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14 Jul 18 19:07
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Date Joined: 12 Mar 02
| Topic/replies: 55,133 | Blogger: peter the butcher's blog
How it used to be Love


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Report jedi sophie March 22, 2021 8:12 PM GMT
Sorry Lou.

I dont agree at all.

Pep has managed these teams because he had revolutionary ideas as a young man, some he implemented as a player before as coach or manager.

Hes since revolutionised football alongside a few others, Klopp being one. Both are by far the most important person at there club....

Not in your case Bruno or Maguire.

Pep continues to improve and evolve, this season being a fine example.

Most players say hes different, just better, than others. I think you need to listen to voices if there is many over a number of years.

United mistake by Fred at weekend was basically because Utd are trying to play like Pep, but dont have the players. Most teams are and imo its absurd.

So Ole is good enough but is openly copying Pep. Mmmmmmm, not sure that holds up.

I assume when Fergie had his 20 years of success if he walked out in the middle you'd have been happy with let's just say the Walsall manager to step in?

As the players would still be there....

I'm all for debate but you seem a bit set in your ways or views. Not always a good thing.

One more to add.

How are Chelsea now looking like at least the second best team in league, unbeaten in months since sacking Frank and appointing Tuchel? If it's all players.

Hes another of a similar ilk by the way, thinks differently, modern day manager.
Report jedi sophie March 22, 2021 8:21 PM GMT
By the way there are many elements of the old style football I would love back.
Tackling,passion,less diving etc.

But the long ball garbage isnt one. Hoofing it up the park, come on?

Big Sam and the like should get what they deserve....

The pundits chair.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 22, 2021 8:27 PM GMT
jedi

Fair enough we'll just have to agree to disagree then.

I could sight may cases in return:

Why have your team with the great Klopp in charge gone downhill, the players or Klopp, what's he doe to change things. Yes he's had injuries but obviously there are replacements so what has gone wrong that's his fault and not the eleven on the pitch kicking the ball?

Arsenal have tried three or four managers since the great Wenger ............ no difference, gone backwards if anything?

I've posted many times England have tried about EIGHTEEN different managers since 1966 but never done anything.  Surely it's simply the players we have just aren't as good as Germany, Argentina, Brazil, Spain, Portugal, France, Uruguay, Belgium, Croatia.  EIGHTEEN times we try a different manager ....... but nothing?
Report Emitdeb March 22, 2021 8:29 PM GMT
How nice of Ole resting his best player for the upcoming international break! It was only the FA Cup quarter final! FFS! Madness!
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 22, 2021 8:29 PM GMT
jedi

I mean hoofing it away from a goal kick.  It's 100% safe that it's up the other end whereas how many times this season do we see teams playing it out and getting caught leading to a goal.  Look at United on Sunday, a tap in from three or four yards out.  So frustrating.
Report jedi sophie March 22, 2021 8:36 PM GMT
Yes let's agree to disagree then Lou....

Your final post suggests again if we posted a dozen times each there would be no common ground anyhow.

Klopp has had relative success everywhere, stepped up the ladder every time. And has worked miracles at Liverpool.

A mixture of things behind this season. All at the same time too. Investment injuries pandemic to name a few. Bringing in the Accrington Stanley manager I'm fairly sure would not help however....even if Klopp has made mistakes he remains the main man, and will bring us back.

Of that I'm also sure.

Ole, I doubt it.

In fact why even have managers? Have a poll among fans? Draw lots or straws. Line up 1.2.7.1.

It's a simple game after all. Just hoof it and chase it lads.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 22, 2021 8:39 PM GMT
jedi

Yes fair enough let's agree to disagree.

Cheers
Report grumpyjim March 22, 2021 11:34 PM GMT
Lampard .. not a proven Manager in fact a real rookie ..what a chance to show he has what the game needs ..  Found out  his failings .. Man Management  non existent .. Gave it ago who wouldnt ..  .. proves its not a stroll in through big entrance door and all will be well .. in fact its very  very hard to keep a 28 man squad happy with only 11 .. useful shirts mainly . Need to count a top class bench nowadays to be successful .  LEAVES  ...A Richer MAN  .. ..and may well come back stronger in time ..
KLOPFF   ...   moved every time at just right moment on back of  successful .. stints at clubs he played for and had his good men behind him to prop him up if a glitch happened .. guys with proven history ..  take some along  to new  clubs he moved to  and on again ..   later ,, success followed him .. but ?? on leaving clubs he left lost it mainly .. .  now  at Liverpool ..BRILLIANT STORY  gets them  motivated with his mates . and story carries on .. but ?? teams all fall away at some stage ..  HIS METHOD  now understood by the watchers how he does it .. LOSES A FEW KINGPINS AT VITAL TIME  and low and behold it crumbles 6 on bounce at home lost ..now a rethink of the game new tactics and better players .. next up probably .. GERMAN TEAM AWAITS  .. lets face it he had problems as well that devistated the MAN lost his MOTHER HIS MENTOR AND BEST PAL WITH HIS FATHER ..  NO FUNERAL THANKS TO COVID nd unable to go it all takes its toll on the strongest of men .. HIS RUNNING UP AND DOWN etc a joy to behold  AND DID HE CARE NOT A JOT  Wonderful human being .. in game  . I need to salute him for what he has brought to our shores ..   . he will come again ..
Report Capt__F March 22, 2021 11:42 PM GMT
nice words jimHappy
Report grumpyjim March 22, 2021 11:57 PM GMT
handy to tell it as it is . Capt F .  ptb got your message .. not feltWOUNDS GOT SOMETHING UP TOLD ME BUT FORGET   short memory these days ..not felt .  well after various .. surgery etc . back home now .. he will be fine  .   likes to keep fit playing with a racket and misses that .. once he gets going again will perk up .. mixed up a bit Captain . big blobby fingers no helping either .,?  good to hear from you ..
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 23, 2021 9:25 AM GMT
There's obviously many opinions and we could argue all day with our various ones but regarding Fred/Mctominay/Matic in midfield:

1:   I don't think there's that much between the three of them.  None of them exactly a skilful 'No 10' type and all decent enough without being that good.  For me Mctominay is the stand out of the three so he must play.  Of the other two, again little in it with perhaps Fred edging it as he's younger, quicker.

2:   Many say we shouldn't have two of them playing as it effects our forward play which is true, sometimes you watch United and they barely have a shot at goal BUT we played with two defensive midfielders against Leicester and still got beat.  How much worse would it have been if we'd only had one there?

