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Giro 2017 Chat Thread

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Replies: 378
By:
Cauthenmeister
When: 25 May 17 21:52
TJVG too good a rider not to win races. Agree with SP that he has lacked confidence, and he isn't going to be a serious GC contender. Hopefully he can find some direction for the rest of his career now.
Quintana and Nibali now must be hoping that three weeks of racing will finally crack Dumoulin because he looked stronger than them on the last climb. They have winning form over the distance, he doesn't yet.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 09:59
Stage: 19 15km final climb into Piancavello likely to be the key climb and staging ground for another fight between the principals. Nibali is not giving up, Quintana is under pressure, Dumoulin is facing (and so far easily passing) a stiff test to his GT GC aspirations, and Pinot wants a stage victory. Quintana showed he is not fearful to try something early, he went 50 kms out yesterday for the first attempt, however the nature of this stage suggests that the final climb will be where the race will be held for the GC men, and that climb is 15.5 kms long.

...And it is here where I think Quintana will launch another attack, especially in the first half of the climb where he is suited by the steepness, because Dumoulin should easily handle the gradients thereafter, and in fact find suitable to launch his own attacks, and so even if Quintana opens a gap there, Dumoulin has so far shown he can limit losses.

Breakaway a very high chance of making it though, I think. The peloton looks quite weak, for instance that dominance we witnessed from MOV last week seems to have fizzled-out for the most part and they are trying the tactic of forward satellites for Quintana, SUN don't want a hard ride for Dumoulin so they won't push the pace, ORS can't do their recent pace-making forever, and so if the breakaway composition is right and they gain 3 mins by the final climb, I would favour the break. Landa laughably short, though. Will assess the situation IR.
By:
Badsworth
When: 26 May 17 12:56
It's all kicking off, GC teams attacking when Dumoulin returning to the back of the peleton from a natural break. Looks like the Dutch riders against the rest.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 12:59
I cannot believe what we are seeing here...
By:
bb66
When: 26 May 17 12:59
if that's true they used a natural break again, it looks ver unsportmanlikeSad
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:07
The Dutch Express versus the Nibali/Quintana Alliance, and there's' a big break out there, too. What a stage!
By:
Badsworth
When: 26 May 17 13:09
Now saying there was a split on a descent & Dumoulin was caught out.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:11
The source of that is legitimate, so likely to be the case.
By:
bb66
When: 26 May 17 13:25
gap closed
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:28
A break to form on the descent and consolidate a gap at the bottom, both GC groups to slow things down, break to build a nice gap and win?
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:30
Break forms on the ascent as the rejoined peloton sits up, a bit.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:32
I was just wondering where Quintana was, couldn't see him in the peloton, he had gone back to the TC.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:33
Peloton not really slowing, but the break looks quality.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:35
Break: Rolland, LL Sanchez, Rui Costa, S Henao.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:36
...plus a couple of others, was mentioning the quality riders.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:37
Why is the peloton still riding, QST are being daft.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:40
If the break are given a bit of ground by the super-reduced peloton, they'll come home, I believe.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:43
Both groups will fry up to the final climb, and hopefully the peloton will sit up after such a stiff start.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:50
See how the break are combining once at the bottom, looks like it might be 6 (in the break) versus one QST rider (on front of peloton). The break so far look comfortable together, and the quality outweighs.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 13:57
Break combining nicely, as expected, Shalunov trying to impress, also. Peloton sat up once at the bottom, and that sparked another break to form. Bigger, Landa involved, again.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 14:30
Two breaks come together and it's there's, I believe, they have 7mins and will have at least 3mins by final climb.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 14:44
break home as expected.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 14:51
Some good Spaniards to choose from, but I cannot consider Landa after his tactically-deficient efforts so far.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:19
If Sanchez can keep his gap on this early part which doesn't him as is too steep, he should be capable of holding on the milder gradients later.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:19
*suit
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:20
Rui Costa looks to be struggling for mine.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:26
Rui Costa attacks and suddenly looks like he'll open a gap. Lol.
By:
monarch
When: 26 May 17 15:35
Had Sanchez backed... thought i was looking good
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:40
are you watching, monarch?
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:43
Landa a loss for me, first for the race.
By:
monarch
When: 26 May 17 15:43
Yep. But only the last 40 mins or so.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:46
Landa romping home, just thought he was going to do something stupid again, but he is clearly the strongest and has held his condition.
By:
monarch
When: 26 May 17 15:47
Back to what i said yesterday. Can't begrudge him a stage win
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:52
No, definitely not, but the value was never there for him.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:57
Dumoulin looks to be limiting his losses.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 15:59
Landa wins. Cry
By:
bb66
When: 26 May 17 16:59
imagine how close this Giro would have been without the fall of Thomas and LandaCry
By:
Badsworth
When: 26 May 17 17:39
Like SP I laid Landa. Sad
Kelderman was also taken out by the police motorbike, he may have been help to Dumoulin in the mountains.
By:
SwingingPick
When: 26 May 17 17:51
I think Quintana requires a minimum of 22 secs on Dumoulin on tomorrow's stage. That will only give Quintana a mere 60 secs lead into the final ITT. However, since Quintana doesn't look very strong, I think he requires more like 1:40 to 2:00 minutes lead, coming out of tomorrow. Even if he gains a minute, that gives him a 1:38 lead. I believe that Dumoulin going hard in the ITT can pull that out, without even needing Quintana to have a bad day as he had in the earlier ITT. However, if Quintana does experience a bad day and Dumoulin goes ordinarily, it'll be an extra minute for Dumoulin against Quintana like earlier, and he wins the Giro by a minute, I believe.

