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Just announced they have won their appeal on the EBT tax case.
Still tax cheaters though thanks to Mr Whyte.
Still tax cheaters though thanks to Mr Whyte.
Show More
Are you on phuckin drugs 
It's HMRC who have won
Amusing ridicule on matter of side letters 'There was a conscious decision to conceal their existence, and that extended even to the Club’s auditors'
That in itself amounts to a very damning comment on just how rancid the whole outfit were
They died chasing The Lions
It's HMRC who have won Amusing ridicule on matter of side letters 'There was a conscious decision to conceal their existence, and that extended even to the Club’s auditors'
That in itself amounts to a very damning comment on just how rancid the whole outfit were
They died chasing The Lions
would whyte have paid the little bill(9m) if he knew that they would win the big case....and in turn save the club from all this turmoil ?
Former Rangers Football Club wins Big Tax Case appeal
The former Rangers Football Club was placed into administration in February
The former Rangers Football Club has won an appeal against a tax bill over its use of Employee Benefit Trusts.
The club, which is now in liquidation, used the scheme from 2001 to 2010 to make £47.65m in payments to players and staff in the form of tax-free loans.
HM Revenue and Customs had challenged the payments, arguing that they were illegal.
Rangers disputed the bill and a First Tier Tax Tribunal (FTT) has ruled the payments were loans that can be repaid.
In its ruling, which two judges endorsed, with one dissenting, the FTT concluded: "This was a lengthy appeal, heard over 29 days and set down over an extended period.
Continue reading the main story
Rangers crisis explained
Rangers went into administration owing up to £134m to unsecured creditors.
As a result its registrations with the Scottish FA and Scottish Premier League were terminated.
Charles Green led a consortium which bought Rangers' assets for £5.5m.
The former Sheffield United chief executive reformed Rangers as a new company.
The 'newco' did not get the required votes for re-admittance to the SPL and started life in Scottish Division Three.
"There was extensive reference to documentary productions and relevant case-law. At a late stage in its deliberations it became clear that the tribunal would be unable to issue a unanimous decision. It is conscious of and regrets the consequent delay.
"The majority view reflects the argument that the controversial monies received by the employees were not paid to them as their absolute entitlement.
"The legal effect of the trust/loan structure is sufficient to preclude this. Thus the payments are loans, not earnings, and so are recoverable from the employee or his estate.
"The dissenting opinion adopts the approach set down by the decision of the House of Lords in Ramsay in 1981.
"By giving regard to the intentions of the parties entering the arrangements, and in the absence of commercial reality for the loan structure, the monies received by the employees via the trust constitute earnings for income tax purposes.
"At the request of parties, the tribunal agreed to anonymise the published form of the decision."
Old Rangers was under the control of Sir David Murray when it began using EBTs.
He sold the club for £1 to Scottish businessman Craig Whyte in 2011, while the tax liability was in dispute.
The FTT, before a judge, concluded in February, the same month as the old Rangers, now under the control of Mr Whyte, was forced into administration by HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) over non-payment of tax totalling about £14m.
HMRC subsequently rejected proposals for a creditors agreement that would have allowed the old club to continue.
Administrators Duff and Phelps then negotiated a sale of assets to a consortium led by Charles Green for £5.5m.
He has since formed a new club, now playing in the Scottish Football League Third Division.
The former Rangers Football Club was placed into administration in February
The former Rangers Football Club has won an appeal against a tax bill over its use of Employee Benefit Trusts.
The club, which is now in liquidation, used the scheme from 2001 to 2010 to make £47.65m in payments to players and staff in the form of tax-free loans.
HM Revenue and Customs had challenged the payments, arguing that they were illegal.
Rangers disputed the bill and a First Tier Tax Tribunal (FTT) has ruled the payments were loans that can be repaid.
In its ruling, which two judges endorsed, with one dissenting, the FTT concluded: "This was a lengthy appeal, heard over 29 days and set down over an extended period.
Continue reading the main story
Rangers crisis explained
Rangers went into administration owing up to £134m to unsecured creditors.
As a result its registrations with the Scottish FA and Scottish Premier League were terminated.
Charles Green led a consortium which bought Rangers' assets for £5.5m.
The former Sheffield United chief executive reformed Rangers as a new company.
The 'newco' did not get the required votes for re-admittance to the SPL and started life in Scottish Division Three.
"There was extensive reference to documentary productions and relevant case-law. At a late stage in its deliberations it became clear that the tribunal would be unable to issue a unanimous decision. It is conscious of and regrets the consequent delay.
"The majority view reflects the argument that the controversial monies received by the employees were not paid to them as their absolute entitlement.
"The legal effect of the trust/loan structure is sufficient to preclude this. Thus the payments are loans, not earnings, and so are recoverable from the employee or his estate.
"The dissenting opinion adopts the approach set down by the decision of the House of Lords in Ramsay in 1981.
"By giving regard to the intentions of the parties entering the arrangements, and in the absence of commercial reality for the loan structure, the monies received by the employees via the trust constitute earnings for income tax purposes.
"At the request of parties, the tribunal agreed to anonymise the published form of the decision."
Old Rangers was under the control of Sir David Murray when it began using EBTs.
He sold the club for £1 to Scottish businessman Craig Whyte in 2011, while the tax liability was in dispute.
The FTT, before a judge, concluded in February, the same month as the old Rangers, now under the control of Mr Whyte, was forced into administration by HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) over non-payment of tax totalling about £14m.
HMRC subsequently rejected proposals for a creditors agreement that would have allowed the old club to continue.
Administrators Duff and Phelps then negotiated a sale of assets to a consortium led by Charles Green for £5.5m.
He has since formed a new club, now playing in the Scottish Football League Third Division.
Violencia Fantastico Retardo
would whyte have paid the little bill(9m) if he knew that they would win the big case....and in turn save the club from all this turmoil ?
----------------------------------------------
Exactly my point Violencia,Whyte obliterated them for no reason.
And Murray of course who was desperate to escape and flogged the club to Whyte for a quid.
would whyte have paid the little bill(9m) if he knew that they would win the big case....and in turn save the club from all this turmoil ?
----------------------------------------------
Exactly my point Violencia,Whyte obliterated them for no reason.
And Murray of course who was desperate to escape and flogged the club to Whyte for a quid.
HMRC knew they couldn't get money from the rotting carcass that is der hun, so they have got a verdict
allowing them to pursue individuals
allowing them to pursue individuals
Quite a colourful hearing.
Mr Yellow, Mr Blue, Mr Red, Mr Green, Mr Turquoise, Mr Violet, Mr Grey, Mr Black, Mrs Crimson, Mr Silver, Mr Gold, Mr Purple, Mr Indigo, Mr Magenta, Mr Scarlet.
Is it normal at these hearings to disguise witness names or are they afraid of some "social unrest" fae ra berrs.
Mr Yellow, Mr Blue, Mr Red, Mr Green, Mr Turquoise, Mr Violet, Mr Grey, Mr Black, Mrs Crimson, Mr Silver, Mr Gold, Mr Purple, Mr Indigo, Mr Magenta, Mr Scarlet.
Is it normal at these hearings to disguise witness names or are they afraid of some "social unrest" fae ra berrs.
Those names were only released after FPLG demanded to "know who these people were!" 
Lol, the only colour not mentioned was mr fkn White! 
The side letter issue will see the title stripping begin, that's the main issue, the deceased club wouldn't have been paying anything anyway.
The side letter issue will see the title stripping begin, that's the main issue, the deceased club wouldn't have been paying anything anyway.
EXCLUSIVE: Return of the King! He's got cash for a place on Rangers board
By STEPHEN MCGOWAN
PUBLISHED: 22:30, 16 November 2012 | UPDATED: 22:30, 16 November 2012
Comments (9)
Share
Dave King has revealed plans to plough fresh cash into Rangers — just months after seeing a previous investment of £20million go down the drain.
The former Ibrox director won a six-year court battle with the South African Revenue Service to have a freeze on his British assets revoked last week, leaving the Johannesburg-based businessman free to invest in the UK.
And, despite the continuing fight to clear his name on 322 charges of tax evasion in South Africa, Glasgow-born King has set his sights on a return to the Ibrox boardroom, insisting there are now no issues over his ‘fit and proper’ person status.
His lingering concerns over chief executive Charles Green’s profit-based business plan mean the 57-year-old will sit out the current £20m share issue. Impressed by Walter Smith’s recruitment to the Ibrox board, however, King says he is almost ready to talk, telling Sportsmail: ‘I am certainly inclined to invest in Rangers again. I lost £20m through Rangers but I can absolutely see a scenario where I would like to return to the Rangers boardroom one day soon.
‘Any substantial investment I made in the club would incorporate that caveat. If I was going to come in with substantial sums of money then I would expect to be on the board as well.
