Carrick

2nd only to RVP as Man Utds best player this season.

Is Dawsy laughing at the original post or his own player comparisons?

ps. Carrick has always been a good player, but not so great if he gets pressed hard. Teams should do that to him a lot more, he struggles when put under pressure imo.

He's a pure passer DZA...only as good as his options. He plays alot of passes standing so as you aware he hasnt really got the mobility to get away from as many tight spots as say an iniesta, especially from a static position.

I maintain he'd look an absolute world beater in that Barcelona side. Every player has two or three options absolutely every time.

I don't think  he's allergic to pressing seen him play well in plenty of games where teams are pressing but where he looks worse is when the team as a whole are not performing and he does not have options.

He could play the Busquets role for Barca, he certainly couldn't out-perform Xavi. He is not in his realm.

Mind you, Busquets is quite an under-rated player by many people. I don't think Barca would be any hurry to trade him for Carrick, but there isn't much in it either way.

He'd coast it behind Xavi and Iniesta with Messi floating and Alves bombing on...absolutely coast it. Might even get a sniff of the national team too as one of the few englishmen who recognise the value of passing to someone in the same shirt.

I don't think Spain or Barca would miss a beat if they swapped Busquets with him. Dawsy comparing him to Xavi though is just...

IMO Busquets and Carrick are quite similar in their passing, both very good at playing first time passes off of either foot. Busquets probably doesn't have as good a range of passing as Carrick, but he does have the Barca education, which puts him infront in terms of fitting into their team.

The guy is tripe but to be fair he has played well recently, why?

Because Cleverely does everything he doesn't and more

Xavi recently said that Busquets is the best 1 touch player he has ever seen.

RIDICULOUS COMMENTS. ABSOLUTE BANDWAGON GARBAGE. ABSOLUTE CRAP!

Ahoy 1982 14 Jan 13 02:49
Xavi recently said that Busquets is the best 1 touch player he has ever seen.

But Xavi has never seen me play, which makes his opinion as much use as Anne Frank's drumkit.

Sir Alex keeps playing this useless player. I don't get it. No wonder we are only 7 points ahead at the top of the League. Sir Alex needs to win more than 66% of the hardest league in the world, damn him, he's rubbish, we need Wenger and Coquelin to fill the Sir Alex and Carrick void. FFS.

Decent enough player and good enough to keep United going in the league but against the very top players he struggles. Witness the 2009 and 2011 CL finals as proof of this. Comparisons with any Barca player are a joke, he's far too slow and immobile to play their fast paced high pressing game. He was subbed off breathing out of his arse in the 2011 final because he couldn't keep up with them.

And yes Fergie does keep picking him. But he also picked Phil Neville and John O'Shea well over 200 times and they both won numerous trophies.

Most people could easily name a dozen better midfielders than him.

If he steps up in the CL ties against Real then i may have to re-consider this opinion but until then no chance.

Had the Hobbit and the worst Brazilian since Stevie Wonder had a go at his wife's muff in his back pocket yesterday

Decent enough player and good enough to keep United going in the league but against the very top players he struggles. Witness the 2009 and 2011 CL finals as proof of this.

Nonsense...of the highest degree. He suffered as a result of team as a whole being totally outclassed. If you swopped Busquets and Carrick on the day do you seriously think Busquets would look anything other than totally swamped and Carrick would look anything but in total control?

Your copying and pasting appears to have finished a bit early. Did you not read the next 2 sentences?

Scapegoat for overall failure of the team. Like I said if you move him over to the Barcelona side for the game and Sergio over to the utd team only the demented think the outcome and flow of the game would be altered.

Busquets is vastly under rated by those who don't see and appreciate the work he does.

Obviously the plaudits go to Messi, Xavi and Iniesta but all three would admit that Busquets is the engine of the team.

2 of Barca's worst performances this season were home and away to Celtic. Who missed both games? Busquets.

Also let's not forget Barca were willing to let Yaya Toure (who is miles better than Carrick) leave because they had Busquets.

It's laughable for anyone to think Carrick could cope with the style of football they play. He's not quick enough for a start.

I'm not attacking Busquets as such but you are overstating matters.

If Carrick had Xavi and inestia infront of him and Messi dropping off with Alaves bombing up the flank you'd be amazed how accomplished he'd look.

We are not going to agree on this so lets agree to disagree.

Carrick is having a good season but Busquets is in a completely different league to him!