3:   Again we could argue all day but Van De Beek has made a good few starts now and come on as sub for minutes here and there and done just about nothing.  I said recently that if we chose a third division player instead how much less could that player do than Van De Beek.  I'm dead serious?  It begs the question why buy him obviously as he's not going to take Bruno's place and he's not exactly a 'tough' midfielder like the three mentioned above.  Just don't get it with him, not a dribble, not a nice pass, barely even touching the ball in most games.  Oh and one goal?

We've all got our opinions but for me I'd play two of those three midfielders against the stronger sides but with all due respect if we're playing teams from the bottom half then just one of them, Bruno next to them and four upfront.  Two on the wings and two in the middle rather than Martial up there on his own against two/three/four defenders.

So trying the best we've got in a 'Like for Like' scenario from all the success we had under SAF I'd go with this:

SCHMEICHEL ................ HENDERSON

NEVILLE ................... WAN BASSAKA
FERDINAND ................. LINDELOF/BAILLY
VIDIC ..................... MAGUIRE
IRWIN ..................... SHAW

BECKHAM ................... GREENWOOD
SCHOLES ................... BRUNO
KEANE ..................... MCTOMINAY
GIGGS ..................... RASHFORD

HUGHES .................... CAVANI
VAN NISTELROOY ............ MARTIAL

Literally NOT ONE of these new players would get in the team as all eleven aren't as good as their counterparts BUT for me that's the best we've got, that's a typical system that worked so try to replicate it as best we can.  On paper that still looks a decent team with Central defence and the inconsistency of Rashford, Martial, Greenwood, Bruno the standout problems.   Give us two really good Central defenders and someone like Haaland and we'd be a lot better.

PS:  Can't see why we'd want ANOTHER winger in the likes of Sancho when we've already got Martial, Rashford, Greenwood and James wanting to play wide?
Report REDROB March 23, 2021 11:51 AM GMT
Martial, Rashford and Greenwood all want to play through the middle, only James is a winger. Beckham & Giggs delivered from byline for strikers to attack the ball, Your like for like citing Rashford and Greenwood never ever get to the byline. Strikers thrive on crosses they can get on the end of, not receiving the ball with their back to goal. Cavani must think WTF sort of team am I playing in.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 23, 2021 12:34 PM GMT
Red

Oh I know that just saying they play out on the wing but yes as you point out they all cut inside.

Just think that team I picked is just about the best we have.  They're just not good enough with literally NOT ONE being as good as the counterparts I picked.  You can't even say I've handpicked that particular eleven as I could have chose:

VAN DER SAAR

BROWN
BRUCE
PALLISTER
EVRA

KANCHELSKIS
ROBSON
INCE
RONALDO

CANTONA
ROONEY

Same again, not one of our eleven (the Full Backs are roughly a match to be fair) would take the place of those above either.  Our players just aren't as good, all a manager can do is pick what he has to choose from.
Report REDROB March 23, 2021 12:58 PM GMT
It's the tactics that are naff Lou.
This passing inside your own box is a recipe for disaster. Leicesters 2nd goal: Henderson to Maguire who's on the edge of 6 yard box, he passes to Fred who's in the D facing his own goal an opposing player up his arris and 2 more either side of him within 3 yards, his options were limited, back to Maguire, back to Henderson, boot it out for a corner or try and turn the geezer behind him and set off. Who instructs them to play this way ?
Time to try a 3 at the back and use full backs as wingbacks, chance of getting decent crosses in.
3 - 4 -3 with Bruno, Rash or Martial with Cavani up top.
Report REDROB March 23, 2021 1:05 PM GMT
* Leicesters first goal that should be.
The second goal was all down to Matic.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 23, 2021 1:06 PM GMT
Red

Oh I agree about the faffing about at the back it's a complete no brainer.  Just get the keeper to kick it the field away from harms way.  Seen it with many sides not just United, how many more goals do you give away before you stop doing it?

Still think you need more than one man (Martial or Cavani) in the middle.  It's an awful lot to ask one man up there on his own against two, three, four defenders.  I'd have Martial AND Cavani as I've stated before.
Report REDROB March 23, 2021 1:07 PM GMT
That what I said, Cavani alongside either Rash or Martial, bruno just behind.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 23, 2021 1:07 PM GMT
Red

What about their other goal, corner comes over, beats everyone and Mctominay leaves his guy to head it in from two yards out at the far post.  Awful.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 23, 2021 1:08 PM GMT
Red

Oh fair enough misunderstood that.  Yes I agree two up top, Bruno just behind.
Report REDROB March 23, 2021 1:10 PM GMT
every goal was avoidable but the second was criminal, scorer picked it up on halfway line with Matic alongside him, ran all the way into box having been tracked the whole way by Matic who never attempted a challenge at any stage, Fred made a last ditch attempt but it was as the guy was shooting, should never have got that far.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 23, 2021 1:23 PM GMT
Yes Matic sort of cantered back, Fred made an effort to do something at least but all too late.
Report pushkin99 March 23, 2021 8:12 PM GMT
Maybe I will Lou, maybe I won't. But one of Brighton and United play positive attacking footie, the other does not and just seems to play percentage footie, getting much better results than their performanes have deserved. On this much we agree surely, as is the testimony of the very many critical posts by United fans on this thread would imply?
Report pushkin99 March 23, 2021 8:17 PM GMT
As I have stated many times before, I would have been really worried if United had recruited Poch, I think with his acumen and United's financial muscle, u would have once again been competing for the trophies worth winning, the CL and the PL.

That u have persisted with OGS, the classic lowly paid yes man, shows the limited expectations of your owners. Their sole ambitions are to keep the money from the gravy train rolling in, while paying out as little as possible.

Long may that continue.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 23, 2021 8:23 PM GMT
push

I've had enough of reading your utter nonsense so another who I'll simply BLOCK so won't be able to see a word of it anymore.
Report pushkin99 March 23, 2021 8:27 PM GMT
bye bye lou. I am sure as the very many others that u have also blocked will testify, the pleasure was all yours!
Report pushkin99 March 23, 2021 8:28 PM GMT
How sad, lou in denial right to the end.
Report grumpyjim March 23, 2021 9:43 PM GMT
No matter whats said its not got one bit part better in all this time .. 8years .. Managers have not been on the cheap  .. far from it .. all got handsomely paid on exiting ..   Leicester are a very workmanlike outfit .. and result no surprise .. UNITED play with a fear factor built in as no one helps each other some really do very little and some HIDE   if the head goes down you hardly see them again .. Worst culprit at moment being   MARTIAL  a poor attitude if ball is taken off him .. and some of his antics wanting a foul  I
need to hide behind a corner .. GOOD PLAYERS  have come and happy to go as its not a happy environment to be part off and need a way out ASAP  .. most doing really better than they ever displayed at united . ....  THEY dont always do well in shirt on OFF DAYS  ..  no easy FIX  .. NOW    AFTER A BILLION QUID LOST  .. and a Stadium needing revamped and clean up .. ,
Report duffy March 24, 2021 5:36 AM GMT
Here's the irony with the playing out from the back thing. Everyone does it because Pep does it and they all want to be trendy like him, the whole point of it is to drag the opposition on to you and create space and opportunities once you've successfully got out.