‘I still have some concerns about the business model adopted by Charles Green. But investing in Rangers is a situation I would like to look at again towards the end of this season.
‘Clearly Charles Green might have something to say about that. And the time is not now for me to come back because Charles has a business plan which I don’t quite agree with.
‘But I would regard myself as a potential investor going forward.
‘As Rangers progress through the leagues they will need another type of investor.
‘The reality is that once Rangers are back in the Premier League, fans will expect them to automatically start challenging for the title and start competing in Europe again — which is what we all want.
‘But that will require extra capital in a couple of years’ time. And it will be then that people like myself will come into the equation. Because I would be willing to put money into the club on a non-profit basis.’
King put £20m into Rangers during David Murray’s tenure and lost every penny when the oldco club was plunged towards financial oblivion by former owner Craig Whyte.
Concerns over Green’s profit motive prompted his brief dalliance with the Blue Knights takeover group in the summer, as former manager Smith was fronting another splinter group funded by businessman Jim McColl.
Impressed by Green’s ability to bring Smith on side, however, King’s stance towards the current regime has softened.
‘All credit to Charles for being able to do that,’ he said. ‘It’s a great thing because it says that Charles must be getting the club going in the right direction.’
King was also deterred from investing in Green’s Sevco consortium by a restraining order imposed by the Crown Office on behalf of SARS.
Before having the order lifted, however, King also had 37 counts of fraud and racketeering dropped in his adopted land and insists there are now no impediments to an Ibrox return.
‘I wrote to the SFA at the end of last year when I was looking to be involved in one of the consortiums, telling them of the allegations against me and asking if this might cloud their judgment in terms of my ability to be a fit and proper person at Rangers?
‘Their response was that because it was only allegations they would take representations from my legal team and if they could convince them I had a strong case then there would be no issue.
‘Now that has gone away. My assets have been freed and it’s just not an issue any more.’
........................................................................
Some gers fans dont want any of the old board near the club whilst others will take a different view.At The end of the day the wage structure is unlikely to match up to what it used to be which is for the best in my view.
By STEPHEN MCGOWAN
PUBLISHED: 22:30, 16 November 2012 | UPDATED: 22:30, 16 November 2012
Comments (9)
Share
Dave King has revealed plans to plough fresh cash into Rangers — just months after seeing a previous investment of £20million go down the drain.
The former Ibrox director won a six-year court battle with the South African Revenue Service to have a freeze on his British assets revoked last week, leaving the Johannesburg-based businessman free to invest in the UK.
And, despite the continuing fight to clear his name on 322 charges of tax evasion in South Africa, Glasgow-born King has set his sights on a return to the Ibrox boardroom, insisting there are now no issues over his ‘fit and proper’ person status.
His lingering concerns over chief executive Charles Green’s profit-based business plan mean the 57-year-old will sit out the current £20m share issue. Impressed by Walter Smith’s recruitment to the Ibrox board, however, King says he is almost ready to talk, telling Sportsmail: ‘I am certainly inclined to invest in Rangers again. I lost £20m through Rangers but I can absolutely see a scenario where I would like to return to the Rangers boardroom one day soon.
‘Any substantial investment I made in the club would incorporate that caveat. If I was going to come in with substantial sums of money then I would expect to be on the board as well.
‘I still have some concerns about the business model adopted by Charles Green. But investing in Rangers is a situation I would like to look at again towards the end of this season.
‘Clearly Charles Green might have something to say about that. And the time is not now for me to come back because Charles has a business plan which I don’t quite agree with.
‘But I would regard myself as a potential investor going forward.
‘As Rangers progress through the leagues they will need another type of investor.
‘The reality is that once Rangers are back in the Premier League, fans will expect them to automatically start challenging for the title and start competing in Europe again — which is what we all want.
‘But that will require extra capital in a couple of years’ time. And it will be then that people like myself will come into the equation. Because I would be willing to put money into the club on a non-profit basis.’
King put £20m into Rangers during David Murray’s tenure and lost every penny when the oldco club was plunged towards financial oblivion by former owner Craig Whyte.
Concerns over Green’s profit motive prompted his brief dalliance with the Blue Knights takeover group in the summer, as former manager Smith was fronting another splinter group funded by businessman Jim McColl.
Impressed by Green’s ability to bring Smith on side, however, King’s stance towards the current regime has softened.
‘All credit to Charles for being able to do that,’ he said. ‘It’s a great thing because it says that Charles must be getting the club going in the right direction.’
King was also deterred from investing in Green’s Sevco consortium by a restraining order imposed by the Crown Office on behalf of SARS.
Before having the order lifted, however, King also had 37 counts of fraud and racketeering dropped in his adopted land and insists there are now no impediments to an Ibrox return.
‘I wrote to the SFA at the end of last year when I was looking to be involved in one of the consortiums, telling them of the allegations against me and asking if this might cloud their judgment in terms of my ability to be a fit and proper person at Rangers?
‘Their response was that because it was only allegations they would take representations from my legal team and if they could convince them I had a strong case then there would be no issue.
‘Now that has gone away. My assets have been freed and it’s just not an issue any more.’
........................................................................
Some gers fans dont want any of the old board near the club whilst others will take a different view.At The end of the day the wage structure is unlikely to match up to what it used to be which is for the best in my view.
Your missing the point here thebrave, this is tax avoidance at it's worst. Of course the payments are wages and the individuals will never be asked to pay the 'loans' back. It's utterly disgraceful that this country is losing billions of pounds of tax and national insurance to this kind of thing.
This is actually a good result for HMRC, no?
Instead of finding against the dead club in liquidation, who wouldn't be paying anything, they now will be able to go after individuals yes?
Ex players, managers, etc. sounds about right.
Instead of finding against the dead club in liquidation, who wouldn't be paying anything, they now will be able to go after individuals yes?
Ex players, managers, etc. sounds about right.
No liamcol. The monies are treated as loans from on offshore trust, there is no liability on the recipients. If I lend you £100,000 there are no tax consequences. The whole point of this set up is so the employer avoids having to pay tax and national insurance, saving itself money.
But the loans will have to be repaid to old club and liquidator and HMRC are biggest creditor so they will get their money.
I don't know much about the case at all but it seems quite a good decision by HMRC.
Win and be faced with nothing.
Lose and go after individuals and get the money that way
I don't know much about the case at all but it seems quite a good decision by HMRC.
Win and be faced with nothing.
Lose and go after individuals and get the money that way
So why are all of you who live in the UK paying all your taxes?
Just tell your boss, put 20k forward for paye and NI and the rest put through a trust, jobs a good un.
Just tell your boss, put 20k forward for paye and NI and the rest put through a trust, jobs a good un.
Clear as mud! the big money investors will pour into Rangers in the not too distant future as if nothing has happened.Its the wee investors who lost out under the oldco I feel for, pure greed & mismanagement. They should get their collar felt.
The verdict includes the fact that some players were not legally paid, and ARE therefore liable for payment of tax 
I meant the wee creditors as well, couldnae pay the paper shop ffs!
great news for all Rangers fans ,no title stripping ,cheating accusations were wrong and the spl jumped the gun bigtime ,they wanted to strip titles before this case was even heard .
Taxman refused the cva due to the BTC and there should now be hell to pay .
Taxman refused the cva due to the BTC and there should now be hell to pay .
THE Board of The Rangers Football Club issued the following statement today.
Charles Green, chief executive commented: “I am sure that all Rangers fans will welcome that a judgment has been reached on this case at last.
“That said, the judgment will not affect the operations of the Club nor the proposed flotation of the business as a public company.
“This case is historic and was a matter for The Rangers Football Club plc ('oldco') which is in liquidation.
“The Rangers Football Club Ltd is a corporate entity formed following the acquisition in June this year, by a consortium led by me, of the business and assets of Rangers, including the Club and its honours.
“As HMRC stated in June when they decided to vote against the proposed oldco CVA, no tax liabilities relating to 'oldco' would transfer across to the new company. HMRC have recently reaffirmed this position to the Club's tax advisers, Deloitte.
“The Rangers Football Club Ltd is a company free of external debt.
“The judgment serves to further undermine the validity of the SPL Commission into the use of EBTs.
“As we have said all along the SPL decision to press ahead with a commission was ill-timed and fundamentally misconceived.”
Charles Green, chief executive commented: “I am sure that all Rangers fans will welcome that a judgment has been reached on this case at last.
“That said, the judgment will not affect the operations of the Club nor the proposed flotation of the business as a public company.
“This case is historic and was a matter for The Rangers Football Club plc ('oldco') which is in liquidation.
“The Rangers Football Club Ltd is a corporate entity formed following the acquisition in June this year, by a consortium led by me, of the business and assets of Rangers, including the Club and its honours.