True we'll probably never agree on this but if Toure was allowed to leave because of his emergence and Mascherano has had to re-invent himself as a centre back to get in the side then i fail to see how Carrick can be compared to him.

Why has he played so rarely for England if he's that good? A succession of managers overlooked him. 26 caps in 12 years and only 12 caps since 2008 in what have probably been his 'peak' years.

R0y this may be your worst ever shout.

Carrick as good as Busquets!!!

Busquets would walk into any starting line up in the world and any manager would pay 40m for him in an instant.

He is light years ahead of Carrick as a player ffs.

Biscuit1979
14 Jan 13 13:41
Joined:
16 Nov 10
| Topic/replies: 35,221 | Blogger: Biscuit1979's blog
True we'll probably never agree on this but if Toure was allowed to leave because of his emergence and Mascherano has had to re-invent himself as a centre back to get in the side then i fail to see how Carrick can be compared to him.

Why has he played so rarely for England if he's that good? A succession of managers overlooked him. 26 caps in 12 years and only 12 caps since 2008 in what have probably been his 'peak' years.


Firstly you need to recognise that Carrick plays a much more similar role to Busquets than either Toure or Mascherano would for Barcelona. So in that context he'd be a better player than either of the those two for the balance of the Barcelona team.

Secondly England do not value this type of player. We've seen it countless times over the years. He'd probably have more caps if he were spanish despite not being a starter!

I don't get it myself, he should have been given a run in the england team for sure..instead we prefer the likes of scott parker and gareth barry.

I'd guess that Carrick is more successful at club level because, as a result of the foreign influence there is a little more around him in terms of european style of play. His passes are going to be better appreciated and used by such sides.

I don't really know though because he's never been given a proper go. He came in against was it columbia and put in a man of the match performance and got dropped next game one world cup I remember. We've never been interested in picking the best side, just the 'best' players.

Barcelona's tactics rely on a player like Busquets being as comfortable on the ball in tight areas as Busquets is. While he has the defensive mind to close off the opposition when he needs to.

Carrick has none of that.

He is a good passer of the ball when given time but there is nothing else about him that suggests he is anywhere near the standard good enough to play for Barcelona.

Come back when Carrick starts pulling out these moves in a game -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrXp5HpeNsg

Comparing Barcelona and anyone just seems ridiculous. Carrick is a great player, and is one of Fergies main men. We're talking about the best team in England, and the best manager in the world.

Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta are light years ahead of Carrick. Barcelona and La Liga are ahead of United and the EPL by a distance.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 1:15PM, Biscuit1979 wrote:

Busquets is vastly under rated by those who don't see and appreciate the work he does.Obviously the plaudits go to Messi, Xavi and Iniesta but all three would admit that Busquets is the engine of the team.2 of Barca's worst performances this season were home and away to Celtic. Who missed both games? Busquets.Also let's not forget Barca were willing to let Yaya Toure (who is miles better than Carrick) leave because they had Busquets. It's laughable for anyone to think Carrick could cope with the style of football they play. He's not quick enough for a start.

^ This is what I was trying to say.

I always thought that Dawsy was the most delusional glory hunting Rag on here but it seems Roy is up there with him

R0y standard argument when he comes up with these absurd opinions is that we are all thick and dont understand.

Expect that from him soon.

The only thing I miss about forumite Jason Dodd is that he used to trounce and embarass ROy every day on here

JamDav1982
14 Jan 13 14:02
Joined:
03 Jul 04
| Topic/replies: 5,384 | Blogger: JamDav1982's blog
Barcelona's tactics rely on a player like Busquets being as comfortable on the ball in tight areas as Busquets is. While he has the defensive mind to close off the opposition when he needs to.

Carrick has none of that

Proof that you remain one of the most clueless around.

R0y you think Carrick is as good as Busquets.

I would pipe down as you have already been made to look like a fool.

Carrick does not have anywhere near Busquets ability on the ball and is nowhere near as good as him defensively.

Keep contributing to these threads and making yourself an even bigger imbecile.

Carrick is a very good player defensively, imo. I base that on watching him play for Spurs.

Busquets is a very good player, but I don't think there is a huge gulf between him and Carrick.

I also think Yaya Toure is a much better player than either of them.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 9:27PM, the dza wrote:

Carrick is a very good player defensively, imo. I base that on watching him play for Spurs.Busquets is a very good player, but I don't think there is a huge gulf between him and Carrick.I also think Yaya Toure is a much better player than either of them.