As previously stated, Nibali is still in this, but the question comes back to Dumoulin. Will he drift off the back of tomorrow's peloton, like he did today? Much of why he struggled today was because of having to chase back on for a long way, which cost his legs, which he has said he didn't even have at the start of the race. He did maintain his losses on the final climb and in total he lost 1:09. He can again be put into difficulty tomorrow since the Monte Grappa looms early, and there is a lot of riding and the climb to Foza remaining. The descent will allow him some rest and recuperation and if MOV don't begin to inflict some damage on him on Grappa than his prospects improve.

There is a school of thought that Dumoulin's wheels are looking to come off and psychologically the Vuelta is coming back to haunt him. He did look tired today, but there is no way he cracked, I simply cannot agree with such an observation. He was just tired, just didn't have the legs, but limited losses and again comes back to fight another day. Is it getting too much for him, though? Yes, it might be getting too much for Dumoulin, but he will be hoping that MOV don't strike out early on the Grappa, and even if they do, he just has to repeat his limiting losses ride of today on the climb to Foza. Grappa is not an overly tough climb, and he does get a long descent.

On the other hand, if he is given a tough climb on the Grappa, the final climb is tough-enough to crack him, if he again has poor legs. If he cracks he is out, a broken GC GT aspirant, perhaps.

In conclusion, and taking into account that I have bigger green on Dumoulin than on Nibali and Quintana (Pinot is a loss): I still think we are seeing a developing Dumoulin, who is showing us that he can limit losses and stay in the GC race, like never before. Unless he panics or more than two factors combine to conspire against him tomorrow, such as poor legs and a tough ride on the Grappa by MOV, he should lose no more than another minute on the final climb which might be a little harder than today, but is similar in distance and if Quintana leaves his attack late, he won't gain enough.

+1:38 is good for Dumoulin on Quintana going into the ITT, I believe. Nibali and Pinot are different narratives, and since this race is all about Dumoulin, he is who I am concentrating on, but those two are still in it, particularly Nibali.

Finally, Dumoulin to maybe lose contact if MOV ramp things up toward the top of the Grappa, but rejoin on the descent and keep his legs for the final climb in order to limit losses by losing no more than a minute and being 1:38 going into the ITT.

The ultimate question being asked of Dumoulin is: Who is Dumoulin? Is he a fighter with a big heart, or a man previously psychologically-scarred by the Vuelta? After the stage today when surrounded by a crowd of reporters, whilst on the rollers and answering questions, he still looked and sounded confident to me, but his trash-talking before today's stage is not the way he should be approaching his racing, much better to show he has the heart and courage to fight like a lion, and secure his place as a worthy GT contender.
By:
Cauthenmeister
When: 27 May 17 12:45
Hot weather not good news for Pinot.
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