“As HMRC stated in June when they decided to vote against the proposed oldco CVA, no tax liabilities relating to 'oldco' would transfer across to the new company. HMRC have recently reaffirmed this position to the Club's tax advisers, Deloitte.
“The Rangers Football Club Ltd is a company free of external debt.
“The judgment serves to further undermine the validity of the SPL Commission into the use of EBTs.
“As we have said all along the SPL decision to press ahead with a commission was ill-timed and fundamentally misconceived.”
A list of honours that Rangers has won as a club and records set by teams past and present.
European Cup Winners' Cup: Winners 1972; Runners-up 1961, 1967
UEFA Cup: Runners-up 2008
Scottish League Champions (54)-- WORLD RECORD
*1891, 1899, 1900, 1901, 1902, 1911, 1912, 1913, 1918, 1920, 1921, 1923, 1924, 1925, 1927, 1928, 1929, 1930, 1931, 1933, 1934, 1935, 1937, 1939, 1947, 1949, 1950, 1953, 1956, 1957, 1959, 1961, 1963, 1964, 1975, 1976, 1978, 1987, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1999, 2000, 2003, 2005, 2009, 2010, 2011
*In 1891 the championship was shared with Dumbarton
Scottish Cup Winners (33)
1894, 1897, 1898, 1903, 1928, 1930, 1932, 1934, 1935, 1936, 1948, 1949, 1950, 1953, 1960, 1962, 1963, 1964, 1966, 1973, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1981, 1992, 1993, 1996, 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003, 2008, 2009
Scottish League Cup Winners (27)
Season Starting: 1946, 1948, 1960, 1961, 1963, 1964, 1970, 1975, 1977, 1978, 1981, 1983, 1984, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1990, 1992, 1993, 1996, 1998, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2007, 2009, 2010.
Record Ibrox attendance:
118,730 v Celtic, Division One, January 2nd, 1939
European Cup Winners' Cup: Winners 1972; Runners-up 1961, 1967
UEFA Cup: Runners-up 2008
Scottish League Champions (54)-- WORLD RECORD
*1891, 1899, 1900, 1901, 1902, 1911, 1912, 1913, 1918, 1920, 1921, 1923, 1924, 1925, 1927, 1928, 1929, 1930, 1931, 1933, 1934, 1935, 1937, 1939, 1947, 1949, 1950, 1953, 1956, 1957, 1959, 1961, 1963, 1964, 1975, 1976, 1978, 1987, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1999, 2000, 2003, 2005, 2009, 2010, 2011
*In 1891 the championship was shared with Dumbarton
Scottish Cup Winners (33)
1894, 1897, 1898, 1903, 1928, 1930, 1932, 1934, 1935, 1936, 1948, 1949, 1950, 1953, 1960, 1962, 1963, 1964, 1966, 1973, 1976, 1978, 1979, 1981, 1992, 1993, 1996, 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003, 2008, 2009
Scottish League Cup Winners (27)
Season Starting: 1946, 1948, 1960, 1961, 1963, 1964, 1970, 1975, 1977, 1978, 1981, 1983, 1984, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1990, 1992, 1993, 1996, 1998, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2007, 2009, 2010.
Record Ibrox attendance:
118,730 v Celtic, Division One, January 2nd, 1939
Surely it is not only Rangers who took advantage of this loophole... The porn baron who sold them the idea can't have been the only person out there to think it up.
Somebody should go and piy the papers as a matter of principle.
If a criminal is up for 2 murders and is only found guilty for 1 murder,then he is still a murderer.
Just the same as Rangers are still tax evaders.
Just the same as Rangers are still tax evaders.
Sad thought is that there is a large section of Sellik fans would take a proper humping from Benfica tonight in exchange for a different verdict on the Tax case.
Obsessed.
Obsessed.
Never mind tax evaders,I hope those work evaders get soaked
and miserable in Lesburn
and miserable in Lesburn
Celtic playing more open tonight, not a good idea.
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mactheknife
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Former Rangers Football Club wins Big Tax Case appeal
The former Rangers Football Club was placed into administration in February
The former Rangers Football Club has won an appeal against a tax bill over its use of Employee Benefit Trusts.
The club, which is now in liquidation, used the scheme from 2001 to 2010 to make £47.65m in payments to players and staff in the form of tax-free loans.
HM Revenue and Customs had challenged the payments, arguing that they were illegal.
Rangers disputed the bill and a First Tier Tax Tribunal (FTT) has ruled the payments were loans that can be repaid.
In its ruling, which two judges endorsed, with one dissenting, the FTT concluded: "This was a lengthy appeal, heard over 29 days and set down over an extended period.
Continue reading the main story
Rangers crisis explained
Rangers went into administration owing up to £134m to unsecured creditors.
As a result its registrations with the Scottish FA and Scottish Premier League were terminated.
Charles Green led a consortium which bought Rangers' assets for £5.5m.
The former Sheffield United chief executive reformed Rangers as a new company.
The 'newco' did not get the required votes for re-admittance to the SPL and started life in Scottish Division Three.
"There was extensive reference to documentary productions and relevant case-law. At a late stage in its deliberations it became clear that the tribunal would be unable to issue a unanimous decision. It is conscious of and regrets the consequent delay.
"The majority view reflects the argument that the controversial monies received by the employees were not paid to them as their absolute entitlement.
"The legal effect of the trust/loan structure is sufficient to preclude this. Thus the payments are loans, not earnings, and so are recoverable from the employee or his estate.
"The dissenting opinion adopts the approach set down by the decision of the House of Lords in Ramsay in 1981.
"By giving regard to the intentions of the parties entering the arrangements, and in the absence of commercial reality for the loan structure, the monies received by the employees via the trust constitute earnings for income tax purposes.
"At the request of parties, the tribunal agreed to anonymise the published form of the decision."
Old Rangers was under the control of Sir David Murray when it began using EBTs.
He sold the club for £1 to Scottish businessman Craig Whyte in 2011, while the tax liability was in dispute.
The FTT, before a judge, concluded in February, the same month as the old Rangers, now under the control of Mr Whyte, was forced into administration by HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) over non-payment of tax totalling about £14m.
HMRC subsequently rejected proposals for a creditors agreement that would have allowed the old club to continue.
Administrators Duff and Phelps then negotiated a sale of assets to a consortium led by Charles Green for £5.5m.
He has since formed a new club, now playing in the Scottish Football League Third Division.
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mactheknife
Date Joined: 06 May 03
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When: 20 Nov 12 16:26
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Former Rangers Football Club wins Big Tax Case appeal
The former Rangers Football Club was placed into administration in February
The former Rangers Football Club has won an appeal against a tax bill over its use of Employee Benefit Trusts.
The club, which is now in liquidation, used the scheme from 2001 to 2010 to make £47.65m in payments to players and staff in the form of tax-free loans.
HM Revenue and Customs had challenged the payments, arguing that they were illegal.
Rangers disputed the bill and a First Tier Tax Tribunal (FTT) has ruled the payments were loans that can be repaid.
In its ruling, which two judges endorsed, with one dissenting, the FTT concluded: "This was a lengthy appeal, heard over 29 days and set down over an extended period.
Continue reading the main story
Rangers crisis explained
Rangers went into administration owing up to £134m to unsecured creditors.
As a result its registrations with the Scottish FA and Scottish Premier League were terminated.
Charles Green led a consortium which bought Rangers' assets for £5.5m.
The former Sheffield United chief executive reformed Rangers as a new company.
The 'newco' did not get the required votes for re-admittance to the SPL and started life in Scottish Division Three.
"There was extensive reference to documentary productions and relevant case-law. At a late stage in its deliberations it became clear that the tribunal would be unable to issue a unanimous decision. It is conscious of and regrets the consequent delay.
"The majority view reflects the argument that the controversial monies received by the employees were not paid to them as their absolute entitlement.
"The legal effect of the trust/loan structure is sufficient to preclude this. Thus the payments are loans, not earnings, and so are recoverable from the employee or his estate.
"The dissenting opinion adopts the approach set down by the decision of the House of Lords in Ramsay in 1981.
"By giving regard to the intentions of the parties entering the arrangements, and in the absence of commercial reality for the loan structure, the monies received by the employees via the trust constitute earnings for income tax purposes.
"At the request of parties, the tribunal agreed to anonymise the published form of the decision."
Old Rangers was under the control of Sir David Murray when it began using EBTs.
He sold the club for £1 to Scottish businessman Craig Whyte in 2011, while the tax liability was in dispute.
The FTT, before a judge, concluded in February, the same month as the old Rangers, now under the control of Mr Whyte, was forced into administration by HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) over non-payment of tax totalling about £14m.
HMRC subsequently rejected proposals for a creditors agreement that would have allowed the old club to continue.
Administrators Duff and Phelps then negotiated a sale of assets to a consortium led by Charles Green for £5.5m.