Busquets is a better player than Toure quite easily in the DM role.

If you want to compare them as box players then Toure would be better but that is not Busquets position.

As for Carrick, he would not be in the top twenty DM's in the world right now and Busquets will go down as one of the best ever in that position.

I also think Yaya Toure is a much better player than either of them.

Not in that position for that team.

He would be a better DM than Carrick.

I don't think there is anything Carrick can do better than Yaya Toure, not one single aspect of his game imo.

That goes for Busquets as well. They sold him coz Busquets is a good replacement, he plays the role very well and they could make £30m quid and not really be any weaker for it. But Toure is a superior player in every respect.

You (Jamdav) won't agree, but there we go.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 10:43PM, the dza wrote:

I don't think there is anything Carrick can do better than Yaya Toure, not one single aspect of his game imo.That goes for Busquets as well. They sold him coz Busquets is a good replacement, he plays the role very well and they could make £30m quid and not really be any weaker for it. But Toure is a superior player in every respect.You (Jamdav) won't agree, but there we go.

Thats not the case and Busquets had replaced him in the team before he left and justifiably so.

Busquets is clearly a better DM than Toure.

Anyone watching how the two performed for Barcelona could tell you that.

Personally I'd say Carrick has a better range of passing from deep as well as a greater sense of where to sniff out danger.

Yaya may be more physically capable to compensate for the lack of anticipation but I don't think he would ever have the desire to perform the role.

I don't think utd would be improved by having toure in place of carrick and no other changes at all.

Do you also think he's better than alonso in that position out of interest? I assume so.

Barca were struggling with debt, they got to cash in, Pep seen a player similar to himself in Biscuits and he wanted him in the team

Barca have never sold a player as they are struggling with debt.

£27m for Toure when he was the second choice DM was too good to turn down.

R0y Carrick has a better range of passing than Busquets and Toure but that is it, he is vastly inferior in other areas and would not be anywhere near good enough to play Barcelona's passing game.

You come off as a bit patronising JamDav.

I watched them both play for Barca, I'm sure many of us here enjoy watching Barca games and watch them regularly. I know I do. And I don't see anything that Busquets does in a superior fashion to Yaya Toure when he played behind Xavi and Iniesta.

I have a sneaky feeling that they won a few trophies with Yaya in that position.

the dza
14 Jan 13 22:56
Joined:
06 Apr 05
| Topic/replies: 6,866 | Blogger: the dza's blog
You come off as a bit patronising JamDav.


understatement!

Jan 14, 2013 -- 10:56PM, the dza wrote:

You come off as a bit patronising JamDav.I watched them both play for Barca, I'm sure many of us here enjoy watching Barca games and watch them regularly. I know I do. And I don't see anything that Busquets does in a superior fashion to Yaya Toure when he played behind Xavi and Iniesta.I have a sneaky feeling that they won a few trophies with Yaya in that position.

Busquets is far better on the ball than Toure, is more mobile and reads the game better defensively.

Toure often looked off the pace with the passing of Xavi and Iniesta etc but had other strengths.

The man who worked with them both every day clearly though Busquets was better as he had him startting ahead of him.

R0y Carrick has a better range of passing than Busquets and Toure but that is it,

The only point I'm making is that with this range of passing he'd slot in very nicely. I think he'd actually do a better job than Toure even though toure is the better player when he can be bothered.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 10:57PM, R0ykeane wrote:

the dza14 Jan 13 22:56Joined:06 Apr 05| Topic/replies: 6,866 | Blogger: the dza's blogYou come off as a bit patronising JamDav. understatement!

Coming from the man that calls anyone thick that does not agree with him.

Yes, I also think he's better than Alonso in that position (to Roy). Toure's passing is tremendous, see City's recent game against Newcastle for a couple of good examples. He has superb vision and technique, physically is a beast, excellent dribbler (certainly compared to others mentioned), is a good tackler and has good defensive attributes, as well as his obvious quality going forward.

If I had to play Toure, Alonso, Carrick or Busquets as my centre-half for an entire season, I would pick Toure. Which would tell you how I rate his defensive attributes.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 10:59PM, JamDav1982 wrote:

Jan 14, 2013 -- 10:57PM, R0ykeane wrote:the dza14 Jan 13 22:56Joined:06 Apr 05| Topic/replies: 6,866 | Blogger: the dza's blogYou come off as a bit patronising JamDav. understatement!Coming from the man that calls anyone thick that does not agree with him.

