wrong there. How would he know how much customers on here spend with other bookmakers ?
Mr.Angry
22 Jul 11 10:24 Joined: 05 Jan 11 | Topic/replies: 607 | Blogger: Mr.Angry's blog
Option #1:
Allow punters to be fleeced.
Take a cut.
Punters disillusioned.
Short-term profit increase.
Option #2:
Create an exchange which works for all.
Prevent punters being fleeced.
Makes a sustainable long-term platform.
Long-term profit increase.
Which is the best business decision?
MORE OR LESS PERFECT EXPLINATION....
now for the behavior of the winners.
Winners with edge they don't think they can maintain (fast pictures eg) want option 1 (without the cut 20/40/50/60% preferably)
Winners that think their edge is continuous - want option 2
The second group are more symbiotic and aligned with Betfair.
and betfair are starting to realize this - and going after the parasitic extractors, and hopefully looking after the symbiotic ones.
PC2 does not quite get this balance correct... but at least now Betfair understand the value of each customer... a year or few ago - they really thought big bettors big winners where good
22 Jul 11 10:24 Joined: 05 Jan 11 | Topic/replies: 607 | Blogger: Mr.Angry's blog
Option #1:
Allow punters to be fleeced.
Take a cut.
Punters disillusioned.
Short-term profit increase.
Option #2:
Create an exchange which works for all.
Prevent punters being fleeced.
Makes a sustainable long-term platform.
Long-term profit increase.
Which is the best business decision?
MORE OR LESS PERFECT EXPLINATION....
now for the behavior of the winners.
Winners with edge they don't think they can maintain (fast pictures eg) want option 1 (without the cut 20/40/50/60% preferably)
Winners that think their edge is continuous - want option 2
The second group are more symbiotic and aligned with Betfair.
and betfair are starting to realize this - and going after the parasitic extractors, and hopefully looking after the symbiotic ones.
PC2 does not quite get this balance correct... but at least now Betfair understand the value of each customer... a year or few ago - they really thought big bettors big winners where good
I think that in answer to the main thread that has anyone create an exchange model to see what is happening now will need a pretty powerful computer to do all the number crunching that is involved with the current mega-beast company aka "Betfair".
has anyone take notice that they have said even with the old premium charge "they were only breaking even." or do you all not bother to remember the heartaches betair have and only what may hit your own pockets!
the fact they make a continual profit every year is actually a rarity for new companies that are only a decade old and expanding, but marginal business is very risky and to counter the large hole that keeps getting bigger that is the big winners group, winners dont go away they keep winning and then more winners come along, its a fertile plain and there is a lot of framing going on, year in, year out, the winners make more profit combined than betfair, you can bet on that!
has anyone take notice that they have said even with the old premium charge "they were only breaking even." or do you all not bother to remember the heartaches betair have and only what may hit your own pockets!
the fact they make a continual profit every year is actually a rarity for new companies that are only a decade old and expanding, but marginal business is very risky and to counter the large hole that keeps getting bigger that is the big winners group, winners dont go away they keep winning and then more winners come along, its a fertile plain and there is a lot of framing going on, year in, year out, the winners make more profit combined than betfair, you can bet on that!
Feck, I think you may be wrong there. How would he know how much customers on here spend with other bookmakers ?
By survey Eddie? Other bookmakers were definitely mentioned. I'm sure this was brought up elsewhere and Bayes (I think) took the comment the same way I do.
By survey Eddie? Other bookmakers were definitely mentioned. I'm sure this was brought up elsewhere and Bayes (I think) took the comment the same way I do.
lets transform the current problems within betfairs revenues into a more understandable model.
lets imagine betfair is a casino and they have a few poker table at the back that start a sit and go cash poker game, and for this example lets assume the casino is not a 24 hour business and ends business at 4 p.m. because of high running costs vs poor attendance at unsociable hours.
in the begining of the day there are many punters around and many of them join in the games and have a good time. as the day draws along some professional players are doing quite well and have huge stacks of chips in front of them, the casino owners are very happy as they get a percentage of the chips, a rake, lets say 5%
as the day turns into night more people join and the casino goes through is usual business and the top players, the sharks so to speak amass even more chips off the punters who are now thinning out.