He has since formed a new club, now playing in the Scottish Football League Third Division.
Fully
You are wrong your team has not won any trophies,and has no honours,although that may be rectified at the end of this season,with their first trophy,possibly division 3 champions
By the way enjoy the party
You are wrong your team has not won any trophies,and has no honours,although that may be rectified at the end of this season,with their first trophy,possibly division 3 champions
By the way enjoy the party
Notsoshrewd you don,t get it do you?
All the trophies you and your pals demanded to be handed over 5 months ago
now remain where they belong.
Have a nice xmas
All the trophies you and your pals demanded to be handed over 5 months ago
now remain where they belong.
Have a nice xmas
Fully I've never demanded any trophies be handed over. Rangers have sold their trophies to a new club. I did demand that the history books be rectified should Rangers have been found to be cheating. I await the outcome of the investigation. You do realise though that the tribunal did find that with respect to some players the EBTs were illegal?
The hatred and jealousy shown to RFC by minnows within the SPL has been sickening. They obviously felt that this would be the only way to defeat us, but guess what the result was.......FAIL.
A tainted title does not disguise the real agenda here.
A tainted title does not disguise the real agenda here.
Your in with the minnows now.
Get over it and look inside the club for the cause not outside.
Get over it and look inside the club for the cause not outside.
Hardly minnows. Some of our opposition have brought more of an away support than some of the jokers in the SPL. And some of them even try to play a bit when they visit Ibrox.
Hope Mr Green sticks to his word and tells the SPL to poke it when they come begging. There is far more integrity, honesty, grace and appreciation where we are than where we were.
Hope Mr Green sticks to his word and tells the SPL to poke it when they come begging. There is far more integrity, honesty, grace and appreciation where we are than where we were.
Travelrug
There is far more integrity, honesty, grace and appreciation where we are than where we were.
==================================================================================================
I do not believe that sentence could come from a rangers supporter and expect to be taken seriously.
There is far more integrity, honesty, grace and appreciation where we are than where we were.
==================================================================================================
I do not believe that sentence could come from a rangers supporter and expect to be taken seriously.
Don't know why the Rangers fans are so happy.
You went up shiit creek for nothing
Sevco forever. And ever.
You went up shiit creek for nothing
Sevco forever. And ever.
This is my understanding of it, open to correction of course:-
The verdict finds that the 'loans' were not payments to players for services rendered (playing football) for TAX purposes only. The verdict found that there was no breach of tax law in making the payments and not deducting tax and National Insurance as it was not due (in most of the cases, it was admitted that the payments in some cases were taxable and this was not in dispute). These loan trusts were specifically outlawed in 2011 (once knowledge of their widespread use was discovered by HMRC) but were used as a means to get around paying tax prior to that and today's finding confirms that they did not breach the tax laws of that time (2001 - 2010) and that Rangers were not liable to pay tax and National Insurance on those 'loan' payments made to players.
That has nothing to do with SPL rules which, as I understand it, provide that all payments to players have to be declared at the time of registration of the player in order for that player's registration to be valid. The decision today does not decide that the second payments to Rangers players complied with SPL rules - that is a separate issue to be decided by the SPL at a future date.
If the SPL find that the payments were in breach of SPL rules then it follows that those players (up to 40% of Rangers players) were not registered in accordance with SPL Rules and were, thus, ineligible and those rules further provide that any team who fields an ineligible player is deemed to have lost any game in which he played 3-0. That is where the title stripping will stem from if the SPL so finds. It is almost a given that Rangers would be found to have lost the vast majority of their matches between 2001-2010 by a 3-0 scoreline and the SPL would be entitled to strip them of any points and titles won during that time.
BUT Celtic apparently operated the same EBT structure for Juninho Paulista in the 2004-5 season to avoid paying tax and used it to pay him an extra £765k. They subsequently decided against using it, came clean to HRMC and paid any tax due on those monies. But again, for the same reasons as above, that is irrelevant to SPL Rules. If Celtic did not declare those payments at the time of his registration, they too should be deemed to have lost any matches he played by a 3-0 scoreline. I have read online that if that was indeed the case with Juninho, then working back the 2004-5 season points total would mean that Aberdeen won that league with 64 points.
If the Juninho EBT did exist and if they didn't declare the payments to the SPL at the time of his registration, then would Celtic fans please shut up calling Rangers cheats etc etc. They are as bad as each other. In fact Rangers were, purely from a tax perspective, right to use them and Celtic were wrong to cease using and paying tax on them. If HMRC don't challenge today's verdict (and it would be pointless for them to do so as this verdict leaves it open for them to seek repayment of these 'loans' and recover some of the money they are owed - if they successfully appeal then they can only go after the former Rangers oldco which has zero assets), then it could surely be open to Celtic to rely on the verdict and seek repayment of the tax they paid on Juninho's loans?
Of course I could be way off here and am open to correction as I said. I am sure there are people on here more familiar with the issues than I am. There is still a hell of a lot up in the air and the matter is by no means concluded, could be appealed by HMRC and the SPL still have to decide on it.
BTW I am Irish and would have a natural leaning towards Celtic but I am not a fan as I find the childish and sectarian bickering that goes on between the two clubs and their fans quite tedious.
The verdict finds that the 'loans' were not payments to players for services rendered (playing football) for TAX purposes only. The verdict found that there was no breach of tax law in making the payments and not deducting tax and National Insurance as it was not due (in most of the cases, it was admitted that the payments in some cases were taxable and this was not in dispute). These loan trusts were specifically outlawed in 2011 (once knowledge of their widespread use was discovered by HMRC) but were used as a means to get around paying tax prior to that and today's finding confirms that they did not breach the tax laws of that time (2001 - 2010) and that Rangers were not liable to pay tax and National Insurance on those 'loan' payments made to players.
That has nothing to do with SPL rules which, as I understand it, provide that all payments to players have to be declared at the time of registration of the player in order for that player's registration to be valid. The decision today does not decide that the second payments to Rangers players complied with SPL rules - that is a separate issue to be decided by the SPL at a future date.
If the SPL find that the payments were in breach of SPL rules then it follows that those players (up to 40% of Rangers players) were not registered in accordance with SPL Rules and were, thus, ineligible and those rules further provide that any team who fields an ineligible player is deemed to have lost any game in which he played 3-0. That is where the title stripping will stem from if the SPL so finds. It is almost a given that Rangers would be found to have lost the vast majority of their matches between 2001-2010 by a 3-0 scoreline and the SPL would be entitled to strip them of any points and titles won during that time.
BUT Celtic apparently operated the same EBT structure for Juninho Paulista in the 2004-5 season to avoid paying tax and used it to pay him an extra £765k. They subsequently decided against using it, came clean to HRMC and paid any tax due on those monies. But again, for the same reasons as above, that is irrelevant to SPL Rules. If Celtic did not declare those payments at the time of his registration, they too should be deemed to have lost any matches he played by a 3-0 scoreline. I have read online that if that was indeed the case with Juninho, then working back the 2004-5 season points total would mean that Aberdeen won that league with 64 points.
If the Juninho EBT did exist and if they didn't declare the payments to the SPL at the time of his registration, then would Celtic fans please shut up calling Rangers cheats etc etc. They are as bad as each other. In fact Rangers were, purely from a tax perspective, right to use them and Celtic were wrong to cease using and paying tax on them. If HMRC don't challenge today's verdict (and it would be pointless for them to do so as this verdict leaves it open for them to seek repayment of these 'loans' and recover some of the money they are owed - if they successfully appeal then they can only go after the former Rangers oldco which has zero assets), then it could surely be open to Celtic to rely on the verdict and seek repayment of the tax they paid on Juninho's loans?
Of course I could be way off here and am open to correction as I said. I am sure there are people on here more familiar with the issues than I am. There is still a hell of a lot up in the air and the matter is by no means concluded, could be appealed by HMRC and the SPL still have to decide on it.
BTW I am Irish and would have a natural leaning towards Celtic but I am not a fan as I find the childish and sectarian bickering that goes on between the two clubs and their fans quite tedious.
Even if these vile tax dodging kvnts were innocent of breaking the law they're no better than the financial sector skvm who've plunged the world into crisis through their greed. As lurka said they may have broken SPL rules in any case and surely must have broken rules during their Craig Whyte title season.
I've read a bit more about the Juninho EBT and it was apparently paid at the end of his tenure at Celtic as a golden handshake payment, ie a payment for early termination of his contract which Celtic sought to pay in a tax efficient manner. If that is true then it would be completely different to the second side-letter contracts that Rangers used from day one with their players and the payment was not due at the date of his registration, meaning that Celtic did not breach SPL rules.
