the complete looney that is henry winter. re arsenal

Best football journalist (usually!) my a country mile.

^ by

he's been defending Wenker for years now, about time he wised up

Football is now about not winning trophies so that you may qualify for other tournaments that you also won't win.

Winter also claimed that Fellaini would walk into any team in the league and Baines is the second best left back in the world.

biggest game of the season so far and they spend less than 30 seconds talking about it

They lost their cup final against Birmingham .

what they should do ,is wait for arsenal to miss out on ch lg football then ask the question ,its easy to demand trophies when you have had the security of ch lg in your back pocket,
to quote the line of jack nicholson in a few good men, i,d rather you just thanked me for what i,m giving you

@ 1st time poster...

i totally agree with that assessment...

and in may, this may well just be the time we can ask them

Except Henry Winter's right - certainly in theory. It shows you what a plastic sport football has become when it's no longer about winning trophies.

He is correct, ask any club what they would prefer - the FA Cup or CL football and they will all choose CL football.

It is not all about the money either, the cups have become an afterthought and there is more glory now from just being part of the CL than winning a domestic cup.

ive said for years that winning the fa cup should be rewarded with a champions league spot...

after all, what glory is there in finishing 4th

Neither clubs or Uefa would want the cup winners getting in the CL, so it wont happen.

i agree jamdav...

wrong though isnt it...

teams who win things should be rewarded

you,ve obviously got your brain full of yorkshire puds imagine some of the scenario,s if the fa cup winners got the ch lg spot,
1 you could get 6 home games against non prem lg sides
2 you could play a final or semi final against a side in a ch lg semi or final resting players
3,if you wernt in the top 3 in the lg, and in the fa cup semi you could play a reserve side in the last few lg games effecting relagation and title challengers

in other words whats happened to the fa cup in reverse,that,ll be 2 competitions ruined

The only way the FA Cup can be seen as a big trophy to win is if the FA give huge prize money for winning it.

Thats what it is all about these days.

Same with the Europa League, teams would take it a lot more seriously if the money was better.

Prizemoney is not important ,doubt the players even know what it is

The FA Cup has been diminished greatly by the FA 's own changes to it in the last 20+ years, but still Arsenal fans will have fonder memories of winning it in 2005 than of qualifying for the CL in later seasons,or going out of the Last 16 this year

Did Van Persie and Fabregas leave Arsenal because they were afraid they wouldn't get to play in the Champion's League? They cited not winning any trophies at all.

easy soloution to op - charge 10k for a cup final ticket and arsenal can re coup champions league money,and fans who want a cup can pay for it.

The only way the Europa League can get interesting is if they make it straight knock out the group games are just killing it.

tobermory - the prize money would be important to clubs.

Of course players  and fans will remember an FA Cup win more than qualifying for the CL, but that doesnt change the fact that all the top clubs will have CL qualification over the FA Cup.

how can you target winning the fa cup its madness you might get
utd away
city away
spuds away
chelski away
l,pool in semi,s
everton in final

if you remain undefeated against that lot you might as well concentrate on the lg because you,d pish the lg anyway

The Prizemoney even in the premier league is negligible for finishing higher .United won it in 2011 and only got £6M more than West Brom did for finishing 10th .Probably make more money from a pre season tour in the far east.


So i can't see them handing out the sort of sums that make a big difference for The FA Cup.

We are talking about the top clubs and the prize money for the CL and not league places.

tobermory - you mention the likes of Van Persie and Fabregas moving on to win trophies, well they were not moving on with the domestic cups in mind.

If they had won a couple of FA Cups yet were playing for a club not qualifying for the CL they would have moved on much sooner.

arsenal have done well selling players for millions in profits whoomed they groomed in the cup competitions

the vast majority of regular match going fans would prefer a trophy any day of the week

7 years trophyless years in a row in the CL or say 3 seasons in the CL and 2 trophies ? the latter is a no brainer surely

wait till wenger doesnt deliver ch lg and see if you think the same ,your speaking from a position where secretly you think he can deliver both,that means you think 88 other teams would rather win a trophy than play ch lg,absolutly clueless position

Sometimes you can finish fourth and still end up playing in the Europa League

but are winching about missing out on the ch lg or not winning the fa or carling cup,

I don't think they have to be mutually exclusive for those teams such as Arsenal, especially the FA Cup as that competition is given it's own space on Saturday's within the fixture list so it's not like the Carling Cup where you have to play Tue/Wed/Sat.

It's such a squad game these days anyway, crikey, you even have to name your squad of 25 before the season starts so the skill is to keep everyone fit and win every game no matter what the competition. Don't get me wrong, teams will still prioritise but the FA Cup is THE one where Arsenal could still put out their best eleven and not worry so much about keeping people fresh.