Carrick slot into the Barcelona system? Are for real?

Busquets was doing things in last nights game that Carrick could only dream of doing.

Jam, who would you rather have been biscuits and De Rossi for example? as a defensive midfielder

Busquets easily.

easily The Euros proved otherwise, De Rossi easily one of the best in the comp and capable of covering many positions. Saying easily just comes across as rather idiotic tbh

IMO, Busquets was starting ahead of Toure due to Toure being primed for a move (cashing in) and Busquets being groomed as his replacement. That's sensible management, but I don't necessarily think it means the coach thinks Busquets is the much better player.

My opinion, obviously.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:02PM, Winner_Winner_Chicken_Diner wrote:

easily  The Euros proved otherwise, De Rossi easily one of the best in the comp and capable of covering many positions. Saying easily just comes across as rather idiotic tbh

Busquets in team of comp says differently.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:02PM, the dza wrote:

IMO, Busquets was starting ahead of Toure due to Toure being primed for a move (cashing in) and Busquets being groomed as his replacement. That's sensible management, but I don't necessarily think it means the coach thinks Busquets is the much better player. My opinion, obviously.

You are just making things up now!

Since when do teams drop players and weaken the team to try and sell them?

Guardiola clearly rated Busquets as the better player by the time Toure left. When Toure did get games it was often in defence or in one  of the more forward midfield positions by that point.

God I do wonder about you sometimes Jam.... But do carry one, its rather funny you posting your "opinion" around every thread you enter as if its a fact.....The fact you can look objectivity on anything will always let you down

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:08PM, Winner_Winner_Chicken_Diner wrote:

God I do wonder about you sometimes Jam.... But do carry one, its rather funny you posting your "opinion" around every thread you enter as if its a fact.....The fact you can look objectivity on anything will always let you down

Everyone is giving their opinion you nugget.

Maybe take a step back and go re read your posts on any thread you nugget, you come across as a patronising prick, where you barca_fan_4life or whatever his name was, alter ego imao

Move on winner winner and stop crying patronising when you having nothing left to add to the conversation.

Some Busi quotes to help you see the light -

ESPN FC BLOGS
ESPNFC United
Kicking and Screaming
Relegation Zone
Monday Musings
Tactics and Analysis
La Liga
The Toe Poke
The Boot Room
Fantasy Picks
Five Aside
The Scout's Notebook
On the Move
Football Africa
Soccer USA
CLUB BLOGS
Premier League Clubs
Arsenal
Aston Villa
Chelsea
Everton
Fulham
Liverpool
Manchester City
Manchester United
Newcastle United
Norwich City
Queens Park Rangers
Reading
Southampton
Stoke City
Sunderland
Swansea City
Tottenham
West Bromwich Albion
West Ham United
Wigan
European Clubs
AC Milan
AS Roma
Barcelona
Bayern Munich
Celtic
Inter Milan
Juventus
Paris Saint-Germain
Rangers
Real Madrid
Sep 22
12:55
AM BST
Love him or hate him, Sergio Busquets is a genius
Posted by Francesc Tomas
RECOMMEND60TWEET9EMAIL
Sergio Busquets has established himself as a key man capable of collecting 14 titles with Barcelona and the highly-prestigious World Cup and European Championships with Spain within just four seasons of his professional debut. However, the Catalan midfielder is still one of the most underrated footballers in the world, loved and hated in equal measure.

I honestly can't understand why.

Doubters believed Pep Guardiola promoted Sergio from our Barcelona B team back in 2008 simply because of his friendship with dad Carles, his former Blaugrana teammate during Johan Cruyff's Dream Team era. They couldn't have been further from the truth, according to his instant impact in a team already full of talented play-makers such as Xavi, Iniesta, Yaya Toure or Keita.

Sergio Busquets went on to make 41 appearances in his first professional season, developing dynamic partnerships in the middle of the field which allowed Xavi and Iniesta to advance their positions and rotate much more freely. The result? Barcelona went on to complete the most successful season in our over 110 years of history, winning each and every one of the 6 competitions we entered in 2008/09, including La Liga, Champions League and the Club World Cup.

His tremendous achievements at Barcelona didn't go unnoticed for long. Vicente Del Bosque was quick to realize Busquets was the missing link in Spain's midfield and pretty much followed Guardiola's lead when building his team for the 2010 World Cup, taking our Barcelona formation as the basis for La Roja. The result? Spain came back home with the legendary golden trophy after Sergio played every match in the biggest competition in world football.