But here's the rub, it doesn't even work for City, they don't move the ball quick enough once they have achieved the initial part of the plan and aren't able to capitalize on space created and consequently we see them often struggling to break sides down endlessly moving from side to side.

Pep has continually tried to recreate his Golden Barca style of play and never more so than with his City sides, but the truth is that even with the quality he has had it just hasn't even come close to what is needed to achieve that level of quick moving play and when it doesn't work it can look tedious and City often look like that.
Report grumpyjim March 24, 2021 6:10 AM GMT
PLENTY of gripes about the game as it is for watching purposes .. really dreadful some of it  .go back to 2  3  5 .. and get it away from your goalkeeper ..many changes made in game have taken it backwards rather than the progress it was going to make .. I would never have BELIEVED  ..the money in the game as it still rumbles on ..  obscene payments . for what we have to watch .. Short life span we know at the  top if  you reach that level . UNITED are in a bad place once again and a restart is on its way .. once again .. OGS  .. does have a mountain to climb ..  Media .. have a lot to answer and these players nowadays feed the fire ..  in all walks of life ..
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 24, 2021 8:03 AM GMT
duffy

Totally agree if it doesn't work for the stand out side what chance the rest of us?

Up until recently you would never have seen it.  To dilly dally at the back I sit there thinking "Oh no, no get rid of it", squerming in my chair.  To be fair to Fred anywhere else on the pitch it's no big deal that he gives a pass away with a weak kick obviously that happens all the time right over the pitch but for Maguire to give it to him there really put him in it and in this instance where his pass did go astray the forward ran it and tapped it pretty much into an empty net.

Goals are of a premium and in this instance United are giving them a one start.  Surely now after Sunday OGS must say to his men NO MORE DILLY DALLYING just kick it up the field away from harms way and we start from there.  Without that mistake and Mctominay leaving his forward to tap a header in from two yards out on the far post Leicester don't even beat us and we were awful.  So frustrating.
Report olddesperado March 24, 2021 10:28 AM GMT
The players didn't just decide to show themselves up every game playing out from the back of their own accord.
That's they way this amateurish management want it and if there's one thing we know about ole it's that he doesn't learn from any mistakes or change something not working.

Our group are not suited to play this way but that won't enter his head I'm afraid.

Speaking if not learning lessons I fully expect de gea to be back in goal after the international break.
Report grumpyjim March 24, 2021 10:54 AM GMT
FRED  . unfortunately the lad is not quality or anywhere near  it for Premiership in any team ..like so many others .. not fair to name them .we do not have one single player 
  this whole squad who can gel them together to improve our lot on the park .. and thats where it all happens .. Watch game after game when under pressure all hands showing 
  where the ball should go .?  and none of them give it here to ME  .. NOT A ONE  can fix it .. and chances of OGS  knowing anything ?about motivation . he appears scared to have a go at them .. DOES NOT  ..like confrontation for some  reason .. SOME MANAGERS  spluttering shouting pointing urging them to do better never happens  at the THEATRE OF HORRORS .,  SUNDAY NO DIFFERENT ..  .. HE must think his men are so good ,do not need to pull  UP them there   SOCKS   . and get on with it ..at 70 plus million  a player .. we are getting bad deals .. over 8 long years ..   ptb   would rather go down a division and start .. FRESH  .. from   Scratch ..  when hand waving occurs and they do not want the ball  they should be put to task  of playing for the ball on every occasion ..  on and on this great AMERICAN BASED SHOW GOES ON   .. as if its a no brainer .. no one ever gets the BULLET ..  COSY CORNER CAFES NEED BUILT ALL AROUND THE STADIUM  ..I WILL not pay in another dollar to this fiasco .  .. We need to take this on .. not sure how but its not anywhere near what we wish to watch .
Report grumpyjim March 24, 2021 10:54 AM GMT
FRED  . unfortunately the lad is not quality or anywhere near  it for Premiership in any team ..like so many others .. not fair to name them .we do not have one single player 
  this whole squad who can gel them together to improve our lot on the park .. and thats where it all happens .. Watch game after game when under pressure all hands showing 
  where the ball should go .?  and none of them give it here to ME  .. NOT A ONE  can fix it .. and chances of OGS  knowing anything ?about motivation . he appears scared to have a go at them .. DOES NOT  ..like confrontation for some  reason .. SOME MANAGERS  spluttering shouting pointing urging them to do better never happens  at the THEATRE OF HORRORS .,  SUNDAY NO DIFFERENT ..  .. HE must think his men are so good ,do not need to pull  UP them there   SOCKS   . and get on with it ..at 70 plus million  a player .. we are getting bad deals .. over 8 long years ..   ptb   would rather go down a division and start .. FRESH  .. from   Scratch ..  when hand waving occurs and they do not want the ball  they should be put to task  of playing for the ball on every occasion ..  on and on this great AMERICAN BASED SHOW GOES ON   .. as if its a no brainer .. no one ever gets the BULLET ..  COSY CORNER CAFES NEED BUILT ALL AROUND THE STADIUM  ..I WILL not pay in another dollar to this fiasco .  .. We need to take this on .. not sure how but its not anywhere near what we wish to watch .
Report HGS March 24, 2021 11:57 AM GMT
I would never have BELIEVED  ..the money in the game as it still rumbles on ..  obscene payments . for what we have to watch ..