as they clock strikes four customers are told that the casino is closing and are ushered out the doors, but the sit and go poker game is reduced to a one table and the players are still intent on beating each other and winning even more money from a game now that has no new money coming in and is just a battle of nerves to keep or win more from the remaining players.
the casino now has a problem, they wont make anymore money as they cannot admin anymore chips as its strict company policy not to give chips out after hours, when the manager says can you finish your game please the players insist that they want to countinue the game and wont go away till one winner wins everthing what ever they do, even though now its costing the casino an ever increasing amount to stay open and offer them a service!
what should the casino do in its own interest and that of the clients?
1.....force them all to leave and risk upsetting them and losing there custom in the future.
2.....make an agreement that whoever wins the game pays a bigger percentage to the house to pay for all the service used.
its betfair that has to pay all the bills and if they decide to stay in bussiness to basically let
a small handful of people make a fortune continually when they are running up there own charges to do so then then they have to calculate how long they can keep this going on and apply a charge to represent what they are taking out of the business compared to what it costs betfair too operate and itself prosper.
2.....ban them
lets imagine betfair is a casino and they have a few poker table at the back that start a sit and go cash poker game, and for this example lets assume the casino is not a 24 hour business and ends business at 4 p.m. because of high running costs vs poor attendance at unsociable hours.
in the begining of the day there are many punters around and many of them join in the games and have a good time. as the day draws along some professional players are doing quite well and have huge stacks of chips in front of them, the casino owners are very happy as they get a percentage of the chips, a rake, lets say 5%
as the day turns into night more people join and the casino goes through is usual business and the top players, the sharks so to speak amass even more chips off the punters who are now thinning out.
as they clock strikes four customers are told that the casino is closing and are ushered out the doors, but the sit and go poker game is reduced to a one table and the players are still intent on beating each other and winning even more money from a game now that has no new money coming in and is just a battle of nerves to keep or win more from the remaining players.
the casino now has a problem, they wont make anymore money as they cannot admin anymore chips as its strict company policy not to give chips out after hours, when the manager says can you finish your game please the players insist that they want to countinue the game and wont go away till one winner wins everthing what ever they do, even though now its costing the casino an ever increasing amount to stay open and offer them a service!
what should the casino do in its own interest and that of the clients?
1.....force them all to leave and risk upsetting them and losing there custom in the future.
2.....make an agreement that whoever wins the game pays a bigger percentage to the house to pay for all the service used.
its betfair that has to pay all the bills and if they decide to stay in bussiness to basically let
a small handful of people make a fortune continually when they are running up there own charges to do so then then they have to calculate how long they can keep this going on and apply a charge to represent what they are taking out of the business compared to what it costs betfair too operate and itself prosper.
2.....ban them
sorry ban them is solution option 3 not 2 in the last post
the casino now has a problem, they wont make anymore money as they cannot admin anymore chips as its strict company policy not to give chips out after hours, when the manager says can you finish your game please the players insist that they want to countinue the game and wont go away till one winner wins everthing what ever they do, even though now its costing the casino an ever increasing amount to stay open and offer them a service!
That has to be THE stupidest analogy in the history of the written word.
The simple fact is that Betfair provide a means by which punters can exchange bets with one another. It should have ZERO interest in profits of individual punters. If it turns out that some winners are draining the funds from the system too quickly then they should tweak the system to prevent that. By going down this route Betfair is no longer an Exchange (the very thing which made it successful in the first place) - it becomes a bookmaker (the very thing it was set up NOT to be).
That has to be THE stupidest analogy in the history of the written word.
The simple fact is that Betfair provide a means by which punters can exchange bets with one another. It should have ZERO interest in profits of individual punters. If it turns out that some winners are draining the funds from the system too quickly then they should tweak the system to prevent that. By going down this route Betfair is no longer an Exchange (the very thing which made it successful in the first place) - it becomes a bookmaker (the very thing it was set up NOT to be).
mr angry your idea to tweek the system to prevent it, isnt that what the premium charge is or do you propose one that is made from magic beans and allows big players to continually drain the reserves at the same rate, you cant have it both ways!
no analogy is perfect as its a representation of some not all the factors involved and by the way do you care to try to do better or do you want to oppose the robin hood approach of betfair to rob the rich to feed the poor as other punters would like to see betfair promote new players and give them incentives not just keep feeding the rich!