If that is the case then that entirely differentiates the Celtic EBT use from Rangers EBT use. Even if these EBT 'loan' payments were a legitimate means of avoiding tax, for me they were at least morally wrong as the payments could not be said to be for anything other than football services. Seeing as Celtic eventually came clean and paid tax that they felt it was right to pay, that is another reason not to tar them with the same brush as Rangers.
Apparently these EBT schemes have been used in England (Arsenal were rumoured to use them a lot) to pay players for 'image rights', something which is not a payment in return for football services per se, in order not to breach league rules. I suppose that may have been done in order to compete with foreign clubs on wages, where foreign clubs offer salaries net of tax and have lower tax to pay than in the UK.
If that is the case then that entirely differentiates the Celtic EBT use from Rangers EBT use. Even if these EBT 'loan' payments were a legitimate means of avoiding tax, for me they were at least morally wrong as the payments could not be said to be for anything other than football services. Seeing as Celtic eventually came clean and paid tax that they felt it was right to pay, that is another reason not to tar them with the same brush as Rangers.
Apparently these EBT schemes have been used in England (Arsenal were rumoured to use them a lot) to pay players for 'image rights', something which is not a payment in return for football services per se, in order not to breach league rules. I suppose that may have been done in order to compete with foreign clubs on wages, where foreign clubs offer salaries net of tax and have lower tax to pay than in the UK.
Travel rug why would any SPL team be jealous of Sevco?
The SPL clubs have been jealous of Rangers and their success for years. The fools thought this was their chance to bury the club and formed an ugly alliance to try to finish us off.
One thing that the mugs did not account for is the fact that the worlds most successful club has winning engrained in everything we do. Yesterday's victory proved that once again that good will overcome despite the lies, bile and hatred that was raked up principally by the no mark Liewell and followed by charlatans like Thomson and Petrie.
SPL, no thanks. You are welcome to your wee tainted charade.
One thing that the mugs did not account for is the fact that the worlds most successful club has winning engrained in everything we do. Yesterday's victory proved that once again that good will overcome despite the lies, bile and hatred that was raked up principally by the no mark Liewell and followed by charlatans like Thomson and Petrie.
SPL, no thanks. You are welcome to your wee tainted charade.
Why are Rangers in division 3 if they did nothing wrong ? Has the Hearts bill been paid yet before they go under ?
Nov 21, 2012 -- 1:37AM, lurka wrote:
This is my understanding of it, open to correction of course:-The verdict finds that the 'loans' were not payments to players for services rendered (playing football) for TAX purposes only. The verdict found that there was no breach of tax law in making the payments and not deducting tax and National Insurance as it was not due (in most of the cases, it was admitted that the payments in some cases were taxable and this was not in dispute). These loan trusts were specifically outlawed in 2011 (once knowledge of their widespread use was discovered by HMRC) but were used as a means to get around paying tax prior to that and today's finding confirms that they did not breach the tax laws of that time (2001 - 2010) and that Rangers were not liable to pay tax and National Insurance on those 'loan' payments made to players. That has nothing to do with SPL rules which, as I understand it, provide that all payments to players have to be declared at the time of registration of the player in order for that player's registration to be valid. The decision today does not decide that the second payments to Rangers players complied with SPL rules - that is a separate issue to be decided by the SPL at a future date.If the SPL find that the payments were in breach of SPL rules then it follows that those players (up to 40% of Rangers players) were not registered in accordance with SPL Rules and were, thus, ineligible and those rules further provide that any team who fields an ineligible player is deemed to have lost any game in which he played 3-0. That is where the title stripping will stem from if the SPL so finds. It is almost a given that Rangers would be found to have lost the vast majority of their matches between 2001-2010 by a 3-0 scoreline and the SPL would be entitled to strip them of any points and titles won during that time.BUT Celtic apparently operated the same EBT structure for Juninho Paulista in the 2004-5 season to avoid paying tax and used it to pay him an extra £765k. They subsequently decided against using it, came clean to HRMC and paid any tax due on those monies. But again, for the same reasons as above, that is irrelevant to SPL Rules. If Celtic did not declare those payments at the time of his registration, they too should be deemed to have lost any matches he played by a 3-0 scoreline. I have read online that if that was indeed the case with Juninho, then working back the 2004-5 season points total would mean that Aberdeen won that league with 64 points.If the Juninho EBT did exist and if they didn't declare the payments to the SPL at the time of his registration, then would Celtic fans please shut up calling Rangers cheats etc etc. They are as bad as each other. In fact Rangers were, purely from a tax perspective, right to use them and Celtic were wrong to cease using and paying tax on them. If HMRC don't challenge today's verdict (and it would be pointless for them to do so as this verdict leaves it open for them to seek repayment of these 'loans' and recover some of the money they are owed - if they successfully appeal then they can only go after the former Rangers oldco which has zero assets), then it could surely be open to Celtic to rely on the verdict and seek repayment of the tax they paid on Juninho's loans?Of course I could be way off here and am open to correction as I said. I am sure there are people on here more familiar with the issues than I am. There is still a hell of a lot up in the air and the matter is by no means concluded, could be appealed by HMRC and the SPL still have to decide on it.BTW I am Irish and would have a natural leaning towards Celtic but I am not a fan as I find the childish and sectarian bickering that goes on between the two clubs and their fans quite tedious.
one correction, you are not Irish.. you are west brit skoom
Travel rug Rangers died. Most fans would trade trophies for the fact that there cub is still in existence. Yes your new club may reach the big leagues in years to come and obtain all sorts of successes but until that day I think I can speak for all football fans and say no they are not jealous of either of your old club or your new club at this time.
what I don't understand is this . . .
if rangers are dead, why are so many celtic fans so obsessed with this little 3rd division team?
the night that celtic beat barcelona in the champions league there were celtic fans on here after the game wondering if sevco fans were raging or not.
they had just beaten the best team in the world in the biggest club competition in the world and all they could think about was what was going on with another club and it's fans.
you would think that fans would spend more time thinking about their own team and less thinking about any other team.
if rangers are dead, why are so many celtic fans so obsessed with this little 3rd division team?
the night that celtic beat barcelona in the champions league there were celtic fans on here after the game wondering if sevco fans were raging or not.
they had just beaten the best team in the world in the biggest club competition in the world and all they could think about was what was going on with another club and it's fans.
you would think that fans would spend more time thinking about their own team and less thinking about any other team.
Rangers are very much alive and kicking. Dignity well and truly intact.
The SPL clubs have shown a complete lack of class throughout this debacle. Guilty before any trial, your hatred and jealousy knows no bounds.
There must be a few people within HMRC, SFA, SPL preparing some arse covering statements at the moment. One thing I know is that Liewell will quite happily strangle his cohorts to save his own name. He has played a shrewd game throughout this but his day will come and I hope it is Mr Green that corners him and makes him suffer.
The SPL clubs have shown a complete lack of class throughout this debacle. Guilty before any trial, your hatred and jealousy knows no bounds.
There must be a few people within HMRC, SFA, SPL preparing some arse covering statements at the moment. One thing I know is that Liewell will quite happily strangle his cohorts to save his own name. He has played a shrewd game throughout this but his day will come and I hope it is Mr Green that corners him and makes him suffer.
Well said Travel old boy!!
Never mind notsoshrewd,he is obsessed with oldco, newco,sevco and dunn&co.
Never mind notsoshrewd,he is obsessed with oldco, newco,sevco and dunn&co.
Nov 21, 2012 -- 8:48PM, Outpost wrote:
what I don't understand is this . . . if rangers are dead, why are so many celtic fans so obsessed with this little 3rd division team? the night that celtic beat barcelona in the champions league there were celtic fans on here after the game wondering if sevco fans were raging or not. they had just beaten the best team in the world in the biggest club competition in the world and all they could think about was what was going on with another club and it's fans. you would think that fans would spend more time thinking about their own team and less thinking about any other team.
I think there was one person said that but nothing like a bit of a lie to crawl out of a hole eh
Dignity? Your team cheated the tax payer out of about £15-20 million. Do you know what dignity is? It wasn't a trial it was a tax tribunal. They concluded that Rangers bill from HMRC should have been substantially less but that they still owe tax in some cases of EBT use. Which clubs had found you guilty before trial?
You are trying to take the moral high ground by saying everybody got it wrong we aren't tax cheats to £100 million like you said only to £20 million. It's hard to decide if you are actually being serious with such comments.
You are trying to take the moral high ground by saying everybody got it wrong we aren't tax cheats to £100 million like you said only to £20 million. It's hard to decide if you are actually being serious with such comments.
Shrewdie, you seem to be fascinated with the workings and history of RFC. Why don't you get yourself a ticket for the Elgin City game next week, come on over it is a great place to be. Better be quick though, I hear it is selling out fast.
I'll pass thanks. I'm just a hardworking taxpayer who believes old fashioned values like honesty, integrity and dignity mean something. You enjoy your game little buddy.
