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Waterwheel Inc.
05 Sep 11 03:55
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Date Joined: 26 Oct 05
| Topic/replies: 42 | Blogger: Waterwheel Inc.'s blog
I'm sure this is something some idiot asks often enough (it's something of a mug bet after all), but after a bit of digging through the search engines I've found no decent answers so I wonder if someone could help me out and ease my curiosity?

I assumed there was a standard formula, but after checking the prices for a few possibles on the England game I found that even when bookies had the same price up for first goalscorer and correct score markets they had different scorecast prices. So following on from this, I wonder if anyone has any significant experience on who offers the better prices about them? (From what I checked, VC seemed to come out consistently better than the opposition.)

Thanks for any comments anyone can offer.

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Replies: 28
By:
Alex the old wrinkled retainer
When: 05 Sep 11 04:05
I would multiply FGS x CS odds when the betfair markets have matured, less 5% to arrive at fair value.
By:
loveit
When: 05 Sep 11 05:37
its nowhere near fgs x cs - 5%.it should be buts not.
normally ends up being -25% on betfair and %30 + anywhere else.
its a fantastic bet to lay if you have the funds to do so.
By:
RonaldinhoRAT
When: 05 Sep 11 09:17
I wonder if anyone has any significant experience on who offers the better prices about them?


Betfair only offer a few scorecasts on a few matches but their prices will be best by a long way. Compare BF scorecast to FG odds and you'll more often than not see very little difference in value, bookies will have over 200% books for SC.

The calculations for scorecasts go way back and differ from company to company some working from templates from 15 years ago, to try to find a formula would be very hard, i'd imagine a few people sat around multipying FG prices by correct scores then taking away between 25% and 60%. As a related contingency bet a deduction would be reasonable but the FG and CS prices already come with healthy overrounds combined with an additional deduction for the related part.

So good luck on finding the scorecast valueConfused
By:
kenilworth
When: 05 Sep 11 09:26
One of the most heavily promoted bets by bookmakers
so the lack of value should be obvious. Other bets
to avoid are h/time - f/time, again encouraged.
By:
DeKaiser
When: 05 Sep 11 10:58
Avoid HT-FT ? It is a goldmine if you know what you are doing [;)]
By:
jinjing
When: 05 Sep 11 11:43
Laugh

Odds = return rate / probability
By:
Waterwheel Inc.
When: 05 Sep 11 14:49
Thanks for the replies, it was pretty much the fact that the prices were so bad that led me to wondering how on earth they were calculated. Needless to say I shan't be in a hurry to go placing one anytime soon.
By:
Alex the old wrinkled retainer
When: 05 Sep 11 19:01
Why would  the "right and fair price" for a Scorecast bet be anything other than CS x FGS?  I am perplexed why anybody would think it should be discounted, except for nominal commission if an exchange is used.


I agree with most who indicate that they are Turpin bets. For layers, not backers.
By:
Alex the old wrinkled retainer
When: 05 Sep 11 19:15
In fact it can be more than a Turpin bet.  Sometimes the odds offered put it into the trap bet category.
By:
RonaldinhoRAT
When: 05 Sep 11 19:37
Alex the old wrinkled retainer
05 Sep 11 19:01 Joined: 07 Aug 06 | Topic/replies: 17,058 | Blogger: Alex the old wrinkled retainer's blog
Why would  the "right and fair price" for a Scorecast bet be anything other than CS x FGS?  I am perplexed why anybody would think it should be discounted,


Imagine a virtual match where all have a equal chance to score priced at 19/1, take the 1-0 score priced at 7/1

so is it better to have

£10 on 1-0 to win £80
or
£1 on each scorecast £160
By:
DaveEdwards
When: 05 Sep 11 22:27
A different way to look at the correct price might be as follows:

Player A scores first & his team wins 2 - 1

On a basic formula you could look at multiplying price for Player A and the odds on both teams scoring one more goal, i.e. 1-1 not including the first goal. Virtually impossible to do as predicting both the player to score, the time of his goal and therefore the odds of both teams scoring in the remaining time available would be a particularly difficult situation to model in my opinion.

In very limited scenarios it could be playable, but you'd have to be right on top of your game. Of course the overround ensures the muppet money covers any lucky or skillful win on this bet.
By:
DeSSieReborn
When: 05 Sep 11 22:29
They work out what would be fair to give away, then reduce it by 50%.
By:
DeSSieReborn
When: 05 Sep 11 22:30
scorecasts are for mugs
By:
DaveEdwards
When: 05 Sep 11 22:30
they are indeed
By:
gnashersblackpool
When: 05 Sep 11 22:42
correct score x1st scorer prices minus 50%isoften the norm.

as example if rooney scores first for utd oppents cant win 1nil 2 niletc,so these have to b factored in.
By:
DaveEdwards
When: 05 Sep 11 22:48
if it is done on a straight multiplication less 50%, it would tend to indicate how much faith they have in their own ability to price this with any degree of accuracy
By:
Warnsie
When: 05 Sep 11 22:54
Load of old tosh these bets, only do them in the ground before the match, for a bit craic between the lads. Theyre just fun bets, anyone who takes them seriously must actually be micey. Not sure how theyre calculated but the odds always seem ridiculous.
By:
Warnsie
When: 05 Sep 11 22:56
Load of old tosh these bets, only do them in the ground before the match, for a bit craic between the lads. Theyre just fun bets, anyone who takes them seriously must actually be micey. Not sure how theyre calculated but the odds always seem ridiculous.
By:
DaveEdwards
When: 05 Sep 11 22:58
They aren't fun bets at all. On the part of the bookmaker they are very serious bets. It's an easy way to relieve you of money.

Anyone who does these for fun too must actually be micey, whatever the **** that means.
By:
Warnsie
When: 05 Sep 11 23:08
Chill out u RAGING old goat. I think i can afford to throw a tenner at a scorecast once a week. Don't lose any sleep over it PAL haha.
By:
DaveEdwards
When: 05 Sep 11 23:11
I won't be losing any sleep over it.
By:
Warnsie
When: 05 Sep 11 23:12
Do u never have a bet for fun Mr Dave Edwards? Hmmm?
By:
DaveEdwards
When: 05 Sep 11 23:16
no
By:
Warnsie
When: 05 Sep 11 23:18
Awwwuuhh, u should some time, might be dead fun :)
By:
DaveEdwards
When: 05 Sep 11 23:19
each to their own Warnsie, good luck
By:
Alex the old wrinkled retainer
When: 06 Sep 11 07:50
Is this true Dave, are you a raging old goat? Laugh
By:
marychain1
When: 06 Sep 11 08:31
No harm with having a fun bet for small steaks. My mate and I chuck a few quid each week at goals galore trying to get 10 right at 350/1-500/1. We don't expect it to come in ever, and we are perfectly aware that it's a terrible value bet, although we've been one team off twice. But it's fun watching the goals come in and marking them off the coupon as we sit in the gresty road en watching crewe lose.

If anyone cares it the two teams that have cost us have been Coventry and Peterborough.
By:
Alex the old wrinkled retainer
When: 06 Sep 11 08:36
"If it were not for recreational punters it would be much tougher to make money."




ATOWR 06/09/2001
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