I think everybody agrees a pricing adjustment was necessary but not one that catches dolphins in shark nets!!! By the way how is the pc giving an incentive to losing players???
perhaps the greed you refer too is found in the bookmakers who were once black market set ups
before gambling was allowed in the uk and wont ever promote big winners to use there services
they wont even tolerate them and yet make a bigger mark up then betfair.
the fact is betfair is so good for punters that there is a over healthy amount of winning going on and this will need some form of control to prevent the adverse effect of revenue depletion.
at least try to understand what betfair are doing and show a little intelligence in the matter.
before gambling was allowed in the uk and wont ever promote big winners to use there services
they wont even tolerate them and yet make a bigger mark up then betfair.
the fact is betfair is so good for punters that there is a over healthy amount of winning going on and this will need some form of control to prevent the adverse effect of revenue depletion.
at least try to understand what betfair are doing and show a little intelligence in the matter.
the pc is giving an incentive to losing players as it indicates there are real winners on here and i think we all would like to join there ranks and 40% of something big is better than 100% of a closed door in the face and nothing
and also 40% of the liquidity on betfair is far, far greater than the 100% of all the other exchanges combined so its a no brainer for me
bf_fananatic
at least try to understand what betfair are doing and show a little intelligence in the matter.
They did it with the PC1. With the PC2, perhaps you might show a little intelligence in the matter, fanatic. You've posted 170 times in 3-4 days, all on this matter and all saying the same sort of thing. Have you not been reading any of the replies?
at least try to understand what betfair are doing and show a little intelligence in the matter.
They did it with the PC1. With the PC2, perhaps you might show a little intelligence in the matter, fanatic. You've posted 170 times in 3-4 days, all on this matter and all saying the same sort of thing. Have you not been reading any of the replies?
She isn't concerned with replies , she is just trying to clutter up every thread with pro betfair BS....
well layer when i start using my application that makes 500 plus points profit per week and you calculate what my pc payments might be in the future then you will realise that my only concern is that betfair make enough commission out of me to offset any undesirable effect my winning will have on there revenues, sorry to let you know this but I am not the christmas turkey that you like to think I am and nor are betfair!
i have made predictions based on my current strike rate on backs and lays and given stake size matching targets in current liquidity and lets say I make 12.5 million per annum then if betfair keep 7.5 million and I get to keep the rest I will be happy
i will be happy with 10% of the figure as long as I am allowed to operate in the best exchange in the world run by the best people to run it.
i will be happy with 10% of the figure as long as I am allowed to operate in the best exchange in the world run by the best people to run it.
Well stop wasting time on the forum, then and get on with it.
and by the way if I want to offset the premium charge its a peice of cake, I turn my knowledge of form factors and prediction modelling on the horse racing market which is ten times the volume of trade be it on less races excluding overseas racing, or should I look into football which is booming.
its a winners playground on here and you all know it
its a winners playground on here and you all know it
well you lot stop crying like babies and go earn yourself some money
What do you think I've been doing to be liable for PC? Derr
layer i do read posts and i know your doing well, and good luck to you
so you make money layer and dont have to pay tax, cant see why you can complain, just raise your game and make yourself and betfair more money so they can help all the users and the company, we all have to do out bit.
Thanks, fanatic. This is just an exchange and there are others.
I saw you posted that bet tor dotcom looked alright. Check their comm structure, it's even worse than here. Good luck with your system.
I saw you posted that bet tor dotcom looked alright. Check their comm structure, it's even worse than here. Good luck with your system.
bf fanatic, is bringing whole new meaning to refer to earn, how much they paying you for sing there praises all day and everyday, is it a short term contract.?
well the only money i will get from betfair is when i am succesful and paying comms and pc and still making a profit which will do for me, i trust they are managing the only business that will allow winners, an exchange and because I have a brain I know that slagging them off is counter productive, they dont do it with you so why do it to them!