Ach well, it could have been so good. We have so much in common as I happen to be a hard worker also. Alas I do not pay any income tax. I hope you understand that sometimes this can be perfectly legal, HMRC are quite happy with the arrangement and at the moment there does not seem to be any plans to stop it......lets just hope I do not get one of those special inspectors that have been involved in the recent witch hunt.
If you ever do fancy a seat among the good upstanding citizens of Glasgow, give me a holler and I will sort you out with one of the sought after seats.
If you ever do fancy a seat among the good upstanding citizens of Glasgow, give me a holler and I will sort you out with one of the sought after seats.
Yes I agree. Tax avoidance is perfectly legal, clever but very distasteful. In the case of Rangers though their are very clever but extremely distasteful tax avoidance scheme worked well for many years. Until it resulted in them going bust and ceasing to exist.
Would have bee great wee legal tax scheme but for the fact of liquidation.Bad karma. The lesson learned is don't be a tax dodging fanny and you won't die.
Would have bee great wee legal tax scheme but for the fact of liquidation.Bad karma. The lesson learned is don't be a tax dodging fanny and you won't die.
The now dead Rangers FC owed more than £5.5million is owed to “trade creditors” – including and a lady called Susan Thomson who runs a face-painting business. She is owed £40,the Scottish Ambulance Service £8438 and Mr Bhattia the newsagent is owed £534.14 (Ali's Monster Muncj bill?).
And those millions in taxes; how many soldiers,airmen,sailors, doctors and nurses would that have paid for? As was presciently said by Ian ARcher although years ago '"This has to be said about Rangers…as a Scottish Football club they are a permanent embarrassment and an occasional disgrace. This country would be a better place if Rangers did not exist".
They no longer exist although their new wee tribute band continue to wave the Ibrox flags of bigotry, apartheid and ignorance.
And those millions in taxes; how many soldiers,airmen,sailors, doctors and nurses would that have paid for? As was presciently said by Ian ARcher although years ago '"This has to be said about Rangers…as a Scottish Football club they are a permanent embarrassment and an occasional disgrace. This country would be a better place if Rangers did not exist".
They no longer exist although their new wee tribute band continue to wave the Ibrox flags of bigotry, apartheid and ignorance.
Hatters fan??
Surely not a luton fan preaching about irregularities and people being left owed money by a corrupt club using administration as a hiding place.
Surely not a luton fan preaching about irregularities and people being left owed money by a corrupt club using administration as a hiding place.
Tax avoidance, very distasteful. Are you telling me that if you had an opportunity to offset your tax liability you would refuse? Aye right. Here are some examples of distasteful behaviour....threatening referees and their families, vandalising graves of employees of rival clubs, booing/chanting during rememberance day minute silence. Does that ring any bells?
As for hatters (another one to add to the obsessed list), using Ian Archer as your reference for credible opinion is laughable. Next you will be quoting the disgraced BBC (who are proving to have lot more in common with one of those unfortunate SPL clubs than we all expected). I hate to spoil your wee dream, the famous Glasgow Rangers are very much alive. I could not care less for revenge on diddy SPL clubs, I honestly hope that you lot never darken our door again.
As for hatters (another one to add to the obsessed list), using Ian Archer as your reference for credible opinion is laughable. Next you will be quoting the disgraced BBC (who are proving to have lot more in common with one of those unfortunate SPL clubs than we all expected). I hate to spoil your wee dream, the famous Glasgow Rangers are very much alive. I could not care less for revenge on diddy SPL clubs, I honestly hope that you lot never darken our door again.
Doesn't ring any bells mate. I'm assuming given the standard diversion tactics of the usual old firm fan it has something to do with celtic though.
It is distasteful. You only have to look at the reaction to Amazons, Starbucks, Jimmy Carr's or Bradley Wiggins use of tax avoidance. You take the benefits and the negatives of it though. Perfectly legal but it gets them bad press etc. Rangers enjoyed the benefits of the tax avoidance but now are crying there eyes out and blaming everyone else now that the scheme has brought home the negatives i.e it was sufficiently dodgy and complex that HMRC got involved and even Murray, Whyte and those in positions of power at Rangers weren't confident that they would have won the tax case resulting in the club being flogged for a pound and no one wanting to put any money in.
Not that it made any difference as it wasn't the BTC that led to your liquidation.
It is distasteful. You only have to look at the reaction to Amazons, Starbucks, Jimmy Carr's or Bradley Wiggins use of tax avoidance. You take the benefits and the negatives of it though. Perfectly legal but it gets them bad press etc. Rangers enjoyed the benefits of the tax avoidance but now are crying there eyes out and blaming everyone else now that the scheme has brought home the negatives i.e it was sufficiently dodgy and complex that HMRC got involved and even Murray, Whyte and those in positions of power at Rangers weren't confident that they would have won the tax case resulting in the club being flogged for a pound and no one wanting to put any money in.
Not that it made any difference as it wasn't the BTC that led to your liquidation.
Celtic made a bigger donation to the neglected injured soldier fund than Rangers pay in total squad weekly wages put together.
You donated over 10K ? You will be buying shares in Rangers then i take it
Would not like to declare that kind of information. HMRC/CFC might be watching
Any Rangers F. C. shareholders care to explain why " The Herald " still quotes a share price for the Oldco . It is listed daily , under the PLUS category . The price is 12.5p , and it hasn't moved for ages . Is this just sloppy journalism , or do the shares remain active ?
how can you be the "worlds most successful club" if you don't exist?
Still a club who did not pay any taxes for over a year and conned small business's out of millions of pounds.
So how the fukc can they be upset?
So how the fukc can they be upset?
Don't you read the newspapers Shoulda? That's nothing to do with Rangers a bigger boy did it and ran away (Craig Whyte). Then Lloyds, HMRC, SPL, SFA and almost everybody else assisted in Rangers demise. They are the victims really. 
Rangers fans hit out at HMRC following Big Tax Case
23 Nov 2012 08:25
HUGH KEEVINS takes your calls as the fallout from the Rangers tax case rumbles on.
Fans raise a banner on the gates of Ibrox
THE Hotline really should come to you in a brown envelope with a window for the relevant address because it’s all about tax.
The depth of feeling surrounding the verdict which has cleared Rangers oldco of any wrongdoing concerning the use of EBTs hasn’t even begun to be fully established yet.
Anger is about to be unleashed and this must also be the first tax issue in history which divides public opinion based on which team you support.
That’s why some of the following must be taken with this column’s customary pinch of salt.
But Stuart McLeod, Glasgow, was genuinely upset when he said: “Hopefully the verdict in Rangers’ favour will put an end to the childish sniping from supporters of other clubs. It took two years to establish Rangers’ innocence and two minutes for the rest of Scottish football to decide we were guilty.
“The SPL also joined in this juggernaut of destruction and they should hang their heads in shame. Whatever happened to innocent until proved guilty?”
David Gardiner, Glasgow, e-mailed: “Given the fact that HMRC sent Rangers’ oldco to the wall, shouldn’t they now be liable for the shares and debentures that were lost by fans like myself?”
And Jim McBeth, Glasgow, said: “HMRC has an agenda against Rangers and that was what created the witch-hunt against the club.”
Bryce Wilson, Glasgow, e-mailed: “Will other clubs in Scotland now be pursued over their use of EBTs? If not, why not?
“I’m interested in this sporting integrity everyone talks about, or is this witch-hunt reserved for Rangers alone?”
David Runham, Southampton, said: “Can someone explain to me why HMRC are wasting millions of pounds of taxpayers money on an appeal against the verdict that favoured Rangers when, even if they were successful, they won’t get a penny back?”
Hugh McPhail, Duntocher, said: “The Scottish Plonkers League has more faces than the town hall clock. Will the clubs in it now admit they were being premature when they put the boot into Rangers?”
I believe this is called coming straight to the point.
Speaking of which, Ian Barr, Irvine, said: “Somebody must be held to account for the way in which Rangers have been made to suffer.
“We are the victims of jealousy and hatred and have been forced out of Europe and forced into losing our best players.”
And Rab Fleming, East Kilbride, said: “HMRC put Sir David Murray under stress and he sold the club to a man who created the circumstances which led to a transfer embargo being imposed on Rangers. We must have a strong claim for compensation from HMRC.”
Or Mister Whyte.
Stevie Hill, Tranent, wasn’t happy in the midst of victory. He said: “The verdict offers me hollow comfort because my club lost its original name, and where was the like of Michael Mols when Rangers could have used some of his money to avoid administration?”
Then William Gateley, Glasgow, said: “The Rangers haters have had an obsession with the tax case. Now they can get back to filling the empty seats in their own grounds.”
But Edward Easson e-mailed an equally sarcastic response to the outraged Rangers fans.
