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Sir Alex - Gerrard is not a top, top player
Sir Alex - Gerrard is not a top, top player
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gerrard was never given license for england to be a true offensive midfielder imo
look at how often he was shuffled out onto the left to accommodate himself and lampard when both were at their peaks. England manager after manager stubbornly played gerrard and lampard when it just wasn't working, both wanted to do the same things as a central pair. i still believe a lot of other nations would have set up the england team around gerrard as the main focus of attack, this never happened out on the left or as a pair in the centre with lampard. i doubt i will ever see a player at liverpool of his type again. of course not the technical brilliance of zidane,ronaldo,messi etc but a drive that could single handedly win lost causes week after week for club. mentioning zidane he rates him as one of the best ever so i'd rather take his words over a blinkered fergie that often revels in comments like this. gerrard probably paid for his swashbuckling performances through his 20's, i think he has been on the decline since we were 2nd in 08/09. his partnership with torres showed exactly what he could do not only with assists but with supporting goals, they were awesome together and really pinnacled that season. the groin problem a couple of years back was so nearly the end of gerrard's career by all accounts and his energetic style resulted in many injuries over career. now we are seeing a player far removed from that player i will always remember marauding around the pitch in average liverpool sides somehow getting wins and draws for us when he was head and shoulders above anything else on the park. without gerrard liverpool would not have qualified for the champs league nearly so much in them years. I have the utmost respect for scholes, a simply sublime player for utd but you have to say he played in much better teams than gerrard did at liverpool so comments like gerrard never got a kick in the big games are unfair,if he'd gone to utd or any big side through most of his twenties he'd have fitted in no problem quality wise. if you'd swap scholes for gerrard utd would have still been winning titles and liverpool would still have been mediocre! not surprised by fergies comments, he's probably still haunted by the 1-4 score when gerrard and torres tore his team a new one, when at last liverpool genuinely had a side capable of winning a title! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0O-uBYEOLE or this goal, one i will never forget  so in summary not a technically brilliant player never given the license internationally as he was at club to make best uses of his attacking threats played in mostly average liverpool sides that were never remotely good enough to win a title won lost causes on countless occasions for club in league, extremely consistent could have fitted in seamlessly into any title winning side through his twenties i sometimes look at youtube for his top goals and have forgotten half of them till seeing them again, scored so many amazing goals until recent seasons. of course age catches up with everyone but i feel a bit sad that far too many will remember SG as what he is now and not what he was for so long a truly great player imo a top top player for his actual effect in games given the quality around him. |
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I think you have it about right stridingedge, but I would say that it was the qualities that made Gerrard such a formidable player for Liverpool in the Premier League that mitigated against him having an equal impact in International Football.
It doesn't really matter how non-Liverpool fans will remember him, Liverpool fans will remember him as the force of nature that he was for them for a decade at least. Ferguson's words just prove his own lack of class, they don't provide any lasting final word on the career of Steven Gerrard. |
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Given that England have not produced a top top player in the modern era then I can understand his comment
However he had to shoulder some responsibility as the last potentially top top player wad under his guidance from the age of 19 and he never trained on Entitled to his opinion and many will agree as for gerrard his legacy will not be tarnished imo |
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However he had to shoulder some responsibility as the last potentially top top player wad under his guidance from the age of 19 and he never trained on
Who dis? |
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Excellent post stridingedge
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I can't stand Ferguson but he's right about Gerrard. When he was up against Keane and Scholes he was anonymous.
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keane in the liverpool sides at the time would have been very ordinary!
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I'm not a big fan of gerrard But really the old drunk has been manipulating the press and stabbing people in the back all his life
What he really should be explaining in his book is How much his knighthood really did cost. Has he ever done anything to help anyone with his position and wealth Did he put bug eyes in charge of utd knowing he was going to fail miserably and make himself seem even better. Did he really have refs teams other players and managers on his payroll. What's the extent of his gambling and is it a problem Why does he bring his political views into things that he shouldn't Why does he need the money and will any of the millions go to charity. |
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both fergie and gerrard are overly self-defensive imo.
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by this standard, which fergie era players at man utd were "top top"?
ronaldo and that's pretty much it. |
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Maybe Gerrard is the best Liverpool player never to win a domestic league medal.
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gerrard is tops as far as brits are conserned,thats including the scotch as fergie calls them.
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So just to clarify this - fergie thinks Gerrard is not a 'top top' but is a top player? I'm sure SG is pleased to know that amazing insight..........
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Ferguson just needs to realize anyone could have passed that ball back to Drogba.
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I get what Fergie meant, there was simply no need for him to come out and say it. For all success he has always been an embittered man and sadly seems he'll die that way,too. I have known lots of people who claim he is such a caring man and looks after his staff so well but it appears it has to be on his terms.