Correct jim. The standard MOST are having to put up with is nowt short of shocking yet the money just keeps rising.
Report Emitdeb March 24, 2021 12:23 PM GMT
What money is rising?
Report HGS March 24, 2021 1:00 PM GMT
Don't see players taking new contracts halfway through current ones for less, so wages for a start.
Sponsorship levels always seem to be on the up. Think Utd just got a new shirt deal to give an example. Would have to be more than the last one imo.
TV money rises every contract renewal with more and more worldwide contracts being added for even more.
So yes, fair to say imo, that money is still rising.
Report grumpyjim March 24, 2021 3:12 PM GMT
Stadiums will be obsolete if this continues into 2023/4  T/V  will have succeeded in winning all games hands down ..no need for fans as we knew it . 30 percent if lucky it ever happens this year or next ..
  no let up  and this Jab as its called .. ..virus  may  well regain,some other strain .. before long .. a lot of the future is up in the air  .. like the dates plucked out of fresh .AIR that we have to believe in time after time ..changing daily .. used to like the muppets ..    . IN Uniteds case it was bought with a rosy future ahead ...  where is ROSIE   ..  lost in the exit door with all dinero gone as well .. only serious changes at top can solve this .. are transfers conducted  ..in EUROS OR G.B.P/ ? now only in pounds surely  .. out of the great EU   ..
Report HGS March 24, 2021 5:27 PM GMT
No fans. Count me out. 1 and a bit seasons of this enough for anyone.
Report grumpyjim March 24, 2021 7:19 PM GMT
NO Fans   ,no trouble,no policing bills .. stewards and all others not needed .. Huge saving . at nearing 78 years .. not so much pressure on me as supporter ..  .never been back since    ,, SAF  , retired ..  NEVER BE  , back now , its over  .but still want the best  ,for UNITED  .. not just UK .. the whole World is troubled BIGTIME  .. for years ahead ..  some countries already go no travel ..?? before 2023 .. and that will be reviewed also .. Boris keeps pulling dates out of  ..?  FRESH AIR .  and moving Goalposts  .. he knows no more than his  Buddies .  PEOPLE STILL DIE  ,every day .. their nearest and dearest, cannot  support them at a    Funeral .. IF thats not a tough call then all is about more changes  ................... Never have more      T ,V.      been Sold to back up world domination OF THE SERVICES THEY CAN PROVIDE  .. Americans meet  to watch their
  team and all hours of the day .. all shareholders ..  sad when you write this .. REALITY   ..  ......... ...........
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B March 24, 2021 8:16 PM GMT
Nicky Butt has left United.

Wonder what the reason is as who decides to up and leave Manchester United?  Only possibility I can think of is he's been offer a managerial post somewhere or will be looking to do so.  He's spent most of his life at the club so must be very difficult to walk away.

Can't see why they'd get rid so hope the true reason actually comes out.
Report lurka March 24, 2021 8:18 PM GMT
Talk of Keane and Butt going to Cetic
Report grumpyjim March 24, 2021 9:38 PM GMT
good choice if it works .. always worth a chance on pretty good players .. PASSION FOR GAME  a huge asset ..........
Report olddesperado March 25, 2021 1:47 PM GMT
I read a clip from a book coming out where Alex Ferguson sent a txt to ole the morning after ole's first game which he won 5_1 .
The txt said I've been out all night celebrating getting my club back.

All I can say is fergie has surely caught up on his missed sleep during the majority of our games since.
Report grumpyjim March 25, 2021 6:01 PM GMT
its been dreadful time .. for sure .. Can check that out with a call .. BUT  ..sort of statement that would help sell a book ..  its no doubt he would be chuffed with the result .. for sure ..  right ..  he has not been very far for some time ..  HEALTH  .. going wrong was a huge blow and he got through it  ,had a lot of work in the diary  at the time .none of it was taken up ,to my knowledge .  We know TV picks him  out these days .. on his own in stand  .. Theatre of Dreams   .. still his second home .. Might be uncomfortable way he got beat sometimes ,,, BUT  .  not long to get running at full steam ahead .. once more . Scotland turned out some great managers and players 40 ish years ago ..
Report olddesperado March 25, 2021 7:52 PM GMT
It sure did jim.

You have to wonder where all the players have gone.

Bit like ireland now we are not producing any decent level players either.
Report olddesperado March 25, 2021 7:58 PM GMT
The fergie quote came from a book called the first 100 days written by a Scot who managed one of the lesser Scottish teams.
Could be Motherwell not sure if that's right though.
Report grumpyjim March 25, 2021 9:58 PM GMT
my mate speaks to the boss every week . good chance he will know . SCOTLAND NICKED A DRAW against the odds . 2  2  .. finished .. Mctominay had a good game  . THAT lads talent frightens me  ..  Once he starts  learning to running at the opposition .. he will be some machine and ref will give him the credit every time he gets brought down . ..CAN KEEP BALL AT HIS FEET  .as if it belongs there . and awareness around him is very very good .
  BEST  squad for 30 years maybe . ?  .time to learn old game worked as well as todays CRAP  . T.V.  football is future get yourself biggest TV you can afford .. as running out of the guts for teles .. and makers are up to ears in work backlog .. and unable to stop to produce more parts ..   PRICES will Rocket ... No let up in fans attending for some time to come .. . plus   Olympics to come .. not sure how timing will work here sure somebody will know ..  ?
Report grumpyjim March 25, 2021 10:58 PM GMT
7 million a year contract for poor ..... OGS   ...in print or I would not BELIEVE it ..  OGS   .. till end of 2024  season ..  Daily Mail tomorrow .. just to be Signed  .. ?
Report 11kv March 25, 2021 11:03 PM GMT
7 ffs worlds gone mad.
Report REDROB March 25, 2021 11:05 PM GMT
was reading about the class of 92 the other day, when they broke into the first team and signed their first professional contract they were all on the same, a massive (for them at the time) 250 quid a week. Grin
Report grumpyjim March 26, 2021 8:55 AM GMT
game has progressed since  class of 92  not for better nor for decent fans .. 92 was a perfect football set up all get same except captain gets a bit extra for over seeing the cause .Corporate GREED..and Superstars  ??  and  TV.  belong the game now ..    built into game since that era  .MORE  ...Level playing field if that was possible .. LOST the Beautiful Game ..    Since that time .. ONLY  ...downturn is players get loads of Abuse these days   .some of it difficult to understand in todays World .. IT never goes away its their daily, in some form or another .  WELL PAID would be party to the  HUGE  divide  that exists today .. FANS no longer important .. and the game as it stands no CROWDS  suits the future ..as savings are HUGE . no abuse from fans match days only  ,,social media to run all the system  ,as they please ..  not going away for now .  already SEPTEMBER  is on cards .. and plucked out of  ....FRESH AIR  .. THE  Date . will go on for longer too much going on , via Countries ,not happy about vaccines etc .. ALL up in the AIR ALSO  ...
Report grumpyjim March 27, 2021 10:06 AM GMT
BEAUTIFUL  game sold down the river .. come to mind .. LOCAL SIDE  no longer .. applicable .. 2 Manchester sides in top PREMIERSHIP .. HOW many from area have been lucky enough to come up to todays standard ..   Fear wont be many ..   Finish up 3 or 4 centres . for top class  football  . IN  ,,.   ENGLAND  .   Rest can be sold to local government for use of local kids and start again ..   No other way to get game as we know ,,,,back .  . WOMEN  ,,,in Football seems to be making it into BIGTIME  .. T.V. Spots . for themselves NOW  .
Report grumpyjim March 31, 2021 6:50 PM BST
old des perado . ..does 100 days book yourefer to have something bto do with the Glazers take over .. ?all my mate knows that is a 100 days .
Report olddesperado April 1, 2021 6:53 AM BST
Hi Jim,   I've done a bit of searching and found it.
It's called  " the first 100 days , lessons in leadership from the football bosses"

It was co written by Mickey Mellon  Dundee United manager.