He said: “If you earn money in the UK do you pay tax? The answer to the question is in the affirmative if you’re one of the little people and a resounding ‘No’ if you sell coffee or play for Rangers.”
William McCord, Glasgow, saw that sarcasm and raised the pot.
He said; “Will the BBC devote as much air time to how HMRC got it wrong as they did to
hounding Rangers ?”
And Frank O’Donnell, Ralston, said: “Rangers were not found totally innocent in a two to one verdict. The taxman must appeal these findings.”
Ian Wylie, Paisley, said: “No miscarriage of justice has taken place. A degree of doubt was in the mind of the person who voted to find Rangers guilty of mis-using EBTs.”
Gerard Deacon, Kilsyth said: “If the EBTs were a loan, how many of those players and staff at Rangers paid them back? I wish I could get my bank to give me a loan like that.”
But anger remained the majority verdict.
Ian McLean, Aberdeen, said: “What’s happened to Rangers is a disgrace and there should be a full, public inquiry into the events that have left us where we are.”
And Jimmy Neil, Glasgow, put a price on his frustration when he said: “I believe the SPL should be sued for£50million for making Scotland the laughing stock of the football world.
“They shirked their responsibility and let the SFL decide Rangers’ fate.”
Gerard Connelly, Glasgow, e-mailed: “There were people who were hoping and praying Rangers would be found guilty of tax avoidance without bothering to wait for the verdict. This was the frenzied bloodlust of a piranha.”
Steady.
Lewis McDonald, Armadale, said: “The general attitude within Scottish football and sections of the media appears to be that Rangers deserve all they get.
“But which SPL chairman will be the first to apologise for hounding the club out of there and forcing them into the SFL?”
Let’s end on what was as close as we got to elements of humour.
Stevie Campbell, Glasgow, said: “In the immortal words of Mel Gibson, ‘They can take away our SPL status, but they’ll never take our titles.’”
And Alec Cameron, Erskine, said: “Now that Rangers have been found to be as pure as the driven snow, is there any chance that some day we can actually get back to talking about the fitba’?”
What an old fashioned guy you are, Alec.
23 Nov 2012 08:25
HUGH KEEVINS takes your calls as the fallout from the Rangers tax case rumbles on.
Fans raise a banner on the gates of Ibrox
THE Hotline really should come to you in a brown envelope with a window for the relevant address because it’s all about tax.
The depth of feeling surrounding the verdict which has cleared Rangers oldco of any wrongdoing concerning the use of EBTs hasn’t even begun to be fully established yet.
Anger is about to be unleashed and this must also be the first tax issue in history which divides public opinion based on which team you support.
That’s why some of the following must be taken with this column’s customary pinch of salt.
But Stuart McLeod, Glasgow, was genuinely upset when he said: “Hopefully the verdict in Rangers’ favour will put an end to the childish sniping from supporters of other clubs. It took two years to establish Rangers’ innocence and two minutes for the rest of Scottish football to decide we were guilty.
“The SPL also joined in this juggernaut of destruction and they should hang their heads in shame. Whatever happened to innocent until proved guilty?”
David Gardiner, Glasgow, e-mailed: “Given the fact that HMRC sent Rangers’ oldco to the wall, shouldn’t they now be liable for the shares and debentures that were lost by fans like myself?”
And Jim McBeth, Glasgow, said: “HMRC has an agenda against Rangers and that was what created the witch-hunt against the club.”
Bryce Wilson, Glasgow, e-mailed: “Will other clubs in Scotland now be pursued over their use of EBTs? If not, why not?
“I’m interested in this sporting integrity everyone talks about, or is this witch-hunt reserved for Rangers alone?”
David Runham, Southampton, said: “Can someone explain to me why HMRC are wasting millions of pounds of taxpayers money on an appeal against the verdict that favoured Rangers when, even if they were successful, they won’t get a penny back?”
Hugh McPhail, Duntocher, said: “The Scottish Plonkers League has more faces than the town hall clock. Will the clubs in it now admit they were being premature when they put the boot into Rangers?”
I believe this is called coming straight to the point.
Speaking of which, Ian Barr, Irvine, said: “Somebody must be held to account for the way in which Rangers have been made to suffer.
“We are the victims of jealousy and hatred and have been forced out of Europe and forced into losing our best players.”
And Rab Fleming, East Kilbride, said: “HMRC put Sir David Murray under stress and he sold the club to a man who created the circumstances which led to a transfer embargo being imposed on Rangers. We must have a strong claim for compensation from HMRC.”
Or Mister Whyte.
Stevie Hill, Tranent, wasn’t happy in the midst of victory. He said: “The verdict offers me hollow comfort because my club lost its original name, and where was the like of Michael Mols when Rangers could have used some of his money to avoid administration?”
Then William Gateley, Glasgow, said: “The Rangers haters have had an obsession with the tax case. Now they can get back to filling the empty seats in their own grounds.”
But Edward Easson e-mailed an equally sarcastic response to the outraged Rangers fans.
He said: “If you earn money in the UK do you pay tax? The answer to the question is in the affirmative if you’re one of the little people and a resounding ‘No’ if you sell coffee or play for Rangers.”
William McCord, Glasgow, saw that sarcasm and raised the pot.
He said; “Will the BBC devote as much air time to how HMRC got it wrong as they did to
hounding Rangers ?”
And Frank O’Donnell, Ralston, said: “Rangers were not found totally innocent in a two to one verdict. The taxman must appeal these findings.”
Ian Wylie, Paisley, said: “No miscarriage of justice has taken place. A degree of doubt was in the mind of the person who voted to find Rangers guilty of mis-using EBTs.”
Gerard Deacon, Kilsyth said: “If the EBTs were a loan, how many of those players and staff at Rangers paid them back? I wish I could get my bank to give me a loan like that.”
But anger remained the majority verdict.
Ian McLean, Aberdeen, said: “What’s happened to Rangers is a disgrace and there should be a full, public inquiry into the events that have left us where we are.”
And Jimmy Neil, Glasgow, put a price on his frustration when he said: “I believe the SPL should be sued for£50million for making Scotland the laughing stock of the football world.
“They shirked their responsibility and let the SFL decide Rangers’ fate.”
Gerard Connelly, Glasgow, e-mailed: “There were people who were hoping and praying Rangers would be found guilty of tax avoidance without bothering to wait for the verdict. This was the frenzied bloodlust of a piranha.”
Steady.
Lewis McDonald, Armadale, said: “The general attitude within Scottish football and sections of the media appears to be that Rangers deserve all they get.
“But which SPL chairman will be the first to apologise for hounding the club out of there and forcing them into the SFL?”
Let’s end on what was as close as we got to elements of humour.
Stevie Campbell, Glasgow, said: “In the immortal words of Mel Gibson, ‘They can take away our SPL status, but they’ll never take our titles.’”
And Alec Cameron, Erskine, said: “Now that Rangers have been found to be as pure as the driven snow, is there any chance that some day we can actually get back to talking about the fitba’?”
What an old fashioned guy you are, Alec.
Rangers tax shambles: Liquidators target Duff & Phelps, HMRC & Craig Whyte as they try to claw back millions
23 Nov 2012 07:23
LONDON-based auditors BDO say they are ready to assess “all options” in their efforts to hunt down the guilty parties in Rangers' demise.
Ibrox
RANGERS' liquidators last night confirmed they will be launching a full-scale probe into the Big Tax Case scandal in a bid to claw back tens of millions of pounds through the law courts.
London-based auditors BDO spoke to Record Sport last night just hours after former Ibrox director Paul Murray had called on them to track down any guilty party in the club’s demise and pursue them for damages.
Finance expert Murray claims the final sum, which would be handed back to the club’s creditors, could be around the £50million mark.
Murray also called for a wide-ranging inquiry into the circumstances that led to Rangers going under, stretching back to more than two years ago when Craig Whyte – the man who closed the oldco down – first surfaced as their would-be new owner.
Murray believes BDO have the power to forensically examine the role of all involved in the circumstances that brought the Ibrox club to its knees – including Lloyds Bank, administrators Duff and Phelps, Whyte and his lawyers, Collyer Bristow, HMRC and even the SPL and the SFA – and then seek damages from anyone they believe helped force the club under.
And now BDO say they are ready to assess “all options” in their efforts to hunt down the guilty parties.
Exposed: The lies and fantasy of Craig Whyte who drove Rangers out of business
In a statement that was drafted especially for Record Sport, Malcolm Cohen, the company’s business restructuring partner and Joint Interim Liquidator, said: “As Joint Interim Liquidators, our main objective is to maximise returns to creditors.
“By investigating the reasons for the company’s failure, we will better understand the avenues available to enable the recovery of all possible monies for the creditors.
“Only after we evaluate all the options available to us will the Joint Interim Liquidators be able to comment on what approaches we may pursue.
“This is a complex case with many potential areas for us to investigate.