Despite the fact that Busquets has just started his 5th professional season, he has already made 198 appearances for the Blaugranas thanks to his brilliant footballing mind.

When in possession, Sergio is able to either retain the ball (which inevitably attracts many fouls) or find quick passes into space. He knows how to pace the game, often mixing short passes to Xavi or Iniesta, wide openings to the wings and through passes to Messi. When defending, he gets to those loose second balls before anyone else, reading the plays before they actually happen.

The biggest names in our beloved sport seem agree, as the following quotes prove:

Pep Guardiola: “Busquets is the best defensive central midfielder in the world. He's tactically very strong and will only become more important for Barcelona in the future. He can follow in the footsteps of Carles Puyol and Xavi. He's very humble and calm, but doesn't mind speaking up when he sees fit either. If I was reincarnated as a player, I'd like to be like him."

Vicente Del Bosque: "If I were a player, I would like to be like Busquets."

Xavi: “Without Busquets, Barcelona and Spain could never had achieved what we have achieved” 

Pacho Maturana: “For me, Sergio Busquets is the best player in the world. He never plays badly, always solves all the problems.”

Cesar Luis Menotti: “The first time I saw Busquets playing, I called a friend and said: ‘I saw a player from an extinct species’. An absolute talent.”

Winner Winner: "He is not a patch on Carrick or De Rossi"

I'm not making thing up Jam, I quite clearly said it's my opinion. You could be right for all I know, but Toure himself complained of being ignored by Guardiola etc. Things aren't always black and white and if a club is planning on cashing in on an expendable asset because they have a good youngster coming through, then it's not that much of a far-fetched scenario.

I don't think every youngster that comes in and takes the place of a first-teamer is necessarily thought of as a better player by the coach at that time. Much of the time (imo), it's because the coach thinks it's the best move for the club in the long term; the older player can be sold for good money and the youngster can develop into a quality player by getting the game time he needs.

The quotes are high praise indeed, but this one is debatable, surely?

Xavi: “Without Busquets, Barcelona and Spain could never had achieved what we have achieved”

Barca won the lot without Busquets and Spain won Euro 2008 with Senna as the defensive midfielder.

Now if Xavi had said that about himself or Iniesta, I'd be inclined to agree...

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:17PM, the dza wrote:

I'm not making thing up Jam, I quite clearly said it's my opinion. You could be right for all I know, but Toure himself complained of being ignored by Guardiola etc. Things aren't always black and white and if a club is planning on cashing in on an expendable asset because they have a good youngster coming through, then it's not that much of a far-fetched scenario. I don't think every youngster that comes in and takes the place of a first-teamer is necessarily thought of as a better player by the coach at that time. Much of the time (imo), it's because the coach thinks it's the best move for the club in the long term; the older player can be sold for good money and the youngster can develop into a quality player by getting the game time he needs.

Do you honestly think Guardiola would not chose his strongest team in the semi final of the CL?

Busquets replaced Toure that season and it was merited on ability it was quite clear.

Barcelona nor any other top team would weaken their side purely to let a youngster in. Busquets was better than Toure by the time he left and Guardiola clearly thought it and called him the best DM in the world.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:21PM, the dza wrote:

The quotes are high praise indeed, but this one is debatable, surely?Xavi: “Without Busquets, Barcelona and Spain could never had achieved what we have achieved”  Barca won the lot without Busquets and Spain won Euro 2008 with Senna as the defensive midfielder.Now if Xavi had said that about himself or Iniesta, I'd be inclined to agree...

Of course they won a lot without him but both side have won more with him and both are up there as the greatest sides ever due to the way they keep the ball, in which he is a massive part.

Thats is the point.

He is considered at Barca to be the best one touch player etc.

i think it's a coincidence that the posters who rate carrick have watched him play at their clubs and can appreciate what he brings to a team.

re the carrick/busquets debate, imo busquets is a much better fit for barca than carrick would be.

Once again Jam fails to see  another opinion/ totally misses the point....I merely laughed at you saying easily but coming from you its no surprise...Maybe when you get your dick out of all things Barca/Spain related you can reason with people....

You do show yourself up to be an idiot most times you post on here....

Would it be juvenile of me to say that Busquets is a horrible big fanny of a player, who while bringing superb artisan qualities to his game,  has a rancid attitude and has resorted to the lowest forms of cheating on too many occasions for me to have any respect whatsoever for him as a footballer ?
Give me Gaz Baz of Carrick over him any day !