If you Google that you will get the full story and context around it.
Report olddesperado April 1, 2021 7:01 AM BST
In the book he speaks to ole gunner solskaer,  David moyes,Sean dyche, Sam allardyce,among others.
I think it's to raise funds for motor neurone disease.
Report grumpyjim April 2, 2021 3:42 PM BST
He puts his names to a lot of things could well be correct .Not been around much lately .. Know he had to miss bits and pieces but never made one in particular .. Due to Lockdown restrictions .  My mate made it as in a different tier at that time .. Seen him at games at Old Trafford .. on TV .Sitting  on his own watching proceedings ..  Wonder how he sees it these days . ? seems yesterday he left .. but runs into 8 years ..  Little if any ground has been made during that time .. With various set ups but nothing has clicked so far .conditions this past year . needs to go behind us all soon and back to some sort of new learning to live with these DREADFUL  VIRUS  STRAINS .. Flying all around us .. WORLD WIDE  a   Serious business . Changing all our lives forever ..  GOT PFIZER  ..  Jag start of this week over 70 ..bad headache wakening up after second day .. one PARACETEMOL  an hour late felt great and  still  do . HAD  ..literally cold feet and hands all winter .. low and behold they are   as  warm as pies now . ?? strange but good for me  .. Never felt the jag .. ?
Report olddesperado April 3, 2021 9:50 AM BST
Glad you got it Jim   ,  hopefully you can start to live fairly normally now again.

Just watched a documentary about big Norman Whiteside last night.
Really nice guy.
Was on £16 a week in 82 when he made his debut and his win bonus was £800.

Now there's an incentive.

And before anyone thinks that £16 might be good for 1982  I started an apprenticeship the same year in the building trade on £25 a week.

Nowadays I'm pretty sure apprentice footballers are on £thousands a week before they even get near the first team.
Report grumpyjim April 3, 2021 2:40 PM BST
Hard to believe that money was so poor .. 1958  AS an  first year  APP CABINETMAKER  . 2 POUNDS  SEVENTEEN SHILLINGS AND SIXPENCE . for 48 hour week  ..
Your were really tired at end of your shift .. GOOD   not really a  jobs a job .. what I  WANTED  .. .. ? ..10 min break in mid morning ,tea to make for around 16 Shop for buns for the greedy and needy .. people  at 1030 .. am  done that for 2 years as well as my JOB  .. ?  Half  Hour lunch   .. FINISH 5PM  .. 8  .. 1 am  Sat  Overtime ..  then footie at 3 pm .. pubs closed 2 /30 pm reopened 5 pm finished 9 PM  .. Tough days  ... out  Mon  to Sat ..  learn to take it in your stride ..
Report duffy April 3, 2021 8:59 PM BST
Something has gone wrong for me as back in the 80's I was having a tenner on a horse and more than 30 years later I am still having a tenner on.

In reality I'm probably having 5 bob on.Cry
Report grumpyjim April 4, 2021 5:08 AM BST
good you still have a tenner on ,but sometimes it doesnt add up ..Run by financial experts . Betting now you wonder what its about .. Stick with your tenner  .as long as you are happy with that .. has to be a fun sort of thing with scant reward .. My Grandfather lifted lines as an retired ex  PAINTER  ..  55 yearl old .. illegal . then .and that started me off as an  8  year old in 1951 .. would ask him how my horse done .  its in the  ..BING SON  ..  later on in years I said to him there  must be lots of horses in that BING  .. AYE SON    I  suppose you are right there .   Tanner or Shilling would be tendered at that time ..  for big players .. ? I know the man who received the bets  .went on to be a president of the N B Association ..  lovely guy always well dressed .. ........ Now  a Layer  bet 3 numbers ??  ........  .for a year pays Inland Revenuue .....  300 million pounds  ...TAX  for ONE YEAR  ? WELL DONE TO HER . MUCH .. MUCH  .... Better than football player ..  Silly Game ..
Report duffy April 4, 2021 8:24 PM BST
Manchester United have officially confirmed the appointment of John Murtough as the club’s new Football Director after an extensive search, while club legend Darren FletcherLaugh also takes up a new role. The Red Devils have been looking at bringing in a new figure to oversee recruitment and football operations for several years, with the likes of Sevilla transfer guru Monchi and former Lille sporting director Luis Campos linked with the role. But United have opted to promote from withinLaugh, with former head of football development Murtough – who was brought to United in 2013 by David Moyes Laugh– handed the reins.LaughLaughCrazyCrazy
Report grumpyjim April 4, 2021 9:50 PM BST
few passengers on tonight .. and more to follow behind scenes .. you couldnt make it up .. 83 mins  to do the job  .. SHOULD BE A STEAL   ....that was in first half that the non event .. passed by in 45 nins .. second half looked slghtly better . Difficult to watch so many red shirts failing in their   .. Job Discription .. think most fans must see how short we are of hard working players ..  BRIGHTON   ,, not worst side we have had visit thats for sure .. worked painlessly for 94 mins for scant reward .. Caused plenty of problems during that time . Well Done to them .. Europe ,  NOW ONLY TO WIN THAT  ,SAVE THE MANAGER  .. Seems a cosy place to be .. mostly .. getting even cosier . SETTLED side is far off still .
Report olddesperado April 4, 2021 10:19 PM BST
Pretty awful again but we somehow get the point again.

We really seem to have no direction or plan other than a flash of individuality here and there.

So many players walking with and without the ball it's maddening.

Aimlessly passing across the pitch over and over at a snail's pace.

I genuinely don't think I can watch much more of this tbh.