“Throughout the liquidation, and once our appointment is ratified, we will be working closely with the Liquidation Committee and the appropriate bodies to assist us with our investigation.”
Ibrox
Murray, who tried for more than a year to save the club from the clutches of Whyte’s regime, said last night: “I am delighted to hear about BDO’s statement.
“As a former director of the club, I will make myself available to help facilitate this process.
“I believe it is absolutely vital that the conduct of everyone who was involved in this scandal is investigated thoroughly in order to determine why a 140 year-old Scottish institution was allowed to be destroyed in this manner.”
Cash clawed back would go into the oldco creditors’ pot and the majority of it would be taken by HMRC who were owed £15m in PAYE by Whyte.
FROM AROUND THE WEB:
23 Nov 2012 07:23
LONDON-based auditors BDO say they are ready to assess “all options” in their efforts to hunt down the guilty parties in Rangers' demise.
Ibrox
RANGERS' liquidators last night confirmed they will be launching a full-scale probe into the Big Tax Case scandal in a bid to claw back tens of millions of pounds through the law courts.
London-based auditors BDO spoke to Record Sport last night just hours after former Ibrox director Paul Murray had called on them to track down any guilty party in the club’s demise and pursue them for damages.
Finance expert Murray claims the final sum, which would be handed back to the club’s creditors, could be around the £50million mark.
Murray also called for a wide-ranging inquiry into the circumstances that led to Rangers going under, stretching back to more than two years ago when Craig Whyte – the man who closed the oldco down – first surfaced as their would-be new owner.
Murray believes BDO have the power to forensically examine the role of all involved in the circumstances that brought the Ibrox club to its knees – including Lloyds Bank, administrators Duff and Phelps, Whyte and his lawyers, Collyer Bristow, HMRC and even the SPL and the SFA – and then seek damages from anyone they believe helped force the club under.
And now BDO say they are ready to assess “all options” in their efforts to hunt down the guilty parties.
Exposed: The lies and fantasy of Craig Whyte who drove Rangers out of business
In a statement that was drafted especially for Record Sport, Malcolm Cohen, the company’s business restructuring partner and Joint Interim Liquidator, said: “As Joint Interim Liquidators, our main objective is to maximise returns to creditors.
“By investigating the reasons for the company’s failure, we will better understand the avenues available to enable the recovery of all possible monies for the creditors.
“Only after we evaluate all the options available to us will the Joint Interim Liquidators be able to comment on what approaches we may pursue.
“This is a complex case with many potential areas for us to investigate.
“Throughout the liquidation, and once our appointment is ratified, we will be working closely with the Liquidation Committee and the appropriate bodies to assist us with our investigation.”
Ibrox
Murray, who tried for more than a year to save the club from the clutches of Whyte’s regime, said last night: “I am delighted to hear about BDO’s statement.
“As a former director of the club, I will make myself available to help facilitate this process.
“I believe it is absolutely vital that the conduct of everyone who was involved in this scandal is investigated thoroughly in order to determine why a 140 year-old Scottish institution was allowed to be destroyed in this manner.”
Cash clawed back would go into the oldco creditors’ pot and the majority of it would be taken by HMRC who were owed £15m in PAYE by Whyte.
FROM AROUND THE WEB:
Lewis McDonald, Armadale, said: “The general attitude within Scottish football and sections of the media appears to be that Rangers deserve all they get.
“But which SPL chairman will be the first to apologise for hounding the club out of there and forcing them into the SFL?”
A lot of good stuff their but this one is definately my favourite. Has he been living in a cave for the last year and missed Rangers going in to administration and liquidation because they couldn't pay their debts?
“But which SPL chairman will be the first to apologise for hounding the club out of there and forcing them into the SFL?”
A lot of good stuff their but this one is definately my favourite. Has he been living in a cave for the last year and missed Rangers going in to administration and liquidation because they couldn't pay their debts?
Travelrug
Have you wiped the year and a half when Rangers refused to pay tax and all the small business's from your memory?
Can you explain why rangers are innocent?
If they had paid these debts they would'nt have gone into admiistration,then liquidation.
Or am i missing something?
Have you wiped the year and a half when Rangers refused to pay tax and all the small business's from your memory?
Can you explain why rangers are innocent?
If they had paid these debts they would'nt have gone into admiistration,then liquidation.
Or am i missing something?
The Rangers were brow beaten into the state they find themselves in now.
Hope none of your clubs have to go through what we as Gers fans have had to suffer over the last few years.
Hope none of your clubs have to go through what we as Gers fans have had to suffer over the last few years.
Thread title "the rangers - big tax case". Tribunal found in favour of Rangers Football Club therefore "innocent"
Unfortunate that the SPL clubs and the Scottish media could not see beyond their bigotry, hatred and jealousy to give the investigation a chance to run it's course. Tainted.
Unfortunate that the SPL clubs and the Scottish media could not see beyond their bigotry, hatred and jealousy to give the investigation a chance to run it's course. Tainted.
Mac, I hope they do. Then they will realise how despicable their behaviour has been.
Unlikely they would manage to survive.
Unlikely they would manage to survive.
You do realise that this result is the one HMRC wanted, don't you?
Elgin v Sevco game called off as too many tickets have been sold.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20456791
Very amateurish but you have put up with these things when you play in the diddy leagues.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20456791
Very amateurish but you have put up with these things when you play in the diddy leagues.
Only team in Scotland that seems to sell out their matches. Envious eyes from the SPL diddies again shrewdie?
"You do realise that this result is the one HMRC wanted, don't you?"
So why are HMRC considering an appeal?
So why are HMRC considering an appeal?
I think they were supposed to get 25 million back from oldco http://local.stv.tv/glasgow/101607-rangers-administrators-have-written-to-ticketus-to-terminate-25m-deal/
Meanwhile Craigie boy, the man who ripped them off, has mugs galore queuing up to make him and his Green front a fortune.
Meanwhile Craigie boy, the man who ripped them off, has mugs galore queuing up to make him and his Green front a fortune.
Still no reply to my post , regards the share price of Rangers F. C. quoted in "The Herald". It's in the listings again today , as always ,current price 12.5 pence . There's no footnote about them being suspended . Maybe it's all just bad journalism , and a media hoax . Can any shareholders explain the confusion ?
Craig Brown has admitted he will bid for 2 Tonga players in January tranfer window.
Serious question out of interest for the Rangers fans. Papers this morning and last couple of days with McCoist etc saying how the TC decision has completely vindicated Murray's involvement in Rangers demise and that his legacy is intact and that the entire downfall of Rangers was Whytes fault. What are Rangers fans views on Murray?
I can't understand all this fawning over Murray now given his involvement with the EBTs These EBTs were completely legal and were loans. Murray is Chairman and owner of Rangers. Under his direction Rangers borrowed about £20 million from HBOS with interest being payable. Rangers then set up a perfectly legal EBT scheme to give no interest non-repayable loans to it's employees all the while still having borrowed money from HBOS which they are paying interest on. Rangers then pump money in to the Trust. Murray then applies for 0% non repayable loans to the amount totalling in the end about £6 million. Murray receives this money. Murray is under no obligation to return this money. A couple of years later Rangers liquidate for being unable to pay their debts. Thats my understanding anyway of what happened.
This all seems perfectly legal but it's quite clearly a case of syphoning off money out the club for himself. If Aberdeen, Hearts or Celtic or any other team went bust and it turned out Romanov, Milne or Lawell had done the above or syphoned off ownership of stadium etc. I'd imagine they would be getting pelters and the fans would be furious.
Whyte seem to be getting all the criticism from the media when on the basis of the above Murray looks just as crooked as him. Is it just because Murray is mates with all these guys and Whyte isn't?
I can't understand all this fawning over Murray now given his involvement with the EBTs These EBTs were completely legal and were loans. Murray is Chairman and owner of Rangers. Under his direction Rangers borrowed about £20 million from HBOS with interest being payable. Rangers then set up a perfectly legal EBT scheme to give no interest non-repayable loans to it's employees all the while still having borrowed money from HBOS which they are paying interest on. Rangers then pump money in to the Trust. Murray then applies for 0% non repayable loans to the amount totalling in the end about £6 million. Murray receives this money. Murray is under no obligation to return this money. A couple of years later Rangers liquidate for being unable to pay their debts. Thats my understanding anyway of what happened.
This all seems perfectly legal but it's quite clearly a case of syphoning off money out the club for himself. If Aberdeen, Hearts or Celtic or any other team went bust and it turned out Romanov, Milne or Lawell had done the above or syphoned off ownership of stadium etc. I'd imagine they would be getting pelters and the fans would be furious.
Whyte seem to be getting all the criticism from the media when on the basis of the above Murray looks just as crooked as him. Is it just because Murray is mates with all these guys and Whyte isn't?
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