Re the Yaya argument ... Mancinci has moulded him into a completely different player who transcends any of the read the game and give it simple stuff that Busquets is good at, so comparisons are fairly pointless nowadays .... Busquets will never score and create as many goals as Yaya or will he maraud his way through an entire teams defence all by himself. Yaya will never have the defensive discipline required to perform to Busquets level as a DM .... I know who I'd rather pay my money to go and see though and luckily enough its Yaya.

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:27PM, Winner_Winner_Chicken_Diner wrote:

Once again Jam fails to see  another opinion/ totally misses the point....I merely laughed at you saying easily but coming from you its no surprise...Maybe when you get your dick out of all things Barca/Spain related you can reason with people....You do show yourself up to be an idiot most times you post on here....

I said easily as Busquets is without doubt the better DM than De Rossi and any team in the world would pick Busquets ahead of him.

Last nights game was an example of how good he is. His passing was phenomenal ans he totally shut down Isco and Jaoquin.

Other DM's like De Rossi may charge about more, cover more ground etc but I dont think there has ever been a DM that mixes ability on the ball and defensive reading of the game the way Busquets does.

Well, I conceed there then Jam. Guardiola thought he was better...but I don't.

Same as I thought Modric was an over-rated player for Spurs and not an upgrade on Alonso. Jose should have called me and saved himself a few quid.

Then again, I once thought Andy Caroll might be a decent buy for Spurs, so I clearly don't know it all (my profit/loss would provide further evidence of that...)

So my final say:

1. Toure (Yaya)
2. Busquets
3. Carrick

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:32PM, the dza wrote:

Well, I conceed there then Jam. Guardiola thought he was better...but I don't. Same as I thought Modric was an over-rated player for Spurs and not an upgrade on Alonso. Jose should have called me and saved himself a few quid.Then again, I once thought Andy Caroll might be a decent buy for Spurs, so I clearly don't know it all  (my profit/loss would provide further evidence of that...)So my final say:1. Toure (Yaya)2. Busquets3. Carrick

Guardiola had it -
1.Busquets
2.Toure

Thats says far more.

De Rossi does not charge about, only when he has to.....But under pressure he is calm, driving forward he can do that and passing/shooting excellent....If he played for Barcelona he would fit in like a hand in a glove....One plays for Barca, the other Roma and that makes a big difference...Imo, his performance against Spain in the opening game of the Euros was one of the best individual performances of the tournament and showed his pedigree

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJ4Kdl08nP8

Played as a sweeper in that game and set many things up as well as defending...Watch and and tell me different though...

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:43PM, Winner_Winner_Chicken_Diner wrote:

De Rossi does not charge about, only when he has to.....But under pressure he is calm, driving forward he can do that and passing/shooting excellent....If he played for Barcelona he would fit in like a hand in a glove....One plays for Barca, the other Roma and that makes a big difference...Imo, his performance against Spain in the opening game of the Euros was one of the best individual performances of the tournament and showed his pedigreehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJ4Kdl08nP8Played as a sweeper in that game and set many things up as well as defending...Watch and and tell me different though...

Wow you think De Rossi could fit into Barcelona's passing style as well as Busquets!!!

Take a lie down son.

De Rossi is a much more complete player than any of the others mentioned on this thread to be fair, I maybe have missed something with Busquets but DDR can do a bit of everything while SB is purely a DM whose job is made relatively simple by having several of the best players in the world in front of him everytime he plays ....

Plus DDR is an absolute warrior who I've never seen rolling around like an avon lady in an attempt to get his opponents sent off.

"Easily" if given that chance

Jan 14, 2013 -- 11:52PM, arrested development wrote:

De Rossi is a much more complete player than any of the others mentioned on this thread to be fair, I maybe have missed something with Busquets but DDR can do a bit of everything while SB is purely a DM whose job is made relatively simple by having several of the best players in the world in front of him everytime he plays .... Plus DDR is an absolute warrior who I've never seen rolling around like an avon lady in an attempt to get his opponents sent off.

You are missing the point that the best players in the world have it easier with them behind them.

In the best one touch passing team in the world he is considered the best within the club at it.

I would agree De Rossi is the more complete midfielder but not the better DM.

Clearly you watch him much more than I do so I'm happy to defer, like Man U fans will tell you how great Carrick is and I think that Gareth Barry is a class footballer who is ridiculously maligned by most casual observers I suppose  ...