My sports package is up in June and I doubt very much I'll be renewing as I don't really watch other games and we are almost unwatchable.
Report REDROB April 4, 2021 10:28 PM BST
Again Pogba needlessly giving ball away in final third led to a goal, a liability as a defensive midfielder, Mactominey a far safer option. Badly need a midfield general, maybe Mac'll grow into the role, but they can't really afford to wait. Cavanis' an old fashioned type centre forward  who needs crosses, waste of time him being there without them, although it was a great touch of his to Bruno that led to Rashfords goal. Another somewhat fortunate 3 points, spurs next up.
Report grumpyjim April 4, 2021 10:49 PM BST
s  Stick with it old d p .. you need something taking up your time .. Check if something cheaper and better deals about ,.. they are there . ask on here somebody will put you on the  best for you .. HUGE CLUB doesnt go away its who can restore it to at least watching it is a JOY of sorts anything beats at the moment  .....is dire . FORTRESS OLD TRAFFORD NEEDS REBUILT  ..  at half the present costs ..all earn the same in a team game ANY difference should be in the costs percentage and dies as you put boots on .. COUNTLESS times the wrong ball was played by every player .
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B April 4, 2021 11:20 PM BST
Yes poor again tonight we got away with a win.

As Redrob points out Pogba giving the ball away for their goal but to be fair if Ole picks Mctomminay and Fred people say there's no flair between them so it's a tricky one.

Upfront bar the goals Rashford, Cavani, Bruno and Greenwood offered very little.  the great Bruno has really dropped in class over the past few months often doing very little and giving the ball away timer and time again.  Of course because he's our new hero everyone doesn't say anything but e honest he's often poor of late.  Over half of his goals are penalties too whcih I've pointed out before most reading this could knock into the corner.
Report duffy April 5, 2021 12:06 AM BST
Fernandez is average but looks better as he's playing alongside trees.

We are in for the long haul with the current set up as OGS continues to be blessed with the team annoyingly continuing to hit the dizzying heights of mediocrity and therefore CL football is achieved which is all the board request, how they get there is inconsequential to them.

Those of us with a tendency to view things through a rose tinted lens will no doubt look at a 2nd place finish and garner some sort of encouragement from that.

What we've actually experienced and continue to do so since SAF left is a period in our history that will probably be struck from the record books as something that didn't actually happen.

We must all hope that at some point in the near future Ed will step out of the shower and we will all see that it was just a bad dream and we can start back from the day after SAF left.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B April 5, 2021 10:26 AM BST
duffy

Yes I agree.  Cty are far and away the best team, Liverpool without their injuries almost as good then there's a big gap to us who probably are the third best team in the league.  Just shows you the standard though when the likes of Leicester, Spurs, Chelsea aren't quite even as good as us.  I'd rate us as about 7/10 at best (I almost want to say six and a half) so not great at all are we.

I posted before and nobody could answer me that if you picked a typical Fergie team NOT ONE of our current team would get near it.  Would you swap for Schmeichel, the back four, Scholes, Keane in midfield, Beckham, Kanchelskis, Ronaldo, Giggs, Cantona, Hughes, Solksjaer, Yorke, Van Nistelrooy, Rooney, Tevez.  See what I mean, Ole can only pick what we have and NOT ONE would get in the team.  At a push our two full backs are decent but other than that the rest are miles off I'm afraid.
Report grumpyjim April 5, 2021 11:04 AM BST
put in the graft to the game and some would just about get pass marks . with a good bit of stregthening . Fred seems to be cotinuosly in a  15 square meter Bubble.not keen to do too much .. NEVER a red devil for sure . Bruno was going great guns .. now lost all the gunpower ..  DID help lift us off a lowly position at the start of his campaign ..Seems to be argueing within himself as it goes wrong time after time .. Cavani Dissappeared .Rashford has made it outside football Bubble  with his GONG  .. his game has deteriorated . somewhat .. Sadly these guys need to think the future for themselves .. Tough time for all and easy to be a critic ,.    .Lucky Chappies going home with huge paypackets . in mean time we sufferer the whole lot on our broad shoulders time after time . Glad saw chance of a cheaper big TV  in october .. BE over in 10 months .. Payments   Saved it all already .. to watch some poor stuff .. AS A Professional person myself  . need to keep doing my best for all around us .. Short lifespan FOOTBALLERS   .. MOSTLY  its all they know ..  ..   no chance of ever retrieving the club back in our lifetime ..  LOT OF SADNESS  .. to take in and still ongoing .. BRIGHTON MANAGER GOT FLYING COLOURS FROM ME  .. done well ..
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B April 5, 2021 11:09 AM BST
Jim

Agree about Bruno argueing with himslef as he fcuks up.  If it were me I'd give him some back saying "YOU gave that ball away, YOU made that bad pass, YOU  were greedy not passing it, YOU had that wild shot that went miles wide".

He seems to moan at the others when it's his fault.  I wouldn't stand for it, why don't the players let him know it.  He gets a great goal here and there granted, plays some nice passes and obviously some will go astray as it's not just tapping it sideways but overall 'The great Bruno Fernandez"?  Not for me sorry.
Report grumpyjim April 5, 2021 10:26 PM BST
we have been close with all different managers .. in Fairness they all done a job of sorts , but consistency and what we watched wasnt for us really .. expecting  too much .. maybe .. Think players shoulder much of the present problems  .. MOYES got off to worst possible start as players revolt won the day .. On it goes to this day .. What might have been .. OGS  unable to put best on from the bench .. to give us an edge .. GOD forbid .. 10 or 12 year old fan would make better substitutes .. >>>>>>>>James and Greenwood can forget a permanent shirt .. LIKEWISE  FRED LINDELOF RASHFORD  6  that need to haul them socks up very quickly ..  Sorry its not great but as you see it you have to run with them ..   OGS  .. if he has little say as some sugest ..   The Showers ,, are going to be busy on EXIT DAYS  .. CLEAR OUT  and some fresh plain paper for round ,,, YEAR  9  ?  times are a changing now surely .  AGAIN   ..
Report REDROB April 6, 2021 6:43 PM BST
Just watched highlights of the wolves/west ham game. Why is it that Jesse Lingard suddenly looks like a player ? Scored more goals and had more assists in his first 6 games for them than he did in his last 50 appearances for Utd. Looked a class act yesterday, and did things that we'd be raving about if a United player did them.
Report olddesperado April 6, 2021 8:51 PM BST
If he was an unknown we would be thinking he was just the type if player we need.

Fast, direct , good dribbler and an eye for goal.