"the only business that will allow winners" Please fanatic, now you are talking sh!t. If anything, they are the only exchange that penalises winners.
layer so what should they do then, hand the keys over to the big winners and go home and mow there lawns in the knowledge that only the winners can keep more and more of the money at everyones expense.
alot of firms ban bots, have betfair, no , there they go again being fair all the time and doing the best they can, shame on them for being so fair and succesful
Geez. Look at this guy. Lecturing others to "go earn some money" when he is clearly doing nothing other than posting all day.
Do the other exchanges ban "forum bots"?
Do the other exchanges ban "forum bots"?
nearly clock out time for that plant , then FAFH will be along to pick up the slack....
amI the only one who finds it a bit hard to believe, on the basis of his forum persona, that bff has developed the world's best greyhound system?
bf_fananatic
22 Jul 11 15:19 Joined: 17 Jul 11 | Topic/replies: 186 | Blogger:
bf_fananatic's blog
layer so what should they do then, hand the keys over to the big winners and go home
That's the best suggestion you've made yet
22 Jul 11 15:19 Joined: 17 Jul 11 | Topic/replies: 186 | Blogger:
bf_fananatic's blog
layer so what should they do then, hand the keys over to the big winners and go home
That's the best suggestion you've made yet
Of course he has. Obviously someone with such a strategy ready would think "right, let's put that to one side and get posting!"
I do agree with one thing he says though. Providing you have a strategy which is guaranteed to earn several million a year, you should be ok to pay the Premium Charge.
The way forward is simply to develop such a strategy. This can apparently be done by trying a bit harder.
Nae bother.
I do agree with one thing he says though. Providing you have a strategy which is guaranteed to earn several million a year, you should be ok to pay the Premium Charge.
The way forward is simply to develop such a strategy. This can apparently be done by trying a bit harder.
Nae bother.
I think you are correct about Fanatic having clocked out now Hero. Have a nice weekend Fanatic and see you monday morning when you are back in the office:)
average strike rate backing 28%
average strike rate laying 90%
average profit margin backing 40%
average profit margin laying 30%
average point profit per meeting 17-22
average points profit per week 500 plus
cant give you some useful information, there is at least 2 to 3 times the profit to be made
laying then backing as logically there are more losers than winners in any race, q.e.d.
average strike rate laying 90%
average profit margin backing 40%
average profit margin laying 30%
average point profit per meeting 17-22
average points profit per week 500 plus
cant give you some useful information, there is at least 2 to 3 times the profit to be made
laying then backing as logically there are more losers than winners in any race, q.e.d.
upon successful implementation of greyhound using an automated betting system i will embark on the
detail progression to horse racing though the time to get this application in running order is
at least 6 months and maybe as much as 12 months, a hell of a lot of data gathering form filtering
and rating models to wade through!
detail progression to horse racing though the time to get this application in running order is
at least 6 months and maybe as much as 12 months, a hell of a lot of data gathering form filtering
and rating models to wade through!
and if lucky enough to make a good profit, god willing, I will glady pay my premium charge to betfair as they are the best betting site in the world!
does your system involve allowing the greyhounds access to your computer?
would explain a lot imho
would explain a lot imho
I want to succeed in my future doing something that has been a love of mine for 26 years, predicting the result of a greyhound race, I dont want to get banned from a betting company for being too good at what i will do, the new premium charge will make me feel like I am paying my way on here as I dont want to deplete betfairs revenues and cause them harm, the premium charge as is now will ensure that
all good winners are paying there way to ensure that betfair does better than break even with its winners against new money coming in, what you lot are doing is giving betfair a bad name which aint good for anyone. I havent come accross any bad press that says befair are a bad company only praising them for all there achievements, but of course some folk dont like others to get on and I think thats what is going on with a lot of people on the forums here, I have come to terms with betfairs decision and hope that all the fuss dies down and people carry on using the best thing since slice bread for the bettor, betfair, and for those that imagine I must work for them well
when I ever pay my premium charge I will be in a partnership with betfair ensuring that they can power the company to new heights as I beleive there growth is sustainable and its british and
lets give them a break and show some loyalty instead of acting like a load of spoilt children that dont want to pay there way.