I still maintain Busquets has been a cynical cheat and should be embarrassed at some of his behaviour over the last few years though ...

the dza
14 Jan 13 22:59
Joined:
06 Apr 05
| Topic/replies: 6,875 | Blogger: the dza's blog
Yes, I also think he's better than Alonso in that position (to Roy). Toure's passing is tremendous, see City's recent game against Newcastle for a couple of good examples. He has superb vision and technique, physically is a beast, excellent dribbler (certainly compared to others mentioned), is a good tackler and has good defensive attributes, as well as his obvious quality going forward.

If I had to play Toure, Alonso, Carrick or Busquets as my centre-half for an entire season, I would pick Toure. Which would tell you how I rate his defensive attributes.

Center back is a completely different thing. I'm talking about the quarter back position in deep midfield. I think he's a good passer and very comfortable in tight spaces but I don't think he's the sort of player that dictates a game with his passing. He's normally very positive with his passing which again with that role the balance might be off. The fact he can dribble is irrelevant. The sort of areas you'd want him on the ball in that role you really would not want him dribbling and vacating the space. I think you just really rate Toure and as a result would have him over most in just about any position.I'm assuming you think he'd be a better winger than pretty much everyone bar Bale? Better striker than everyone bar the top few...etc...

*Vacating the space or risk losing the ball in those areas when teams swiftly worked out he'd dribble from there.

I'm making a very narrow point that seems to be getting lost in alot of noise. For that specific role in that specific team I have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that:

A) Carrick could come in and slot seamlessly into that barcelona side
B) That both he and Busquets are better suited to the overall betterment of that side in that role than Toure.


To say that Toure can do everything that Carrick can do and better is like saying Rooney can do everything Roy Keane could do and better.... don't see Rooney making a better midfield general anytime soon.

Hate the cliche 'quarter back position'.


However this is a totally different position than a defensive midfielder.

Players like Pirlo and Xabi Alonso are top in these positions, far better players than Carrick to be honest. These players almosy always need a work horse alongside them to give them the ball.

Busquets is a pure DM and far and away the best in the world at it.

In my opinion he is as good a defensive midfielder as Makelele was with the ability of someone like Riquelme on the ball. He is a phenomenal player.

Jan 15, 2013 -- 10:06AM, R0ykeane wrote:

*Vacating the space or risk losing the ball in those areas when teams swiftly worked out he'd dribble from there.I'm making a very narrow point that seems to be getting lost in alot of noise. For that specific role in that specific team I have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that:A) Carrick could come in and slot seamlessly into that barcelona sideB) That both he and Busquets are better suited to the overall betterment of that side in that role than Toure.To say that Toure can do everything that Carrick can do and better is like saying Rooney can do everything Roy Keane could do and better.... don't see Rooney making a better midfield general anytime soon.

Carrick has nowhere close to the defensive ability or technique in tight areas to get near the Barcelona team.

it's groundhog day on this thread

Aye, neither does Mascherano. Do one you demented bat.

Mascherano is a better DM than Carrick and has been a great signing for Barcelona.

You are right in the point that he is not nearly as good on the ball as Busquets, hence why he is now seen as a centre half.

This thread with you comparing Busquets and Carrick may be your lowest point R0y. Which really does say something.

Ability of someone like Riquelme on the ball.

ffs

If you wanted to make a comparison, you could have mentioned one of the most under rated players in the last 20 years...Fernando Redondo. But Biscuits will never have his class ever

Carrick is good enough for Barca is he?

aye ive heard some shyte on this forum over the years but that is....

did he get a kick in the 2 finals?

Jan 15, 2013 -- 11:08AM, Winner_Winner_Chicken_Diner wrote:

Ability of someone like Riquelme on the ball.  ffsIf you wanted to make a comparison, you could have mentioned one of the most under rated players in the last 20 years...Fernando Redondo. But Biscuits will never have his class ever

Winner Winner I stand by that 100%.

Busquets is unreal on the ball.

This JamDav príck is as patronising as they come on here,Tried telling me as a fact that Rio,Vidic and even phil jones were far superior defenders to Chris Smalling,
absolute clown.

Pacho Maturana: “For me, Sergio Busquets is the best player in the world. He never plays badly, always solves all the problems.”


oh dear,that just totally ruins whatever credibility them quotes had, to begin with

Jan 15, 2013 -- 1:24PM, CheltenhamRoar wrote:

This JamDav príck is as patronising as they come on here,Tried telling me as a fact that Rio,Vidic and even phil jones were far superior defenders to Chris Smalling,absolute clown.