Is it our lack of movement that hindered him or has he just upped his game or is he just in one of those little periods where the gods look down on you for a few weeks.

Probably a bit of all three.
Report the_don April 6, 2021 9:09 PM BST
There's definitely a player in Lingard, his movement was always quite good for us but in his position (behind the striker) you have to come up with big numbers in goals and assists. Even in his best times (around 4 years ago?) he never sustained those numbers for more than a couple of months.

He was an easy target during tough times for a lot of fans, of course he didn't help himself with all the online posts etc. Like many, he's a confidence player - hasn't had it for 2 or 3 years but now he has with less pressure and more game time at West Ham. No future for him at Utd imo but good luck to him, at the mo he's going well.
Report grumpyjim April 6, 2021 9:39 PM BST
too cosy at  UNITED TO  , bother as its in their hand allthe time lovely lovely contracts . some Beggar  belief .. Game as it stands has gone for good for united as long as the said drivers of the team prepare to search better players at half money that are at least worth watching .. as it is .NOTHING   .. heartache maybe .. watchin the lot unfold .......... Every  premier side have suffered some poor shows for FANS  .. AND Left managers scratching their heads ?.. PANDEMONIUM   IN A  ,,,,PENDEMIC ATMOSPHERE .Liverpool gave away some cracking goals tonight ..
Report grumpyjim April 7, 2021 10:33 PM BST
Bayern 25 plus chances an majority of game . an off night for them .. ??These games only make you feel best miss that level where we are at the moment .. could be embarrising .. Could a good United pull together at that standard .. on a GOOD NIGHT .. unlikelly  ..............must dream on another 10 years    ish .. plus ..  Enjoyable tonight yes . Spanish Ref ..... allowed game to keep going taxing    all the players .. well done to him and his assistants ..
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B April 8, 2021 12:08 AM BST
Jim

That's what I say about us.  Probably the second or third team in the league we are yet how far are we behind Bayern, PSG?

I really can't possibly see how if you were trying to be HONESTLY accurate that our team warrants a rating of 7/10.  We are probably a six and a half.  Whoopdeedoo!
Report grumpyjim April 8, 2021 11:12 AM BST
lou  think you are mixing me up with DUFFY ON  MARKS OUT OF 10 ... GAVE 7  Ithink .  said before we came close nearly not worst side at top 6 .. BUT EVERY YEAR FELL TO BITS  .. now  we need to go onwards and get realplayers at proper price who want ..  // TO be there .. REAL DEAL  ...RED DEVILS .. if ? That is Possible and think it is ,, with a guy who really is a boss , and stands no nonsense ..  Jose  .. jury is out on him once again ..at another club .. Funny old Game ..
Report duffy April 8, 2021 5:19 PM BST
Fergies last team that won the league by 10+ points was 7/10.

Since then we have been 1/10, and the 1 is for managing to get out onto the pitch on time.
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B April 8, 2021 6:12 PM BST
Hardly 1/10 duffy but they're no more than about 6.5
Report grumpyjim April 8, 2021 6:17 PM BST
I  like it .. SAF  and a few mates won first 3 races at liverpool AINTREE RACES TODAY  prices around 11 t0 1    ..3 to 1   .. and evens .. About ..90 t0 1  treble ..  still a winner after 8 years . A  Good ,, MAN  .  Not lost his  ,TOUCH  .. 3   GRADE ONE RACES ..  ,,  ..
Report HGS April 8, 2021 7:08 PM BST
Yeah, nice treble. Had the second 2 but couldn't touch the first after it's last couple of runs. They got some nice horses and good luck to em. Think the TV banging on about 3-0 in Liverpool was a bit over the top mesen. Not like they could win owt with em in Manchester after all CrazyCrazy
Report the_don April 8, 2021 8:49 PM BST
Their players are kicking lumps out of ours yet it's 3 bookings to nil to us?? Obviously our players and bench aren't screaming and squealing enough for the ref. Crazy
Report grumpyjim April 8, 2021 10:23 PM BST
invested a lot of money for top class horses looks as though they will get a turn ..3 GRADE ONE WINNERS IN THE STABLE ..  well done to them another hard game .. some hefty bills .. to go with it .
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B April 8, 2021 11:57 PM BST
Only watched the highlights show after the game.  They showed about 10 minutes all in with United having the Rashford shot and a weak penalty.  Not another shot shown so we must have been very poor.

Grenada are obviously rubbish, a very easy draw for us but when will we actually play well again.  Scraped through against the mighty Brighton at the weekend and as I've pointed out before I couldn't tell you one player apart from Danny Welbeck who even plays for them yet United struggle to beat them.

We really need to start performing soon, yes we'll qualify for Champions League but we're not much cop are we.
Report olddesperado April 9, 2021 5:49 AM BST
Dreadful performance again , absolutely horrible team to watch with all the walking and standing over the ball and then the slow paced sideways passing.

We never zip it about ahead of people .

We keep winning but it can't sustainable going forward to keep getting results playing so poorly.
Like 11 strangers out there.

And when will stand up for ourselves,   like don said they kicked lumps out of us and he gives us 5 yelliw cards yet other than Bruno not one player seriously complained and not a whimper from the bench.

They are a spineless bunch both on the field and in the dugout stands or wherever ole sits most of the game.
Report grumpyjim April 9, 2021 10:27 AM BST
..NOT A TEAM  at all really individual shysters ..  Referee got few marks out of 10 .. and as poor as I have seen for some time . So far behind other squads at a bit less cost .. TO  say its not fun is  a  ....REALITY CHECK    .. NEIGHBOURS CITY  .. parting with 16 million a year till 2025  .. is disgusting to say the least .. Decent player but leaves me cold sometimes on an attitude front .. but this seems to be the up to date hotshots are all about . Glad our FANS  at end of the day can refuse to take on season tickets .. Our American owners can fill it up every other week sending planes full of supporters over to see the fruits of their buying into the  ...AMERICAN DREAM  .. NO doubt TV.  of the future do not care about empty  Stadiums  as they can sell  icecream to anyone ..     ..,,Sad day for football this PANDEMIC  .. may well be a big big change forever ..  NEVER   seen 11  Manchester players  ,,,,,KICKED SO OFTEN  . in 90 Minutes. Every game brings us something Different .  A new level our squad have achieved .  final of that trophy soon be behind us as well as doubt we are near good enough to survive with 5 yellows in a game ..  ADDING TO THE WOE .. Still trying to Figure out what IS   .  EXPECTED OF A  UNITED MANAGER ??  ITS Where the story begins and surely ENDS  ..  somewhere   SOON  ..
Report grumpyjim April 11, 2021 10:02 AM BST
dropped unbelievable  points  in the earlier part of this campaign .. tell a tale now of a    2 TIER TEAM  ..   ,,CITY  drop 3 points .. UNITED  have 2 games in hand that need secured .. in tha lot we see 9 points adrift clawing back .. DONT BE SURPRISED  if OGS  can vulcanize this squad to pick up pieces and make it a   HUGE Finish that works for him .. As a fan you curse some of the dross he served up in a Pandemic YEAR  .. ROOKIE  comes to mind .. seee what today brings .. can they be mobilized to recover the sins of 12 months ..REAL SIDE OF     .. RED DEVILS   would be sitting proudly on the top of this mediocre season .. in our case too many missfits .. THISis the bibbest game this season that needs winning .. plus a 100 percent points in BAG  .. to salvage what we as fans knew . ...
Report duffy April 11, 2021 6:29 PM BST
First half 1/10