Obviously clubs would like CL football and trophies, but none of the top clubs would take an FA Cup ahead of CL qualification.

ffs its a no brainer you have more championship clubs playing weakened sides in the cups than prem lg sides to protect their lg interests

The same Henry winter who wrote this gem -

Arsenal vs Tottenham: Robin van Persie the only Gunner in Henry Winter's combined XI
Robin van Persie is the only Arsenal player who would get into an all-star North London XI on this season's form – which says it all about their contrasting fortunes.

Without the goals of the outstanding Van Persie, a contender for Footballer of the Year, Arsenal would be staring even further into the abyss. Unlike Arsène Wenger, Harry Redknapp recruited superbly at Tottenham Hotspur last summer with Brad Friedel, Scott Parker and Emmanuel Adebayor (on loan) slotting in immediately.
Luka Modric has not betrayed any disappointment about his move to Chelsea not happening, Gareth Bale has developed his game further, also threatening through the middle, while Spurs' fullbacks are two of the best in the country, certainly attacking-wise.
Benoît Assou-Ekotto has also proved more secure defensively. Redknapp's centre-backs have both been exceptional. Van der Vaart has shown his ability to play wide and come in or excel when in the hole off Adebayor.
North London XI (4-4-2): Friedel; Walker, King, Kaboul, Assou-Ekotto; Van der Vaart, Parker, Modric, Bale; Van Persie, Adebayor.
Premier League form, 2011-2012

so you have championship sides prefering a top 6 championship finish to a cup run ,and mug arsenal fans saying they,d rather win cups that these sides are playing reserves in than qualifying for the champions lg,i,d love arsen would give them what they want euefa cup football and the capital cup, can just see 60, 000 turning up on a thursday night to watch glentoran

mind posting the article

Alex McLeish and Kenny Dalglish might agree with the sentiments in the article but winning a trophy recently hasn't kept them in EPL employment.

Try asking the fans that don't support one of last seasons top 4 if they would rather win the FA Cup or finish 4th. 99.9% my arse. The Champions League is a cash cow that is making the divide between the big boys and the rest ever wider.

Apologies to the OP if that original statement was only aimed at Arsenal fans.

99.9% of Newcastle, Everton, Villa fans would take a trophy over fourth place surely? (unless they are shareholders)

given a choice we'ed take what comes, wtf is a trophy ???

yes only because 4th place is practically worthless unless you do it year after year and we at everton dont have the infrastructure to do it - so a trophy would be better - the £15m one off would be nice but we get that every other year by selling a player anyway

However Arsenal do have the squad and infrastructure to continually qualify for the champs league which is preferable to winning a cup

Teams like Everton and Newcastle probably would take a trophy ahead of a CL spot as being in the champions league would be over achieving and most likely a one off.

The top teams need it regularly for their finances and to attract the top players.

Teams fighting relegation and fighting for CL spots regularly will always have the FA Cup as an afterthought as their is little financialo gain to it,

id give up any hope of a domestic cup trophy if offered 10 years champions league

big problem for the likes of Newcastle, Spurs and Liverpool is that if they just miss out on fourth they end up in the Europa League which mucks up their league campaign with all those lovely Thurs-Sun games.

Oct 29, 2012 -- 10:13PM, Marxist-Leninist wrote:

big problem for the likes of Newcastle, Spurs and Liverpool is that if they just miss out on fourth they end up in the Europa League which mucks up their league campaign with all those lovely Thurs-Sun games.

Plus they're not good enough (bah Spurs).

Take your points 28 Oct 12 10:55 Joined: 29 Nov 07 | Topic/replies: 18 | Blogger: Take your points's blog
Winter also claimed that Fellaini would walk into any team in the league and Baines is the second best left back in the world.

Imo, Fellaini would go very close to doing so, he is not only a big lumbering target but a fine footballer who is only getting better and better.  Everton may very soon be on the end of a big bid's from across Europe...

Fellaini is a decent player but wouldnt 'walk into any top side in europe' ffs.

Arsenal, of course, need champions league football. otherwise they would lose all their best players and not be able to attract the highest quality players!

As would any of the top four not getting CL football, no matter how many FA Cups they win.

sarcasm

henry winter eh?

the geezer who had to swim the tyne the other week because his prediction re the toon was so far out.

Arsenal have had many top class players in the last few years and have some today.

Sarcasm was a bit pointless there really.

JamDav1982 29 Oct 12 21:46 Joined: 03 Jul 04 | Topic/replies: 4,909 | Blogger: JamDav1982's blog
Fellaini is a decent player but wouldnt 'walk into any top side in europe' ffs.

Before mouthing of for once Jam, read the post I was responding to you knob, any team in the league...ie England

Journos, fans etc always moaning about money getting wasted in football, wages too high blah blah blah
then next minute hammer arsenal for not wasting money on silly wages and transfer fees

Sorry miss read that Winner Winner - as it is up there with your usual sh1te I never thought to read again.

Irony clearly lost on you

Yes