Haha wow I stand by that one all day long. Chris Smalling is average.

Its hard not seem patronising to someone so dim.

perhaps they meant Barcelona B. Guardiola said a couple years ago they didnt even rate Wilshere that highly, they had better players in the youth team over there. Hed laugh in your face if u told him carrick was good enough for their midfield

That type of comment sums up your knowledge of the game,So Busquets is world class,and Smalling is average,Go have a lie down.

jesus wept. you re saying Smalling who isnt even a man u regular is now on a par with Busquets is he? a guy who has a cabinet full of medals for club and country ffs

Busquets is a fantastic player.A snidy cheat who goes down way too easily(not the only player) but a fantastic player.

Jan 15, 2013 -- 3:08PM, CheltenhamRoar wrote:

That type of comment sums up your knowledge of the game,So Busquets is world class,and Smalling is average,Go have a lie down.

I hope for your own sake you are fishing.

Busquets is the best in the world in his position.

Smalling is average and at best the fourth choice center half at his club.

CheltenhamRoar 15 Jan 13 13:24 
This JamDav príck is as patronising as they come on here,Tried telling me as a fact that Rio,Vidic and even phil jones were far superior defenders to Chris Smalling,
absolute clown.




Does any United fan think that Rio and Vidic are not superior defenders to Smalling? I think even Smalling would tell you they're superior defenders.

If Carrick was called Carrickinho and played for Barca/Madrid then he'd be labelled as the best centre midfielder in the world right now. People don't rate him highly purely because he is English and is playing for United.

Replying to Roy here: I rate Toure as a better player than Carrick in a position that he has regularly played in over the course of his career. Talking about wingers or comparing Roy Keane with Rooney is a complete strawman argument. Toure has played the role behind Iniesta and Xavi and won the lot.

I cannot think of anything that Carrick can do that Toure can't, but there are things that Toure can do that Carrick cannot.

And yes, I do rate him highly and I think he might be the best all-round player about (for the clowns, that doesn't mean I think he is the best player full-stop.)

Toure has played the role behind Iniesta and Xavi and won the lot.

Mashcerano has played at center back at won the lot...yet he can't defend and is an average center back. Toure is a bloody good player...he's hardly going to struggle to play in that team in that midfield is he. Still think the likes of Carrick, Busquets and Alonso far better suited to the overall balance of the team even though they are all arguably worse players when toure can be bothered.

Not really a strawman argument whatever that is...I can give you countless examples of players having more ability in almost every area than another but not being as effective in a certain role as others.

Anyhow I believe we have exhausted this one? Onwards.

Return_Of_Dawsy 15 Jan 13 21:09 
If Carrick was called Carrickinho and played for Barca/Madrid then he'd be labelled as the best centre midfielder in the world right now.




Unlikely. Barca/Real have better midfielders than Carrick on their subs benches.

carrick is a bit like scholes never truely valued in england, scholes only ever got the praise he deserved in recent years despite being the best player to ever grace the premiership. carricks credibility was ruined by both champions league finals against barcelona, in 09 he was identified by xavi as uniteds main threat and clearly targeted by both xavi and iniesta who ruthlessly pressed him throughout and never gave him a sniff in 11 champs league final as barcelona formed a triangle around him containing Messi Iniesta and Xavi,officially the world's best three players at the time according to FIFA, the criticism was unfair as it wasnt only carrick but the team who massively under performed. if carrick performs aswel as he can in the next round of the champs league maybe he wil start to get the praise he deserves

Jan 16, 2013 -- 3:55PM, muzzyeire wrote:

carrick is a bit like scholes never truely valued in england, scholes only ever got the praise he deserved in recent years despite being the best player to ever grace the premiership. carricks credibility was ruined by both champions league finals against barcelona, in 09 he was identified by xavi as uniteds main threat and clearly targeted by both xavi and iniesta who ruthlessly pressed him throughout and never gave him a sniff in 11 champs league final as barcelona formed a triangle around him containing Messi Iniesta and Xavi,officially the world's best three players at the time according to FIFA, the criticism was unfair as it wasnt only carrick but the team who massively under performed. if carrick performs aswel as he can in the next round of the champs league maybe he wil start to get the praise he deserves

Carrick will never be close to the player Scholes was.

He is a good player having a good season but nowhere near the top midfield players as Scholes was.