Second half 8/10 and the best we have played in a long long while.

Good performances all round but special mentions for Cavani, Pogba, Fred and again Shaw who was my MOTM.
Report REDROB April 11, 2021 6:40 PM BST
Must be some sort of record for winning when behind at half time, dont know the stats but seems to have happened plenty times this season.
Report the_don April 11, 2021 6:42 PM BST
Henderson too I thought was excellent, good saves and positive in general. Cavani has looked rusty on return, showed his class today, shame he won't/can't do that every week. Fred poor for 50 minutes but then much better after his goal. Roy Keane has just agreed with me so must be right!
Report LOU MACARIS TARTAN B April 11, 2021 6:45 PM BST
1/10 is ridiculous duffy.

They were about 3 or 4/10 and second half I agree an 8.

Got to be honest although I think the disallowed goal is a little harsh he did slap him in the face didn't he.  I played football (FOOT ball) and would try my best to maybe dribble past the other guy, tackle someone and never thought of touching anyone with my hands so where do all the hands come from?  Mctominnay is away from him so just run, keep going why slap him in the face?  Look what it cost us a perfectly good goal and what is a foul? Yes it was.  Keep the hands down and play FOOT ball.

Poor in the first half but fully deserved in the end.  I am getting to the end of my tether with Fred though.  Yes he's tenacious and breaks up things but skill wise and specially for a Brazilian he seems to have very little skill.  Struggles to control it, wayward passes he's not much of a player is he.  A real trier but not good enough for Manchester United Football Club sorry.
Report the_don April 11, 2021 6:51 PM BST
Disallowed goal a ridiculous decision, then game would be stopped every 10 seconds if that's a foul. In a way the officials have fudged it because if they give a foul then it should be a second yellow for McTominay.

Not fussed whether Fred is from Brazil or Bradford to be honest but we definitely need an upgrade. Squad player maybe and he and McTominay team up well in tougher games but the need for a better defensive midfielder who can pass well is obvious, especially when we are dominant in possession.
Report grumpyjim April 11, 2021 7:03 PM BST
at least we can think of the game as a positive  , from start their was a decision by the whole team to avenge terrible drubbing they deserved at home game .. ,, hardly anyone turned up that day .. the hardest way possible  .. LEARN HARD WAY  .. Mctominay .. an agressive  player tries his best all the time ..   SON was beat fair and square .. didnt like it   ? PUT HIS HAND on McT s  back to unbalance him but he was of and felt his hand and threw an arm out to brush him off ...   he had no IDEA   ,, his face was there as was heading forward fast ..all in a second or less . worst VAr decision ever made and no right to interfere ..  VAR taking over the whole game must be un acceptable . and HIGHLIGHTED IN HIGHSET PLACES  ...
Report grumpyjim April 11, 2021 8:05 PM BST
the don .. I really like the VAR  .. and in time it wll get better .. GOODNESS KNOWS where it  all leaves the referee as main man  SURELY  thats not in VAR  SCHEDULE ..  can ? VAR   sort out a referee who is having a nightmare in a  ,,,,Ding Dong  battle on the turf for future chances at the highest level .. Spanish REF last week got 10 out of 10 for letting them get on with GAME  ,, few interruptions and you get a huge step backwards today ..   at a lower level    LEAGUE  as  CHAMPION s League .. before top ..   VAR  to be looked at and improve .. First thing needs offside fixed once and for all as daylight   and whole body has to be in front of last defender forget about toe caps and elbows etc .. load of rubbish .. GAME NEEDS ADVANTAGE TO FORWARDS TO GET AN EDGE IF POSSIBLE  .. PROBLEM CAN SOLVE ITSELF  .. GAME  goes bacwards with wrong changes .. all the ball has to be over the line for a goal no messing .. Self Explanatory .. to a football man at heart to impove the  ..... BEAUTIFUL GAME  .. in no PANDEMIC TIMES  ..
Report olddesperado April 11, 2021 9:47 PM BST
Second half best performance of the season.

Henderson, shaw,Fred,Pogba and cavani all excellent. Greenwood when he came on too.

Var and the ref a disgrace although I guess it made us play but does beg the question do they play within themselves until they get a trigger.

Imagine where we might be if they played like they really wanted it from the first whistle.
Report the_don April 11, 2021 9:49 PM BST
Yes Jim, think I saw that ref (and there have been a couple of others in Europe) who just ignore or wave players away when they fall down for nothing. Soon lets them know that there has to be a fair bit of contact for it to be a foul - some free kicks these days are an absolute joke, Son had another one today seeing the ball out from Rashford where he just fell to the floor and got the free kick. Of course we have players who do it too.

The reversal of the decision today was just rank bad. But was the ref pressured into it by the VAR team? Probably. There will never be consistency from all referees and that has to be accepted. There are thousands of different scenarios in a match and it's impossible to make or teach all referees to make exactly the same decision. The whole process needs starting again from scratch but it won't be and is here to stay unfortunately.
Report the_don April 11, 2021 9:54 PM BST
Olddesp, unfortunately it seems we nearly always need provoking or being woken up, usually by going behind. The team seem to play much better if they have a purpose eg. coming from behind or having plans to counteract the opposition (City, Leeds, PSG etc)
If they are left to improvise or make the running in a game there is little to no urgency.
Report olddesperado April 11, 2021 10:01 PM BST
Agreed,  that's the thing I hate about this team,  the lack of urgency.

Ambling around passing it sideways at a snail's pace.
Report olddesperado April 11, 2021 10:03 PM BST
Maguire is one of the worst at this btw and somewhat sets the tone .
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