all good winners are paying there way to ensure that betfair does better than break even with its winners against new money coming in, what you lot are doing is giving betfair a bad name which aint good for anyone. I havent come accross any bad press that says befair are a bad company only praising them for all there achievements, but of course some folk dont like others to get on and I think thats what is going on with a lot of people on the forums here, I have come to terms with betfairs decision and hope that all the fuss dies down and people carry on using the best thing since slice bread for the bettor, betfair, and for those that imagine I must work for them well
when I ever pay my premium charge I will be in a partnership with betfair ensuring that they can power the company to new heights as I beleive there growth is sustainable and its british and
lets give them a break and show some loyalty instead of acting like a load of spoilt children that dont want to pay there way.
well president that about sums up the level of professionalism that most forum addicts apply to rational statements, where do you reign, some banana republic no doubt
Until he switches to one of his other personalities ...
dash your sentences are far too small to exhibit any useful I.q. , do a bit of pasting why dont you.
I have noticed its always the same guys mud slinging and passing silly comments, sometimes they break out into grand gestures, but mostly you retort to the lowest form of wit.
maybe you lot work for betquack or lads or hills, who knows
i have heard the press mention that there are a load of groaning misfits on the forum but there opinions are not taken seriously , I wonder why?
if betfair has which it does over 3 million users then how come there are say 10 duck eggs continually on hte forums that jump in and pass bad comments about betfair and its policies and there on here all the time, very strange, that means there are millions that arent on the forums and enjoying the services that betfair provides, at least I have tried to stick up for betfair as you wouldnt be able too talk like you do at another site that belong to the company you used.
rapid onset of meltdown from the latest plant
.. Lacks the staying power of FAFH...
.. Lacks the staying power of FAFH...
Well that should finish this tread off quite nicely at long last.
Tks.max
What took you so long ?
Tks.max
What took you so long ?
BF_Fantastic, i'd like to hear about your greyhound rating system.
Picking winners or losers isnt what determines profitability, you need to do it at the right value, and with BF's tight markets you will need to be a very good price assessor to win.
Picking winners or losers isnt what determines profitability, you need to do it at the right value, and with BF's tight markets you will need to be a very good price assessor to win.
average strike rate backing 28%
average strike rate laying 90%
average profit margin backing 40%
average profit margin laying 30%
average point profit per meeting 17-22
average points profit per week 500 plus
cant give you some useful information, there is at least 2 to 3 times the profit to be made
laying then backing as logically there are more losers than winners in any race, q.e.d.
Oh dear. You start off by saying your backing margin is better than your laying even with 1/3 the returns, then you suggest because there is more horses in a race you can make 2/3 times more by laying because more horses will lose than win? rotflmfao...
Let me point out something most here will feel very obvious. Every option in a market is represented by a statistical chance of them winning the event. They are all weighted to their ability, conditions, etc etc etc...
A 2.00 horse still has a 50% chance of winning the event regardless if there is 2 horses in the race or 180 horses in the race.
I hope your system that takes the number of runners, and lays anything under that value treats you well. Greyhound racing (6 runners in UK?), just lay whatever runners you can at under 6.00 and you will make a killing... rotflmfao
Oh dear....
average strike rate laying 90%
average profit margin backing 40%
average profit margin laying 30%
average point profit per meeting 17-22
average points profit per week 500 plus
cant give you some useful information, there is at least 2 to 3 times the profit to be made
laying then backing as logically there are more losers than winners in any race, q.e.d.
Oh dear. You start off by saying your backing margin is better than your laying even with 1/3 the returns, then you suggest because there is more horses in a race you can make 2/3 times more by laying because more horses will lose than win? rotflmfao...
Let me point out something most here will feel very obvious. Every option in a market is represented by a statistical chance of them winning the event. They are all weighted to their ability, conditions, etc etc etc...
A 2.00 horse still has a 50% chance of winning the event regardless if there is 2 horses in the race or 180 horses in the race.
I hope your system that takes the number of runners, and lays anything under that value treats you well. Greyhound racing (6 runners in UK?), just lay whatever runners you can at under 6.00 and you will make a killing... rotflmfao
Oh dear....
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