A fantastic manager, who's achievements may never be repeated. Sadly, whilst difficult decisions have to be made to keep ahead of the field in management, they didn't to sell his book and he's made poor decisions: Keane mocked for his tongue, Beckham for having the temerity to question and Gerrard for not being brave enough ( that's what he has said privately) to make the move across the East Lancs Road. It's all about control with Fergie, maybe that is why he questioned Gerrard.He didn't have the ability to control a game like Scholes or a Xavi in their pomp but a destructive player that when on song he'd have improved any title winning team across Europe. That said , everyone has a weakness, mine will be reading the book when it's handed to me ! |
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miscreant man
controlling a game in a man u side that was winning or challenging for top honours every season and trying to control a game as a liverpool player that have been woefully short of class most seasons is like chalk and cheese mate. this is the point that i think is unfair if you'd swapped and sent gerrard to man u and scholes or keane to liverpool you would have seen very little difference and as i have said on here i am a big admirer of scholes, think he was a fantastic player. i'm sure fergie is perfectly aware of this and would love to hear him say different. as for not controlling a lot of games against most of the league opposition, this i'm afraid is not true at all, i'm not talking the last few seasons but for 7 or 8 seasons previous to that. if the gerrard of his twenties was in the current team with the offensive quality we've got it would be fecking fantastic, alas he does nbot have the same engine and is usually spraying hollywood balls from deep. |
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Teams win titles and unfortunately Gerrard played in an era when the teams he played in had too many sub standard players around him
managed to carry the team in cup competitions but impossible to do in the league at international level unfortunately the gap at times was just too much Fergie despite his success always came across as a bitter man - I think this is what kept him going and led to his longevity in the game |
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SE
I know you do but I feel you have that wrong. SG loved the long raking pass whereas Xavi AND Scholes both choose to pass short and control the flow of the game. SG's natural instinct is to make that pass, hit that shot.. nothing wrong in it but when the opposition is strong , it's 3-5 minutes to regain the ball. I don't share the '' If he played in Man U side'' if he did , imo , he would still hit that pass , have that shot. I'm good friends with a lad who coached him at 14/15 in his Sunday League days and he hit those passes then, he tried them shots,too. It's his natural game. But so good was he at it, on his day , it came off for him. He not only had the ability to do so but also the courage to carry it out. Whether he played for LFC , Man U or England, he'd never have controlled a game like others did, because of that natural instinct, he would though ,I agree , helped them win a championship. |
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it's just baconface having a pointless swipe at liverpool. which is pretty much what you'd expect from a classless tribalist with too much time on his hands.
gerrard was as good as anyone who's played for man utd in the last twenty years except for ronaldo. including keane, scholes and cantona. he was just playing in a weaker team. and I fcking hate liverpool, btw. |
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ok miscreant it's all about opinions we'll agree to disagree, you mkay know people, i've watched gerrard hundreds of times since he was 18, basically grew up adult life with him as he's the same age.
i stand by the point that swapping gerrard for scholes would neither have stopped man u winning what they won or helped liverpool achieve more than they did. we always had a few good players but a strong 11 is something we rarely had and a strong squad rarer still! man utd have had great sides and they are the sum of the parts, in a lot of these top games gerrard was often trying the unlikely i agree with that but the team was often being over run away from home especially. i don't think it was much of a surprise that when we got real quality throughout the side alonso/mascherano/torres the team in general got much stronger in the big games (as demonstarted by the results against them improving over 3 seasons) and gerrards assists and goals with torres were impressive. most of this play was linking up in the danger areas whilst alonso and mascherano did a lot of the holding work. perhaps controlling the game is the wrong terminology, having an effect in the game a better one. whatever you like to use, gerrard was awesome when the overall quality of the team improved. we have decent quality now but gerrard blatantly does not have the engine and is hence often a deep player these days with a good passing completion mostly and mostly short balls keeping things ticking over. gerrard was always most effective as an attacking midfielder having a direct impact where it mattered and unfortunately for liverpool he was often carrying a team that was short in quality. england lets face it have been poor as a team pretty much consistently but gerrard was never used as that main attacking link in games. either pushed left (whicch happened a lot for a while) or paired with lampard and both blatantly wanted to do the same things in games and often we got caught out. |
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Top, top players for me have to have won Fa, Prem and Champions League.
If they had won it all in the same season...then they are a top, top, top player |
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I slaughtered the guy for donkey's years until he scored that hat trick against us and celebrated by rocking the baby. I even allowed myself a little smile but keep that off the transfer thread please.
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Top, top players for me have to have won Fa, Prem and Champions League.
------ diego maradona crying tears of frustration at not making TBB's definitive list. paul gascoigne sobbing into his chicken nuggets. |
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lampard must try harder to get on the fergies list
200 goals as a midfielder just not good enough  |
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TheBetterBettor 24 Oct 13 17:26
Top, top players for me have to have won Fa, Prem and Champions League. Messi and Ibra currently struggling to make your list then. |
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Top top players win league titles.How many has Stevie 'errr' Gerrard won ?
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fck dont mention g best and world cups then eh
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I think when you judge a player you have to judge him on his individuality not what the team's he's played for
Paul scholes is reckoned by many to be a top top player and he's won plenty of team awards individually he's never won one that I'm aware of I don't know statistically out of the two who has scored the most prem goals per games played or the most domestic cup goals or the most European goals or the more international goals or who has the most caps or who has scored the most goals in major finals I know lanyard has some excellent stats but he's often described as not a top top player by many maybe someone has stats that can be compared |
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Lampard I meant
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By the very definition of a top top player I'm not sure any mentioned on this thread qualify - of today's generation of players probably Messi but the real greats come along at perhaps one every 5 to 10 years - not 5 a minute - of course supporters have there own favourites but seem to forget reality - there are some really good players but they cannot lace the boots of the true World greats from yesteryear
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Please enlighten the masses geordie1956 by naming those true greats you refer to, say in the last 50 years.
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Pele, Tostao, Cruyff, Muller, Beckenbauer, Maradona, B Charlton, Eusabio - there are more but they are some of the top top players I refer to - World Class and not merely very good Premiership players
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ronaldo is better than half those, for a start.
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